Grievences Altertation

Fieryo · Post by **Fieryo** » Sat Jun 03, 2006 3:13 pm

I was looking through the grievences of a person i am currently in a game with and several of them (s/he has five) are about how s/he "wasted time". This person has NOT wasted my time. I think it would be a good idea to have Bad Grievences and Good Grievences (I know thats kind of oxymoronic, the name can be changed). So if three people file Bad Grievences against some one but then I file a Good Grievence against them because they played well or something, they woud actually only have two Grievences in total. I think this might help with the dumb complaints from people who are just sore losers.

Jota · Post by **Jota** » Sat Jun 03, 2006 4:20 pm

I could see something like that working, although I think it'd have to be a bit more than just a one-for-one regardless of the content. Say, if two people each rebut a particular grievance, then that grievance doesn't count. Possibly with some minimum seniority/number of games before you're allowed to rebut grievances. And you probably shouldn't be able to rebut multiple grievances on the same person.

lackattack · Post by **lackattack** » Sat Jun 03, 2006 7:05 pm

A few people have suggested allowing positive feedback as well as negative and I think it could work nicely if we separate the counts like this:

lackattack [5-2]

i.e. lackattack (that's me by the way) has 5 positive and 2 negative

Positive feedback could be left for people who are great team partners, for example.

mrdexter · Post by **mrdexter** » Sat Jun 03, 2006 7:24 pm

lackattack wrote:A few people have suggested allowing positive feedback as well as negative and I think it could work nicely if we separate the counts like this:

lackattack [5-2]

i.e. lackattack (that's me by the way) has 5 positive and 2 negative

Positive feedback could be left for people who are great team partners, for example.

That's gotta be the way forward :-)

Scarus · Post by **Scarus** » Sat Jun 03, 2006 7:54 pm

Could work, but it might just turn into a popularity contest....i.e., a popular person gets a grievance filed against him/her. He/she is pissed, gripes about it, and all of his/her friends start piping in about what a great person he/she is.

I think it makes more sense to fix the grievence system to begin with, rather than just to slap a patch on it. The thing I have the biggest problem with is the public nature of unsubstantiated grievances. Maybe they do need to be public, else why have them, but it looks like anyone can complain about just about anything and it still shows as a negative, scarlet, number, next to your name. I think that there should be some substantial, verifiable, infraction, before you're branded.

I still like the idea of the old ignore list, (a private alternative), for minor, non-verifiable grievances, and perhaps a more formalized grivance procedure for more substantial issues. I think befor someone puts a negative number next to your name for everyone to see, that there should be some kind of due process, or at least some investigation, and judgment, by a neutral party.

Which reminds me, a while back we were told that we might eventually get a chance to vote on whether we wanted the old ignore list back. What d'ya think?

AK_iceman · Post by **AK_iceman** » Sat Jun 03, 2006 8:04 pm

i think this is a great idea lack, if used with the greivance moderator it would work well.

Risk_06 · Post by **Risk_06** » Sat Jun 03, 2006 8:52 pm

*points at Scarus* I second that notion! And while we're at it can someone please erase my own Grievance? Please?

Jota · Post by **Jota** » Sat Jun 03, 2006 10:32 pm

Will the moderator get to weed out those spurious good grievances, too? Will there be a policy about positive revenge grievances? ("Hey, that guy just filed a nice comment on my playing! Well let's see how he'd like a taste of his own medicine!")

Haydena · Post by **Haydena** » Mon Jun 05, 2006 11:15 am

Heh, nice one Jota...

I love this idea, I know my brother has just started playing and is worried that a major he is playing with (Very high ranked, I know he is trustworthy) has 1 grievance and will be a dishounorable player, if this 'good feedback option was introduced then you could easily see the amount of hounorable and decent games this player has played far outweighs the amount of times he has pissed someone off...

It would also help in spotting those damn unwanted grievances that people have filed because they are pissed that they are lost, I mean, a moderator would look twice at someone with over 100 good feedback and 1 bad feedback wouldn't they?

wicked · Post by **wicked** » Mon Jun 05, 2006 11:23 am

ditch the grievances ... bring back the ignore list ... that'll solve all the problems with the grievances.

Twill · Post by **Twill** » Mon Jun 05, 2006 8:08 pm

scarus, you are dead right, but then, we are still talking about requiring you to have played a game against someone to give them feedback, and theoretically, if someone has played you 100 times, they have the right to give you feedback 100 times...if you are dishonest 1 time, then why would it be a bad thing if you get the 99 other good feedbacks to show your true character. (this applies to Jota's revenge positivity comment too)

As for a verification of grievances...that would require hundreds of person-hours, especially as the site grows. Perhaps a solution would be a drop-down list of options (suspected secret alliance, backstabber, rude, insulted my hair, etc) to limit the stupid "he/she wasted my time" comments. The other possible deterrent which could be added would be to have the option to "view all comments left by this person" So If I said "Lack is a doody-head" and I knew you could track down all of my comments and see how immature I was being, then it might dissuade me from posting them.

Then there are all sorts of back end stuff we could code for the mod(s), like user "flagging" of grievences which are stupid etc. so that it is easier/less time consuming for a mod to track these down. or perhaps "grievance weights" (similar to theose "did you find this review helpful - yes/no" check boxes) so that you, as users, could make stupid grievances go away (of course, we run into the same problem scarus pointed out earlier with populairty contests, especially with clans on the rise)

Anyhoo, just some thoughts

Twill

wicked · Post by **wicked** » Mon Jun 05, 2006 8:15 pm

I'd have to create many more multi accounts just to positively counter all my grievances. :twisted:

You guys really like to be busy, eh? :twisted:

Fieryo · Post by **Fieryo** » Tue Jun 06, 2006 8:50 am

Twill wrote: Perhaps a solution would be a drop-down list of options (suspected secret alliance, backstabber, rude, insulted my hair, etc) to limit the stupid "he/she wasted my time" comments. Twill

Glorious idea.

JCole200 · Post by **JCole200** » Tue Jun 06, 2006 9:14 am

So, shouldn't we start this? Ya know, developing a list of grievances that are valid?

This was the first thing I heard you talk about.. and yet it hasn't been touched that I have read.

I, yet again, got a game when both people I played against filed against me. (Gaining popularity all the time!)

Why? Because they were friends with each other, so they wouldn't attack one another. So I filed a grievance.. then get retilation against me. This was one of the first things you talked about not allowing.. yet.. there it is.. I have a big "4" on my name to prove it.

And any luck on finding this mod yet?

Fieryo · Post by **Fieryo** » Tue Jun 06, 2006 7:48 pm

on the subject of a moderator: it will be a daunting task regardless of how we go about doing it, but i think there should be a more formal way of filling out some form of form, like Twill has in the cheating/abuse section, something that people HAVE to use. That way the moderator wouldn't have to go looking for "false" grievences, they would come to him (or her).

AK_iceman · Post by **AK_iceman** » Tue Jun 06, 2006 7:52 pm

i agree, that would make their job a lot easier

bluesrock12000 · Post by **bluesrock12000** » Wed Jun 07, 2006 11:14 am

I want the old ignore list. I liked that somone could not join a game I was in.

Grievences Altertation

Grievences Altertation

I don't know

Bring Back the Old