The Temple of Jinn [03/02/2014] V9m pg 15

[dolomite13]

I'll have some time later today to really take a good look at the distances issue.

I did have one more question. Can you explain how the bombardments work?

I cannot figure it out from the legend. They seem to imply that you need to hold Ghul and all of a specific area (Water Crystal & WC1 thru WC3) to unlock the bombardment from the Water Crystal to the Water Gems.

However the XML does not support conditional bombardments so I am a bit confused.

It may be easier to have a conditional border that includes Ghul and all WC1-WC3 to be allowed to assault the Water Crystal. And just have Water Crystal ==Bombard==> Water Gems
- Crystals bombard like Gems (WC => Wg*)
- Hold Ghul + Wc1-Wc3 to unlock WC
- Hold Ghul + Ec1-Ec3 to unlock EC
- Hold Ghul + Fc1-Fc3 to unlock FC
- Hold Ghul + Ac1-Ac3 to unlock AC
- Hold Ghul + Tj2-Tj5 to unlock Tj1
- Tj1 bombards all gems

Just a suggestion but you may also want to put a crystal tip of Tj1 and rename it something like "Crystal Spire" and add a light coming up from it like the Luxor hotel in Vegas. That might be cool and evoke the feeling that it could strike all gem locations with it's immense power. I would also change it to require the Key not Ghul to access Tj1 and I would reverse the numbers making Tj5 the tip or using an alternate name like I suggested.

=D13=

[dolomite13]

I noticed a few things ... I think you have 1 less blue gems than the others 22 vs 23. I also notices that you labeled both ends of the T3 teleport as T3a.

I simply cannot follow the map as it is so I created a flow chart style map (see below) and moved things so that teleports were closer to each other. This should be the map as you have it, i didn't change any of the connections between territories however I did invert areas etc.

Anyway based on what I see here there are plenty of spots where the game is slightly imbalanced. Some monsters guard gems and some don't. Some players can run through many gems before running into a monster or player and some are right next to other players.

Take a look at where I put the black arrow. If you break the map at that point (Fg08 Wg08) you still have 2 teleports to get from one side to the other and the two players right there in the middle wouldn't have to worry about each other right away.

Anyway that's all for now I need to spend the evening with my wife.

=D13=

[bigimg]http://imageshack.com/a/img12/5746/7k6i.png[/bigimg]
http://imageshack.com/a/img12/5746/7k6i.png

[Blakkrose]

I'll have some time later today to really take a good look at the distances issue.

I did have one more question. Can you explain how the bombardments work?

I cannot figure it out from the legend. They seem to imply that you need to hold Ghul and all of a specific area (Water Crystal & WC1 thru WC3) to unlock the bombardment from the Water Crystal to the Water Gems.

However the XML does not support conditional bombardments so I am a bit confused.

It may be easier to have a conditional border that includes Ghul and all WC1-WC3 to be allowed to assault the Water Crystal.

...

Just a suggestion but you may also want to put a crystal tip of Tj1 and rename it something like "Crystal Spire" and add a light coming up from it like the Luxor hotel in Vegas.

You're right. I love it
I like your suggestion!

I will use the name "Jinn's Crystal" instead of TJ1

make Crystal areas with conditional border dependent Ghoul.
if you do not have Ghoul do not have access to Crystal areas, Air Crystal, Ac1, Ac2, Ac3, Fire Crystal, Fc1, etc...

I would leave TJ1 (Jinn's Crystal) independent from Ghoul because it is protected, along with the rest of the Temple, from the Gate

As for the look and feel of "Jinn's Crystal" and new legend I'll work in the morning

[Blakkrose]

I noticed a few things ... I think you have 1 less blue gems than the others 22 vs 23. I also notices that you labeled both ends of the T3 teleport as T3a.

It is not true, there are 23 Water Gems. Here is a picture that shows more clearly the gems.
[bigimg]http://www.blakkrose.altervista.org/The_Temple_of_Jinn/The_Temple_of_Jinn_Water_Line.jpg[/bigimg]

For the label of the Teleport, I will revise together with the first update to the map.


