[GC] Choose Which Position (Color) to Join in a Game

[croco]

I do like the idea of addressing people by name. However, now that I have more experience in CC I see that being a bit of an issue. People are still going to use color names and it would be hard to sort this out in the software.

Perhaps a better, and very easy, solution would be to simply change the colors so that they are more colorblind friendly. Get rid of red and start with g,b,y,p. That simple change would allow most colorbinds to play up to 4 person games without issue. After those 4, make it as colorblind friendly as possible but even just moving red from 1 to 8 in your color profile would help a ton. Could use white and black as colors as well.

White is currently used for Neutrals.

Black armies were denied as they aren't visible on a lot of maps.

The problem is - we use 9 different colours for the army counts as it is - and they are as far apart as they can possibly be on the spectrums.

i.e. the colours are a tweaked version of
White FFFFFF (I didn't colour this one)
Red FF0000
Green 00FF00
Blue 0000FF
Yellow FFFF00
Pink FF00FF
Cyan 00FFFF
Black 000000 (We use a tweaked black to a grey)

Then one had to be chosen in the middle of the ranges - and an orange seemed to be the best fit...
Orange FF8800

As you can see - the first 8 colours are as far apart as they can possibly be (based on hex values).

I know this doesn't help you being Colourblind though... but if we removed Red - we'd then have to have another "mid range" colour - and the majority of people here would find it harder to distinguish who is who.

The other mid range colours could be...

FF0088
00FF88
0088FF
8800FF
888888

As you can see (although I appreciate you may not be able to) - these colours are too similar to the other colours... hence the choice of Orange.

(I know there have been complaints from some that Grey and Green are too close too each other too)

C.

I don't think it's possible to find 9 colors that your run-of-the-mill red/green colorblind person can distinguish in simple letters on the screen. However, you certainly can reorder what you have to make smaller games more enjoyable for us. By starting with red and green you make it impossible for us to play a game with easily distinguished colors. Simply moving red or green down the line would solve this and wouldn’t require any new colors. If you position red in-between pink and cyan you allow us to play 4 person games with easily distinguished colors. This seems like a very simple fix. Again, 7% to 10% of men are red/green colorblind.

[targetman377]

so cant you make a color skem where only the person picks any color and it only shows up on there map? and then on other peoples maps it shows up the usally color execept the on the color that they chose could this work?

[yeti_c]

so cant you make a color skem where only the person picks any color and it only shows up on there map? and then on other peoples maps it shows up the usally color execept the on the color that they chose could this work?

At the moment the Army numbers are generated as an overlaid image - this image is created by the server. I'm pretty sure that once an image is created - it is cached so that it only ever has to create this image once - and then sent out as many times as it's requested.

Changing it so that everyone and anyone can choose their own colours would probably stress the server a lot more than currently.
(Note not just upto 8 (players) times as much - as normal people can come and view your games with their settings)

The only way this could work is to change the way the army numbers are generated - i.e. remove them from an image overlay and place them as text on screen... (kindof similar to how BOB displays hovers) however - that could cause a lot of code generation that Lack doesn't want to run either - similarly stressing the servers more.

Also using that technique can have flaws - as if you change text size etc in your browser that could throw out the alignment and so such.

C.

[lanyards]

Concise description:

• Instead of having to join games in a certain order, or having to wait for the team before yours to join, you can just join in the correct slot.

Specifics:

• It could look a little something like this?
  [bigimg]http://i282.photobucket.com/albums/kk273/lanyards/gamejoin.jpg[/bigimg]

This will improve the following aspects of the site:

• For team tourny games, you don't have to wait for the other team to join.
• This allows you to pick which color you want your armies to be.
• Probably other improvisations of the site that I'm not thinking of.

Anyone like this idea?

--lanyards

[blakebowling]

Already on the To-Do list (clicky)

[lanyards]

Already on the To-Do list (clicky)

This suggestion is more the way of how it could be done. Joining by slots.

--lanyards

[blakebowling]

Already on the To-Do list (clicky)

This suggestion is more the way of how it could be done. Joining by slots.

--lanyards

Since it hasn't been done yet, this should probabally be in the suggestion thread.

[lanyards]

Already on the To-Do list (clicky)

This suggestion is more the way of how it could be done. Joining by slots.

--lanyards

Since it hasn't been done yet, this should probabally be in the suggestion thread.

Isn't it?

