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Postby bryguy on Tue Oct 30, 2007 8:43 pm

this looks like a twisted version of the world :shock:
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Postby I GOT SERVED on Tue Oct 30, 2007 9:09 pm

oaktown wrote:yeah, while I think it would be good for small map gameplay, the 3 army minimum may be the one play feature that you don't mess with. And it would really screw somebody once they fell behind.

The biggest reason I'm leaning against it is that it will mess up the simplicity of the board to have to explain it!


Both are very valid points. I'd say it's best not to mess with something like this.

But other than that, keep up the great work!
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Postby Herakilla on Tue Oct 30, 2007 11:20 pm

i cant get that song outta my head! we watched it last year in american history dangit! *hums along with it*
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Postby yamahafazer on Wed Oct 31, 2007 2:37 am

Herakilla wrote:i cant get that song outta my head! we watched it last year in american history dangit! *hums along with it*


lol... come back read it again... YOU KNOW YOU WANT TO :lol:
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Postby oaktown on Sat Nov 03, 2007 10:57 am

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I felt that North America presented a huge challenge early in the game, as there was no easy bonus on that side of the map. The North America bonus can now be capture in stages, with the three USA territories giving a +2 by themselves and the bonus going to +5 when all of N. Am. is held. I think this makes an East v. West gameplay much more attractive.

I've added stars to represent the USA bonus. I didn't want to change the color because it is still a part of the N.Am continent, so I think this is clear.

Other changes were just cosmetic: nudged lines, added tiny roundels to the aircraft wings, reworked the bonus legend, etc. I gave Bert some color, and I'm not sure about it - he may need to go back but with some color behind him somehow, because that corner needed some contrast.

I've also dropped some army counts in so people can see what they'll look like without army shadows (I'd like to keep this map clean, colorful, and army shadow-free.) The position of the numbers in no way reflect any alignment - the XML isn't done, I jst copy/pasted on some numbers.
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Postby oaktown on Sat Nov 03, 2007 11:54 am

and since I had an extra half hour to kill his morning, i threw together the xml file (no coordinates). The only funny tags are bombardments and the North American override of USA.

