PYP~Mafia [05/21] end game

[legionnare]

@ strikewolf.Only repentant sinners shall pass.
Fake vote Legion for being a fifty-fiver.

##Fakevotecrasp
Ha, baws to you, you're just hiding behind that '45' avatar secret Mr No.

[mtamburini]

This fake BW vote on crasp must mean hes town and theres mafia pushing this agenda.

[strike wolf]

This fake BW vote on crasp must mean hes town and theres mafia pushing this agenda.

Overly defensive scum buddy alert!

[Streaker]

This fake BW vote on crasp must mean hes town and theres mafia pushing this agenda.

Overly defensive scum buddy alert!

Fakevote strike wolf for not voting on overly defensive scum buddies, thats scummy!

[jonty125]

Fakevote jonty125 because I'm not allowed to vote for myself, per se the rules

[mtamburini]

You read the rules? Must be scum

[virus90]

is it weird to be kind of exciteted about the draft order ?

[HotShot53]

is it weird to be kind of exciteted about the draft order ?

Not really, since that will depend which of the many crazy roles we are able to pick...

Question for the mod... how exactly will we draft our roles? If we draft 5th for example, will we know what the prior 4 roles picked were that we can't pick? Or will we send in multiple choices, and just get the first one that isn't picked already? Or something else?

[virus90]

is it weird to be kind of exciteted about the draft order ?

Not really, since that will depend which of the many crazy roles we are able to pick...

Question for the mod... how exactly will we draft our roles? If we draft 5th for example, will we know what the prior 4 roles picked were that we can't pick? Or will we send in multiple choices, and just get the first one that isn't picked already? Or something else?

I wondered aswell, but its in the first post. but let me make it easy for you:

Basicly; if your pick is already picked you will be vanilla all game. so the draft not only determines the "crazy roles" we are gonna get but also if we are gonna have roles at all. since being 21st will probably give you a slin chance of picking a role that is not already picked... or atleasts makes it hard.

for the specifics i would say; read the first post

[virus90]

ok ill make it super easy; since its so important: this is exactly what it states in the first post:

The order of the draft will be revealed after everyone sends in their numbers. The pool of roles will always be available.The pool of roles will be picked secretly by draft order via PM. Once that role is gone, if anyone else tries to pick it later they will be notified it is gone and will end up stuck with their Vanilla Role. It is entirely possible to end up with Scum Cops, Scum Vigilantes, Town Role blockers and so on.

[dd515087]

We vote together to ban 4 roles in this forum, so we will know what roles we ban. Not sure if we do that now or if we wait till after the draft order has been determined

[Whatsausage]

Oop, beat me to it virus, I had it copied and ready to paste

That will make it interesting, I think we could use that along with the draft order to determine some roles. The most obvious example being that if the second draftee tries to choose the same role as the first, then we could all know his role. Of course that isn't alignment indicative and it would almost certainly be more useful for all the town to just get their own PR's. Just thoughts.

FP'd by dd

[StorrZerg]

is it weird to be kind of exciteted about the draft order ?

Not really, since that will depend which of the many crazy roles we are able to pick...

Question for the mod... how exactly will we draft our roles? If we draft 5th for example, will we know what the prior 4 roles picked were that we can't pick? Or will we send in multiple choices, and just get the first one that isn't picked already? Or something else?

Everyone submits which ever role they would like via pm (one role). Priority picks go to those who are highest on the draft. If you pick something that someone else also picks, who ever is higher on the draft gets that power, the lower pick gets the role vanilla town (or mafia).

[StorrZerg]

Doing draft order now. Will be up soon.
Voting thread will be up shortly as well

[StorrZerg]

The Draft


1 Djfireside
2 mtamburini
3 HotShot53
4 Killuminati19
5 Virus90
6 Metsfanmax
7 jonty125
8 grt
9 legionnare
10 streaker
11 crasp
12 charm
13 Whatsausage
14 dd515087
15 aage
16 Zivel
17 jwiedlin
18 pancakemix
19 strike wolf
20 Iron Butterfly
21 Some7hingCLEVER


The Voting Thread

viewtopic.php?f=213&t=208086

You have 48 hours to figure out bans.

