Nordic Countries [Quenched]

[natty dread]

<--

Ok here's a map of the
Nordic Countries!

Big thanks to: The.Killing.44, Isaiah40, Industrial Helix, MrBenn, Eyestone, Snufkin, Alstergren, Peter Gibbons, Ender516, Evil_DIMwit, all the other foundry mods and also to the whole Foundry Community for helping me make this map into what it is today. I wanted to add thanks to you into the map, but the list grew so long so I decided to post this on the first page of the thread instead.


Current feedback/comment requests:

- does this map go to beta soon?


Latest versions

Updated images - upload these please

large: http://img101.imageshack.us/img101/2039 ... opev60.png
small: http://img85.imageshack.us/img85/9930/n ... 0small.png


Latest XML

XML file: http://h1.ripway.com/ndread/nordic_xml_9.xml





Latest images, version 60

60 - for upload
large: [bigimg]http://img101.imageshack.us/img101/2039/northeuropev60.png[/bigimg]
small:





59a
large
[bigimg]http://img94.imageshack.us/img94/9575/northeuropev59a.png[/bigimg]
small







[spoiler=older versions]59
large.
[bigimg]http://img233.imageshack.us/img233/307/northeuropev59.png[/bigimg]
small.


58f
large
[bigimg]http://img641.imageshack.us/img641/1537/northeuropev58ff.png[/bigimg]

small



58a
large image:
[bigimg]http://img532.imageshack.us/img532/8189/northeuropev58a.png[/bigimg]




58
[bigimg]http://img202.imageshack.us/img202/9518/northeuropev58.png[/bigimg]
and small image:


version 57b, large
[bigimg]http://img532.imageshack.us/img532/1479/northeuropev57b.png[/bigimg]

v57b, small


57c
[bigimg]http://img444.imageshack.us/img444/1517/northeuropev57c.png[/bigimg]



v57 large
[bigimg]http://img249.imageshack.us/img249/2048/northeuropev57.png[/bigimg]
v57 small

56d
large:
[bigimg]http://img547.imageshack.us/img547/2271/northeuropev56d.png[/bigimg]
small:


56c
large image:
[bigimg]http://img340.imageshack.us/img340/381/northeuropev56c.png[/bigimg]
small image:

