CIA Confirms: Waterboarding Prevented Attack on Los Angeles

[b.k. barunt]

Good to hear. Now would someone please explain my point to Gabon? You know, how THE CIA IS NOT TO BE TRUSTED. THEY ARE A COVERT ORGANIZATION THAT OPERATES BY FALSEHOOD. DECEPTION IS THEIR POT OF FOOKING TEA.

He seems rather thick and self obsessed, and the words don't seem to filter through. I know he's not actually asking me to waste my time gathering "evidence" that the CIA is a covert organization is he? Tell you what Gabon, google "Lying Motherfuckers" and see who's in the top 3.

Btw, the Mossad is also a covert org., and their official motto is "By Deception Thou Shalt Do Warfare". They're up front about it, which makes them respectable liars, while the CIA are hypocritical chickenshit liars. I don't believe the respectable liars, and you choose to believe the chickenshit ones. Go figure.


Still no evidence,
Honibaz

[GabonX]

Information came to light regarding the interogation methods used by the CIA. Water boarding and a number of other methods used have been seen as controversial.

I understand that people have a negative view of this, but it is irrational to pass judgement without all of the information. At this point, after extensive media coverage and change to a new administration which is very much against what happened, it is likely that we have fairly accurate information about this topic.

The information we have had states that three people were water boarded extensively (to the tune of several hundred times each), but this is still a very small number of people. The most recent information we have been given indicates that this interrogation resulted in averting a second act of airplane highjacking and vandalism.

Is it possible that they are lying? Sure, but it is very unlikely. The current administration as well as Congress has access to the information in question and both have remained silent. If in fact there were more people who were water boarded and this hadn't averted an attack it would be in this administrations political interests to make this known. Despite this they have not refuted any of this information which means that it is most likely accurate.

I still don't know what it is that you disagree with. Is your position that the CIA lies about everything all the time?

Honestly I think you just like to pick arguments with me.

[b.k. barunt]

f*ck me running. Did you just ask me if i said the CIA lies about everything all the time? Shit! Are you really that fooking abstruse?!! Didn't i just capitalize every fooking letter?!?!?! You actually think i'm going to type it out again?


* * head explodes * *

[PLAYER57832]

Information came to light regarding the interogation methods used by the CIA. Water boarding and a number of other methods used have been seen as controversial.

I understand that people have a negative view of this, but it is irrational to pass judgement without all of the information. At this point, after extensive media coverage and change to a new administration which is very much against what happened, it is likely that we have fairly accurate information about this topic.

The information we have had states that three people were water boarded extensively (to the tune of several hundred times each), but this is still a very small number of people. The most recent information we have been given indicates that this interrogation resulted in averting a second act of airplane highjacking and vandalism.

Is it possible that they are lying? Sure, but it is very unlikely. The current administration as well as Congress has access to the information in question and both have remained silent. If in fact there were more people who were water boarded and this hadn't averted an attack it would be in this administrations political interests to make this known. Despite this they have not refuted any of this information which means that it is most likely accurate.

The Problem with such techniques is that you can force anyone to say anything under torture. The real truth is is that waterboarding has NOT provided real information. The REAL information (such as who really was the mastermind behind the Bombing) came to the FBI investigators before torture was used. This IS confirmed by top officials in the FBI, etc.

Further, the techniques that Bush administration used that ARE considered torture is more than just waterboarding. They include putting people in boxes, hanging them for long periods of time, etc. In many cases, the people using these techniques violated the standing orders.. even th expanded orders put forth by the Bush administration. For example, exceeding time limits given for keeping people in one position, etc.

[Snorri1234]

lends credibility to Cheney's claims.

None.

There is no credibility to it. They have already confirmed that they got no information due to waterboarding or other methods which they didn't already know or was of no importance.

[GabonX]

No, the CIA has stated that a second act of airplane highjacking and vandalism was averted due to the interrogation. You guys are denying what happened based on a negative emotional reaction you have to percieved torture.

Believe me, this isn't the last we are going to hear about this, but if it really weren't true we would have likely heard from the current administration. Why would it be in their interest to hide the fact that water boarding did not avert an attack if it were true?

Hopefully the reports are released in a reasonable amount of time.

[Juan_Bottom]

Juan Bottom Confirms: got like 500 chicks pregnant before

[GabonX]

Information came to light regarding the interogation methods used by the CIA. Water boarding and a number of other methods used have been seen as controversial.

I understand that people have a negative view of this, but it is irrational to pass judgement without all of the information. At this point, after extensive media coverage and change to a new administration which is very much against what happened, it is likely that we have fairly accurate information about this topic.

The information we have had states that three people were water boarded extensively (to the tune of several hundred times each), but this is still a very small number of people. The most recent information we have been given indicates that this interrogation resulted in averting a second act of airplane highjacking and vandalism.

Is it possible that they are lying? Sure, but it is very unlikely. The current administration as well as Congress has access to the information in question and both have remained silent. If in fact there were more people who were water boarded and this hadn't averted an attack it would be in this administrations political interests to make this known. Despite this they have not refuted any of this information which means that it is most likely accurate.

