Conquer Club

bedub1 wrote:

Phatscotty wrote:Canadian Premier Williams is coming to the USA for his heart surgery. Isnt that the same guy who said in the past, repeatedly...

Any Health Care available in the USA is available in Canada

fastforward to 2010, Canadian Premier Williams, upon needing health care himself....

I can't get the Health Care I need in Canada

I was going to come post about this, but I'm glad you guys are already on top of it. This is just proof that the US DOES have the BEST healthcare system in the world.

I always hope to get the conversation started before everyone can get their talking points.

Phatscotty wrote:

PLAYER57832 wrote:

Phatscotty wrote:

Baron Von PWN wrote:Is that actually a quote from Danny Williams? As far as I know he hasn't spoken to the media about whatever is ailing him yet.

It's standard procedure in Canada that if a patient has a very specific problem requiring a specialist the gov will make sure you get access to that specialist even if it means going outside of the country. sometimes this means the US sometimes it means Europe all depends on the circumstances. In the Premier's case we don't know the details he and his staff have declined to give them. He might just not want to wait and so he bought the procedure in the US or it might be a rare case that needs a very specific kind of specialist.

he is a very popular politician it will be interesting to see how this will play out in Newfoundland & Labrador.

when you say "wait" it sounds like "oh that's just the way it is in Canada, ya know?" like you always have to wait.....for heart surgery? How long is that wait? holy shit is everything ok up there?

For a reality check, try seeing how long an uninsured person has to wait here in the US...

OR what it costs most people who only think they have enough insurance, here in the US. Things have changed in the past year with the bank issues, but the year before it was still true that roughly 75% of bankruptcies came within 2 years of a serious medical issue. Paying for the healthcare might not have been the direct and immediate cause of a person losing their home, etc. However, it often set off a cascading set of issues.

you CAN NOT be turned away from an emergency room....everything you said is a myth.

lol. she didn't say anything about emergency rooms. in fact, the discussion is about a highly specialized procedure on a heart. Everything you said is a myth.

bedub1 wrote:

Phatscotty wrote:Canadian Premier Williams is coming to the USA for his heart surgery. Isnt that the same guy who said in the past, repeatedly...

Any Health Care available in the USA is available in Canada

fastforward to 2010, Canadian Premier Williams, upon needing health care himself....

I can't get the Health Care I need in Canada

I was going to come post about this, but I'm glad you guys are already on top of it. This is just proof that the US DOES have the BEST healthcare system in the world.

Which of course is why Americans die sooner than most other developed nations.

Baron Von PWN wrote:

bedub1 wrote:

Phatscotty wrote:Canadian Premier Williams is coming to the USA for his heart surgery. Isnt that the same guy who said in the past, repeatedly...

Any Health Care available in the USA is available in Canada

fastforward to 2010, Canadian Premier Williams, upon needing health care himself....

I can't get the Health Care I need in Canada

I was going to come post about this, but I'm glad you guys are already on top of it. This is just proof that the US DOES have the BEST healthcare system in the world.

Which of course is why Americans die sooner than most other developed nations.

Sure, completely discount that we make our own life choices. For example, for some unknown reason, there is an abundance of red meat in the USA. People can go and choose to eat meat whenever they want. I could go on for a week why Canadians live 4 months longer on average than Americans. To say it's all because of Canadas health care system is absolutely naive.

Phatscotty wrote:

Baron Von PWN wrote:

bedub1 wrote:

Phatscotty wrote:Canadian Premier Williams is coming to the USA for his heart surgery. Isnt that the same guy who said in the past, repeatedly...

Any Health Care available in the USA is available in Canada

fastforward to 2010, Canadian Premier Williams, upon needing health care himself....

I can't get the Health Care I need in Canada

I was going to come post about this, but I'm glad you guys are already on top of it. This is just proof that the US DOES have the BEST healthcare system in the world.

Which of course is why Americans die sooner than most other developed nations.

Sure, completely discount that we make our own life choices. For example, for some unknown reason, there is an abundance of red meat in the USA. People can go and choose to eat meat whenever they want. I could go on for a week why Canadians live 4 months longer on average than Americans. To say it's all because of Canadas health care system is absolutely naive.

If only there were some kind of system that helped people stay healthy. Oh well we can only dream.

Baron Von PWN wrote:

Phatscotty wrote:

Baron Von PWN wrote:

bedub1 wrote:I was going to come post about this, but I'm glad you guys are already on top of it. This is just proof that the US DOES have the BEST healthcare system in the world.

Which of course is why Americans die sooner than most other developed nations.

Sure, completely discount that we make our own life choices. For example, for some unknown reason, there is an abundance of red meat in the USA. People can go and choose to eat meat whenever they want. I could go on for a week why Canadians live 4 months longer on average than Americans. To say it's all because of Canadas health care system is absolutely naive.

