Conquer Rome (The Fall of the Roman Empire) [Quenched]

[Ika Pakao]

Maybe it can be a random capital and a random tribe?

That is what kabanellas tried above. Unfortunately you can only have one <positions> tag.

I'm sorry. I'm illiterate when it comes to coding.

[Dukasaur]

All this obsession with "balancing" ruins so many good maps. Don't worry about it. Sometimes you get a great drop, sometimes you get a shitty drop. The "balance" comes in playing enough games over time that your greats and shits even out.

Give it fixed starting positions and you could dumb this thing down to the level of Feudal War, and that would be a truly horrible end for a wonderful map.

[Kabanellas]

that's why I need 2 starting positions tags - tribes and capitals could never be related.

Basically everything would stay the same. We'll be just taking out the possibility of players getting more capitals than others. All regions will continue to be randomly distributed, including capitals.

We'd be just creating a subdivision between normal distributable regions and capitals. But all randomly distributed the same.

[nolefan5311]

I understand the concern Kaba, I just don't agree that it needs to be done. So, your opponent starts with 3 capitals and you only start with 1. Like Duka said, it's all part of the game. No map is going to be perfectly fair, and this is already one of the most balanced maps out there. Obviously, it's your map and if you want to make the change, then so be it. I'm just going on the record that I don't think it needs to be changed.

[ender516]

I must again call for make capitals of dioceses as starting points like in the third crusade map. they do not need to start with 6 units, just distribute them so that each player will has the same number of them. or make them as 2 neutrals from start.

look on this map.
http://www.conquerclub.com/game.php?game=11955507

Oneyed

Cannot as the game is fog.

Now that the fog has lifted, it looks to me like yellow started with 6 capitals and blue with 2, which does seem unbalanced.

[thenobodies80]

I'm just going on the record that I don't think it needs to be changed.

+1

Leave it as it is now Kab. I understand what you want to do, but actually it's not possible...

[ender516]

Yes, but what is possible and has been suggested a few times, most recently by Ika Pakao in an admirably detailed post, is simply making the capitals starting positions. We wouldn't even need a maximum for 2-player games, as the capitals do not provide a bonus with which to overwhelm an opponent on the first turn.

[Oneyed]

Yes, but what is possible and has been suggested a few times, most recently by Ika Pakao in an admirably detailed post, is simply making the capitals starting positions. We wouldn't even need a maximum for 2-player games, as the capitals do not provide a bonus with which to overwhelm an opponent on the first turn.

100% agreed.

Oneyed

[nolefan5311]

Yes, but what is possible and has been suggested a few times, most recently by Ika Pakao in an admirably detailed post, is simply making the capitals starting positions. We wouldn't even need a maximum for 2-player games, as the capitals do not provide a bonus with which to overwhelm an opponent on the first turn.

100% agreed.

Oneyed

If the capitals are made starting positions, they will either have to be tied to certain barbarian tribes, or the barbarians tribes will have to be removed as starting positions, both of which are significantly larger changes to the gameplay than making sure an even amount of capitals are distributed.

[ender516]

Yes, but what is possible and has been suggested a few times, most recently by Ika Pakao in an admirably detailed post, is simply making the capitals starting positions. We wouldn't even need a maximum for 2-player games, as the capitals do not provide a bonus with which to overwhelm an opponent on the first turn.

100% agreed.

Oneyed

If the capitals are made starting positions, they will either have to be tied to certain barbarian tribes, or the barbarians tribes will have to be removed as starting positions, both of which are significantly larger changes to the gameplay than making sure an even amount of capitals are distributed.

Whoops, I had forgotten that the barbarians were starting positions. Your statement then is completely correct, and I apologize for keeping this going. Sorry, Oneyed, but until we get a change to the XML which allows independent sets of starting positions (and I would wholeheartedly support such a suggestion), I think we are stuck with the way things are.

[Kabanellas]

yup,
for this change to happen Barbarians Settlements and Capitals would have to be independent from one another.

