Power Role Draft Mafia - Town Wins!

[everywhere116]

Well, if we are looking for something to discuss to get us out of the joke vote phase we could discuss the merits of a day 1 mass claim to try weed out any scum members who may have taken one of the scum only roles. (Unless Rodion through them an unnecessary bone by telling the scum which role were not chosen so they can fake claim them.)

I doubt he would do that.

[edocsil]

Well, if we are looking for something to discuss to get us out of the joke vote phase we could discuss the merits of a day 1 mass claim to try weed out any scum members who may have taken one of the scum only roles. (Unless Rodion through them an unnecessary bone by telling the scum which role were not chosen so they can fake claim them.)

I am certain if we try to manipulate the game like that that Rodion will just give the scum the fakes. Also, Scum could have taken cop to deny others the cop. Same goes for all power roles.

[pmchugh]

Well, if we are looking for something to discuss to get us out of the joke vote phase we could discuss the merits of a day 1 mass claim to try weed out any scum members who may have taken one of the scum only roles. (Unless Rodion through them an unnecessary bone by telling the scum which role were not chosen so they can fake claim them.)

Normally I am against mass claim, especially in themed games but it sure is tempting here. For a start we do not out any power roles by doing so, because we already know who has the power roles. If they picked a mafia only role then they will be fucked by the mass claim. Personally I would like to see moderators do more to stop mass claiming but I guess that is the fault of the mod not the players. Maybe it will cause people to think more about the rules they set out.

I am for it.

Well, if we are looking for something to discuss to get us out of the joke vote phase we could discuss the merits of a day 1 mass claim to try weed out any scum members who may have taken one of the scum only roles. (Unless Rodion through them an unnecessary bone by telling the scum which role were not chosen so they can fake claim them.)

I am certain if we try to manipulate the game like that that Rodion will just give the scum the fakes. Also, Scum could have taken cop to deny others the cop. Same goes for all power roles.

unvote vote edoc

This sounds like fear to me.

Yes there is the chance of taking roles to stop town and vice versa but it is pretty much human psychology to pick positively rather than negatively. I would be shocked if scum put cop top of their list.

I would at least like the top 5 players to claim, in reverse order from 5 to 1. It is near impossible for them to fake claim and if they picked one of the standard roles we will be able to keep watch over them.

[spiesr]

Something I just thought of. Rodion, can you tell us if the mafia players were allowed to communicate with each other during the role selection phase?

I would at least like the top 5 players to claim, in reverse order from 5 to 1. It is near impossible for them to fake claim and if they picked one of the standard roles we will be able to keep watch over them.

I think it would better to go in the original order. Doing it that way will make fake claiming very slightly more difficult.

[pmchugh]

I thought the opposite spesir. Because we can ask people for the list of roles they submitted, and then this would place restrictions on which roles you could claim you put above your own. For instance, if someone put a role that would hint scum top of the list then it would be harder to hide this.

[Rodion]

Something I just thought of. Rodion, can you tell us if the mafia players were allowed to communicate with each other during the role selection phase?

Yes, they were allowed.

[ghostly447]

Guys I am a bit confused. What do you mean by "The top 5 players"? Lol. I feel stupid for asking.

[everywhere116]

Well, if we are looking for something to discuss to get us out of the joke vote phase we could discuss the merits of a day 1 mass claim to try weed out any scum members who may have taken one of the scum only roles. (Unless Rodion through them an unnecessary bone by telling the scum which role were not chosen so they can fake claim them.)

I am certain if we try to manipulate the game like that that Rodion will just give the scum the fakes. Also, Scum could have taken cop to deny others the cop. Same goes for all power roles.

I have to disagree. Rodion wouldn't violate Non Tangere, and he wanted us to use the draft order to our advantage. Why else would he have posted it?

The scum probably tried to take the powerful roles to deny them to the town. Then again, the reverse is also true, and we have more people gunning for those roles. They probably also wanted their ninja and framer roles, too, which makes it less likely, although possible, that they have a power role.

[spiesr]

I thought the opposite spesir. Because we can ask people for the list of roles they submitted, and then this would place restrictions on which roles you could claim you put above your own. For instance, if someone put a role that would hint scum top of the list then it would be harder to hide this.