Code: Select all
<?xml version="1.0"?>
<map>
   <title>Duck and Cover</title>
   <smallwidth>600</smallwidth>
   <smallheight>600</smallheight>
   <largewidth>645</largewidth>
   <largeheight>645</largeheight>
   <filetype>jpg</filetype>
   <continent>
      <name>North America</name>
      <bonus>5</bonus>
      <components>
         <component>Mexico</component>
         <component>Eastern USA</component>
         <component>Central USA</component>
         <component>Western USA</component>
         <component>Canada</component>
         <component>Alaska</component>
         <component>Quebec</component>
         <component>Greenland</component>
      </components>
      <overrides>
      <override>USA</override>
      </overrides>
   </continent>
   <continent>
      <name>USA</name>
      <bonus>2</bonus>
      <components>
         <component>Eastern USA</component>
         <component>Central USA</component>
         <component>Western USA</component>
      </components>
   </continent>
   <continent>
      <name>Europe</name>
      <bonus>2</bonus>
      <components>
         <component>U.K.</component>
         <component>Western Europe</component>
         <component>Scandinavia</component>
      </components>
   </continent>
   <continent>
      <name>USSR/E. Bloc</name>
      <bonus>4</bonus>
      <components>
         <component>Eastern Bloc</component>
         <component>Moscow</component>
         <component>Kazahk</component>
         <component>Central Russia</component>
         <component>Siberia</component>
      </components>
   </continent>
   <continent>
      <name>Asia</name>
      <bonus>2</bonus>
      <components>
         <component>Japan</component>
         <component>Korea</component>
         <component>China</component>
         <component>S.E. Asia</component>
         <component>India</component>
      </components>
   </continent>
   <continent>
      <name>Midle East</name>
      <bonus>1</bonus>
      <components>
         <component>Persia</component>
         <component>Arab States</component>
         <component>Turkey</component>
      </components>
   </continent>
   <territory>
      <name>Mexico</name>
      <borders>
         <border>Western USA</border>
         <border>Central USA</border>
      </borders>
      <coordinates>
         <smallx>88</smallx>
         <smally>88</smally>
         <largex>88</largex>
         <largey>88</largey>
      </coordinates>
   </territory>
   <territory>
      <name>Western USA</name>
      <borders>
         <border>Mexico</border>
         <border>Central USA</border>
         <border>Canada</border>
      </borders>
      <coordinates>
         <smallx>88</smallx>
         <smally>88</smally>
         <largex>88</largex>
         <largey>88</largey>
     </coordinates>
   </territory>
   <territory>
      <name>Central USA</name>
      <borders>
         <border>Western USA</border>
         <border>Mexico</border>
         <border>Eastern USA</border>
         <border>Canada</border>
      </borders>
      <bombardments>
         <bombardment>China</bombardment>
         <bombardment>Siberia</bombardment>
         <bombardment>Central Russia</bombardment>
         <bombardment>Moscow</bombardment>
      </bombardments>
      <coordinates>
         <smallx>88</smallx>
         <smally>88</smally>
         <largex>88</largex>
         <largey>88</largey>
      </coordinates>
   </territory>
   <territory>
      <name>Eastern USA</name>
      <borders>
         <border>Central USA</border>
         <border>U.K.</border>
         <border>Quebec</border>
      </borders>
      <coordinates>
         <smallx>88</smallx>
         <smally>88</smally>
         <largex>88</largex>
         <largey>88</largey>
      </coordinates>
   </territory>
   <territory>
      <name>Quebec</name>
      <borders>
         <border>Eastern USA</border>
         <border>Canada</border>
         <border>Greenland</border>
      </borders>
      <coordinates>
         <smallx>88</smallx>
         <smally>88</smally>
         <largex>88</largex>
         <largey>88</largey>
      </coordinates>
   </territory>
   <territory>
      <name>Canada</name>
      <borders>
         <border>Quebec</border>
         <border>Western USA</border>
         <border>Central USA</border>
         <border>Alaska</border>
      </borders>
      <coordinates>
         <smallx>88</smallx>
         <smally>88</smally>
         <largex>88</largex>
         <largey>88</largey>
      </coordinates>
   </territory>
   <territory>
      <name>Alaska</name>
      <borders>
         <border>Canada</border>
         <border>Siberia</border>
      </borders>
      <coordinates>
         <smallx>88</smallx>
         <smally>88</smally>
         <largex>88</largex>
         <largey>88</largey>
      </coordinates>
   </territory>
   <territory>
      <name>Greenland</name>
      <borders>
         <border>Quebec</border>
         <border>Scandinavia</border>
      </borders>
      <bombardments>
         <bombardment>China</bombardment>
         <bombardment>Siberia</bombardment>
         <bombardment>Central Russia</bombardment>
         <bombardment>Moscow</bombardment>
      </bombardments>
      <coordinates>
         <smallx>88</smallx>
         <smally>88</smally>
         <largex>88</largex>
         <largey>88</largey>
       </coordinates>
   </territory>
   
