Conquer Club Olympics

[dazza2008]

Surely the rules have been the same for all so does any of this matter? I think some might be missing the whole point. Is this not for fun?

[Electricksabers]

I am sorry you didn't OBVERSE the guidelines correctly as they were WRITTEN. Maybe instead of waiting 11 days to ask for the rules to be changed, you should have asked for clarification like the person did in the post I linked earlier. But what do I know, you are obviously smarter than me because you can use cool smileys.

[Electricksabers]

Surely the rules have been the same for all so does any of this matter? I think some might be missing the whole point. Is this not for fun?

Yes they are the same for everyone, Josko missed some tourneys, so now he is trying to get the rules changed so he can make them up.

I'm having a lot of fun, even harassing Josko it fun.

[josko.ri]

Surely the rules have been the same for all so does any of this matter? I think some might be missing the whole point. Is this not for fun?

Yes they are the same for everyone, Josko missed some tourneys, so now he is trying to get the rules changed so he can make them up.

I'm having a lot of fun, even harassing Josko it fun.

This is not correct, I am only asking that rules be followed on the way how they were written in guidelines:

This is the post that will have all the details of tournaments.

The Opening Ceremonies start tonight at 9 PM and run until noon tomorrow.
At midnight, speed tournaments will start and will be open for 24 hours. A new one will start every day of the event.
At noon, a casual tournament will enter signups.

When one of the autos fills, another one will be created within the hour after it fills.

As underlined within the quote, it was not determined that casual tournaments will be opened for only 1 day, so I am asking to reopen them again because some players managed their joining plans with expectation that casual tournaments will be opened during the entire duration of the event.

In addition, "Opening ceremonies" tournament, which had the most participants than any other tournament, was reopened afterwards even though for that tournament it was clearly announced closing time, as quoted in the above post.
If reopening can be done for the tournament where the most players joined (so the least players missed joining opportunity) and where closing time was clearly announced, then other casual tournaments where closing time was not announced should be reopened as well.

[Bishup]

Dude, if u were confused, so was I. But it only took one day to understand the cycle, and that is probobly why the first day tourney was put back up. All these complaints, not everyone can be happy, so relax and stop thinking ur interpretation of the rules or what should happen is the correct one... And what's up with the dude saying too many tourneys?!?
I'm enjoying the hell outa this. Gonna be sad to see it stop

[josko.ri]

I'm enjoying the hell outa this. Gonna be sad to see it stop

I cannot see how reopening casual tournament would stop your enjoyment.
That would only give to others who had missed some of tournaments because it was not determined that they will be opened only for one day, to also have fun like you are having.

I am not asking for any special service or whatever, I am just asking to follow rules and give to everyone equal participation opportunity.
I do not see how that would ruin anyone's fun in this tournament (nobody will miss his/her own fun).
I only see how the ones who did not join casual tournaments during short and unannounced 1 day, would also get their part of fun to fully participate in this event.

[apprich]

would be nice to see complete list of all scored countries.

[DoomYoshi]

As has been said, it will not take more than a day to figure out how stuff works. I agree that it was unclear. Unclear doesn't mean that it ends up being whatever is most convenient to those who gripe. One could argue by the same reasoning that the casuals should be open perpetually, long after we are all dead.

The rules may seem to have changed, but they are only becoming clarified.

Opening Ceremonies was opened longer, as it only had an initial period of 16 hours.

What josko initially said to me (via PM) was

Also, it would be nice if you post tournaments with participation bonuses in later days, so the ones who were busy in opening days of the tournament can catch more participation bonuses.

In a few days, his entire story and strategy has changed.

[Ffraid]

...Sunday is the last day. The Closing Ceremonies will open up then...

Did this happen? I tried off and on from noon 'til around 3 CC time and only saw Mini Flonkerton. I just got home (around 10 pm CC time) and tried again to find no casual auto tourneys.