v.56b
large
http://img215.imageshack.us/img215/3670 ... pev56b.png
small
http://img215.imageshack.us/img215/6513 ... bsmall.png
v.56
large
http://img221.imageshack.us/img221/5605 ... opev56.png
small
http://img220.imageshack.us/img220/3791 ... 6small.png
v.55f - only large version of this done so far
http://img181.imageshack.us/img181/7842 ... v55ftr.png
v.55
large
http://img641.imageshack.us/img641/3373 ... pev55e.png
small
http://img94.imageshack.us/img94/5452/n ... esmall.png
v.54 - hey ho
v54 large
http://img163.imageshack.us/img163/9600 ... pev54a.png
v54 small
http://img532.imageshack.us/img532/9637 ... asmall.png
v.53 - stamp this?
v53 large
http://img28.imageshack.us/img28/4209/n ... pev53a.png
v53 small
http://img43.imageshack.us/img43/8435/n ... 3small.png
v.52 - thanks IH - quench lol!
versino 52 lärge
http://img510.imageshack.us/img510/7924 ... pev52a.png
version 52 småll
http://img256.imageshack.us/img256/5049 ... asmall.png
v.51 - thanks Isaiah!
v.51 large
http://img692.imageshack.us/img692/7991 ... pev51i.png
v.51 small
http://img688.imageshack.us/img688/8461 ... ismall.png
v.50 - wow!
v.50 large
http://img638.imageshack.us/img638/3360 ... pev50b.png
v.50 small
http://img638.imageshack.us/img638/5025 ... bsmall.png
v.49
large
http://img51.imageshack.us/img51/3448/n ... opev49.png
small
http://img26.imageshack.us/img26/138/no ... 9small.png
v.48
v.48 large
http://img294.imageshack.us/img294/9395 ... opev48.png
v.48 small
http://img42.imageshack.us/img42/8560/n ... 8small.png
v.47
large:
http://img28.imageshack.us/img28/402/northeuropev47.png
small:
http://img53.imageshack.us/img53/7319/n ... 7small.png
v.46
large:
http://img651.imageshack.us/img651/8616 ... pev46b.png
small:
http://img384.imageshack.us/img384/2626 ... bsmall.png
v.45
Large:
http://img62.imageshack.us/img62/8224/n ... opev45.png
Small:
http://img28.imageshack.us/img28/3783/n ... 5small.png
v.44
Large:
http://img684.imageshack.us/img684/3166 ... opev44.png
Small:
http://img684.imageshack.us/img684/9647 ... 4small.png
v.43
http://img194.imageshack.us/img194/343/ ... opev43.png
small map, with alternate minimap frame:
http://img18.imageshack.us/img18/3544/n ... 3small.png
v.42
http://img693.imageshack.us/img693/9047 ... opev42.png
v.41
http://img535.imageshack.us/img535/3575 ... pev41a.png
v.40
http://img641.imageshack.us/img641/8688 ... pev40b.png
v39 with new mountains
http://img412.imageshack.us/img412/8449 ... pev39a.png
v38, with old mountains
http://img710.imageshack.us/img710/7889 ... opev38.png
v37a
http://img718.imageshack.us/img718/1779 ... pev37a.png
v37
http://img689.imageshack.us/img689/1587 ... opev37.png
v36
http://img265.imageshack.us/img265/5972 ... pev36a.png
v35
http://img193.imageshack.us/img193/9871 ... opev35.png
34d
http://img51.imageshack.us/img51/2677/n ... pev34d.png
v.34b
http://img535.imageshack.us/img535/9203 ... pev34b.png
v.34, 34a
http://img140.imageshack.us/img140/6523 ... pev34a.png
http://img40.imageshack.us/img40/2744/n ... opev34.png
V.33a & 33b
http://img52.imageshack.us/img52/5460/n ... pev33a.png
http://img7.imageshack.us/img7/4374/northeuropev33b.png
v.32
http://img686.imageshack.us/img686/4696 ... opev32.png
v. 31a & 31
http://img34.imageshack.us/img34/1073/n ... pev31a.png
http://img34.imageshack.us/img34/2815/n ... opev31.png
v.30
http://img641.imageshack.us/img641/4446 ... opev30.png
v.29b
http://img716.imageshack.us/img716/6436 ... pev29b.png
v.29
http://img202.imageshack.us/img202/1568 ... opev29.png
V.28 http://img69.imageshack.us/img69/842/northeuropev28.png
v.27 http://img682.imageshack.us/img682/1214 ... opev27.png
v26b - same as below w/ adjusted boni and new text to help with the sea route problem http://img138.imageshack.us/img138/2305 ... pev26b.png
version 26 http://img17.imageshack.us/img17/9261/n ... opev26.png
V.25b http://img94.imageshack.us/img94/9774/n ... pev25b.png
v.25 http://img163.imageshack.us/img163/1860 ... opev25.png
v.24g http://img707.imageshack.us/img707/3165 ... pev24g.png
v24 http://img300.imageshack.us/img300/3339 ... pev24c.png
V23a http://img262.imageshack.us/img262/9416 ... pev23a.png
Version 22 http://img36.imageshack.us/img36/5140/n ... opev22.png
Version 21 http://img177.imageshack.us/img177/1646 ... opev21.png
Version 20 http://img707.imageshack.us/img707/2482 ... opev20.png
Version 19 http://img503.imageshack.us/img503/189/ ... opev19.png
Version 18: http://img17.imageshack.us/img17/4675/n ... opev18.png


even older versions:

Version 17: http://img682.imageshack.us/img682/6033 ... pev17a.png
Version 16: http://img40.imageshack.us/img40/9333/n ... opev16.png
Version 15: http://img22.imageshack.us/img22/2033/n ... opev15.png
Version 14: http://img5.imageshack.us/img5/9997/northeuropev14.png
Version 13 - borders: http://img690.imageshack.us/img690/5541 ... opev13.png
Version 13 A - connections: http://img689.imageshack.us/img689/7528 ... pev13a.png
Version 12: http://img513.imageshack.us/img513/3826 ... opev12.png
Version 11: http://img37.imageshack.us/img37/1654/n ... opev11.png
Version 10: http://img37.imageshack.us/img37/5308/n ... opev10.png
Version 8: http://img338.imageshack.us/img338/5089 ... ropev8.png
Version 7: http://img69.imageshack.us/img69/9687/rhfjdjejdyg.png
Version 6a: http://img260.imageshack.us/img260/3194 ... opev6a.png
Version 5: http://img211.imageshack.us/img211/4616 ... ropev5.png
Version 5a: http://img5.imageshack.us/img5/4390/northeuropev5a.png
Version 4. http://img337.imageshack.us/img337/8018 ... ropev4.png
Version 3. http://img338.imageshack.us/img338/6526 ... ropev3.png
Version 2 http://img69.imageshack.us/img69/8410/northeurope5.png
Version 1½: http://img17.imageshack.us/img17/4792/northeurope4.png
first draft, Version 1: http://img340.imageshack.us/img340/8002 ... urope3.png[/spoiler]