If only there were some kind of system that helped people stay healthy. Oh well we can only dream.

I think it's called "force"? no thank you, prefer freedom

Baron-

You see, if we just lay inside a box, and never eat red meat, and never have any fun, and never fly on an airplane, never go out in the sun, never work more than 28 hours a week, or never drive on a highway, you can live a very long time! This is the best! Can't you see? here, I'll show you! now you don't even have the choice! This is the way everybody should be!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Phatscotty wrote:

Baron Von PWN wrote:

Phatscotty wrote:

Baron Von PWN wrote:

bedub1 wrote:I was going to come post about this, but I'm glad you guys are already on top of it. This is just proof that the US DOES have the BEST healthcare system in the world.

Which of course is why Americans die sooner than most other developed nations.

Sure, completely discount that we make our own life choices. For example, for some unknown reason, there is an abundance of red meat in the USA. People can go and choose to eat meat whenever they want. I could go on for a week why Canadians live 4 months longer on average than Americans. To say it's all because of Canadas health care system is absolutely naive.

If only there were some kind of system that helped people stay healthy. Oh well we can only dream.

I think it's called "force"? no thank you, prefer freedom

Baron-

You see, if we just lay inside a box, and never eat red meat, and never have any fun, and never fly on an airplane, never go out in the sun, never work more than 28 hours a week, or never drive on a highway, you can live a very long time! This is the best! Can't you see? here, I'll show you! now you don't even have the choice! This is the way everybody should be!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Not sure which Baron you're quoting there but they would be very wrong. Red meat in moderation is good for you, as is sunlight and flying is one of the safest means of travel.

Baron Von PWN wrote:

Phatscotty wrote:

Baron Von PWN wrote:

Phatscotty wrote:

Baron Von PWN wrote:
Which of course is why Americans die sooner than most other developed nations.

Sure, completely discount that we make our own life choices. For example, for some unknown reason, there is an abundance of red meat in the USA. People can go and choose to eat meat whenever they want. I could go on for a week why Canadians live 4 months longer on average than Americans. To say it's all because of Canadas health care system is absolutely naive.

If only there were some kind of system that helped people stay healthy. Oh well we can only dream.

I think it's called "force"? no thank you, prefer freedom

Baron-

You see, if we just lay inside a box, and never eat red meat, and never have any fun, and never fly on an airplane, never go out in the sun, never work more than 28 hours a week, or never drive on a highway, you can live a very long time! This is the best! Can't you see? here, I'll show you! now you don't even have the choice! This is the way everybody should be!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Not sure which Baron you're quoting there but they would be very wrong. Red meat in moderation is good for you, as is sunlight and flying is one of the safest means of travel.

holy shit dude look up the word freedom...you just have not a clue

Phatscotty wrote:

PLAYER57832 wrote:

Phatscotty wrote:For a reality check, try seeing how long an uninsured person has to wait here in the US...

OR what it costs most people who only think they have enough insurance, here in the US. Things have changed in the past year with the bank issues, but the year before it was still true that roughly 75% of bankruptcies came within 2 years of a serious medical issue. Paying for the healthcare might not have been the direct and immediate cause of a person losing their home, etc. However, it often set off a cascading set of issues.

you CAN NOT be turned away from an emergency room....everything you said is a myth.

Missed the point again. If you are able to walk around, etc. then you are no longer a true "emergency" in most cases. Suspected heart issues ARE emergencies, but only if the doctor believes you and doesn't think you are just looking for a warm place, on drugs, etc.

Besides, reliance upon emergency rooms is part of why our uninsured health bill (paid for by we taxpayers) is so very, very high and rising. That's part of the problem, not the solution. The solution is to get everyone REGULAR care.

But, hey, I only have family all over the US and in Europe, have multitudes of experiences (both good and bad) with several different insurance companies, and have been obtaining this for more than a few years on my own dime.

Don't let this all fool you. Socialized or Privatized Healthcare = Someone is still getting rich, and it's not me.

Change the Government, they answer to us. If they don't listen, vote them ALL out!!!

Smile stickers for everyone!

PLAYER57832 wrote:

Phatscotty wrote:

PLAYER57832 wrote:

Phatscotty wrote:For a reality check, try seeing how long an uninsured person has to wait here in the US...

OR what it costs most people who only think they have enough insurance, here in the US. Things have changed in the past year with the bank issues, but the year before it was still true that roughly 75% of bankruptcies came within 2 years of a serious medical issue. Paying for the healthcare might not have been the direct and immediate cause of a person losing their home, etc. However, it often set off a cascading set of issues.

you CAN NOT be turned away from an emergency room....everything you said is a myth.