I simply cannot follow the map as it is so I created a flow chart style map (see below) and moved things so that teleports were closer to each other. This should be the map as you have it, i didn't change any of the connections between territories however I did invert areas etc.

Some monsters guard gems and some don't.

As soon as possible I will move all the gems outside the areas protected by the monsters.

Take a look at where I put the black arrow. If you break the map at that point (Fg08 Wg08) you still have 2 teleports to get from one side to the other and the two players right there in the middle wouldn't have to worry about each other right away.

I will consider the hypothesis by recalculating distances from Iblis and Key

Anyway that's all for now I need to spend the evening with my wife.

If I could, I would also

[Blakkrose]

Here is the update to version 9
[bigimg]http://www.blakkrose.altervista.org/The_Temple_of_Jinn/The_Temple_of_Jinn_Ver9.jpg[/bigimg]

1. changed the T3a label (right side) into T3b,
2. changed the TJ1 label in Jinn's Crystal,
3. changed the TJ3 label in TJ1,
4. changed the TJ5 label in TJ3,
5. tried to give Jinn's Crystal an effect similar to luminescent crystal with a beam of light that goes upwards but i am not fully satisfied,
6. removed the 6 Dun territories,
7. moved all the gems that were protected from the monsters,
8. removed the 8 starting points, as suggested by Aleena, players will start from 4 random territories among the 92 gems,
9. introduced Killing territories: if you own a Crystal without the other required territories all your troops in the Crystal are killed,
10. split level, as suggested by dolomite13 to make the game more dynamic,
11. modified the legend with all the latest changes.

I have 3 questions to be solved:

1. it is possible to create a conditional Territory Killer (I am referring to Crystals)?
   
2. In the previous version all Crystals suffered a decay of 3 troops per turn. it is possible to maintain this characteristic while inserting the Killer Territories?
   
3. What happens to the troops on TJ1, TJ2, TJ3, TJ4 and Jinn's Crystal if you do not have the Key?

[dolomite13]

*removed the 8 starting points, as suggested by Aleena, players will start from 4 random territories among the 92 gems

Great idea. You may want to make sure that each player gets 1 non random and 3 random starts. This would allow you to make sure that at least 1 territory is at a consistent distance from each other player.

split level, as suggested by dolomite13 to make the game more dynamic,

Yea! and I love that little spiky graphic.

*it is possible to create a conditional Territory Killer (I am referring to Crystals)?

Not with the current xml. Conditionals are only available on borders at this time. You already gate access to the crystal with Gruhl .. just make it a killer 3 or 5 and you are all set. That way players wont be able to use it for surveillance of the map in a fog game without having Gruhl.

*In the previous version all Crystals suffered a decay of 3 troops per turn. it is possible to maintain this characteristic while inserting the Killer Territories?

With not being able to do conditional killers it won't really matter. I suggest making them killer above.

What happens to the troops of on TJ1, TJ2, TJ3, TJ4 and Jinn's Crystal if you do not have the Key?[/b][/color]

Nothing, they will stay the neutral value you set them to. Jinns Crystal will decay by 3 even if you have the gate or key or whatever but only if controlled by a player as neutrals don't decay. If you want to make Jinn's Crystal a Killer like all of the other crystals it will reset only when held by a player for one turn.

=D13=

[Blakkrose]

Great idea. You may want to make sure that each player gets 1 non random and 3 random starts. This would allow you to make sure that at least 1 territory is at a consistent distance from each other player.

It is not necessary.

Yea! and I love that little spiky graphic.

Thanks.

Not with the current xml. Conditionals are only available on borders at this time. You already gate access to the crystal with Gruhl .. just make it a killer 3 or 5 and you are all set. That way players wont be able to use it for surveillance of the map in a fog game without having Gruhl.

I can not make Ghul a Killer Territory because it is part of monsters bonus.
Can I make it as a territory with decay.

With not being able to do conditional killers it won't really matter. I suggest making them killer above.

However, you can simultaneously have a territory with decay and from where you can bombard?
I always refer to Crystals.