Gameplay specifics

62 territories on 9 bonus zones (3 superzones). Of the territories, 57 are regular, 5 are capitals with autodeploy. The regular territories start as normal, the capitals start as neutrals, with 3 neutral troops each...

Of the 57 regular territories, the 9 that border capitals will be coded as starting positions. This will prevent players from getting an unfair advantage by dropping next to capitals. Everyone will have equal chance to grab the capitals.

[spoiler=Starting positions, list]These will be a starting position each, they will start with 3 troops like normal territories.

Uusimaa
Åland
Uppland
Akershus
Skåne
Sjaelland
Bornholm
Føroyar
Vesturland[/spoiler]

[spoiler=Capitals]These start neutral, with 3 neutral troops each.
+1 autodeploy each. Capitals are also required for the bonus of the bonus area they are in.

Reykjavik -> Iceland
København -> Denmark
Oslo -> South Norway
Stockholm -> Sweden Proper
Helsinki -> South Finland[/spoiler]

[spoiler=Bonus areas]updated after GP stamp

Iceland +2
Denmark +2 (+3 with Faroe)

North norway +3 (+4 with Svalbard)
South norway +4
All Norway +9 (+11 with Svalbard)

Norrland (North) +4
Sweden Proper (Central) +4
Gothland (South) +3
All Sweden +13

Finnish Lapland (north) +4
South Finland +3
All Finland +9

note: capital autodeploys are not included in these bonus values.[/spoiler]

[spoiler=Data on bonuses, bonus combinations]updated after GP stamp

Bonus area / territory count / border count / total bonus


Iceland / 6 / 2 / 3
Denmark / 7 / 2 / 3

North norway / 4 / 3 / 3
South norway / 10 / 3 / 5

Norrland / 7 / 3 / 4
Sweden Proper / 5 / 5 / 5
Gothland / 6 / 3 / 3

Finnish lapland / 4 / 3 / 3
South Finland / 11 / 2 / 5

Combinations (from lowest to highest bonus value):

N. Norway & Finnish Lapland / 8 / 3 / 6
Denmark & Gothland / 13 / 3 / 6

Denmark, Faroe & Iceland / 14 / 3 / 7
Iceland, Svalbard & N.Norway / 11 / 4 / 7
Denmark, Faroe & Gothland / 14 / 3 / 7
Finnish Lapland, N.Norway & Svalbard / 9 / 4 / 7

Gothland & Sweden Proper / 11 / 6 / 8
Sweden proper & Norrland / 12 / 6 / 9
All Norway / 14 / 5 / 10
All Finland / 15 / 4 / 10
Finnish Lapland, Norrland & North Norway / 15 / 5 / 10
^ the same + Svalbard / 16 / 6 / 11

All Norway & Svalbard / 15 / 6 / 12

All Sweden / 18 / 7 / 14
All Norway, Svalbard & Iceland / 21 / 6 / 15



Note: capital autodeploys are included in calculation for bonus value.[/spoiler]

To-do list:

Nothing at the moment. Waiting for map to be beta tested.



Map ownership / copyright

The author retains copyright on their work, and gives Conquer Club permission to use the imagery free of charge, for as long as Conquer Club sees fit on the Conquer Club website. Conquer Club cannot sell, lease, or lend the right to use the images to anyone else. The author swears that their map is their own work, or a legal derivative work and by submitting it, do hereby claim all responsibility for that being true.

signed: natty_dread

[natty dread]

A bit of touch up here and there. Fixed a few things. Some small things still need fixing.

[bigimg]http://img17.imageshack.us/img17/4792/northeurope4.png[/bigimg]

OK, so what's next? Any suggestions? Ideas? Gameplay or graphics-wise?

