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Good Riddance

Posted: Tue Nov 10, 2009 11:52 pm
by colton24
http://www.comcast.net/articles/news-general/20091109/US.Sniper.Execution
D.C. sniper Muhammad executed for 2002 attacks

JARRATT, Va. — John Allen Muhammad, the mastermind behind the sniper attacks that left 10 dead, was executed Tuesday night as relatives of the victims watched, reliving the killing spree that terrorized the Washington metro area for three weeks in October 2002.

He looked calm and stoic, but was twitching and blinking as the injections began, defiant to the end, refusing to utter any final words. Victims' families sat behind glass while watching the execution, separated from the rest of the 27 witnesses.

"He died very peacefully, much more than most of his victims," said Prince William County prosecutor Paul Ebert, who witnessed Muhammad die by injection at 9:11 p.m. at Greensville Correctional Center, south of Richmond. Muhammad, dressed in a blue shirt, jeans and flip-flops, had no final statement.

Muhammad was executed for killing Dean Harold Meyers, who was shot in the head at a Manassas gas station during the three-week spree across Maryland, Virginia and Washington, D.C.

Nelson Rivera, whose wife, Lori Ann Lewis-Rivera, was gunned down as she vacuumed her van at a Maryland gas station said when he watched Muhammad's chest moving for the last time, he was glad.

"I feel better. I think I can breathe better and I'm happy he's gone. Because he's not going to hurt anyone else," he said.

Dean's brother, Bob Meyers, said watching the execution was a point of closure but that he was "overcome by the sadness that the whole situation generates in my heart."

"Honestly it was surreal watching the life being sapped out of somebody intentionally was very different," he said on CNN's "Larry King Live."

J. Wyndal Gordon, one of Muhammad's attorneys, described his client in his final hours as fearless and still insisting he was innocent.

"He will die with dignity — dignity to the point of defiance," Gordon said.

The shootings terrorized the region, as victim after victim was shot down while doing everyday chores: going shopping, pumping gas, mowing the lawn. One child was shot while walking into his middle school.

People stayed indoors. Those who did go outside weaved as they walked or bobbed their heads to make themselves a less easy target.

The campaign of terror ended on Oct. 24, 2002, when police captured Muhammad and his teenage accomplice, Lee Boyd Malvo, as they slept at a Maryland rest stop in a car they had outfitted for a shooter to perch in its trunk without being detected. Malvo is serving a life prison term.

They also were suspected of fatal shootings in other states, including Louisiana, Alabama and Arizona.

The U.S. Supreme Court turned down Muhammad's final appeal Monday and Gov. Timothy M. Kaine denied clemency Tuesday.

Re: Good Riddance

Posted: Wed Nov 11, 2009 12:02 am
by HapSmo19
=D> =D> =D> =D> =D> /5

Re: Good Riddance

Posted: Wed Nov 11, 2009 3:14 am
by BigBallinStalin
HapSmo19 wrote:=D> =D> =D> =D> =D> /5

 
= 1 =D>

Re: Good Riddance

Posted: Wed Nov 11, 2009 7:51 am
by Serbia
I honestly thought this thread was about colton leaving CC.

Re: Good Riddance

Posted: Wed Nov 11, 2009 8:33 am
by perchorin
Serbia wrote:I honestly thought this thread was about colton leaving CC.

That's the only reason I looked at it. :(

Re: Good Riddance

Posted: Wed Nov 11, 2009 8:36 am
by alex951
perchorin wrote:
Serbia wrote:I honestly thought this thread was about colton leaving CC.

That's the only reason I looked at it. :(


:lol:

Re: Good Riddance

Posted: Wed Nov 11, 2009 9:46 am
by xelabale
It's a sad state of affairs when a 12 year old gloats over the death of someone under any circumstances.... unless they're simply a troll of course and not 12 at all...

Re: Good Riddance

Posted: Wed Nov 11, 2009 11:13 am
by colton24
xelabale wrote:It's a sad state of affairs when a 12 year old gloats over the death of someone under any circumstances.... unless they're simply a troll of course and not 12 at all...


The guy sniped 10 people for no reason. And Virginia is where some of my cousins are. They could've been killed

Re: Good Riddance

Posted: Wed Nov 11, 2009 11:14 am
by jonesthecurl
Shouldn't have hadda gun.

Re: Good Riddance

Posted: Wed Nov 11, 2009 11:20 am
by Pedronicus
perchorin wrote:
Serbia wrote:I honestly thought this thread was about colton leaving CC.

That's the only reason I looked at it. :(

Me too.

Re: Good Riddance

Posted: Wed Nov 11, 2009 11:22 am
by nagerous
I never applaud the death penalty, which should not be used in any circumstances - perhaps only in a scenario where a person still alived is viewed as a hero and is acting as an active influence on people still alive by speaking out whilst being incarcerated such as hypothetically with the Nazis and the Nuremberg Trials.