Nothing, they will stay the neutral value you set them to. Jinns Crystal will decay by 3 even if you have the gate or key or whatever but only if controlled by a player as neutrals don't decay. If you want to make Jinn's Crystal a Killer like all of the other crystals it will reset only when held by a player for one turn.

OK


It may be okay so we modify or something else?

[dolomite13]

Ghul can have a decay and bombardments the only restriction is that bombardments can't be conditional. So you can't say if you have territory A then territory B can bombard territory C.

=D13=

[Blakkrose]

Ghul can have a decay and bombardments the only restriction is that bombardments can't be conditional. So you can't say if you have territory A then territory B can bombard territory C.

=D13=

I had asked previously:

However, you can simultaneously have a territory with decay and from where you can bombard?
I always refer to Crystals.

because I want the Crystals have a decay, and at the same time they can bombard according to the map legend.
It can be done. Well!
So:

1. all the Crystals: Water Crystal, Earth Crystal, Fire Crystal, Air Crystal, Jinn's Crystal, have a decay of -3 per turn,
2. even Ghul has a decay of -3 per turn,
3. If you lose control of some territory of the Crystal Areas (Wc1, Wc2, Wc3, Ec1, Ec2, Ec3, Fc1, Fc2, Fc3, Ac1, Ac2, Ac3 ) nothing happens: you remain in possession of what you have. You can then continue to bombard from the Crystal territories.
4. finally: control TJ1+TJ2+TJ3+TJ4+TJ5 to access to Jinn's Crystal

These are the latest rules. It's OK?

Click image to enlarge.

[cairnswk]

Blakkrose. has anyone raised colour blind issues yet.
Green completely disappears in these...
http://i155.photobucket.com/albums/s282 ... g~original
http://i155.photobucket.com/albums/s282 ... g~original
http://i155.photobucket.com/albums/s282 ... g~original

[Blakkrose]

Blakkrose. has anyone raised colour blind issues yet.
Green completely disappears in these...
http://i155.photobucket.com/albums/s282 ... g~original
http://i155.photobucket.com/albums/s282 ... g~original
http://i155.photobucket.com/albums/s282 ... g~original

I had noticed these types of tests in other maps.
How are they made​​?
I can recreate them on my project in Photoshop?

If you do not mind, how can I fix it?
Thanks.

[cairnswk]

Blakkrose. has anyone raised colour blind issues yet.
Green completely disappears in these...
http://i155.photobucket.com/albums/s282 ... g~original
http://i155.photobucket.com/albums/s282 ... g~original
http://i155.photobucket.com/albums/s282 ... g~original

I had noticed these types of tests in other maps.
How are they made​​?
I can recreate them on my project in Photoshop?

If you do not mind, how can I fix it?
Thanks.

1. go here http://www.vischeck.com/downloads/ and download the plugin for PS
2. this will place a filter in PS which you can use on .jpegs to see how the different colours come out
3. to fix this, you have to find a set of colours that retain their own distinctive character in the image for CB as well as for normal images.
this will help give you clues http://colorschemedesigner.com/
have a good play around with it to see how it works and what it shows you.
in the menu top right of the title, there is "Colorblind", use this to show differences between normal schemas and how they turnout for CB.

Hope this helps, sorry to bring it up, but you would have to deal with it at some stage in GFX, and probably now it is better to start getting those colours more CB related.
you will have to show the 3 x d,p, and t tests.

I have PS5, and under view > proof setup - P and D - are already in there as filters (just found this)

there is whole discussion here http://www.conquerclub.com/forum/viewto ... 49&t=52914
about the checks and how they came about for our maps. you might find this interesting.

[Blakkrose]

1. go here http://www.vischeck.com/downloads/ and download the plugin for PS
2. this will place a filter in PS which you can use on .jpegs to see how the different colours come out
3. to fix this, you have to find a set of colours that retain their own distinctive character in the image for CB as well as for normal images.
this will help give you clues http://colorschemedesigner.com/
...

Thank you.
The plugin work fine!
Now i must modify color palette but... it's necessary? All maps produced to fulfill these restrictions color?...

...and then, it's a graphic work. In fact I have a lot of time to fix everything.

For now we should discuss gameplay, right?