   <territory>
      <name>Scandinavia</name>
      <borders>
         <border>Greenland</border>
         <border>Western Europe</border>
         <border>Moscow</border>
      </borders>
      <coordinates>
         <smallx>88</smallx>
         <smally>88</smally>
         <largex>88</largex>
         <largey>88</largey>
     </coordinates>
   </territory>
   <territory>
      <name>Western Europe</name>
      <borders>
         <border>U.K.</border>
         <border>Scandinavia</border>
         <border>Eastern Bloc</border>
      </borders>
      <coordinates>
         <smallx>88</smallx>
         <smally>88</smally>
         <largex>88</largex>
         <largey>88</largey>
      </coordinates>
   </territory>
   <territory>
      <name>U.K.</name>
      <borders>
         <border>Eastern USA</border>
         <border>Western Europe</border>
      </borders>
      <coordinates>
         <smallx>88</smallx>
         <smally>88</smally>
         <largex>88</largex>
         <largey>88</largey>
      </coordinates>
   </territory>
   <territory>
      <name>Eastern Bloc</name>
      <borders>
         <border>Western Europe</border>
         <border>Moscow</border>
         <border>Turkey</border>
      </borders>
      <coordinates>
         <smallx>88</smallx>
         <smally>88</smally>
         <largex>88</largex>
         <largey>88</largey>
 </coordinates>
   </territory>
   <territory>
      <name>Moscow</name>
      <borders>
         <border>Eastern Bloc</border>
         <border>Scandinavia</border>
         <border>Central Russia</border>
         <border>Kazahk</border>
         <border>Turkey</border>
      </borders>
      <coordinates>
         <smallx>88</smallx>
         <smally>88</smally>
         <largex>88</largex>
         <largey>88</largey>
      </coordinates>
   </territory>
   <territory>
      <name>Central Russia</name>
      <borders>
         <border>Moscow</border>
         <border>Kazahk</border>
         <border>Siberia</border>
      </borders>
      <bombardments>
         <bombardment>Western USA</bombardment>
         <bombardment>Central USA</bombardment>
         <bombardment>Eastern USA</bombardment>
         <bombardment>Quebec</bombardment>
      </bombardments>
      <coordinates>
         <smallx>88</smallx>
         <smally>88</smally>
         <largex>88</largex>
         <largey>88</largey>
      </coordinates>
   </territory>
   <territory>
      <name>Kazahk</name>
      <borders>
         <border>Moscow</border>
         <border>Central Russia</border>
         <border>Siberia</border>
         <border>Persia</border>
         <border>India</border>
         <border>China</border>
         </borders>
      <coordinates>
         <smallx>88</smallx>
         <smally>88</smally>
         <largex>88</largex>
         <largey>88</largey>
     </coordinates>
   </territory>
   <territory>
      <name>Siberia</name>
      <borders>
         <border>China</border>
         <border>Kazahk</border>
         <border>Central Russia</border>
         <border>Alaska</border>         
      </borders>
      <bombardments>
         <bombardment>Western USA</bombardment>
         <bombardment>Central USA</bombardment>
         <bombardment>Eastern USA</bombardment>
         <bombardment>Quebec</bombardment>
      </bombardments>
      <coordinates>
         <smallx>88</smallx>
         <smally>88</smally>
         <largex>88</largex>
         <largey>88</largey>
      </coordinates>
   </territory>
   
   <territory>
      <name>China</name>
      <borders>
         <border>Japan</border>
         <border>Korea</border>
         <border>S.E. Asia</border>
         <border>India</border>
         <border>Kazahk</border>
         <border>Siberia</border>
      </borders>
      <coordinates>
         <smallx>88</smallx>
         <smally>88</smally>
         <largex>88</largex>
         <largey>352</largey>
    </coordinates>
   </territory>
   <territory>
      <name>S.E. Asia</name>
      <borders>
         <border>China</border>
         <border>India</border>
      </borders>
      <coordinates>
         <smallx>88</smallx>
         <smally>88</smally>
         <largex>88</largex>
         <largey>88</largey>
      </coordinates>
   </territory>
   <territory>
      <name>Japan</name>
      <borders>
         <border>Korea</border>
         <border>China</border>
      </borders>
      <coordinates>
         <smallx>88</smallx>
         <smally>88</smally>
         <largex>88</largex>
         <largey>88</largey>
      </coordinates>
   </territory>
   <territory>
      <name>Korea</name>
      <borders>
         <border>Japan</border>
         <border>China</border>
      </borders>
      <coordinates>
         <smallx>88</smallx>
         <smally>88</smally>
         <largex>88</largex>
         <largey>88</largey>
      </coordinates>
   </territory>
   <territory>
      <name>India</name>
      <borders>
         <border>S.E. Asia</border>
         <border>China</border>
         <border>Kazahk</border>
         <border>Persia</border>
      </borders>
      <coordinates>
         <smallx>88</smallx>
         <smally>88</smally>
         <largex>88</largex>
         <largey>88</largey>
      </coordinates>
   </territory>
   <territory>
      <name>Persia</name>
      <borders>
         <border>India</border>
         <border>Kazahk</border>
         <border>Turkey</border>
         <border>Arab States</border>
      </borders>
      <coordinates>
         <smallx>88</smallx>
         <smally>88</smally>
         <largex>88</largex>
         <largey>88</largey>
      </coordinates>
   </territory>
   <territory>
      <name>Turkey</name>
      <borders>
         <border>Persia</border>
         <border>Moscow</border>
         <border>Arab States</border>
         <border>Eastern Bloc</border>
      </borders>
      <coordinates>
         <smallx>88</smallx>
         <smally>88</smally>
         <largex>88</largex>
         <largey>88</largey>
      </coordinates>
   </territory>
   <territory>
      <name>Arab States</name>
      <borders>
         <border>Turkey</border>
         <border>Persia</border>
      </borders>
      <coordinates>
         <smallx>88</smallx>
         <smally>88</smally>
         <largex>88</largex>
         <largey>88</largey>
      </coordinates>
   </territory>
</map>
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Postby DiM on Sat Nov 03, 2007 12:46 pm

the "USA only" continent is kinda strange without Alaska.

i suggest adding mexico and call it lower north america and make it +3

also i'm not happy with persia. change the name to something modern. :wink:
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Postby oaktown on Sat Nov 03, 2007 2:13 pm

DiM wrote:the "USA only" continent is kinda strange without Alaska.

