Indigo League Mafia/RPG Final Scene

[Ragian]

Day1 post said each trainer was given a starter pokemon, so I assumed that since Team Rocket people were trainers they also got a starting pokemon.
So if we could find pokemon/trainer pairs from this day, one of those pairs could be Team Rocket.

How do you suggest that we go about that?

*notes Hotshot accusing others of inactivity*

I'm not voting him for inactivity, although he hasn't been active. I am voting him because he hasn't yet made any comments on any cases, tried to bring up a case, made a vote, or helped out in any way, he's only made enough posts to not get replaced but hasn't said anything in them.

I just found it somewhat ironic given your input in this game (so far). So it was meant as giving you a wee bit of grief.

[DoomYoshi]

Day1 post said each trainer was given a starter pokemon, so I assumed that since Team Rocket people were trainers they also got a starting pokemon.
So if we could find pokemon/trainer pairs from this day, one of those pairs could be Team Rocket.

How do you suggest that we go about that?

Take the list of players and do a read-through player by player. Assign one partner to every player - whether you think that person has no partners or multiple partners. Then, look for patterns. There are 2 ways I can think of, one is a quantitative way in which you consider votes, quotes and mentions of other players. The other is a more read-based approach.

[Skoffin]

Anyoen care for my thoughts on Marashu? Also, do we have a deadline, Mandy the Mod?

Why are you asking us if we want to hear it? Why not just... say it?

Say what exactly? My thoughts? I posted my thoughts. Now, I want people's opinion(s) on them. Did you not read my thoughts?

READING IS FOR CHUMPS! My bad. I would like to offer you an apology doughnut as compensation.

And on a related note. Is anyone going to discuss why Tim felt the need to bring up a so called "elite four" as scum. So he has swung from pretending not to understand Pokemon, to understanding the mechanics of this game in depth.

Excellent point, and I too would like to hear what he has to say on this.


I honestly think all the time on trying to find trainer/pokemon pairs is pointless right now. The earliest we will get anything that is enough to start determining potential pair ups is tomorrow, right now is simply too soon to try to make reasonable guesses at that as there hasn't been enough content to pick up any patterns. Pairs could be buddying up in their posts at the moment, but they also could be outright ignoring each other to hide the connection. I'd rather we focus on who is actually doing scummy shit right now then continue on the talking about "there MIGHT be pairs in this game, let's weed them out!". Figuring out who might be buddying/ignoring who works better when there is more content to work on.
Some people seem real intent on only talking about the theme and how it might work, which comes across as nothing more than people generating posts to not be scummarining and claim "I'm discussing relevant things!"
Soon I'll start heavily FOS'sing these people if they keep it up. Don't make me come over there, chaps.

Cults are actually pretty rare in games, and the amount of people so easily willing to jump on the "trainers are cult!" idea suggests to me that these players want town to be heavily devided on what may or may not be scum sided. Particularly as there seems to be sentiment that we should go after trainer/pokemon pairs, who are from Oak, rather than saying we should hunt the mafia team. (Team Rocket)

Wing, I promise to write on your wall more often from now on. I'm sorry if I hurt you. Please don't think that you are any less special because I didn't write on your wall.

You never write on my wall, you filthy scrub.

Anyway! My next big FOS will go to Bujuber! *throws confetti*

My issue comes with something he said, and I'll quote

Plus of course, Talapus' case on him, makes sense to me personally... Why would he reject completely the idea that team rocket could be considered trainers? Don't they "train" pokemon?

WHY does Tal's post make sense to you? This quote of yours comes after my rebuttal to Tal's argument, where I pointed out that Masket did NOT reject the idea that Team rocket would be trainers, and that actually he stated that they would have trainers. So, what is your explanation here? did you not read my post or did you not agree with my assessment? I may have directed that post at Tal himself but since you have taken it upon yourself to agree with his position the onus is also on you to defend that position. So, where did Masket say that Team rocket had no trainers? What is your response to my counter-argument to Tal's masket case?
And if you agree with Tal's position why did you not respond tomy remarks on that particular case?

[Ragian]

Day1 post said each trainer was given a starter pokemon, so I assumed that since Team Rocket people were trainers they also got a starting pokemon.
So if we could find pokemon/trainer pairs from this day, one of those pairs could be Team Rocket.

How do you suggest that we go about that?

Take the list of players and do a read-through player by player. Assign one partner to every player - whether you think that person has no partners or multiple partners. Then, look for patterns. There are 2 ways I can think of, one is a quantitative way in which you consider votes, quotes and mentions of other players. The other is a more read-based approach.