Is this a map worth developing?

[RjBeals]

cool texture on the lands, although i'm not sure it works to well on a map. Nice start though.

[Industrial Helix]

Personally, I prefer territories rather that interlinked cities... but your choice really. I like the graphics though. And shouldn't this be called something like greater scandanavia?

[porkenbeans]

ND,
Nice start. I like where this is going. I will suggest to you the same hing that I have suggested to many map makers.
A good work of art needs contrast. You need to contrast the water from the land. Make one on the dark side, and the other light. Try making the water a very light shade of blue, or turquoise. This will make the land stand out. After you do this you will probably not need the outer glow on the land.
Good luck.

[RjBeals]

yes. northern sweden blends in too much with the oceans.

[grifftron]

i like it natty

[isaiah40]

Good start!!

Just a couple of things to start. The ocean, can you knock down the opacity a little or change it something a little more subdued? It pops out too much. The colors of the bonuses need to be changed around or switch out colors because I am having difficulty seeing the switch between one bonus and another. I am not color blind so I can just imagine the trouble for someone who is. Other than these two things for now looking good, hopefully this map goes far!!

[natty dread]

Thanks for all the feedback! All good suggestions and will be taken in account for the next version. This was never supposed to be nothing more than a draft to show where the continents and territories would be, but I got kinda carried away with it...

And shouldn't this be called something like greater scandanavia?

Let me explain my reasoning. Scandinavia only consists of Norway, Sweden and Denmark, and maybe a bit of Finland. I started out wanting to make a map of the Nordic countries (Norway, Sweden, Denmark, Finland, Iceland) but then I thought to include Estonia because they're culturally very very close to Finland, they're practically same people, they just got separated from each other somewhere along the way. So now that I put in Estonia I couldn't even call this the Nordic Countries anymore, so I decided on Northern Europe.

So anyway, let me sum up all the changes that need doing:

- add contrast water/ land
- distinguish bonus colours from each other better
- add more contrast between sweden / ocean

I'll add one of my own:

- draw a better legend

I may be adding a few more territories. Saaremaa, that island on the west coast of Estonia, would make for a good link between Estonia and Sweden. Right now the sea route is between Pärnu and Gotland, and IIRC Pärnu isn't even a port town!

[jefjef]

Northern Europe? Not sure it's the correct name for the region. Perhaps Nordic Countries.

[natty dread]

Let me explain my reasoning. Scandinavia only consists of Norway, Sweden and Denmark, and maybe a bit of Finland. I started out wanting to make a map of the Nordic countries (Norway, Sweden, Denmark, Finland, Iceland) but then I thought to include Estonia because they're culturally very very close to Finland, they're practically same people, they just got separated from each other somewhere along the way. So now that I put in Estonia I couldn't even call this the Nordic Countries anymore, so I decided on Northern Europe.

Anyway, the project name is Northern Europe for now. A name change may be considered later on, like happened on the protein map -> Proteins 101. I'm still working on both maps btw, I won't abandon either unless public opinion clearly shows that the map(s) are not wanted...

[natty dread]

v.2

[bigimg]http://img69.imageshack.us/img69/8410/northeurope5.png[/bigimg]

imageshack is acting up at the moment, the image should be visible in a moment.

damn, I'll try uploading again...

now it should work.

[soundman]

v.2

[bigimg]http://img69.imageshack.us/img69/8410/northeurope5.png[/bigimg]

imageshack is acting up at the moment, the image should be visible in a moment.

damn, I'll try uploading again...

now it should work.

I like it. But you need someway to show which bonus is which.

[natty dread]

There will be, check the previous versions. I just haven't yet decided on the bonuses, so I'll let it be for now.

Anyone have any suggestions for the continent boni?

[soundman]

There will be, check the previous versions. I just haven't yet decided on the bonuses, so I'll let it be for now.

Anyone have any suggestions for the continent boni?

The previous versions are color coded. The new text box has all the same color font so you don't know what's what.

[natty dread]

That's what I'm trying to tell you. Check the previous version to see how I will colour the legend. The latest version's legend is just to show the style that the legend is going to have. I didn't finish the legend of the latest version because I'm still unsure of the bonuses for the continents. The first version had a rough guesstimate of the bonuses, but I'd like some professional opinions on how to arrange the bonuses before the I finish the legend for the next version, and when I do that I will do the colour codes for the legend again.