I guess it will have to remain as it is for now

[Night Strike]

Playing this map for the first time. It completely sucks.

[koontz1973]

Playing this map for the first time. It completely sucks.

OK, why? Post like this always make me think of this.

[macbone]

It has a bit of a learning curve, but I'm starting to really like it. Perhaps in another 30 or so games, I might actually start to figure it out! =)

But seriously, kab, this is a pretty fun map, man. You should do this with WWII!

[chapcrap]

Playing this map for the first time. It completely sucks.

I disagree

[Kabanellas]

Playing this map for the first time. It completely sucks.

OK, why? Post like this always make me think of this.

Ahhhahhh niiice


...and Mac, that's an idea... Though 'Night Strike' might not like it...

[ChrisPond]

this map is perfect as is. my favorite!

I may be biased though as i do pretty well there?

http://www.conquerclub.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=185620
http://www.conquerclub.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=178490
http://www.conquerclub.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=175019

[ironmanbravo]

I like this map as is also

[CMetternich]

I played this map, it is really a complete mess.

The author should at least try to explain the bonus system instead of giving us a history lesson (which, as it was already mentioned by another contributor, needs some tidying up).

This bonus system Bombarding other regions

I hold the region, another player gets the bonus. Why? There is virtually no explanation apart from the short history lesson. Again, what a mess.

[jawsua]

Can somebody please help me with this map? I have no clue how I just lost. The guy I was playing against would respond to any questions I had. He was a bitch. lol

[Oneyed]

Can somebody please help me with this map? I have no clue how I just lost. The guy I was playing against would respond to any questions I had. He was a bitch. lol

have you any tangible questions?

Oneyed

[Kabanellas]

I played this map, it is really a complete mess.

The author should at least try to explain the bonus system instead of giving us a history lesson (which, as it was already mentioned by another contributor, needs some tidying up).

This bonus system Bombarding other regions

I hold the region, another player gets the bonus. Why? There is virtually no explanation apart from the short history lesson. Again, what a mess.

The author does explain how the map works, or wouldn't be almost 23.000 games played on this map so far.
This map requires, though, a little more than the elaborate thinking that led you to believe that there's a history lesson implicit. (Which isn't more than an historical contextualization btw, not a lesson)

[CMetternich]

The author does explain how the map works, or wouldn't be almost 23.000 games played on this map so far.
This map requires, though, a little more than the elaborate thinking that led you to believe that there's a history lesson implicit. (Which isn't more than an historical contextualization btw, not a lesson)

Oh, I already won a game playing this map. So your overhasty sentiment about me was wrong, I did the elaborate thinking.

Nevertheless an impartial writer should acknowledge that there a lot of players (I even dare to say a majority) who are confused when playing this map. So the try to explain was an unsuccessful one, obviously. Maybe a little overhaul would make the map more popular. This led to my posting.

[rousseau72]

This is one of my favorite maps. It has a learning curve but so do most great games. There is checkers for people who want simple games (or doodle the map) Conquer Rome has many subtle strategies and it takes a while to master. Its why I prefer chess and why I prefer maps like this. This map has the additional benefit of given the "feel" of the the historical context of its time better than almost any other map as well.

If you don't like it - then don't play it but please don't insult the map maker with your "impartial" views. Kudos to all the mapmakers who make CC what it is and especially to Kabanellas who does it exceptionally well.

[Dukasaur]

This is one of my favorite maps. It has a learning curve but so do most great games. There is checkers for people who want simple games (or doodle the map) Conquer Rome has many subtle strategies and it takes a while to master. Its why I prefer chess and why I prefer maps like this. This map has the additional benefit of given the "feel" of the the historical context of its time better than almost any other map as well.

If you don't like it - then don't play it but please don't insult the map maker with your "impartial" views. Kudos to all the mapmakers who make CC what it is and especially to Kabanellas who does it exceptionally well.

Well said.