Missed the point again. If you are able to walk around, etc. then you are no longer a true "emergency" in most cases. Suspected heart issues ARE emergencies, but only if the doctor believes you and doesn't think you are just looking for a warm place, on drugs, etc.

Besides, reliance upon emergency rooms is part of why our uninsured health bill (paid for by we taxpayers) is so very, very high and rising. That's part of the problem, not the solution. The solution is to get everyone REGULAR care.

But, hey, I only have family all over the US and in Europe, have multitudes of experiences (both good and bad) with several different insurance companies, and have been obtaining this for more than a few years on my own dime.

you are wrong

Suspected heart issues ARE emergencies, but only if the doctor believes you and doesn't think you are just looking for a warm place, on drugs, etc.

Um, it's still an emergancy if the doctor's wrong and doesn't believe the person having heart "issues".

bedub1 wrote:

Phatscotty wrote:Canadian Premier Williams is coming to the USA for his heart surgery. Isnt that the same guy who said in the past, repeatedly...

Any Health Care available in the USA is available in Canada

fastforward to 2010, Canadian Premier Williams, upon needing health care himself....

I can't get the Health Care I need in Canada

I was going to come post about this, but I'm glad you guys are already on top of it. This is just proof that the US DOES have the BEST healthcare system in the world.

Its simply proof that you have some of the best specialists in the world. I know several Canadian doctors that work in the states simply because the pay is better. If your health system is so great, why do Canadians, and many other nationalities, live longer? I haven't checked, but I bet you Cubans have a longer life span.

notyou2 wrote:

bedub1 wrote:

Phatscotty wrote:Canadian Premier Williams is coming to the USA for his heart surgery. Isnt that the same guy who said in the past, repeatedly...

Any Health Care available in the USA is available in Canada

fastforward to 2010, Canadian Premier Williams, upon needing health care himself....

I can't get the Health Care I need in Canada

I was going to come post about this, but I'm glad you guys are already on top of it. This is just proof that the US DOES have the BEST healthcare system in the world.

Its simply proof that you have some of the best specialists in the world. I know several Canadian doctors that work in the states simply because the pay is better. If your health system is so great, why do Canadians, and many other nationalities, live longer? I haven't checked, but I bet you Cubans have a longer life span.

They do, just barely.

Phatscotty wrote:

PLAYER57832 wrote:

Phatscotty wrote:

PLAYER57832 wrote:

Phatscotty wrote:For a reality check, try seeing how long an uninsured person has to wait here in the US...

OR what it costs most people who only think they have enough insurance, here in the US. Things have changed in the past year with the bank issues, but the year before it was still true that roughly 75% of bankruptcies came within 2 years of a serious medical issue. Paying for the healthcare might not have been the direct and immediate cause of a person losing their home, etc. However, it often set off a cascading set of issues.

you CAN NOT be turned away from an emergency room....everything you said is a myth.

Missed the point again. If you are able to walk around, etc. then you are no longer a true "emergency" in most cases. Suspected heart issues ARE emergencies, but only if the doctor believes you and doesn't think you are just looking for a warm place, on drugs, etc.

Besides, reliance upon emergency rooms is part of why our uninsured health bill (paid for by we taxpayers) is so very, very high and rising. That's part of the problem, not the solution. The solution is to get everyone REGULAR care.

But, hey, I only have family all over the US and in Europe, have multitudes of experiences (both good and bad) with several different insurance companies, and have been obtaining this for more than a few years on my own dime.

you are wrong

Brilliant counter Scotty....Fuckin brilliant!!!! Mind if I use that one?

notyou2 wrote:

bedub1 wrote:

Phatscotty wrote:Canadian Premier Williams is coming to the USA for his heart surgery. Isnt that the same guy who said in the past, repeatedly...

Any Health Care available in the USA is available in Canada

fastforward to 2010, Canadian Premier Williams, upon needing health care himself....

I can't get the Health Care I need in Canada

I was going to come post about this, but I'm glad you guys are already on top of it. This is just proof that the US DOES have the BEST healthcare system in the world.

Its simply proof that you have some of the best specialists in the world. I know several Canadian doctors that work in the states simply because the pay is better. If your health system is so great, why do Canadians, and many other nationalities, live longer? I haven't checked, but I bet you Cubans have a longer life span.

I'm sure it's ALL socialized healthcare, with no single other contributing factor.

notyou2 wrote:

Phatscotty wrote:

PLAYER57832 wrote:

Phatscotty wrote:

PLAYER57832 wrote:you CAN NOT be turned away from an emergency room....everything you said is a myth.

Missed the point again. If you are able to walk around, etc. then you are no longer a true "emergency" in most cases. Suspected heart issues ARE emergencies, but only if the doctor believes you and doesn't think you are just looking for a warm place, on drugs, etc.