The way I see it, a player may possibly already have some information about what roles players before them took, but don't have any information about what players after then took.
When a scum who got a scum only role fake-claims they are trying to guess which roles didn't get assigned. The more information that they have about what roles other players took when they make their fake-claim the easier it becomes. (Because it eliminates incorrect answers for their list of options.) If we bottom up, then every role revealed is one that the scum didn't know was taken. If we go top down then some of the roles reveal may be ones that they already knew where taken. (If they had listed that role higher than the scum role in their list and were not assigned it.) So, the way I see it, the top down option may feed the scum slightly less information, to help them fake claim, than the bottom up method.

[spiesr]

Something I just thought of. Rodion, can you tell us if the mafia players were allowed to communicate with each other during the role selection phase?

Yes, they were allowed.

Okay, sweet.
From this information I present the hypothesis that, in order the help them draft higher, the scum may have coordinate so that none of them chose the same number.
Unless of course they anticipated this line of reasoning and, invoking WIFOM, some of them chose the same number. (Particularly if any of the member were going for the scum only roles, as draft position doesn't matter for those at all.)

The next question is, are the mafia members allowed to talk to each other during the day, or were they informed of what roles they partners received? Basically, is it possible that the scum already know what roles their partners got, or will they have to wait until tonight to confirm this information?

[Rodion]

The next question is, are the mafia members allowed to talk to each other during the day, or were they informed of what roles they partners received? Basically, is it possible that the scum already know what roles their partners got, or will they have to wait until tonight to confirm this information?

They can only talk at night, but their role PM mentioned everyone's roles already.

[edocsil]

Yeah, massclaim D1 is retarded.

A: It works, we find half the scum due to zero fakes. Yay, Winning. Boring game however.
B: It fails due to fakes. All power roles are now outed. Easy scum win.

Sooo... Who wants to gamble that Rodion supplied no fakes? I'll claim if forced, but mass claiming is just bad.

[Djfireside]

Something I just thought of. Rodion, can you tell us if the mafia players were allowed to communicate with each other during the role selection phase?

Yes, they were allowed.

Okay, sweet.
From this information I present the hypothesis that, in order the help them draft higher, the scum may have coordinate so that none of them chose the same number.
Unless of course they anticipated this line of reasoning and, invoking WIFOM, some of them chose the same number. (Particularly if any of the member were going for the scum only roles, as draft position doesn't matter for those at all.)

The next question is, are the mafia members allowed to talk to each other during the day, or were they informed of what roles they partners received? Basically, is it possible that the scum already know what roles their partners got, or will they have to wait until tonight to confirm this information?

I would tend to think they would have tried to vote in pairs because it would be benefical to the mafia to be at the bottom because they would know what roles were taken and what is left possibly. one would have tried to get to the top to steal whatever role they saw as pertinant. I am assuming prob vig.

[Some7hingCLEVER]

Yeah, massclaim D1 is retarded.

A: It works, we find half the scum due to zero fakes. Yay, Winning. Boring game however.
B: It fails due to fakes. All power roles are now outed. Easy scum win.

Sooo... Who wants to gamble that Rodion supplied no fakes? I'll claim if forced, but mass claiming is just bad.

i agree with edocsil here on the part about wanting to not leave it to a gamble

[shieldgenerator7]

Can't see much use for a mass claim, Other than exposing power roles. Mafia only have 2 Mafia only roles, so that won't help much. Unless we can determine night actions and Track who did what in the best interests of town. Even that isn't guaranteed to work tho. Really, any mafia member with a town power role can do things "in best interest" of town knowing full well what's going to happen, so yeah,... a massclaim is not looking like a really good option.

-SG7 ( )

[pmchugh]

Guys I am a bit confused. What do you mean by "The top 5 players"? Lol. I feel stupid for asking.

Alt1978 – 11
MoB – 14
Djfireside – 17
Soundman – 22
Nagerous - 6
Dazza – 6
Somethingclever – 9
Edocsil – 9
Pmchugh – 1
Ragian – 1
Freezie – 1
Spiesr – 7
Everywhere – 7
Ghostly447 – 7
Shield – 7

These guys, the first five people in the draft.