--lanyards

[hecter]

No, this is the suggestion forum. He means you should have just posted it in the thread. If a mod feels the same, they'll just merge it, no worries. I do like the idea though.

[MrBenn]

No, this is the suggestion forum. He means you should have just posted it in the thread.

There isn't a thread for suggestions???

In any case, this is a good suggestion, and a good way of implementing it...

[InsomniaRed]

There isn't a thread for suggestions???

In any case, this is a good suggestion, and a good way of implementing it...

I agree! I really like it. Never again will I be stuck as pink!!! If this could be worked out, I say go for it! Seems like it would be nice to have!

[Bruceswar]

I agree! I really like it. Never again will I be stuck as pink!!! If this could be worked out, I say go for it! Seems like it would be nice to have!

Between Aussie and Pink you love it!

[yeti_c]

Yeah - I mentioned that this was the best way to do this long ago - so I agree with this.

Also - taken further - it could be made to have different passwords for every slot...

C.

[chipv]

Nice idea , lanyards.
It does solve a number of problems, I like it.

The only minor problem is that for teams you still do not have a free choice on colour because the
colours are hard-coded to the order your name is in the list. Since you have to join next to your team-mate names this
reduces your choice of colours even if you are the first team to join.

For example in a doubles game of 8 players, if your team mate chooses teal/cyan, you have to be pink.

The separate suggestion for choosing your colours might be combined with this one perhaps.
So remove the link between colour and order in player list by allowing joining players to select from remaining colours.

[blakebowling]

No, this is the suggestion forum. He means you should have just posted it in the thread.

There isn't a thread for suggestions???

In any case, this is a good suggestion, and a good way of implementing it...

I meant the Choose Army Color at Start Thread, as it is already on the To-Do list

[yeti_c]

The separate suggestion for choosing your colours might be combined with this one perhaps.
So remove the link between colour and order in player list by allowing joining players to select from remaining colours.

Actually - I think choosing your colour independant of position would confuse matters a lot more.

At the moment everyone knows the order and groupings of the teams without having to really check... allowing people to move them around would make this aspect of the game harder and less desirable - thus increasing teammate attacks etc.

C.

[chipv]

The separate suggestion for choosing your colours might be combined with this one perhaps.
So remove the link between colour and order in player list by allowing joining players to select from remaining colours.

Actually - I think choosing your colour independant of position would confuse matters a lot more.

At the moment everyone knows the order and groupings of the teams without having to really check... allowing people to move them around would make this aspect of the game harder and less desirable - thus increasing teammate attacks etc.

C.

Then that reduces your choice of colours for team games as described above.
Removing the choice on the basis that people are used to fixed colours goes against being able to choose your colours freely, a suggestion which I believe you already supported?

So you have free choice for singles games but not team games if that feels right. Up to you.

[yeti_c]

The separate suggestion for choosing your colours might be combined with this one perhaps.
So remove the link between colour and order in player list by allowing joining players to select from remaining colours.

Actually - I think choosing your colour independant of position would confuse matters a lot more.

At the moment everyone knows the order and groupings of the teams without having to really check... allowing people to move them around would make this aspect of the game harder and less desirable - thus increasing teammate attacks etc.

C.

Then that reduces your choice of colours for team games as described above.
Removing the choice on the basis that people are used to fixed colours goes against being able to choose your colours freely, a suggestion which I believe you already supported?

So you have free choice for singles games but not team games if that feels right. Up to you.

No, I supported the choice of being able to choose where you play... - I think changing the order of play/team make up is a bad thing to do in terms of UI.

And you still have *some* colour choice - it all depends on which team you want to play as.

C.

[chipv]

8 player game singles. If one colour is chosen you have 7 colours to choose from using the slot system.
8 player game doubles. If your team mate is the only one who has joined, you have zero choice of colour using the slot system.

Choosing which slot you use also affects game order. I can see players deliberately choosing the slot after a suicider for example in singles.
The game order is still tied to the player name order, so slots introduce a small strategic element into the game.

So I suppose if you object to changing colours in team games, that's fair enough, but the outcome of a slots only implementation is different for teams, and perhaps it's not unreasonable to ask people to pay attention to which colour their team mates are.

[yeti_c]

Yeah - I did consider the (small) strategic possibilities of joining in a place that's after/before someone else - but I'm not 100% sure there are many?!