[josko.ri]

What josko initially said to me (via PM) was

Also, it would be nice if you post tournaments with participation bonuses in later days, so the ones who were busy in opening days of the tournament can catch more participation bonuses.

In a few days, his entire story and strategy has changed.

What I initially said to you via pm is the same like what I initially proposed in this post: http://www.conquerclub.com/forum/viewto ... 5#p4531088
1. This was suggestion, which follows common sense, as described in my reasoning from points (1)~(3) in the linked post. My suggestion was to reopen all tournaments, including speed ones. Point of suggestion is to make other players and organizers aware of what I consider common sense, and then if all players agree with the suggestion then it may be accepted and that was my hope. However, shaneback disagreed with the suggestion and he justified his disagreement with written rules where it is said "speed tournaments will start and will be open for 24 hours", which he had totally right and that is why I accepted that the suggestion was rejected.

2. However, after I accepted his argument which meant that my suggestion was rejected, the next what I did was request, not suggestion, starting from this post: http://www.conquerclub.com/forum/viewto ... 5#p4531215
Everyone had right to disagree with my suggestion because their disagreement is backed up in rules which states that speed tournaments will be opened for 24 hours.
But, I also have right to request organizers to follow other part of rules, where it was not determined that casual tournaments will also be run for 24 hours.
So, I did not change my story how you want to show but I changed my way of communication from suggestion which had one content, to request which had another content. pm sent to you as well as my first post in this topic belong to suggestion part.

Opening Ceremonies was opened longer, as it only had an initial period of 16 hours.

In other news, partially by popular request, the opening ceremonies will be rerun over the next 3 days at secret intervals!

This argument justifies why you should reopen that tournament for 8 hours if you want to stick to 24 hours period for every tournament. However, your decision was to reopen it for 3 days (!) so I do not see how that can be justified nor how that can be under your determined rules.
If you reopen one casual tournament but do not reopen others, that is clear abuse of participation rights of players who missed their chance to join in other casual tournaments.

Players plan their strategy and timing in the tournament according to what is written in the rules. If rules states for only 1 type of tournament that it will be open for 24 hours, logically that means that others will be opened for more than 24 hours. Why would you determine 24 hours period only for 1 type of tournament when you can also say "All auto-tournaments will be opened for 24 hours"? That wording would solve all uncertainties.
In addition, all manually run casual tournaments which are joined through forum have more than 24 hours open period, so that is reason more to conclude that the same will be the case with automatic casual tournaments.

In my case, missing tournaments "Assdoodling", "Banjo Wrestling", MegaBarge Racing", "Oxen Jousting", "Regalia Wearing" is completely my fault because rules clearly said that these tournaments will be opened for only 24 hours, so I was completely aware that being busy on days when they were running will mean that I will not participate in them. That was my choice and I accept consequences for being missed from these tournaments.

However, for "Human Catapulting", "Nuclear Gnarling", "Uranium Enriching", "Wheelchair Slalom", "Zombie Baseball" as well as all casual tournaments, I had already counted on the first day of the event that they will be opened throughout the whole tournament, so I planned my time to join them later when my schedule becomes more flexible. Later on, I have realized that organizer is not following rules on the way as they were written so I have requested it to be followed.

The rules may seem to have changed, but they are only becoming clarified.

Even today, 15 days after the event started, second post still looks like this:

This is the post that will have all the details of tournaments.

The Opening Ceremonies start tonight at 9 PM and run until noon tomorrow.
At midnight, speed tournaments will start and will be open for 24 hours. A new one will start every day of the event.
At noon, a casual tournament will enter signups.

When one of the autos fills, another one will be created within the hour after it fills.

So even today, it says that it contains all the details of the tournament, yet it does not say that casual tournaments will be opened for only 24 hours but it says for Speed and for Opening Ceremonies only. So I do not really see that rules have been clarified, as you are pointing here. They are still the same like they have been on the first day, without further clarification.