I agree, and I considered that, but this is much better for game play. Let's see what others have to say on this.

update: Alaska became a state in 1959, AFTER the time period of this map.

DiM wrote:i suggest adding mexico and call it lower north america and make it +3

Geo-politically that doesn't make sense, and this is a geo-political map rather than a straight geographic map. Any other thoughts on this??

DiM wrote:also i'm not happy with persia. change the name to something modern. :wink:

You're joking, Mr. Winky? Because I've wrestled with this one... In the 1950s Iran endorsed the use of both names, Iran and Persia, so using the older term lends more of a historical feel to the map. Plus, the borders around that territory don't correspond perfectly with iran, so I was going with more of a regional title.
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Postby wcaclimbing on Sat Nov 03, 2007 3:39 pm

I like it.

Sounds fun, but my only complaint is the color scheme.

right now it seems a little.....
missing something.

It just seems like its lacking in the color department. Have you tried changing/ adding any colors on the map?

maybe its just all the earth tones you have. red, orange, yellow, tan, brown, blue, all kinda pale looking.

It just doesnt "fit" the map, IMHO.
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Postby cairnswk on Sat Nov 03, 2007 4:14 pm

wcaclimbing wrote:I like it.

Sounds fun, but my only complaint is the color scheme.

right now it seems a little.....
missing something.

It just seems like its lacking in the color department. Have you tried changing/ adding any colors on the map?

maybe its just all the earth tones you have. red, orange, yellow, tan, brown, blue, all kinda pale looking.

It just doesnt "fit" the map, IMHO.


Oaktown...nice going! :)

I am kinda on board with waclimbing on this re the colour scheme, although i have no probs with the earth tones, but the purple is out of place in that. Perhaps use a similar brown to that used in the CDA logo...only a suggustion :idea:

Anyways, it seems you're well on the way with this with the xml done and all, so could we have a look at large and small together when you next do an update please.
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Postby spiesr on Sat Nov 03, 2007 4:19 pm

I like the color scheme...
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Postby oaktown on Sat Nov 03, 2007 5:29 pm

spiesr wrote:I like the color scheme...

Color isn't my strong point, so I'm willing to play with it and solicit more feedback... I pulled the existing color palette from old 1950s images I found on-line, but I agree that the purple is the weakest of the bunch.

Does nobody have any game play concerns?
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Postby cairnswk on Sat Nov 03, 2007 5:37 pm

oaktown wrote:
spiesr wrote:I like the color scheme...

Color isn't my strong point, so I'm willing to play with it and solicit more feedback... I pulled the existing color palette from old 1950s images I found on-line, but I agree that the purple is the weakest of the bunch.

Does nobody have any game play concerns?


Only thing i'd like to ask....was the middle east involved in the original map? I'm asking because i'm not familiar with this Duck & Cover concept...it's totally a US thing i guess.
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Postby oaktown on Sat Nov 03, 2007 6:02 pm

cairnswk wrote:Only thing i'd like to ask....was the middle east involved in the original map? I'm asking because i'm not familiar with this Duck & Cover concept...it's totally a US thing i guess.

The "original map" is whatever we make of it, but you raise the point that this is probably meaningless to many. For you who are unaware of the history behind this, the US Department of Civil Defense released a film in the early 50s called Duck and Cover, instructing kids how to stay safe if a nuclear bomb was dropped on their town/city. The film followed Bert the Turtle, a very careful little helmet-wearing fellow who dropped to the ground and tucked in his head when an evil monkey (Andy?) set off a stick of dynamite over his head. The film is absolutely awesome in its suspension of reality, telling kids that they'll know that a bomb has gone off if they see a bright flash of light - brighter than the sun, brighter than anything you've ever seen - but if they drop to the ground and cover their necks they'll be safe. Otherwise an atomic bomb could burn you worse than a sun burn!