Besides, reliance upon emergency rooms is part of why our uninsured health bill (paid for by we taxpayers) is so very, very high and rising. That's part of the problem, not the solution. The solution is to get everyone REGULAR care.

But, hey, I only have family all over the US and in Europe, have multitudes of experiences (both good and bad) with several different insurance companies, and have been obtaining this for more than a few years on my own dime.

you are wrong

Brilliant counter Scotty....Fuckin brilliant!!!! Mind if I use that one?

I have a close relative that works at numerous hospitals as head ER. I'm just not even going to adress that point. it's wrong on so many levels. I don't have to educate him on how it really works. I would rather stand back and watch him slit his own throat with demands for socialized medicine, so America can throw the progressives out once and for all.

Mega dittos Scotty!

Phatscotty wrote:holy shit dude look up the word freedom...you just have not a clue

Ok I will. Freedom is the human value, or situation, to act according to one's will without being held up by the power of others.

Hmm sounds pretty subjective. There are many situations in the USA which are not "free" according to the criteria you seem to place on public healthcare. For example: Americans are not free to shoot whomever they please. Americans are forced to drive under certain speeds. they are forced to go school. Americans are prohibited from buying certain things or going to certain countries.

Oh my, how do you Americans live in such an oppressive system.

bedub1 wrote:

Phatscotty wrote:Canadian Premier Williams is coming to the USA for his heart surgery. Isnt that the same guy who said in the past, repeatedly...

Any Health Care available in the USA is available in Canada

fastforward to 2010, Canadian Premier Williams, upon needing health care himself....

I can't get the Health Care I need in Canada

I was going to come post about this, but I'm glad you guys are already on top of it. This is just proof that the US DOES have the BEST healthcare system in the world.

STOP BEING SO UNBELIEVABLY DUMB YOU GUYS! SERIOUSLY!

http://www.denverpost.com/ci_13530098

Why does the greatest health care system in the world ban healthy babies from insurance?

Phatscotty wrote:I have a close relative that works at numerous hospitals as head ER.

So do I, and while I have not run an ER, I have been an EMT in 4 states.

Phatscotty wrote:I'm just not even going to adress that point. it's wrong on so many levels. I don't have to educate him on how it really works. I would rather stand back and watch him slit his own throat with demands for socialized medicine, so America can throw the progressives out once and for all.

Educate me? Try educating yourself. I not only have relatives in emergency care, I was an EMT in 5 states, have literally grilled local doctors and administrators on these issues, partially to solve these issues here (they are well beyond local means of solutions, though) and partially because our whole hospital/medical care systems have been in huge flux.

Among other issues, you might get admitted, get treatment, but the bill collectors WILL come calling unless you are homeless or can prove you are indigent. Even then, relatives can be hit up for payment. In our case, when my husband' insurance changed, leaving us with a $1000 deductable, we told the hospital we would pay 1/2. Their answer? We got sent to collections and I had to field 2 weeks of daily harrassing phone calls until I finally put the charges on our credit card.

Second, definitions of emergencies vary a great deal. You might get care, but the If you are a woman, are poor, are a minority person, you are far less likely to be taken seriously by doctors. If a doctor does not feel your issue is "life threatening", then you have to provide proof you can pay. If you don't, they can generally turn you away. If a doctor does not feel your issue is "life threatening", then they can generally turn you away.

The biggest issue is that when you say "emergency rooms have to treat people" you ignore the fact that emergency is not supposed to be the first line of care. People who can regularly see doctors, get the tests they need are far less likely to need the emergency room. But that care is rarely available for free. Currently, in my community, many of those who have insurance cannot afford to go. And, though I have said it before, I will say it again, those who can are WORKING people -- people working 40 hours plus -- who's kids qualify for Medicaid either because they make less than $39,000 (for a family of 4 in PA) or have a child with a disability.

This uninsured and underinsured group includes a good many small business owners as well as those who work for them.

So .. please explain exactly what it is that you feel "I just have wrong" ?

Oh .. one more thing .... I am not "a guy".

I still don't understand why ER's not being able to deny you care is considered a good argument for your system being awesome.

Snorri1234 wrote:

bedub1 wrote:

Phatscotty wrote:Canadian Premier Williams is coming to the USA for his heart surgery. Isnt that the same guy who said in the past, repeatedly...

Any Health Care available in the USA is available in Canada

fastforward to 2010, Canadian Premier Williams, upon needing health care himself....

I can't get the Health Care I need in Canada

I was going to come post about this, but I'm glad you guys are already on top of it. This is just proof that the US DOES have the BEST healthcare system in the world.

STOP BEING SO UNBELIEVABLY DUMB YOU GUYS! SERIOUSLY!

Seriously guys. This is not proof of anything.