Balance Not Included Come Back Mafia End Game: Mod Down!!!

[Skoffin]

Hiders die if the person they hide behind gets killed. I hid behind Chu because I was pretty sure he's scum and thus not gonna kill himself XD

[Fircoal]

Hiders die if the person they hide behind gets killed. I hid behind Chu because I was pretty sure he's scum and thus not gonna kill himself XD

Not according to mafiascum wiki: https://wiki.mafiascum.net/index.php?title=Hider

"The Hider has the ability to target one player each night. It is a Weak role and as such will die if it targets mafia. In case the hider targets a town-alligned player, he or she will be untargetable for all other roles. However, that does not mean the hider is entirely safe: should the person he or she is hiding behind get shot, the hider will be shot as well. This only goes for a nightkill. "


Hey Skoffin what's your name?

[Skoffin]

That was not the information that my role PM gave me. I was told that each night I could pick someone to hide behind and no actions could target me, however if the person I hide behind is killed then I die too.

If you apparently knew that hiders can't target mafia then why didn't anyone ask me who I hid behind so that we could have cleared Sam? Seems too convenient to try and cast doubt on my role now. In any case I'll clarify with the mod on my role, however as it is not stated in my PM that I can't hide behind mafia I am for now assuming that my initial assumption is correct.

My name is A Frightened Cat. Hey chu, why don't you actually tell us how your role works?

[Skoffin]

Looks like you win this round Chu. Mod confirms I'm supposed to die if I hide behind mafia, so it looks like you can't be scum then.

[DirtyDishSoap]

Then this leave Mets, and possibly dakky

[Metsfanmax]

Looks like you win this round Chu. Mod confirms I'm supposed to die if I hide behind mafia, so it looks like you can't be scum then.

Do you know that you actually hid behind Fircoal last night, i.e. that you weren't redirected or roleblocked?

[Fircoal]

Looks like you win this round Chu. Mod confirms I'm supposed to die if I hide behind mafia, so it looks like you can't be scum then.

Do I still need to reveal my role? As I stated before I'd rather not. That said... Can you hide with the same person multiple nights in a row?

[Metsfanmax]

Then this leave Mets, and possibly dakky

It... also leaves Skoffin. We don't have any evidence of Skoffin's innocence or even proof of telling the truth about the hider role.

[Fircoal]

Looks like you win this round Chu. Mod confirms I'm supposed to die if I hide behind mafia, so it looks like you can't be scum then.

Do you know that you actually hid behind Fircoal last night, i.e. that you weren't redirected or roleblocked?

Given what people are claiming redirection seems very unlikely. Roleblocking could happen although it's a really weird choice if Skoffin is town and the don't end up killing her. It'd be wasting a roleblock.

[Fircoal]

Mets what is your role name?

[Fircoal]

Mets what is your role name?

Or name in general actually. Like how I am Diamond and Sam was Hated Extra #5

[Metsfanmax]

Looks like you win this round Chu. Mod confirms I'm supposed to die if I hide behind mafia, so it looks like you can't be scum then.

Do you know that you actually hid behind Fircoal last night, i.e. that you weren't redirected or roleblocked?

Given what people are claiming redirection seems very unlikely. Roleblocking could happen although it's a really weird choice if Skoffin is town and the don't end up killing her. It'd be wasting a roleblock.

Yes, unless the roleblock is what was redirected.

[Metsfanmax]

Mets what is your role name?

My role name is Dr. Egg.

[Skoffin]

I was specifically told that any actions that went to me would miss, so I take it that any redirect/roleblocks would not be able to touch me. I am essentially untouchable unless the person I hide behind is killed.
This means Chu would have to be town as no one could have interfered with where I went. The only other possibility is that, considering Nag's action got confused with Fircoal, is that my action and Nag's got mixed up. I'll check that this is not the case, but for now it appears chu is cleared.

If anyone actually wants to humour the possibility that I might be scum then I'm willing to do the effort to smack that notion down, I'm fairly sure I should be looking plenty town compared to most chaps here by now. lul

[DirtyDishSoap]

Then this leave Mets, and possibly dakky

It... also leaves Skoffin. We don't have any evidence of Skoffin's innocence or even proof of telling the truth about the hider role.