Besides, the bonus colours have changed. And I might still have to change them...

So.
Any ideas for the continent bonuses?

I don't have a spreadsheet software installed (I think) so could someone run the bonus calculator spreadsheet for me?

[soundman]

Ok I get it now. Here's a link to a couple bonus spreadsheets: http://www.conquerclub.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=466&t=1410 They're towards the bottom.

[natty dread]

I don't have a spreadsheet software installed (I think) so could someone run the bonus calculator spreadsheet for me?

please?

[natty dread]

Vewsion thwee

[bigimg]http://img338.imageshack.us/img338/6526/northeuropev3.png[/bigimg]

[grandin]

Great start, natty!

A couple of suggestions:

Coloring/style;
In my opinion, the map is way to dark. As porkenbeans said, the water needs to be contrasted from the land. I also think that the land areas should have a more 'natural' feel to the colors.
The color scheme combined with the style of the legend makes the whole thing feel like an old worn-down soviet military base.

Regions, Sweden;
Splitting Sweden into only two regions might work, but not where it is done at the moment. Ask a swede where the northern parts of sweden begin, and he might say anything from Gävle to Mora or Sundsvall, but not many would agree that it is as far north as you've drawn the line - and no one would agree that Sveg is in the south of Sweden.
It would be more accurate to use the commonly accepted region of Norrland

The best option would be to use three regions, namely Norrland, Svealand and Götaland

//Really looking forward to someone actually finishing a Norden map

[natty dread]

Great start, natty!

Thanks

A couple of suggestions:

Coloring/style;
In my opinion, the map is way to dark. As porkenbeans said, the water needs to be contrasted from the land. I also think that the land areas should have a more 'natural' feel to the colors.

I already made the land lighter in the latest update, also the sea is now darker. I've also added a slight drop shadow around the land to further contrast it from the water.

The color scheme combined with the style of the legend makes the whole thing feel like an old worn-down soviet military base.

Well, that's kinda what I was going for!

In all seriousness, I know the graphical style is a bit unorthodox and different from other maps, but I don't think that's necessarily a flaw. I want the map to stand out with the graphical style.

Regions, Sweden;
Splitting Sweden into only two regions might work, but not where it is done at the moment. Ask a swede where the northern parts of sweden begin, and he might say anything from Gävle to Mora or Sundsvall, but not many would agree that it is as far north as you've drawn the line - and no one would agree that Sveg is in the south of Sweden.

Well, yes, I agree, but gameplay-wise it was the best choice. As you see I didn't go by any geographical regions, because I didn't want the continents to be too unbalanced. I don't want to make an Asia on this map, a huge chunk of land which nobody wants because it's too hard to defend. Splitting it to three parts would make for too much small bonus areas, since I already have three very small bonus areas.

It would be more accurate to use the commonly accepted region of Norrland

The best option would be to use three regions, namely Norrland, Svealand and Götaland

//Really looking forward to someone actually finishing a Norden map

Like I said, sometimes it's necessary to sacrifice geographical/historical accuracy in favor of better gameplay. After all, this is a gaming site, not an educational one

But I very much appreciate your feedback, and I will look into it and see if I can implement some of the suggestions in the next update.

[jefjef]

I'm sorry but I just don't get the name.

Estonia isn't considered part of Europe. Denmark is barely but is also part of Scandanavia & Nordic countries. Iceland is Nordic.

Confused. But anyway looks like you have a good start.

[natty dread]

Estonia isn't considered part of Europe. Denmark is barely but is also part of Scandanavia & Nordic countries. Iceland is Nordic.

Let me guess... you're an American?

I'm sorry but you're wrong. Estonia is very much a part of europe, it even belongs to the European Union. As is & does Denmark. Iceland is part of the Nordic countries along with Denmark, Sweden, Norway and Finland, and the Nordic countries are considered to be a part of europe. All of them except Norway belong to the EU.

I named the map Northern Europe because it sounds better than "The Nordic Countries and Estonia", ok?

[AndyDufresne]

This map has a long way to go visually. Mechanically, the game play we'll have to delve into...


--Andy

[natty dread]

This map has a long way to go visually.

Of course it does, it's version #3 for gob's sake...

Mechanically, the game play we'll have to delve into...

As always, I would love to hear your ideas and insight. Let me pick your brain!