Conquer Club

Industrial Helix wrote:Just the legend on the small map I think is too small. the Territory name seem fine to me.

ok, I'll fix it. No worries.
Anything else?

those that vote "No", please specify why, and also be aware that you can change your vote if you change your mind (if you like the updates).

changed the big map region font to 13 points inst. of 14 and took away the opacity.
changed the legend font on the small map to be 10 points, like the legend font on the big map.

If you voted No, but like it now, please change your vote.

Latest Version 56 (Big): (p.41)
[bigimg]http://123fresno.com/hypercube/hypercubeDevelopment56.jpg[/bigimg]
Latest Version 56 (Small):
[bigimg]http://123fresno.com/hypercube/hypercubeDevelopmentMini56.jpg[/bigimg]

I have a question,sorry if it was already asked somewhere in the thread,but i can't understand it reading only the explanation on the map:

The yellow orb gives you a +1 for each mini square/cube or it applies only once?
And with squares/cubes with 2 yellows orbs they give you +2?
For example,if i have square Layer II a1-a2-b1-b2 and/or square Layer II b1-b2-c1-c2, what happens?

I agree with RedBaron0 about the kill word http://www.conquerclub.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=468&t=35587&start=600#p2680847

The font is better now, I didn't vote, because I think you don't really need this poll. The foundry administrators will see if its ok, and advance if needed

thenobodies80 wrote:The yellow orb gives you a +1 for each mini square/cube or it applies only once?
And with squares/cubes with 2 yellows orbs they give you +2?
For example,if i have square Layer II a1-a2-b1-b2 and/or square Layer II b1-b2-c1-c2, what happens?

That is a valid question. You are right in that it is not explained clear enough in the legend. Good call.
Backtracking I found this:
If someone later in the game get all 8 yellow balls and therefore hold a "yellow only mini cube", then he would get the +8 for the yellow balls, and +3 for the mini cube, and +6 for the 6 squares, but chances are that that player already has combinations of mini squares or mini cubes with some of the yellow balls, so the "jump" in bonus would most likely be marginal.
In other words, you only get a yellow +1 bonus once/orb. I should add that to the legend.

thenobodies80 wrote:I agree with RedBaron0 about the kill word http://www.conquerclub.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=468&t=35587&start=600#p2680847

The opinion about the bloodthirsty astronaut seems to be all for or all against. So far I sense the majority is for. And this is even though I never equipped him with a gun.

added "once/orb"

Latest Version 57 (Big): (p.41)
[bigimg]http://123fresno.com/hypercube/hypercubeDevelopment57.jpg[/bigimg]
Latest Version 57 (Small):
[bigimg]http://123fresno.com/hypercube/hypercubeDevelopmentMini57.jpg[/bigimg]

Sorry, but "yellow once/orb additional +1 ..." is barely English. Anyway, I'm not sure that the original text was that unclear. The bonus is for each yellow orb, not for each mini-square or mini-cube.

The slash characters are also unnecessary. Why don't we try the following legend?

"Bonus +1 for each yellow orb that is included in one or more mini squares or mini cubes which contain at least one white orb."

changed the legend again

Latest Version 58 (Big): (p.41)
[bigimg]http://123fresno.com/hypercube/hypercubeDevelopment58.jpg[/bigimg]
Latest Version 58 (Small):
[bigimg]http://123fresno.com/hypercube/hypercubeDevelopmentMini58.jpg[/bigimg]

the yellow orb instruction seems pretty explicit now...

one thing though, you don't need that weird '/' in the plural. It's grammatically correct to just say, "if included in one or more mini squares or mini cubes." rather than "... mini square/s or mini cube/s." Even if you were using the generally accepted symbols- parantheses, actually- for conditional plurals such as "... mini square(s) or mini cube(s)" it still wouldn't be right, because you already specified the conditional plural with the phrase "one or more".

Actually, I think a few cosmetic changes could make it even better... how about

only once per orb (even if included in more than one mini-squares or mini-cubes)

MarshalNey wrote:the yellow orb instruction seems pretty explicit now...

one thing though, you don't need that weird '/' in the plural. It's grammatically correct to just say, "if included in one or more mini squares or mini cubes." rather than "... mini square/s or mini cube/s." Even if you were using the generally accepted symbols- parantheses, actually- for conditional plurals such as "... mini square(s) or mini cube(s)" it still wouldn't be right, because you already specified the conditional plural with the phrase "one or more".

Yes, agreed. I tried to make this point, but I guess I wasn't explicit enough.

MarshalNey wrote:Actually, I think a few cosmetic changes could make it even better... how about

only once per orb (even if included in more than one mini-squares or mini-cubes)

We want to be sure that the reader still knows that the inclusion in a mini-square or mini-cube is a necessary prerequisite.

Also, if a yellow orb is part of a mini-cube, it must be part of three mini-squares. So dropping the mention of the mini-cubes could shorten and simplify this. Also, as it stands, if we are mentioning the mini-cubes then we should explicitly exclude the all yellow mini-cube as well, just as is done for the all yellow mini-squares. Perhaps this wording would be better:

Yellow orb included in a mini-square with at least one white orb: additional bonus +1, once and only once per yellow orb.