[strike wolf]

so you changed the sign up list to reflect draft order?

So the townie in me is saying to ban as many mafia roles as possible to leave them with as few roles to pick as possible. It is just a matter of deciding which mafia roles would be the most devastating towards town.

[StorrZerg]

Correct sign up list now reflects draft order

[jwiedlin]

I'm assuming this is the place to discuss bans, and the other thread is purely for voting for bans.

Below are a few roles that worry me if they make it into the hands of Mafia. I didn't have a chance to make it through the whole list, so this is not all-inclusive. This list, when complete, would include most of the killing roles, so it will need to be trimmed down to the greatest threats. Maybe a rating system for threat level if owned by Mafia is in order?

[spoiler= Veteran]As you are experienced you have the ability to survive 1 hit at night. You can also survive 1 lynch.[/spoiler]
[spoiler= hero]Alas, you are the hero of the land! You are so awesome that if you get lynched, you survive and can pick someone from your voting list to lynch instead. You can only survive two lynches.[/spoiler]
[spoiler= NRA Member]You shoot anyone and anything that pokes its head out at you. The first person that tries to visit you each day and night gets killed at the end of the cycle and their action on you does not occur. Listchecks do not count, but everything else does. The suicide bomber overrides your redneck defense.[/spoiler]
[spoiler=Mad Hatter]You may lay bombs on one player per night (maximum 2). If you are killed you will throw the switch and detonate them, killing the players (if they aren't protected by extra night lives, paramedics, or bodyguards). You may remove them from players at any time during the night to get them back, but if a player is lynched with one on them you lose that bomb for good. Bombs are refunded if the target is killed during the night. When you PM me your target choices you must tell me how your role is stupid and explain how you plan to win the game with brainless carpet bombing. Bonus points if you get a quote from Ace on the matter. Bonus points can be used for a special death scene of your choice![/spoiler]
[spoiler=Vigilante]You have the ability to kill up to two people of your choice at any night phase in the game. You cannot use both at once and may wait to use them whenever you feel like. If your hits ever overlap with a mafia hit I will cancel it and notify you the following day and you will be able to use it again. If your hit overlaps with another Vigilante I will cancel all other hits but the first one and will notify anyone who's hit didn't go through the following day and you will be able to use it again. You will not be told if it was mafia or murderer that caused your hit to be canceled.[/spoiler]
[spoiler=CPR Doctor]BE CAREFUL WITH THAT THING! If the person you are protecting gets attacked then you save them as normal. However if they aren't attacked that night you end up shocking them (they take a hit, this can be blocked by protective roles etc.). You can not target yourself at night.[/spoiler]
[spoiler=Assassin]You are an elite assassin who lives for hunting his targets. You have a knife that you can use at any time in the game anonymously and will activate instantly. Just pm me to activate it. However, there are some conditions. When you send in your hit you must do it in such a format: PLAYERNAME and RED and ROLE. If you choose to specify that the player is RED, you must also specify what family they belong to, else the shot fails. For example, StorrZerg RED Godfather or StorrZerg GREEN Modern Detective. The outcome of your assignment depends on whether you get the target right. For example, if you order StorrZerg RED Godfather, and StorrZerg is mafia godfather, your hit succeeds. On the other hand, if his blood is green or he is not the godfather, you fail the assignment. Should you succeed in your hit, you are refunded your kill to use again in the following cycle or later and nobody is the wiser. Should you fail, your target lives but you and your actions will be publicly outed, your intended target outed, and you will permanently lose your powers. Tread carefully Messer Ezio.[/spoiler]

[Metsfanmax]

I'm not sure exactly how it would rank compared to the other concerns, but I'd be worried about Floridian and Politician as mafia because if we get down to late game the vote-altering potential will be huge. On the other hand, with 21 players, this may not be such a concern.

Question re: bullet bill. Would he trigger on any mafia, or does it have to be a NV mafia specifically with a killing role?

[strike wolf]

Yeah. I am concerned that the drafting system favors mafia. Most non-investigative town roles work well with mafia while most mafia roles are completely useless to town. Furthermore mafia having uncontested banning ability on 5 roles...