[cairnswk]

1. go here http://www.vischeck.com/downloads/ and download the plugin for PS
2. this will place a filter in PS which you can use on .jpegs to see how the different colours come out
3. to fix this, you have to find a set of colours that retain their own distinctive character in the image for CB as well as for normal images.
this will help give you clues http://colorschemedesigner.com/
...

Thank you.
The plugin work fine!
Now i must modify color palette but... it's necessary? All maps produced to fulfill these restrictions color?...

...and then, it's a graphic work. In fact I have a lot of time to fix everything.

For now we should discuss gameplay, right?

Necessary, yes! as much as possible.
read here http://www.conquerclub.com/forum/viewto ... 3#p3292843
under Colourblind
you can do it when you like, but it will be ask for.
i was just tryting to save you some pain later possibly.

[Blakkrose]

Necessary, yes! as much as possible.
read here http://www.conquerclub.com/forum/viewto ... 3#p3292843
under Colourblind
you can do it when you like, but it will be ask for.
i was just tryting to save you some pain later possibly.

ok, I read it.
Thank you for the great help that you gave me.
I will get to work as soon as possible.

[iancanton]

*removed the 8 starting points, as suggested by Aleena, players will start from 4 random territories among the 92 gems

Great idea. You may want to make sure that each player gets 1 non random and 3 random starts. This would allow you to make sure that at least 1 territory is at a consistent distance from each other player.

It is not necessary.

increasing the starting points from 1 each to 4 random start positions each is enough to let all players have a chance in most games. remove the bonus for 2 gems because, if someone is lucky enough to start with this bonus, then it will usually be difficult for an opponent to break it in the first few turns.

the orange text for fire crystal is very similar to the red for monsters. have u tried using hues for fire crystal and monsters that are not so similar to each other?

ian.

[Blakkrose]

increasing the starting points from 1 each to 4 random start positions each is enough to let all players have a chance in most games. remove the bonus for 2 gems because, if someone is lucky enough to start with this bonus, then it will usually be difficult for an opponent to break it in the first few turns.

the orange text for fire crystal is very similar to the red for monsters. have u tried using hues for fire crystal and monsters that are not so similar to each other?

All done

I have also worked to my first attempt to adapt the map to the color-blind.
The labels now stand well.

Click image to enlarge.

Click image to enlarge.

No particular problem.
Maybe the Water gems alike, as the Earth gem color but are of different shape and stand the same

Click image to enlarge.

As above...

Click image to enlarge.

The color of TJ territories merges with the rest of the territories but I put a halo that makes the difference.

This can be good as well?

[iancanton]

the gameplay looks good enough to sticky. u can expect a stamp this weekend if no-one finds significant faults.

ian.

[Blakkrose]

the gameplay looks good enough to sticky. u can expect a stamp this weekend if no-one finds significant faults.

ian.

Fantastic!

[iancanton]

here you go, blakkrose. onward and upward!



ian.

[Blakkrose]

here you go, blakkrose. onward and upward!

ian.

Thank you.
Now let work to graphics

[Blakkrose]

Before starting to work on the Small version there are important changes to be made to the map?

[isaiah40]

Before starting to work on the Small version there are important changes to be made to the map?

Give me 2-3 days to look it over. RedBaron0 and myself will let you know to get the small done, as we would rather get any and all major graphical changes done first before you do the small and end up working on two maps at once. With the ability you have shown thus far, I personally (not wearing my blue shoes) think it is ready to go, but (puts blue shoes back on) I have to look it over to make sure things are clear, easy to read etc.

[DearCyrus]

With the ability you have shown thus far, I personally (not wearing my blue shoes) think it is ready to go, but (puts blue shoes back on) I have to look it over to make sure things are clear, easy to read etc.

I love that you know how to put your shoes in order...

[Blakkrose]

Ok, this is my first attemt to create a small version of map.

I hid the levels of small circles, labels and numbers of troops and cast all in one level that I saved separately.
I then loaded this level and reinserted levels missing in the right proportions.
In this way there will be little need to work to change the two maps.

Map Image Small version (630x600):

Click image to enlarge.