Going back to the doubles team choice - yes - the partner player doesn't have the choice - but the first player did when they were choosing the team?

Perhaps a better way would be for a randomise feature for every game that mixes the names about. (Note for team games it would keep the same teams but could change the overall team order - and then player order)

But this would be further away from the colour choice selection if we're keeping the colours in the same order...

Note also - that the colour order was chosen to keep Red away from Orange, Blue away from Cyan, Green away from Slate to avoid as many potential clashes as possible. - especially prevalent in team games.

C.

[targetman377]

so cant you make a color skem where only the person picks any color and it only shows up on there map? and then on other peoples maps it shows up the usally color execept the on the color that they chose could this work?

At the moment the Army numbers are generated as an overlaid image - this image is created by the server. I'm pretty sure that once an image is created - it is cached so that it only ever has to create this image once - and then sent out as many times as it's requested.

Changing it so that everyone and anyone can choose their own colours would probably stress the server a lot more than currently.
(Note not just upto 8 (players) times as much - as normal people can come and view your games with their settings)

The only way this could work is to change the way the army numbers are generated - i.e. remove them from an image overlay and place them as text on screen... (kindof similar to how BOB displays hovers) however - that could cause a lot of code generation that Lack doesn't want to run either - similarly stressing the servers more.

ok i got it thank you for explaining that for me.

Also using that technique can have flaws - as if you change text size etc in your browser that could throw out the alignment and so such.

C.

[windowmere]

i create a 3 player game, and choose blue for my color

next person who wants to join sees longboreder and the 5 remaining color spaces. say they like red, they click "join red"

I think this first-come-first-served, everyone-sees-the-same-colours, select-on-joining-a-game idea is the best solution - a huge improvement for colourblind people, people can still call you by colour, and you always know what you are going to get.

As it is the letters (r4, g5 etc) is helpful, but isn't enough for my colourblindness, so I try to play yellow, blue or whatever c stands for - this means it's very rare I start a game, because it would put me at an disadvantage. With this change I would be less limited on which games I can join, and it wouldn't make a difference if someone dropped out before me.
(I know there is a colourblindness add-on, but that forces people on to firefox, which some people aren't keen on. I prefer Opera, so "get a real browser" isn't helpful advice)

If the colour choice is a profile setting then you don't know what you're getting until you start a game - if (say) 5 people have the preference yellow, blue, c-colour it means 2 of them are going to be disappointed and squinting

[yeti_c]

As it is the letters (r4, g5 etc) is helpful, but isn't enough for my colourblindness, so I try to play yellow, blue or whatever c stands for - this means it's very rare I start a game, because it would put me at an disadvantage. With this change I would be less limited on which games I can join, and it wouldn't make a difference if someone dropped out before me.
(I know there is a colourblindness add-on, but that forces people on to firefox, which some people aren't keen on. I prefer Opera, so "get a real browser" isn't helpful advice)

Just to point out - the colourblindness letters are provided on the site as a whole nowadays - they have been removed from the addons.

Also - for future reference...
R: Red
G: Green
B: Blue
Y: Yellow
P: Pink
C: Cyan
O: Orange
S: Slate

C.

[maximumbandit]

Add the ability for players to chose what color they will play as, rather than have it assigned:

• Everybody remembers playing Risk as a kid with their little brother, who unwaveringly threw a temper tantrum when he didn't get to play as Red. Well guess what, I'm that little brother!!

Specifics:

• When joining a game, I think players should have the option to select what color they would like to play as. I think this would improve team games, and reduce the number of multiple games being started.

This will improve the following aspects of the site:

• This would greatly reduce the number of multiple games being started for the following reasons.
• I am almost always in 4 doubles games at a time. I play with ScatAttack, and we always start our own games so we can be red and green. While this might seem petty, it makes glancing at a map easier when you are used to being the same color.
• when playing doubles as, say, blue, I frequently get confused, think I'm red - and attack my team mate. After hundreds of games as Red, it's hard to switch your brain to identifying with a different color.
• There are frequently games open that we could join. Classic Art, Flat Rate, 2v2 doubles for example, is very common. However, to avoid confusion and to insure we are always the colors we're used to, we will start a new one and play that rather than join one someone else already has.
• Though there would be times when our colors are already taken, they would be far less than they are now if we could chose what color we wanted to play as, and the number of multiple games being started would greatly decrease.

[AceArtemis]

This is already on the official to-do list.