Given how you've played all game, I'll take Skoffins word over yours.

[Metsfanmax]

I was specifically told that any actions that went to me would miss, so I take it that any redirect/roleblocks would not be able to touch me. I am essentially untouchable unless the person I hide behind is killed.
This means Chu would have to be town as no one could have interfered with where I went. The only other possibility is that, considering Nag's action got confused with Fircoal, is that my action and Nag's got mixed up. I'll check that this is not the case, but for now it appears chu is cleared.

If anyone actually wants to humour the possibility that I might be scum then I'm willing to do the effort to smack that notion down, I'm fairly sure I should be looking plenty town compared to most chaps here by now. lul

I'm certainly humoring the possibility. Until Fircoal was allegedly cleared you were pushing on him pretty hard, which I have found scummy given that I think Fircoal is town. (Your action last night would have made you look more like town if you had understood that you would die by hiding behind mafia.) You were also absent from the Ragian lynch. So, given that you've claimed a role that is difficult or impossible to prove/disprove, you are very far from looking town.

[Metsfanmax]

Then this leave Mets, and possibly dakky

It... also leaves Skoffin. We don't have any evidence of Skoffin's innocence or even proof of telling the truth about the hider role.

Given how you've played all game, I'll take Skoffins word over yours.

This is the most impressively long incident of OMGUS that I've ever seen.

[Skoffin]

I was specifically told that any actions that went to me would miss, so I take it that any redirect/roleblocks would not be able to touch me. I am essentially untouchable unless the person I hide behind is killed.
This means Chu would have to be town as no one could have interfered with where I went. The only other possibility is that, considering Nag's action got confused with Fircoal, is that my action and Nag's got mixed up. I'll check that this is not the case, but for now it appears chu is cleared.

If anyone actually wants to humour the possibility that I might be scum then I'm willing to do the effort to smack that notion down, I'm fairly sure I should be looking plenty town compared to most chaps here by now. lul

I'm certainly humoring the possibility. Until Fircoal was allegedly cleared you were pushing on him pretty hard, which I have found scummy given that I think Fircoal is town. (Your action last night would have made you look more like town if you had understood that you would die by hiding behind mafia.) You were also absent from the Ragian lynch. So, given that you've claimed a role that is difficult or impossible to prove/disprove, you are very far from looking town.

Chu was acting in a way I found suspicious, and circumstances and evidence at the time pointed to him being a good possibility. Is your notion that I pushed this hard on Chu to then do a 180 and declare him cleared town? You leave out that I spent almost all of the previous day trying to stop people from voting Sam and even showed how based on actions that Sam could not have made a night kill, which you blatantly left out of your analysis here. My lack of 'understanding' of my role is not on me as I read over my role and accepted it as written, there was no mention of me dying from hiding behind scum as that was left out of my PM and as such that can not be blamed on me. If I were going to go to the trouble of faking a role surely you'd expect me to have actually googled the role first. I'm not a muppet after all. Do you legitimately think I, as scum, would have half arsed it like that?

[Skoffin]

Also of note: My role can actually be proved or disproved. All you need is to have someone target me and see what message you get in return.

[Metsfanmax]

Also of note: My role can actually be proved or disproved. All you need is to have someone target me and see what message you get in return.

Most people don't get a message confirming their action unless they're a cop. And at any rate, even if this was proved, it wouldn't speak to your alignment.

Chu was acting in a way I found suspicious, and circumstances and evidence at the time pointed to him being a good possibility. Is your notion that I pushed this hard on Chu to then do a 180 and declare him cleared town?

That is one possible explanation, yes. It could have happened this way regardless of whether Fircoal is town or scum.

You leave out that I spent almost all of the previous day trying to stop people from voting Sam and even showed how based on actions that Sam could not have made a night kill, which you blatantly left out of your analysis here.