If you run an event where players spend huge amount of their time like this event with 30 tournaments, then you should ensure that they are all equally treated by rules. If someone decides to participate in event which is consisted of 30 tournaments, that means he decided to devote huge amount of his time for participation. Players plan their participation strategy according to rules and that is what I did, to find out later that rules were not followed on the way how they were written.

Fault of not having time to join speed tournaments is my fault and I accept consequences for that.
Fault for writing rules on the way which you did is your fault and you should accept consequences for that and conduct rules on the way how they were written, not penalize players who planned their joining strategy by following your rules.
Not following your own wording of rules leads to huge inequality in how players were treated in this event.

[DoomYoshi]

At my local grocery store, there is a sign that says "No dogs allowed". It does not expressly prohibit bringing my Giraffe. Therefore, giraffes must be allowed in the grocery store. In fact, you are not allowed to shop without a giraffe. That is why I am now starving.

[dazza2008]

At my local grocery store, there is a sign that says "No dogs allowed". It does not expressly prohibit bringing my Giraffe. Therefore, giraffes must be allowed in the grocery store. In fact, you are not allowed to shop without a giraffe. That is why I am now starving.

Can you not get some food delivered?

[osman76]

I see a platinum medal won at the scoreboard (Graeko). Which tournament gave this medal?

[josko.ri]

At my local grocery store, there is a sign that says "No dogs allowed". It does not expressly prohibit bringing my Giraffe. Therefore, giraffes must be allowed in the grocery store. In fact, you are not allowed to shop without a giraffe. That is why I am now starving.

Your grocery store did not write "This sign determines all rules of our grocery store".
If they did write that in addition "No dogs allowed", then you would be welcome to enter with giraffe.

However, in your case second post starts with "This is the post that will have all the details of tournaments."
In case when the post has all details of tournaments and is not determined that casual tournaments will last for 24 hours (which is determined for all other types of tournaments), it clearly means that rule does not apply for casual tournaments.

I request you one more time to accept responsibility for your own poor wording (obviosuly you thought one thing in you head but determined other thing in rules) and to allow players who were following your poor worded rules to fairly participate in this event. Anyone's participation rights shouldn't be abused because of your poor wording.

[tokle]

How is it determined who advances when there is a tie to the scores in these automatic tourneys?
Is it just random?

[Royal Panda]

How is it determined who advances when there is a tie to the scores in these automatic tourneys?
Is it just random?

http://www.conquerclub.com/player.php?m ... d=14714800

If you're talking about this one, I think it's absolutely bullshit that I got eliminated despite beating ltiyank 3-2 in the last round, and we both finished on 10 points after that. Surely head-to-head should be the first tiebreaker?

The way the tournament was set up, I think they had intended to put in a score reset rule in but forgot. Why else make each round out of 5? It's pretty obvious this was intended to be a best of 5, winner advances competition. I won every one of my rounds yet get eliminated in favour of the guy I beat in Round 3!

[Dukasaur]

How is it determined who advances when there is a tie to the scores in these automatic tourneys?
Is it just random?

http://www.conquerclub.com/public.php?mode=tournaments5

Ties in Score shall be broken by the following rules, applied in order:

• Percentage of wins in the tournament as a whole
• The cumulative number of Game rounds required to win the games they have won in the tournament (winning in less rounds is better)
• The order in which the player joined the tournament (first player to join wins)

[Dukasaur]

How is it determined who advances when there is a tie to the scores in these automatic tourneys?
Is it just random?

http://www.conquerclub.com/player.php?m ... d=14714800

If you're talking about this one, I think it's absolutely bullshit that I got eliminated despite beating ltiyank 3-2 in the last round, and we both finished on 10 points after that. Surely head-to-head should be the first tiebreaker?

The way the tournament was set up, I think they had intended to put in a score reset rule in but forgot. Why else make each round out of 5? It's pretty obvious this was intended to be a best of 5, winner advances competition. I won every one of my rounds yet get eliminated in favour of the guy I beat in Round 3!