Re: Good Riddance

Posted: Wed Nov 11, 2009 11:31 am
by colton24
nagerous wrote:I never applaud the death penalty, which should not be used in any circumstances - perhaps only in a scenario where a person still alived is viewed as a hero and is acting as an active influence on people still alive by speaking out whilst being incarcerated such as hypothetically with the Nazis and the Nuremberg Trials.


I don't like the death penalty either. However, what if the guy breaks out? He goes right back to terrorizing people. I don't approve of the death penalty, but in this case it really wouldn't be right to let him live after killing 10 people for no apparent reason. He even brainwashed his son into killing people that got his son the life sentence.

Re: Good Riddance

Posted: Wed Nov 11, 2009 12:57 pm
by xelabale
colton24 wrote:
xelabale wrote:It's a sad state of affairs when a 12 year old gloats over the death of someone under any circumstances.... unless they're simply a troll of course and not 12 at all...


The guy sniped 10 people for no reason. And Virginia is where some of my cousins are. They could've been killed

You were 5 allegedly, what do you know about it?

Re: Good Riddance

Posted: Wed Nov 11, 2009 3:18 pm
by Johnny Rockets
In cases like this the death penalty should be put into play. Any mass murderer or serial killing sociopath has no place in our society, be it behind bars or not.

Someone commits a crime or a multitude of crimes on this level and your willing to fund his incarceration for the next 40-60 years? That's a pretty expensive price tag to avoid some guilt.

I'm not a proponent of the death penalty to be used very freely, but in situations like this I think this element should be removed for the well being of all.

Johnny Rockets

Re: Good Riddance

Posted: Wed Nov 11, 2009 3:28 pm
by safariguy5
Johnny Rockets wrote:In cases like this the death penalty should be put into play. Any mass murderer or serial killing sociopath has no place in our society, be it behind bars or not.

Someone commits a crime or a multitude of crimes on this level and your willing to fund his incarceration for the next 40-60 years? That's a pretty expensive price tag to avoid some guilt.

I'm not a proponent of the death penalty to be used very freely, but in situations like this I think this element should be removed for the well being of all.

Johnny Rockets


I agree, it's expensive to maintain jails. Now if there is hope of turning your prisoners into law abiding citizens, I view this as more of an investment in their future productivity. However, in cases where this clearly is not possible like in this instance, I would prefer the death penalty over all that wasted taxpayer money.

Re: Good Riddance

Posted: Wed Nov 11, 2009 3:32 pm
by Sackett58
Johnny Rockets wrote:In cases like this the death penalty should be put into play. Any mass murderer or serial killing sociopath has no place in our society, be it behind bars or not.

Someone commits a crime or a multitude of crimes on this level and your willing to fund his incarceration for the next 40-60 years? That's a pretty expensive price tag to avoid some guilt.

I'm not a proponent of the death penalty to be used very freely, but in situations like this I think this element should be removed for the well being of all.

Johnny Rockets



Agreed

Re: Good Riddance

Posted: Wed Nov 11, 2009 4:08 pm
by xelabale
Try incarcerating less people, treating your vets better, making more people healthier, and selling less guns - then you won't have to deal with this problem in the first place.

If you yanks need any more help you know where to find me...

Re: Good Riddance

Posted: Wed Nov 11, 2009 4:10 pm
by Snorri1234
safariguy5 wrote:it's expensive to maintain jails.

And it is totally not crazy expensive to use the death penalty!


Now if there is hope of turning your prisoners into law abiding citizens, I view this as more of an investment in their future productivity. However, in cases where this clearly is not possible like in this instance, I would prefer the death penalty over all that wasted taxpayer money.


Talking about wasted taxpayer money, how about the death penalty?

Re: Good Riddance

Posted: Wed Nov 11, 2009 4:15 pm
by the.killing.44
This post was made by colton24 who is currently on your ignore list. Display this post.
HapSmo19 wrote:=D> =D> =D> =D> =D> /5

BigBallinStalin wrote:
HapSmo19 wrote:=D> =D> =D> =D> =D> /5

 
= 1 =D>

I thought he was leaving too, as I read the second and third posts before the first. Only a news article :(

Re: Good Riddance

Posted: Wed Nov 11, 2009 4:25 pm
by safariguy5
Snorri1234 wrote:
safariguy5 wrote:it's expensive to maintain jails.

And it is totally not crazy expensive to use the death penalty!


Now if there is hope of turning your prisoners into law abiding citizens, I view this as more of an investment in their future productivity. However, in cases where this clearly is not possible like in this instance, I would prefer the death penalty over all that wasted taxpayer money.


Talking about wasted taxpayer money, how about the death penalty?


Here's my point, say you have a counterfeiter, who does say 5 years of jail time. Is there a possibility this person can be rehabilitated and lead a law abiding life? I would say yes. Therefore, the time spent in jail can be used for things like education and the such. When he leaves, he enters the workforce, starts paying taxes, the government gets something back.

Now let's say we have this guy from the article. No way would we believe that he can be a law abiding citizen. Are we gonna pay for maybe 60 years worth of his living expenses? Is that cheaper than the amount of money it takes to do a lethal injection? The answer is no, it is not cheaper. Since there is no possibility of any gain in the future, why not use the economical route? If anything, he deserves it too.