Cheers.

Uhh! A doughnut! And I agree with your assessment that it is difficult hunting for pairs now. I don't think, however, Samlen meant now-now. He (right?) just presented one way to go about it, I think. (And who knows? Someone might be able to deduce it from the D1 action already?)

@Wing, what's there to discuss about Tim? He needs to respond to your accusations, but I don't think that I can add to what you have stated about him. I agree... Could you humour me with thoughts on Marashu? Or would you rather wait for his promised post today?

[Anarkistsdream]

So, look... To have 14 people vote, we are going to have to band together... I can't handle Day One lasting another damn week.

Right now, the top four people with votes are:
kwanton (3) - kwanton, Strike, Hotshot

Tim (4) - new guy, Wing, Serbia, madmitch

Minister Masket (5)- Yoshi, Anark, Exile, Talapus, BuJaber

Mitch (4) - Nagerous, dakky, legionnare, Samlen

I am willing to forego my vote on Minister Masket for the time, as I can't guarantee he is scum, though I can guarantee he is a trainer... If he is a good aligned trainer, I really don't want him killed. Although it may aid in putting to rest some other theories some of you folks have mentioned. It also makes you wonder what would happen to that trainers captured pokemon.

Out of the other three, Tim has the strongest case against him. But, if I vote now, it will look like OMGUS, so I will wait to hear from some others...

The point is, we HAVE to come to some sort of agreement, and right now, we are far too divided to make any forward momentum.

Let's try and end this Day One soon so we can gain whatever info we will have by the morning. Not that I am too excited about my prospects of living through the night.

[strike wolf]

Some people seem real intent on only talking about the theme and how it might work, which comes across as nothing more than people generating posts to not be scummarining and claim "I'm discussing relevant things!"

This. Reads based on behavior are much better than trying to find out game mechanics day 1. Game mechanics later in the game may expose some scum but it's really too early to know everything about the game to get much concrete about what's going on and with the "role claims are suicidal" stuck in my head, I'd rather not risk over exposing town roles at the moment.

So, look... To have 14 people vote, we are going to have to band together... I can't handle Day One lasting another damn week.

Right now, the top four people with votes are:
kwanton (3) - kwanton, Strike, Hotshot

Tim (4) - new guy, Wing, Serbia, madmitch

Minister Masket (5)- Yoshi, Anark, Exile, Talapus, BuJaber

Mitch (4) - Nagerous, dakky, legionnare, Samlen

I am willing to forego my vote on Minister Masket for the time, as I can't guarantee he is scum, though I can guarantee he is a trainer... If he is a good aligned trainer, I really don't want him killed. Although it may aid in putting to rest some other theories some of you folks have mentioned. It also makes you wonder what would happen to that trainers captured pokemon.

Out of the other three, Tim has the strongest case against him. But, if I vote now, it will look like OMGUS, so I will wait to hear from some others...

The point is, we HAVE to come to some sort of agreement, and right now, we are far too divided to make any forward momentum.

Let's try and end this Day One soon so we can gain whatever info we will have by the morning. Not that I am too excited about my prospects of living through the night.

I'd be willing to switch my case over to Tim in a heartbeat but I want to hear from Kwanton first as again, I do feel fluff posting is a good scum tell to press on. As of right now, he, The1Exile and Spurg actually need to be prodded (maybe others I've missed as well). Mitch I might consider as a second option but I don't really feel I have much of a read on him (though the fact that I seem to be able to town read him better than scum read him might in itself be a [weak] implication that he could be scum). Minister I am not willing to consider at the moment. You'd really have to change my mind again on him as the reread of him I did a few days ago made him seem more town with an innocent slip than scum making a mistake in my eyes.

Trying to keep this somewhat brief. This was the main long post that bugged me:

[spoiler=Skittles]

I have a strange feeling about Nark & Wing... they keep fighting, accusing each other, and then they both go into "ignore" mode... like they did a show and now they look like mortal enemies. If the assumption is correct that there are multiple trainers, pokemons, teams, whatever, they will get a free pass to the endgame since no one will link them together even if they're part of assumed Team Rocket. If one dies, no one will suspect the other. Pretty smart I'd say, so let's keep eyes open.

Only problem with this idea is that there was no night 0 in this game amd these are two people who have never played with each other. Would be impressive if they managed to coordinate that with no prior communication.

You're on point about the ignoring bit tho. Getting pissy because you can't handle snark and ignoring someone is not helpful.