The thing to remember with all of the autotournaments is that although they look like brackets, they are not actually brackets. In most cases, total wins over the whole tournament is what matters. So, yeah, what happened there is fairly common in these tournaments.

[Royal Panda]

How is it determined who advances when there is a tie to the scores in these automatic tourneys?
Is it just random?

http://www.conquerclub.com/player.php?m ... d=14714800

If you're talking about this one, I think it's absolutely bullshit that I got eliminated despite beating ltiyank 3-2 in the last round, and we both finished on 10 points after that. Surely head-to-head should be the first tiebreaker?

The way the tournament was set up, I think they had intended to put in a score reset rule in but forgot. Why else make each round out of 5? It's pretty obvious this was intended to be a best of 5, winner advances competition. I won every one of my rounds yet get eliminated in favour of the guy I beat in Round 3!

The thing to remember with all of the autotournaments is that although they look like brackets, they are not actually brackets. In most cases, total wins over the whole tournament is what matters. So, yeah, what happened there is fairly common in these tournaments.

My point is that whoever created the tournament clearly forgot to put the 'Score Resets' rule in. It was obviously intended to be made with it in; as it was created, it just benefits whoever had an easier draw in the early rounds (more and quicker wins). I had to play high ranked players all the way through, I beat them all, yet I've been punished because they were good at the game.

I've definitely been robbed of a place in the final here, what more can I do except beat what's in front of me? Why should I miss out on the final despite beating the person who makes it on tiebreaker simply because he had an easier round 1/2? Absolute farce.

[DoomYoshi]

There is a score reset feature. I intended everything to be a bracket, but these things get lost in translation.

[Royal Panda]

There is a score reset feature. I intended everything to be a bracket, but these things get lost in translation.

So what happens with this tournament? Do I just get screwed over?

[DoomYoshi]

"Screwed Over" is not the word I used. You lost due to the tiebreaker protocols. Now that I know there is a score reset feature, I can specify it for all future bracket-type tournaments.

[Royal Panda]

"Screwed Over" is not the word I used. You lost due to the tiebreaker protocols. Now that I know there is a score reset feature, I can specify it for all future bracket-type tournaments.

It's the words I am using, seems ridiculous the person that I beat fair and square in a best of 5 situation will get a silver medal (or better) despite losing in the semi finals, yet I win all my rounds and have to get bronze. The points could be the difference between me winning a general achievement medal or not.

Mistakes happen in setting up auto-tournaments, the least I expect to see is some effort to try and make it a bit better for the guy who gets screwed over because of it. Tiebreakers make sense in non-bracket tournaments. In best of 5 tournaments they should not be needed.

[Bishup]

I'm enjoying the hell outa this. Gonna be sad to see it stop

I cannot see how reopening casual tournament would stop your enjoyment.
That would only give to others who had missed some of tournaments because it was not determined that they will be opened only for one day, to also have fun like you are having.

I am not asking for any special service or whatever, I am just asking to follow rules and give to everyone equal participation opportunity.
I do not see how that would ruin anyone's fun in this tournament (nobody will miss his/her own fun).
I only see how the ones who did not join casual tournaments during short and unannounced 1 day, would also get their part of fun to fully participate in this event.

Because you misunderstood, I never said squat about how ur suggestion would change my enjoyment. Let me make it simple for you. These were my two points:

1. I'm enjoying the hell outa the event
2. Stop bitchin

And I will add that you should thank the effort that was put into this whole thing. And if you have such a problem, then offer help for next year instead of condemnation for the present.

[tokle]

So, the way I understand the rules; This closing ceremony tournament is going to be won by one of those who are paired up with a deadbeat?
There is just on round of 5 games, so the one who wins five games fastest will win. And there is extremely likely there will be at least one deadbeat in the tournament.
So do you have any safe-guards against this situation?