This avoids the negative statement about mini-squares with 4 yellow orbs, and the "once and only once" makes it clear that it doesn't matter how many mini-squares a given yellow orb is in, you only get the additional +1 bonus once. We've also avoided the plurals.

There are a few things to take consideration to:

1)It is a +1 ADDITIONAL bonus IF it is a part of one or more mini squares (with 2 or 3 white orbs) or mini cubes (with 7, 6, 4 or 0 white orbs).
That gives:
a) A mini square consisting of 4 yellow orbs give only the +1 mini square bonus. The yellow orb additional bonus does not apply.
b) A mini cube consisting of 8 yellow orbs GIVE the yellow orb bonus for all 8 yellow orbs, without the need of any white orbs.

2) It is a "one time per orb" bonus. Not a stacked bonus. Better words for this?

3) The yellow orb needs to be represented graphically with a +1.

Whoever comes up with the best legend to sum up that up in as few words as possible wins a lollipop.

Oh, I didn't realize that the all-yellow mini-cube got the additional bonus. Man, this is complicated. You might be better off describing the all-yellow mini-cube as a separate overriding bonus. I need to think about this one, and get back to you.

Yes, that is an effect of the cube bonuses.
What was aimed to avoid was that someone get an easy bonus from holding just 4 yellow orbs.

I was wondering why I have the "forbidden yellow orbs bonus" and did some back research. (It has been over 2.5 years, I can't remember everything, lol).

It seems I added the rule because of the 1 vs 1 game start positions http://www.conquerclub.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=468&t=35587&hilit=stamp&start=315#p2295948

Later it was decided to specify the start positions so that any yellow orb start position would never be next to the other yellow orb start position. In other words, you would never start with more than 2 yellow orbs of any mini square.

This leads me to wonder if the rule with no bonus for a yellow mini square might be unnecessary, since even in a 2 player game you would have to defeat at least 2 other yellow orbs to get an all yellow mini square.

I just think it might be making the rules easier to understand.

The best would of course be if there was a way to test it out, what would work best, but I guess that is impossible until beta play, unless I print out the map and "play with myself".

My concern about this map, is that I'm not convinced it has a market amongst the other CC maps already out there. What do you think will make people really want to play this map?

If I didn't believe people would like to play this map I wouldn't have made all this work for several years now.
But I am convinced many people will love it, and I am convinced it will be one of the favorites amongst many people.
Just look at the spontaneous comments left here and there.

I think it would be a fun map to play on. The simplicity of it would attract even the novice players while the difficulty of it would retain many. I am looking forward to a chance to play it myself.

I think the map is unique because it it completely open. You can go up and down; in and out; left and right and get to just about anyone. Bonuses will be a low grade issue since you don't want to concentrate your forces in a single area of the map. The Forge and Beta may decide that this map needs some barriers/bottlenecks to even out the gameplay, but I don't foresee that. The image is playable, I just don't know if the polishing is complete, there is just something nagging at me that says there is something missing.

(I do still hate the astronaut and the KILL) And that corner might be filled in with something better, like the space shuttle, or the moon, or something in that vein.

The only thing I think still could be done would be to with the aid of a 3D program build a CUBE model with colored rods and orbs and make a "true" tilted perspective with shadows and everything.

The only problem is that I can't handle any 3D program and I don't know anyone that does either. I suppose above model is a very simple thing for someone that does, though.

changed "mini square/s" to "mini squares" and "mini cube/s" to "mini cubes".
Latest Version 59 (Big): (p.46)
[bigimg]http://123fresno.com/hypercube/hypercubeDevelopment59.jpg[/bigimg]
Latest Version 59 (Small):
[bigimg]http://123fresno.com/hypercube/hypercubeDevelopmentMini59.jpg[/bigimg]

paulk wrote:The only thing I think still could be done would be to with the aid of a 3D program build a CUBE model with colored rods and orbs and make a "true" tilted perspective with shadows and everything.

The only problem is that I can't handle any 3D program and I don't know anyone that does either. I suppose above model is a very simple thing for someone that does, though.

paulk,
You really do not need a 3-D program to make an image that appears 3-D. I spent 2 hours in photoshop to produce the 1-point perspective draft, that I last posted. It may not be the angle that you want, but the same effect can be used for any angle that is desired. I used the 1-point because it was easier for demo purposes. It looks like you are wanting a 3-point projection. That entails quite a bit more, than just a couple of hours, to produce something like that. IMHO, that IS what this project needs, as the current artwork is what is holding this project back. It just reminds me of something that you would find doodled on an average 3rd. graders notebook.

Sorry to be so blunt, but that is my honest opinion.

edit-
Like I said before, I really like the idea of this "Cube" map. I have been quietly following its progress, and I would gladly support it, if it were to step up its graphics, to a level that makes people say WOW.

Do NOT let this poll discourage you. My guess is, it will be better received once the graphics are sorted out.

ok, I have tried but everything I have created so far sucks.
I am not really a graphic artist. I just do what I can, because I want to play this map myself.

So could you make the wire frame? That would be awesome.

I voted Yes.. I dont see what more you can do.. Nice job. i havent lloked at this map in a few weeks and it has really come along nicely... Crystall clear considering the dimension... Again Great Work

thank you very much for those kind words.