How would people feel about just the first 3 claiming? Like I said this provides a dual purpose;

1. It is going to be hard for them to fake claim as they are at the top so it is very unlikely they would have one of the unassigned roles.
2. We can keep an eye on the actions the most powerful players take and hereby moderate any overpowered scum and assist over powered townies.

[alt1978]

Sitting at the top of that list...I'm not sure how I feel about being pressured to claim. A couple of folks have put some pressure on me now. How about we have people claim in alphabetical order...no wait...shit. That doesn't help me either. Is there anything besides order of draft that we should be looking at or in this kind of game is that focal point day one? If inactivity is still a scummy tell since we appear to be heading out joke stage...Ragian hasn't said anything for awhile now (comparative to other folks).
Fingernail clipping of uncertainty towards Ragian.

[pmchugh]

Sitting at the top of that list...I'm not sure how I feel about being pressured to claim. A couple of folks have put some pressure on me now. How about we have people claim in alphabetical order...no wait...shit. That doesn't help me either. Is there anything besides order of draft that we should be looking at or in this kind of game is that focal point day one? If inactivity is still a scummy tell since we appear to be heading out joke stage...Ragian hasn't said anything for awhile now (comparative to other folks).
Fingernail clipping of uncertainty towards Ragian.

Hmm, you seem to be against the claiming game under the grounds that you are one of the ones targeted. If you are town, why do you have any fear?

You already have a big ass X on your forehead for being top of the list, so what would it really matter if you claimed?

I'm not saying you should right now, I just want to know why you are opposed to doing it.

[ghostly447]

Sitting at the top of that list...I'm not sure how I feel about being pressured to claim. A couple of folks have put some pressure on me now. How about we have people claim in alphabetical order...no wait...shit. That doesn't help me either. Is there anything besides order of draft that we should be looking at or in this kind of game is that focal point day one? If inactivity is still a scummy tell since we appear to be heading out joke stage...Ragian hasn't said anything for awhile now (comparative to other folks).
Fingernail clipping of uncertainty towards Ragian.

Hmm, you seem to be against the claiming game under the grounds that you are one of the ones targeted. If you are town, why do you have any fear?

You already have a big ass X on your forehead for being top of the list, so what would it really matter if you claimed?

I'm not saying you should right now, I just want to know why you are opposed to doing it.

I agree, that seems scummy that you are sounding so reluctant to claim and even giving another option of hunting down inactives.

[MoB Deadly]

I think it may be a lose/lose situation making alt claim.

1) He is mafia, he is going to have a pretty good role assuming he wanted a good one. Once he claims, we have to go throught the whole WIFOM fog to see if a mafia player would pick the role that he had.
2) He is not mafia, We dont gain much from knowing his role, plus the mafia WANTS the top drafters to have to claim.

I personally think we should start near the middle of the list, what do you guys think

[edocsil]

Sitting at the top of that list...I'm not sure how I feel about being pressured to claim. A couple of folks have put some pressure on me now. How about we have people claim in alphabetical order...no wait...shit. That doesn't help me either. Is there anything besides order of draft that we should be looking at or in this kind of game is that focal point day one? If inactivity is still a scummy tell since we appear to be heading out joke stage...Ragian hasn't said anything for awhile now (comparative to other folks).
Fingernail clipping of uncertainty towards Ragian.

Hmm, you seem to be against the claiming game under the grounds that you are one of the ones targeted. If you are town, why do you have any fear?

You already have a big ass X on your forehead for being top of the list, so what would it really matter if you claimed?

I'm not saying you should right now, I just want to know why you are opposed to doing it.

Vote PMC

You are are cop and doc fishing.

[pmchugh]

I think it may be a lose/lose situation making alt claim.

1) He is mafia, he is going to have a pretty good role assuming he wanted a good one. Once he claims, we have to go throught the whole WIFOM fog to see if a mafia player would pick the role that he had.
2) He is not mafia, We dont gain much from knowing his role, plus the mafia WANTS the top drafters to have to claim.

I personally think we should start near the middle of the list, what do you guys think

Why? Information is to the towns benefits especially if it is about scum. The mafia already know who to target, anyone in the top half is a danger to them.