[StorrZerg]

Question re: bullet bill. Would he trigger on any mafia, or does it have to be a NV mafia specifically with a killing role?

Triggers on people who have killing roles. (Does not trigger off "nukes"
The mafia who submits the kp, would trigger bullet bill as well.

[Djfireside]

Woo first. As for roles to ban out I think the list above is pretty good. The killing roles are the ones we need to phase out cause if mafia pulls too many it will be a quick game.

[HotShot53]

Cool, I go third Now just watch me pick something the first 2 already picked and end up vanilla anyway lol.

For the doctor, you list possibilities of it being weak or paranoid as well as normal... are they three separate roles? Or is it random which one the doctor is? Or was that just how you copied it, but the doctor will just be normal?

As to what to ban, I agree that the killing roles are the most dangerous and least useful to town (half the time town kills other town with them).

The NRA member seems the most dangerous to me... it's likely that if it's in the game it will kill some investigative roles, whether a town or mafia has it. I will probably be voting to ban this role.

CPR doctor could be very dangerous if controlled by mafia... probably the second role I'd ban if I had 2 votes. They could use it as basically a second night kill every night.

Hero is a dangerous role for a mafia to have also... makes it very hard to lynch them.

Assassin is a role that could be used by mafia because town usually tells the truth, while mafia usually lies... so a town assassin would probably be worthless, while a mafia assassin could kill anyone who claimed, or force town to do fake claims.

Those are the 4 most dangerous roles I see that I would recommend banning.

[strike wolf]

Well since no one is taking the bait I left, I'll make a bit more serious post.

NRA member is the role that I would probably have top of my ban list. It's destructive regardless of who has it and in the current set up, town is likely to avoid choosing it but mafia probably won't be so favorable. Beyond that, it is going to be a balancing act picking between roles that can bypass protections (my theory right now is that mafia will mostly vote to ban investigative roles leaving town protection heavy, if they do they will probably try to get the killing roles that bypass protections), the ones with the most shots and the roles that can manipulate votes as someone else said. The Prince of Darkness role also worries me a bit but it's probably not as worthy of dealing away with since it is a one shot ability. The killing through protections is limited as well which makes me feel less concerned. Janitor worries me too but I am not sure it worries me enough to put on my top 4.

Hero is one that looks good as town on paper but considering the most capable townies who could most reliably pull off lynching mafia based on their wagon are the ones less likely to find themselves lynched (Of course there is always the play like a jester plan but that's...risky). It would be a risk if mafia got it as they wouldn't have to be as careful about killing off townies.

I will echo Hotshot's concern about the CPR doctor.

I am not as worried about mafia controlling a veteran. It could be problematic but less problematic than some other roles.

Mad Hatter I would say is a moderate threat. I think I would still be more concerned by the Assassin and the CPR doc falling into mafia hands. I would say the same about vigilante.

A mafia assassin could be very strong but not invincible. I would probably put the threat of this role between that of a mad hatter/vigilante and a CPR doctor.

As far as other lynch alterers other than the Hero, they all bug me.

I would say the roles I would be most prone to get rid of right now are:

1. NRA member
2. CPR doctor
3. Hero

[Streaker]

I agree with the shortlist above, and would like to add the

-Vigilante: You have the ability to kill up to two people of your choice at any night phase in the game. You cannot use both at once and may wait to use them whenever you feel like. If your hits ever overlap with a mafia hit I will cancel it and notify you the following day and you will be able to use it again. If your hit overlaps with another Vigilante I will cancel all other hits but the first one and will notify anyone who's hit didn't go through the following day and you will be able to use it again. You will not be told if it was mafia or murderer that caused your hit to be canceled.

And maybe:

-Admiral Ackbar: Can suicide and kill someone and all medics protecting them and everyone who has made an action on them on the latest half cycle. You may use your ability day or night!

The vigilante is evident: 2 nightkills. if you are mafia and coordinate this, things can get messy pretty quickly.

Ackbar is trickier, but would potentially devastate town in a later stage of the game.

I suggest to wait a little longer, get input from all of the others and then take our short list of 4 to the other thread and divide our votes over them?


PS: DJ, did you take (1) (1), out of curiosity?