Re: Good Riddance

Posted: Wed Nov 11, 2009 4:36 pm
by Snorri1234
safariguy5 wrote: Is that cheaper than the amount of money it takes to do a lethal injection? The answer is no, it is not cheaper.



Actually, the answer is yes, it is cheaper. Currently sentencing someone to death is more expensive than putting them into prison for life. The massive amounts of money involved in the appeals process coupled with the higher amount of money put into a trial where the outcome is deathpenalty mean that it's simply cheaper to put him in jail till he dies than to try to kill him.

Re: Good Riddance

Posted: Wed Nov 11, 2009 4:39 pm
by BigBallinStalin
colton24 wrote:
nagerous wrote:I never applaud the death penalty, which should not be used in any circumstances - perhaps only in a scenario where a person still alived is viewed as a hero and is acting as an active influence on people still alive by speaking out whilst being incarcerated such as hypothetically with the Nazis and the Nuremberg Trials.


I don't like the death penalty either. However, what if the guy breaks out? He goes right back to terrorizing people. I don't approve of the death penalty, but in this case it really wouldn't be right to let him live after killing 10 people for no apparent reason. He even brainwashed his son into killing people that got his son the life sentence.


OH MY GOD! WHAT IF HE DOES? THEN HE MGIGHT RECRUIT BIG AMRY AND KILL US ALL! EVRYONE DEAD! DEAD EDAEED DEAD DEAD!!

Re: Good Riddance

Posted: Wed Nov 11, 2009 4:45 pm
by Snorri1234
BigBallinStalin wrote:
colton24 wrote:
nagerous wrote:I never applaud the death penalty, which should not be used in any circumstances - perhaps only in a scenario where a person still alived is viewed as a hero and is acting as an active influence on people still alive by speaking out whilst being incarcerated such as hypothetically with the Nazis and the Nuremberg Trials.


I don't like the death penalty either. However, what if the guy breaks out? He goes right back to terrorizing people. I don't approve of the death penalty, but in this case it really wouldn't be right to let him live after killing 10 people for no apparent reason. He even brainwashed his son into killing people that got his son the life sentence.


OH MY GOD! WHAT IF HE DOES? THEN HE MGIGHT RECRUIT BIG AMRY AND KILL US ALL! EVRYONE DEAD! DEAD EDAEED DEAD DEAD!!


We should totally be fearfull of all those dudes who break out of jail and get around to killing people again. But we should also not prevent dudes like Michael Scofield from getting out of jail though.

Re: Good Riddance

Posted: Wed Nov 11, 2009 5:31 pm
by BigBallinStalin
Snorri1234 wrote:
BigBallinStalin wrote:
colton24 wrote:
nagerous wrote:I never applaud the death penalty, which should not be used in any circumstances - perhaps only in a scenario where a person still alived is viewed as a hero and is acting as an active influence on people still alive by speaking out whilst being incarcerated such as hypothetically with the Nazis and the Nuremberg Trials.


I don't like the death penalty either. However, what if the guy breaks out? He goes right back to terrorizing people. I don't approve of the death penalty, but in this case it really wouldn't be right to let him live after killing 10 people for no apparent reason. He even brainwashed his son into killing people that got his son the life sentence.


OH MY GOD! WHAT IF HE DOES? THEN HE MGIGHT RECRUIT BIG AMRY AND KILL US ALL! EVRYONE DEAD! DEAD EDAEED DEAD DEAD!!


We should totally be fearfull of all those dudes who break out of jail and get around to killing people again. But we should also not prevent dudes like Michael Scofield from getting out of jail though.


Justifying the death penalty because it would render impossible that prisoner's unlikely escape from prison is a poor reason to allow the state to legally kill people. The prisons' security itself should be evaluated.

Honestly, one has higher chance of being harmed or killed by other factors than prison escapees, which is why I didn't take colton's comment seriously.

Re: Good Riddance

Posted: Wed Nov 11, 2009 5:52 pm
by safariguy5
Snorri1234 wrote:
safariguy5 wrote: Is that cheaper than the amount of money it takes to do a lethal injection? The answer is no, it is not cheaper.



Actually, the answer is yes, it is cheaper. Currently sentencing someone to death is more expensive than putting them into prison for life. The massive amounts of money involved in the appeals process coupled with the higher amount of money put into a trial where the outcome is deathpenalty mean that it's simply cheaper to put him in jail till he dies than to try to kill him.


That may be true, but it is mainly due to the supreme court hearing all of these cases. First, they will hear appeals based on disputed evidence. Then, they'll hear the same case based on improper procedure. Then, they'll hear the case based on "new" evidence or procedural error. While I'm all for the justice system, I do find it highly redundant in the constant rehearing of cases for each technicality. I believe that the appeal should take all of these into consideration and present 1 appeal for that. Alas, that is not the case.

Now, if we were to have 1 firm appeals process instead of what amounts to stall tactics, then I would argue that the death penalty is cheaper.