Flat rate game and diplomacy

[tkr4lf]

Flat rate games are my favorite type of games. The majority of the games I play are indeed flat rate. And I think diplomacy has a real place in the game. It makes it even more fun to me, to add that human element in there in addition to the random luck of the dice. I understand people who don't like the diplomacy/alliances/truces part of it, but I do have a question for them:

Don't people in real wars use diplomacy? Aren't America and Britian allies? If real world wars are fought just as much with diplomats as soldiers, shouldn't the little internet wars we have on this site be fought the same way?

I understand the unhappiness when a player is in the lead, only to be taken down by a joint alliance of 2 or 3 other players. But, don't you think Napoleon felt that way when the coalition finally defeated him? Of course he thought, aw, those little pussies couldn't take me out by themselves, so they teamed up against me! Well of course they did! That's the nature of warfare. The name of the game is winning, no matter how it's done. That goes for real warfare, and should go for the warfare we have here.

I welcome responses/arguments, whatever. Koolback, I like you personally, but don't really agree with your position on this. But, as has been said before, to each their own! However, if you would like to respond to my points here, I would enjoy having a civilized debate with you about this!

[Woodruff]

I understand the unhappiness when a player is in the lead, only to be taken down by a joint alliance of 2 or 3 other players. But, don't you think Napoleon felt that way when the coalition finally defeated him? Of course he thought, aw, those little pussies couldn't take me out by themselves, so they teamed up against me! Well of course they did!

Yes, but he said it in a cool French accent!

[mc05025]

well, as a player who gain points realy quickly I have to dissagree.

Firstly, at flat rate and no spoils there is a lot of luck too because the low rating players can realy destroy you. In escalating games if you are realy unlucky at the biggining you can win the game only by having a good set up.

Obviously there is a lot of luck at ecalating games (especialy when there is fog) but I think the games are much more complicated. It is realy difficalt to play good. I think players with less than 3000 can play realy bad. That means that a master of escalatings games play much better than a normal 2000 to 3000 points player and I will not talk about low rating players. I think thats why some players reach the 4700 points with only escating games and without using a very complicated map. (when Kiron can not , although playing with a friend is helpful)

But as I have said previously, the most important is to be freestyle. It is veeeery important to play at the right time. And the most of the players do not.

At last I want to say that the games at big maps, with 8 players are stalemate from the begining. At no spoils games, well ok it is easily stalemate. At flat rate the players should play good (in order to stalemate), but not very good and not all of them. At escalating games all or almost all the players should play very good, something imposible for public games. Thats why I think the private with high rating players escalating games are at small maps.

[usidyr]

Escalating games depend too much on luck:
1. Spoils - the color of your spoils determines when you can cash in. In the beginning, one of course delays cashing in spoils as long as possible. But in the middle game, the colors highly matter.
2. At least one player is stupid (highly likely in each game) - the stupid player spreads himself thin, giving one of the other players easy chance to wipe the stupid guy and then he is on a roll.
3. Same thing happens if one of the players underestimates an opponent or overestimates his own dice goes in for the kill, giving a third player an easy chance to wipe both of them.
4. Escalating games are too rapid in the mid and late games for any meaningful diplomacy/politics to be possible. So, you are at the mercy of the dice, spoils, initial drop, other players' stupidity etc.

So, I play almost exclusively anything but escalating games. I think adjacent, no spoils, fog games require the most skill. non-fog, non-escalating games also require a lot of skill.