Sitting at the top of that list...I'm not sure how I feel about being pressured to claim. A couple of folks have put some pressure on me now. How about we have people claim in alphabetical order...no wait...shit. That doesn't help me either. Is there anything besides order of draft that we should be looking at or in this kind of game is that focal point day one? If inactivity is still a scummy tell since we appear to be heading out joke stage...Ragian hasn't said anything for awhile now (comparative to other folks).
Fingernail clipping of uncertainty towards Ragian.

Hmm, you seem to be against the claiming game under the grounds that you are one of the ones targeted. If you are town, why do you have any fear?

You already have a big ass X on your forehead for being top of the list, so what would it really matter if you claimed?

I'm not saying you should right now, I just want to know why you are opposed to doing it.

Vote PMC

You are are cop and doc fishing.

Doc is the only role that concerns me claim wise for obvious reasons, but we also have a JOAT with one shot protection, a watcher and a busdriver.

There is plenty of roles out there than can offer a doctor protection.

I still would like to hear from alt the serial submariner, you do realise I can read your name at the bottom of the forum?

p.s. nice OMGUS edoc.

[spiesr]

I still would like to hear from alt the serial submariner, you do realise I can read your name at the bottom of the forum?

His most recent post in this game was today.

Sitting at the top of that list...I'm not sure how I feel about being pressured to claim. A couple of folks have put some pressure on me now. How about we have people claim in alphabetical order...no wait...shit. That doesn't help me either. Is there anything besides order of draft that we should be looking at or in this kind of game is that focal point day one? If inactivity is still a scummy tell since we appear to be heading out joke stage...Ragian hasn't said anything for awhile now (comparative to other folks).
Fingernail clipping of uncertainty towards Ragian.

Here it is.

I personally think we should start near the middle of the list, what do you guys think

You mean we should pick out people from the middle and pressure them to claim, or start a (partial?) mass claim in the middle.
I personally think that if we are going to make a person claim based primarily on their draft position that it should be starting from the top.

[alt1978]

Yes I do realize that you can read my name at the bottom...
In seeing my name down there as much as you do it probably means that I'm really good at submarining...or I have very little clue and have spent an embarassing amount of time trying to figure this out. I take it from the response that inactivity is "not" a scummy tell then at this stage in this game...question answered and point taken.
I am not the doctor...i feel safe in saying that much...so if folks feel it's in the town's best interest to pressure me...I have no problem with that. I don't have anything related to my role to hide. The same cannot be said about my knowledge base (there's plents to hide about how far behind i am on the learning curve. I have however googled and learned omgus...so at least I don't have to work on a new word for the week).
If I came across scummy...my bad...i just didn't think on general principle from what I understand it's a good idea to go around claiming. I thought it was more scummy to come out wanting to claim...and also scummy to be inactive. It appears I may have been wrong on both counts.
I did post earlier today pmc...but it's also true i spent a lot of time trying to get a feel for this madness
I am opposed to systematically going down the list. In all honesty though...if you do start going down the list...starting at the top makes sense...as long as you don't out the doctor in the process.

[pmchugh]

Yes I do realize that you can read my name at the bottom...
In seeing my name down there as much as you do it probably means that I'm really good at submarining...or I have very little clue and have spent an embarassing amount of time trying to figure this out. I take it from the response that inactivity is "not" a scummy tell then at this stage in this game...question answered and point taken.
I am not the doctor...i feel safe in saying that much...so if folks feel it's in the town's best interest to pressure me...I have no problem with that. I don't have anything related to my role to hide. The same cannot be said about my knowledge base (there's plents to hide about how far behind i am on the learning curve. I have however googled and learned omgus...so at least I don't have to work on a new word for the week).
If I came across scummy...my bad...i just didn't think on general principle from what I understand it's a good idea to go around claiming. I thought it was more scummy to come out wanting to claim...and also scummy to be inactive. It appears I may have been wrong on both counts.
I did post earlier today pmc...but it's also true i spent a lot of time trying to get a feel for this madness
I am opposed to systematically going down the list. In all honesty though...if you do start going down the list...starting at the top makes sense...as long as you don't out the doctor in the process.

OK questions answered. Inactive is defo scummy, not answering direct questions while in the forum (submarining) is more scummy as it shows that you could post but choose not to. Although I understand that sometimes you are just reading up or trying to work things out and I am satisfied with your response.

unvote vote freezie for contributing nothing but a joke vote so far