At least for me, the case on Samlen never hinged on whether Sam made a night kill. I was upfront until the end that I was far from confident regarding Samlen, I voted for him because we needed a lynch and I found his posting habits the scummiest of the possible lynch candidates. (Which wasn't very much, but it was what I had to go on at the time.) I don't think anything you did yesterday should have been interpreted as clearing Sam as scum, only as clearing Sam of the specific thing that everyone was hung up on.

My lack of 'understanding' of my role is not on me as I read over my role and accepted it as written, there was no mention of me dying from hiding behind scum as that was left out of my PM and as such that can not be blamed on me. If I were going to go to the trouble of faking a role surely you'd expect me to have actually googled the role first. I'm not a muppet after all. Do you legitimately think I, as scum, would have half arsed it like that?

How about we consider that you have in fact modded a game that had a Hider in it, and AFAICT that Hider died because they hid behind mafia. So, yeah. Kind of looking like a muppet.

[Skoffin]

* People usually do get a message that their action failed.

* I think your argument there is fairly reaching

* I did not clear Sam no, my point was that I proved that Sam most definitely did not make the night kill which further reduced the likelihood of him being scum. If we have one scum left then Sam was innocent by default,
if we have two scum then Sam wasn't an ideal candidate regardless. Your argument here seems to be that I, as scum, spent all day trying to stop a lynch on town Sam to instead try to lynch town Chu when there was no benefit to me doing so. And I can't help but notice my apparent scumminess to you only shows up after I listed you as one of the other possibilities of being scum if Chu was not scum.

* You are expecting me to remember the details of a role from about 9 years ago? I go by what my role PM specifically states as I assume a mod will give me all the relevant details of my role. I cannot and should not be expected to google my role every single game to make sure I have all the correct info. If the notion is that I am scum and lying about my role, then the apparent argument here is that I didn't bother to google the role to ensure I was claiming it correctly first. Considering I have literally gone after people for having flaws in their roleclaims and have lynched them for it it would be pretty poor of me not to fact check my claims first.

[Skoffin]

The only other possibility is that something was done in regards to chu that meant I did not go there. Ie he was driven with another person.
Nag's role only steals a persons action or whole role for the night? I don't know if that would have had an effect on me visiting chu.
Did anyone else target chu in any way?
If not, either Chu is solid town or Chu has a role swapping power. Chu I would like to know your role still.

[legionnare]

Can confirm that I targeted DDS, so no role swapping etc going on there.
@Nag I targeted DDS as I still found him to be suspect by the end of D2

[Metsfanmax]

The only other possibility is that something was done in regards to chu that meant I did not go there. Ie he was driven with another person.
Nag's role only steals a persons action or whole role for the night? I don't know if that would have had an effect on me visiting chu.
Did anyone else target chu in any way?
If not, either Chu is solid town or Chu has a role swapping power. Chu I would like to know your role still.

Skoffin, I have an idea (assuming for the moment I trust that you're really a town hider). You should pre-announce who you are going to visit before the night starts. That way, if you die, and the scene reveals it was because you hid behind mafia (it would usually reveal this), we have possible evidence that the person you hid behind is scum. There's no sense in you dying without us getting any information out of it. There's little risk to you in this if you are who you say you are, AFAICT, and helping reveal scum would be worth it even if you ended up dying over it.

[Metsfanmax]

The only other possibility is that something was done in regards to chu that meant I did not go there. Ie he was driven with another person.
Nag's role only steals a persons action or whole role for the night? I don't know if that would have had an effect on me visiting chu.
Did anyone else target chu in any way?
If not, either Chu is solid town or Chu has a role swapping power. Chu I would like to know your role still.

Skoffin, I have an idea (assuming for the moment I trust that you're really a town hider). You should pre-announce who you are going to visit before the night starts. That way, if you die, and the scene reveals it was because you hid behind mafia (it would usually reveal this), we have possible evidence that the person you hid behind is scum. There's no sense in you dying without us getting any information out of it. There's little risk to you in this if you are who you say you are, AFAICT, and helping reveal scum would be worth it even if you ended up dying over it.

Wait, I guess that doesn't work because scum can then just target the person you're hiding behind for the kill. Nvm. Derp.