Check it out on Youtube to experience a classic piece of 1950s Americana: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C0K_LZDXp0I

So there's no original map per se... I just wanted to do a polar view nuclear war map, and this made for a fun theme.

Here's a first look at the potential size of a small map, 580 x 580. I could go up to 600 x 600, but I think this is fine. Also note that I've replaced the purple... tell me if it's better. I'm still planning on adding more elements around the outside, and I have some ideas. :wink:

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Postby Gnome on Sat Nov 03, 2007 6:07 pm

I like purple better than the dark green...now the map looks darker and less attractive, sometimes brighter colours give people a good mood and they will be attracted by the map and be more eager to play it...That's what it do to me :wink:
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Postby cairnswk on Sat Nov 03, 2007 6:21 pm

Thanks for that Oaktown...good propoganda eh?
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Postby oaktown on Sat Nov 03, 2007 7:31 pm

Gnome wrote:I like purple better than the dark green...now the map looks darker and less attractive, sometimes brighter colours give people a good mood and they will be attracted by the map and be more eager to play it...That's what it do to me :wink:

i tend to agree, but for different reasons... i think the map is thrown off with heavy colors on the right and bright on the left. I'll keep playing.
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Postby asl80 on Sat Nov 03, 2007 8:54 pm

Colour Scheme’s perfect Oaktown. (Including the purple, [and on a second look; or the green])

Bonus change seems good for the US, maintains east/west split well.

Though I really don’t think those stars fit with the map.
They at least “sparkle” too much, make it look a little barbie-dollish, detract from the smoth finish of the map overall.
Maybee you could replace with a darker shade of the present colour, or texture it over the top of the same colour – but please, no stars, way to much going on there. Plain and simple's always a winner.

(Nice little movie, hehe, thanks for the link)

Good work, good luck. Cheers
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Postby d.gishman on Sat Nov 03, 2007 9:02 pm

I agree. I also do not like the stars.

However, the green i am good with
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Postby Coleman on Sat Nov 03, 2007 9:41 pm

Prefer the purple myself. Why does everyone try to get rid of purple!? First Canada now this. #-o
Warning: You may be reading a really old topic.
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Postby oaktown on Sun Nov 04, 2007 12:39 am

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Little changes:
• Purple is back, but in a better place (Europe). The Middle east is no longer the 'neutral' looking color.
• Nicer green on Asia.
• USA... no stars, but a more retro screen which could simulate a field of stars
• Tree lifted from the film... I think it helps work Bert into the overall image.
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Postby AndyDufresne on Sun Nov 04, 2007 12:59 am

I like the way it is looking, Oaktown.

I'd consider instead of using little dots...perhaps diagonal lines ///// to differentiate between USA and Not.

Perhaps also add a black outline around your mushroom clouds...though those clouds look a little odd to me...more like trees I use to draw in grade school :)

Otherwise the game play is looking pretty nice...I think this map is on its way :)


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Postby yamahafazer on Sun Nov 04, 2007 9:05 am

It's all looking good to me Oaktown... Nice work :D
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Postby unriggable on Sun Nov 04, 2007 9:16 am

Insteead of those dots make a special border going around the USA that doesn't go around any other N.A countries.
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Postby asl80 on Sun Nov 04, 2007 9:45 am

The dots were a good revision, but i wouldn't mind seeing the dots as the same colour as the grey territory borders, but perhaps a shade lighter. Otherwise give andy's lines suggestion a look.
(Hmmm ... feeling a little odd with all this picking and choosing ... "No Dorris, the red handbag really matches your outfit, the deep tones definitely bring out the blue in your eyes") hmmmm

But inhibitions aside, i persist ...
Not sure ol' Bert needs to hang out by the tree, reakon he was doing just fine by himself, been an independent bloke and all ... (i've seen him duck and cover - very manly).

Also, is his speech bubble purposively yellow in order to link it with the yellow of the US, if not ... reakon it should remain as the whitey/creamy background colour. Leave the colour for the playing space, for which our eyes can be naturally drawn to ... other wise the speech bubble's too "front and centre". (Don''t want to be reading it over and over again sub consciously - probably an over-exaggeration, but worth considering nonetheless)
[EDIT: Haha, but i'm perfectly happy reading the jingle above deep into the resceses of my sub conscious to surface five years from now while sitting bored on a train]
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