The Problem with such techniques is that you can force anyone to say anything under torture. The real truth is is that waterboarding has NOT provided real information. The REAL information (such as who really was the mastermind behind the Bombing) came to the FBI investigators before torture was used. This IS confirmed by top officials in the FBI, etc.

Further, the techniques that Bush administration used that ARE considered torture is more than just waterboarding. They include putting people in boxes, hanging them for long periods of time, etc. In many cases, the people using these techniques violated the standing orders.. even th expanded orders put forth by the Bush administration. For example, exceeding time limits given for keeping people in one position, etc.

Torture is not a valid means to extract a confession. It can however yield tactical and strategic information.

In other words, even if you didn't kill someone, I could torture you until you confessed to killing that person. If however I already know that you killed someone and I know that you have knowledge of other people who are planning to kill again, torture can result in coercing you to tell me where those people are. This is exactly what happened.

Also, I'm not sure where the comment about the FBI is coming from because we are on the topic of the CIA, an entirely seperate orginization. There was (and perhapse still is) a dangerous lack of transparency between the various intelligence gathering agencies in the United States. If you recall, this is why the Department of Homeland Security was created. This lack of transparency means that now matter how high ranking someone is in the FBI, they will not have access to clasified information from the CIA or military.

[b.k. barunt]

Of course both the FBI and CIA will be very transparent with Homeland Security and give it all the classified info it desires. Btw, i have a bridge that i can give you a great deal on - trust me.


Honibaz

[neanderpaul14]

Btw, i have a bridge that i can give you a great deal on - trust me.


Honibaz

A bridge ??? Really??? Wow that would go great on the ocean front property I just bought in the Dakotas

[pimpdave]

Btw, i have a bridge that i can give you a great deal on - trust me.


Honibaz

A bridge ??? Really??? Wow that would go great on the ocean front property I just bought in the Dakotas

[targetman377]

water boarding, sleep deprvation, confined places, and the others listed in this artical are not torture by any means. if you do not belive me ask what did the nazis do to torcher people. last time i cheeked these will not kill someone. the nazis cut off fingers. and others so this is not torture if any one claims it is does not know history and should shut up.

[b.k. barunt]

Your post just torcherd me.


Honibaz

[Juan_Bottom]

water boarding, sleep deprvation, confined places, and the others listed in this artical are not torture by any means.

http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index ... 158AAmFMkA

Resolved Question Show me another? »
Is it true that the American military executed WWII Japanese soldiers for waterboarding American soldiers?

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/con...

here's a snippet from that article:
"in 1947, the United States charged a Japanese officer, Yukio Asano, with war crimes for carrying out another form of waterboarding on a U.S. civilian. The subject was strapped on a stretcher that was tilted so that his feet were in the air and head near the floor, and small amounts of water were poured over his face, leaving him gasping for air until he agreed to talk.

"Asano was sentenced to 15 years of hard labor,"

sounds to me like that japanese soldier was punished for waterboarding an american...
1 year ago

[targetman377]

water boarding, sleep deprvation, confined places, and the others listed in this artical are not torture by any means.

http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index ... 158AAmFMkA

Resolved Question Show me another? »
Is it true that the American military executed WWII Japanese soldiers for waterboarding American soldiers?

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/con...

here's a snippet from that article:
"in 1947, the United States charged a Japanese officer, Yukio Asano, with war crimes for carrying out another form of waterboarding on a U.S. civilian. The subject was strapped on a stretcher that was tilted so that his feet were in the air and head near the floor, and small amounts of water were poured over his face, leaving him gasping for air until he agreed to talk.

"Asano was sentenced to 15 years of hard labor,"

sounds to me like that japanese soldier was punished for waterboarding an american...
1 year ago

1st off i would not agree with that senance at all if you look at tortue i difine it in much harder terms. what the nazis did that was torcher cuting fingers off is torcher. what we are doing is not. if you dont belive me that is cool.

[Snorri1234]

water boarding, sleep deprvation, confined places, and the others listed in this artical are not torture by any means.

http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index ... 158AAmFMkA

Resolved Question Show me another? »
Is it true that the American military executed WWII Japanese soldiers for waterboarding American soldiers?

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/con...

here's a snippet from that article:
"in 1947, the United States charged a Japanese officer, Yukio Asano, with war crimes for carrying out another form of waterboarding on a U.S. civilian. The subject was strapped on a stretcher that was tilted so that his feet were in the air and head near the floor, and small amounts of water were poured over his face, leaving him gasping for air until he agreed to talk.

"Asano was sentenced to 15 years of hard labor,"

sounds to me like that japanese soldier was punished for waterboarding an american...
1 year ago

1st off i would not agree with that senance at all if you look at tortue i difine it in much harder terms. what the nazis did that was torcher cuting fingers off is torcher. what we are doing is not. if you dont belive me that is cool.

It's not a matter of agreeing with you (after figuring out what you're saying) but a matter of hypocrisy.

