[Official] Canada REVAMP [Quenched]

Keredrex · Post by **Keredrex** » Fri Sep 14, 2007 1:11 am

How about narrowing it down... vote for the top 3 or 4.... let the cartographers fix the maps based on feedback.....then have one last round of votes for the one that gets the The trophy

DiM · Post by **DiM** » Fri Sep 14, 2007 8:36 am

Keredrex wrote:How about narrowing it down... vote for the top 3 or 4.... let the cartographers fix the maps based on feedback.....then have one last round of votes for the one that gets the The trophy

good idea.

MR. Nate · Post by **MR. Nate** » Fri Sep 14, 2007 8:47 am

Really, you want more effort into maps that won't make the final cut? How about letting those cartographers remake something else?

DiM · Post by **DiM** » Fri Sep 14, 2007 8:52 am

MR. Nate wrote:Really, you want more effort into maps that won't make the final cut? How about letting those cartographers remake something else?

the revamp competition already means dozens of hours spent on something that goes to waste. i'm sure they wouldn't mind working a few extra hours if that might ensure their win.

plus some maps might get huge improvements while others might not. i'd hate to see a map with huge potential go to waste because the guy that made it made a spelling mistake or that he made threw the legend in a hurry. a poorly place legend that can be corrected in 30 seconds can ruin a perfectly good map's chances of winning probably to a map that is more carefully produced but lacks the feeling and potential of the first one.

MR. Nate · Post by **MR. Nate** » Fri Sep 14, 2007 9:13 am

I guess I'm not convinced that getting rid of 2, and asking for improvements is going to significantly change what people vote for. I think we're all aware that whichever map wins, it still has to make it through Final Forge. If a cartographer doesn't bring their best effort to the competition, then they probably don't deserve a second chance.

In any case, I don't think that the 4 maps currently in the lead are going to need major changes. Some people have expressed possibly one or two things that are questions about a particular map, but nothing so glaring as to turn off large numbers of voters.

Coleman · Post by **Coleman** » Fri Sep 14, 2007 9:56 am

After looking at things more I really wish I could change my vote from F to D. I doubt that would change anything though.

I would like to see the top 3 with small maps supplied though in a new vote, but I doubt KEYOGI will do that.

DiM · Post by **DiM** » Fri Sep 14, 2007 9:58 am

MR. Nate wrote:I guess I'm not convinced that getting rid of 2, and asking for improvements is going to significantly change what people vote for. I think we're all aware that whichever map wins, it still has to make it through Final Forge. If a cartographer doesn't bring their best effort to the competition, then they probably don't deserve a second chance.

In any case, I don't think that the 4 maps currently in the lead are going to need major changes. Some people have expressed possibly one or two things that are questions about a particular map, but nothing so glaring as to turn off large numbers of voters.

who knows? i guess the only way to find out is if we try it. but prior to that perhaps a survey between cartographers should be done if they are willing to invest time and effort to further improve their maps if it is chosen for a revamp to go through 2 stages.

the whole revamp thing is for graphics only and since graphics are the most important here i think it's safe to say the first impression is really important. most people will cast their vote after a 30 second glance over the maps very few stay and watch carefully each map and then decide.

let's take a quick glance:
A: too much red
B: too shiny in the center
C: too white
D: too dark
E: is the water frozen? too bright
F: too spacy
wooo a shiny water alien map i'll vote for that.

oh crap it's not in the poll. oh well i'll vote for the google earth thingy cause it looks cool.

i'm willing to bet an arm and a leg that if wm mock map would have been added in the poll it would have amassed more votes than all other maps put together.

now let's take a better look:

A: yes it has a lot of red by that can be solve with 2 clicks. the beaver and coin could be removed and the text tweaked. but look at those nice maple leaves. smart thinking. overall a nice crisp touch
B: global lighting could use a reposition or a dampening and the title and legend should be repositioned. but i love the nice touch and especially the gorgeous mountains
C: perhaps a more pastelated chart of color could help this map. love the elevation chart and the representation. nifty idea.
D: the darkness is really cool. looks grungy. but it could use a bit of a gradient feel to it. perhaps it's a bit too strong. keep the feel but make it less.
E: too bright looking. perhaps darkening the water a bit would look better. and the mountains could use some tweaking as they seem to be the focal point of the map because of the contrast. love the title. nice gimmick
F: the borders are too blurry and in many places they aren't true to the background image. and the mountain pass simply scratches the eye. also while adding the maple leaf in the title might seem nice it actually isn't why only the second A is a leaf? why not all? it actually makes you read it as canOda. but look at how cool the earth looks. it makes you really see how big canada is. very nice.

Coleman · Post by **Coleman** » Fri Sep 14, 2007 10:02 am

I think we are seeing a lot of. "WOW THAT SPACE MAP LOOKS FREAKING AWESOME!" without people really considering it. That's how polls go I guess.

DiM · Post by **DiM** » Fri Sep 14, 2007 11:12 am

Coleman wrote:I think we are seeing a lot of. "WOW THAT SPACE MAP LOOKS FREAKING AWESOME!" without people really considering it. That's how polls go I guess.

exactly. in revamps it's all about first impressions. that's why i earlier said wm's alien thing would have surely won. people don't vote based on analysis.

i personally wanted to join this revamp and do an animated map. like a short movie. not for winning but precisely for having fun and showing how an unserious map would win. i talked all the details with gimil. and the plan was perfect but then i totally forgot about it

gimil reminded me about it just 12 hours before the deadline so i had to forfeit.

the best solution for a revamp competition would be if all maps were revealed but no voting option. they would just be displayed for public comment. perhaps each with it's own thread. then for a week each of the cartographers (anonymously of course) would respond to the feedbacks and do modifications. only after that we would have a poll.
as i said the first impression is too important.

MR. Nate · Post by **MR. Nate** » Fri Sep 14, 2007 11:57 am

DiM wrote:the whole revamp thing is for graphics only and since graphics are the most important here i think it's safe to say the first impression is really important. most people will cast their vote after a 30 second glance over the maps very few stay and watch carefully each map and then decide.

DiM wrote:exactly. in revamps it's all about first impressions. that's why i earlier said wm's alien thing would have surely won. people don't vote based on analysis.

the best solution for a revamp competition would be if all maps were revealed but no voting option. they would just be displayed for public comment. perhaps each with it's own thread. then for a week each of the cartographers (anonymously of course) would respond to the feedbacks and do modifications. only after that we would have a poll.
as i said the first impression is too important.

Seems a little presumptuous to assume that no one thinks about their vote before they cast it. The foundry seems to be frequented by a number of people who take the process seriously. I certainly looked at the creativity and originality of each map, as well as the changes and the potential before casting my vote. In addition, that first impression is the same once the map is available for play. I'm sure many people just glance over a map once before deciding if they're going to play it.

I think that the excellence of all of the maps bears out the fact that the current process of voting on revamps is working.

Gozar · Post by **Gozar** » Fri Sep 14, 2007 11:58 am

The impassable blizzard in "C" made me smile.

DiM · Post by **DiM** » Fri Sep 14, 2007 12:02 pm

MR. Nate wrote:
DiM wrote:the whole revamp thing is for graphics only and since graphics are the most important here i think it's safe to say the first impression is really important. most people will cast their vote after a 30 second glance over the maps very few stay and watch carefully each map and then decide.

DiM wrote:exactly. in revamps it's all about first impressions. that's why i earlier said wm's alien thing would have surely won. people don't vote based on analysis.

the best solution for a revamp competition would be if all maps were revealed but no voting option. they would just be displayed for public comment. perhaps each with it's own thread. then for a week each of the cartographers (anonymously of course) would respond to the feedbacks and do modifications. only after that we would have a poll.
as i said the first impression is too important.
Seems a little presumptuous to assume that no one thinks about their vote before they cast it. The foundry seems to be frequented by a number of people who take the process seriously. I certainly looked at the creativity and originality of each map, as well as the changes and the potential before casting my vote. In addition, that first impression is the same once the map is available for play. I'm sure many people just glance over a map once before deciding if they're going to play it.