[joecoolfrog]

water boarding, sleep deprvation, confined places, and the others listed in this artical are not torture by any means.

http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index ... 158AAmFMkA

Resolved Question Show me another? »
Is it true that the American military executed WWII Japanese soldiers for waterboarding American soldiers?

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/con...

here's a snippet from that article:
"in 1947, the United States charged a Japanese officer, Yukio Asano, with war crimes for carrying out another form of waterboarding on a U.S. civilian. The subject was strapped on a stretcher that was tilted so that his feet were in the air and head near the floor, and small amounts of water were poured over his face, leaving him gasping for air until he agreed to talk.

"Asano was sentenced to 15 years of hard labor,"

sounds to me like that japanese soldier was punished for waterboarding an american...
1 year ago

1st off i would not agree with that senance at all if you look at tortue i difine it in much harder terms. what the nazis did that was torcher cuting fingers off is torcher. what we are doing is not. if you dont belive me that is cool.

So you dont believe that the CIA would condone torture, have you the slightest idea how many murderous despots they have supported in the last 50 years. Do you think an organisation that illegaly carpet bombed Cambodia and Laos back to the Stone Age, killing thousands and thousands of innocent villagers, could give a monkey's arse about morality

[GabonX]

Exactly what would the CIA use to "carpet bomb" a given party? I think you're a bit confused as to who is who and who has what.

[SultanOfSurreal]

1st off i would not agree with that senance at all if you look at tortue i difine it in much harder terms. what the nazis did that was torcher cuting fingers off is torcher. what we are doing is not. if you dont belive me that is cool.

I'm sorry but your definition of torture is wrong and you are a complete dullard. in fact i would fully support having your fingers cut off just so you could no longer post this tripe

[PLAYER57832]

water boarding, sleep deprvation, confined places, and the others listed in this artical are not torture by any means. if you do not belive me ask what did the nazis do to torcher people. last time i cheeked these will not kill someone. the nazis cut off fingers. and others so this is not torture if any one claims it is does not know history and should shut up.

... and the Nazis were panzies (pacifists) compared to the Aztecs, so I guess they weren't really torturing anyone either.

If we have to use the Nazis as our standard of what constitutes torture.... then we have lost a lot more than any terrorist attack could ever take.

(and just so we are clear, my family lived under Nazis occupation... I know full well how nasty they were).

[PLAYER57832]

No, the CIA has stated that a second act of airplane highjacking and vandalism was averted due to the interrogation. You guys are denying what happened based on a negative emotional reaction you have to percieved torture.

No, based on FBI testimony as well as testimony of many others. NO attacks were really averted.

Link: http://www.npr.org/templates/story/stor ... =103475220

(note, this is just one of a series of interviews and articles on the matter... I only posted one)

Believe me, this isn't the last we are going to hear about this, but if it really weren't true we would have likely heard from the current administration. Why would it be in their interest to hide the fact that water boarding did not avert an attack if it were true?

You are misinformed. In fact, the current administration has spoken out. Obama has stated officially that he does not want those CIA operatives that were going under orders to be prosecuted. Whether those making the decisions should be punished is still "up for grabs". In addition, there is growing information that many of the underlings well exceeded even the expanded Bush guidelines.

Hopefully the reports are released in a reasonable amount of time.

The most useful information was uncovered BEFORE the people were tortured, not after. That said, there were small snippets optained under torture, but very little of it was not already known/found out through other means and many long-time interrogators have asserted that the same information could have been obtained, perhaps even quicker, if torture had not been used.

That is the real problem. Torture is just NOT an EFFECTIVE means of gaining real information.

Further, if we have to become the enemy to save ourselves ... have we really saved ourselves?

[InkL0sed]

He who would trade liberty for some temporary security, deserves neither liberty nor security.

[targetman377]

the things we are doing will not kill them maybe in extreme cases but we do not just excute people for information. we put them in situations that people do not like at all. ok and as for i do not belive in waterboard another contry that plays by the rules of war. if russia and u.s. got into a war and each side played by the rules of war torturing there soldiers is compleatly imoral. but terrist do not deserve this same right. keep in mind these are the same people that are willing to strap a bomb to themselves and kill incent kids and women ( and they do this alot look at iraq in a middle of a market come on!) and THEMSELVES OK!!! if they are willing to kill themselves to kill one of the u.s. soldiers and also kill the incent they can be tortured all we want they place no value on there life so why should we?? in a conventianal war soldiers do not kill incent civilians. ON PURPOSE!!!!! cause i know all of you in a mintue you will be like look how many cilvians we kill thouse are accdents. ok.

[joecoolfrog]

:roll:

Exactly what would the CIA use to "carpet bomb" a given party? I think you're a bit confused as to who is who and who has what.

The CIA organised the so called ' Dirty Tricks ' campaign in Indochina , part of which was the most sustained use of carpet bombing ever seen.......learn the history before you make an even bigger fool of yourself

[GabonX]

Did not answer question