I think that the excellence of all of the maps bears out the fact that the current process of voting on revamps is working.

i didn't say all people do that i just said most do. and i repeat i'm willing to bet an arm and a leg on that one.

you say the foundry is visited by people that take this process seriously but how many do that? would you say 10-20? i've seen polls with 200 votes. do you really think those 200 votes all came from people that profoundly get involved in the foundry process? i don't.

Coleman · Post by **Coleman** » Fri Sep 14, 2007 12:45 pm

Better not get to into that or you get into the fact the entire governmental system of democracy is flawed at its core. The United States would collapse. :lol:

d.gishman · Post by **d.gishman** » Fri Sep 14, 2007 4:10 pm

F seems to be the clear winner, but I preferred C because it looked nice, but kept the style of the older map.

gimil · Post by **gimil** » Fri Sep 14, 2007 4:19 pm

im intrested to see where the source image for F is. Its an excellent image. However im seeing a possible problem. Is this image copyrighted? if so is there permission to use the image?

casper · Post by **casper** » Fri Sep 14, 2007 7:19 pm

Where's the NONE vote option? The original is better than any of these imo. I would vote for A if it weren't for the goofy random coin & beaver + missing Greenland. And F looks terrible imo.

super steve · Post by **super steve** » Fri Sep 14, 2007 8:02 pm

personally, i think the alien-underwater one is the best. too bad we can't vote for it.

i like the style of F a lot (and i voted for it), but it seems a little bit like that of San Francisco. F is perhaps a bit too spacey...

and I agree kind of with casper: we don't NEED a revamp on Canada, do we?
many other maps need it much more, such as africa, brazil, germany, and others. (i guess there's already revamps going for one or two of those...)

oh well, like someone said earlier, i suppose all of the maps will get revamped eventually....

oaktown · Post by **oaktown** » Sun Sep 16, 2007 10:00 am

F is cruising... the above remark about copyright is a possible concern.

I assume there will be a Final Forge stage on whichever map is chosen? There are some potential issues with F (and all of them probably) such as the size of the army ovals.

Unit_2 · Post by **Unit_2** » Sun Sep 16, 2007 10:24 am

did you guys see that the names of Quebec and Ontario are back-words in F?

oaktown · Post by **oaktown** » Sun Sep 16, 2007 10:28 am

Unit_2 wrote:did you guys see that the names of Quebec and Ontario are back-words in F?

indeed... like I said, there's going to have to be a Final Forge stage for whichever map wins.

hulmey · Post by **hulmey** » Sun Sep 16, 2007 10:39 am

and a long one coz they all need alot of work!!!

jako · Post by **jako** » Sun Sep 16, 2007 12:59 pm

Unit_2 wrote:did you guys see that the names of Quebec and Ontario are back-words in F?

backwords?

seriously, im looking over it 5 times now, and i cant see which are backwards. i even went back to check the original, but i still cant see what backwards names u are refering to in quebec and bc.

unriggable · Post by **unriggable** » Sun Sep 16, 2007 1:18 pm

I think D should...

Army circles and angle of F is screwy.

Keredrex · Post by **Keredrex** » Sun Sep 16, 2007 11:07 pm

jako wrote:
Unit_2 wrote:did you guys see that the names of Quebec and Ontario are back-words in F?

backwords?

seriously, im looking over it 5 times now, and i cant see which are backwards. i even went back to check the original, but i still cant see what backwards names u are refering to in quebec and bc.

he is referring to the bonus legend..... he swapped the colors of quebec and ontario

oaktown · Post by **oaktown** » Sun Sep 16, 2007 11:52 pm

unriggable wrote:Army circles and angle of F is screwy.

I think they're army footballs, not army circles.

And yeah, F will take some getting used to, but i appreciate that it's different from everything else we have. The other options just look like the current Canada map with softer colors.

[Official] Canada REVAMP [Quenched]

Idea

Re: Idea