I kind of agree with Dakky on this, it seems like they are being completely idiotic.. and for what reason? They may not have had any communication as night hasn't happened but they can still see if they are both mafia. While it can be a long shot, i'm still going to FOS Wing and Nark. Something just seems off. Then again, could just be personality clash and both are just being juvenile. Also, Nark, please don't post pictures of Trump again.. I'd rather not see his face.

I always believed Jessie was 17 as she stated so in an episode, but there was also some claim that Jessie/James were early 20's. Either way, they are not the same age as Ash. They are classified as trainers, again anyone who trains/battles pokemon is a trainer, however they are not trainers that have relation to professor Oak.

I'm actually not sure what your issue here is with that particular quote, Tal. Just based on around the pokemon universe is, there has to be both scum pokemon and scum trainers as Team Rocket have both. Meowth is a pokemon, Jessie and James are trainers. It seems apparent to me that by 'team' he meant Team rocket/Skull/Magma/Whatever, not team as in pokemon/trainer anyway. I think there will be a mix of things here, so i think we should stop getting bogged down with notions of "All pokemon are X! all trainers are Y!"

I also believed that Jesse and James were around 17/15, with Ash being around 11, Misty 13(?), and Brock 14? Don't quote me on that, but that's what I've always heard and thought as well.

I really don't understand this bandwagon on Minister. They're an older player, they always seemed a bit scummy when I played with them back in the day even though they were a simple townie. They slipped up a lot. I'm just not buying that the slip up was intentional and even if it was, he did try and semi-claim townie... Why are we trying to get rid of a townie when there are big enough to fry? Unless the people voting MM are trainers also and want to win (and be the very best!)

The way the arguments for and against people are going is really striking me as odd. I haven't played mafia in years so I'm obviously a bit rusty, but these arguments just don't swing me either way. I'm looking out for the ones being the most aggressive and pointing fingers every which way (hence the FOS on Nark and Wing)

Also:

I know I'm going to risk an OMGUS (funny how I remember that of all things) swipe but Vote Exile for foolishly assuming that all trainers will be scum when it flies in the face of the theme.

Can you name one Pokemon game where not every trainer is a piece of scum in both the literal and figurative sense?

If you mean scum but exploiting animals to fight, then yeah they're scum. But there are characters throughout the games and the anime that genuinely care for the wellbeing of Pokemon. It is usually only angry teens and children, or those in Team (insert name here) that are the baddies and scum. Considering this mafia game is based on Gen 1, most of the people encountered in the game and anime weren't bad guys, but I guess some had a mean streak.

I haven't yet decided who will get my vote for Day 1, I really need to reread the thread from the start to try and pick up clues.

[/spoiler]

Says some things about the game. Posts a bit on irrelevant things about trainers that is unlikely to become important and finishes with no conclusion. His main contribute is saying that he leans town on Masket but leaves it open enough that he could vote him later on. My main takeaway? Skittles is one of the many players I still need to find time to reread because at the very least this post rubs me the wrong way.

And of course Nag's (who I also have added to the prod list, PM already sent) quad post back on page thirteen which also says next to nothing and finishes with a pot meet kettle vote on Legionnaire. Though on the other hand, the main point I note from the quad post was the first to really put down the Nark typo case as nothing so counter point.

[WingCmdr Ginkapo]

I have no thoughts on Mars.

I am unsure why Rage keeps asking for my opinion. Why mine over everyone elses?

[madmitch]

I still think Tim is the best bet, but KWANTON has me wondering why he is voting for himself , it looks like he wants to die,if he wants it so bad I say we honor his wishes as long as it doesn't hurt the rest of us.

[Ragian]

I have no thoughts on Mars.

I am unsure why Rage keeps asking for my opinion. Why mine over everyone elses?

I was replying to your comment. So I asked you. I asked everybody earlier. One cared, I think.

[Anarkistsdream]

I have no thoughts on Mars.

I am unsure why Rage keeps asking for my opinion. Why mine over everyone elses?

I was replying to your comment. So I asked you. I asked everybody earlier. One cared, I think.

I said I would read back through it, and I have... I still think Tim will generate more information on the whole for us and I can't totally get behind your vote... As you are the ONLY person so vehemently anti-M, I guess my question is "What do you think you are going to accomplish?" I mean, besides dragging the day out... TBH, you have to know you will not get the votes to lynch him, so why keep it up? Remake your case in the morning... Or are you TRYING to protect Tim?

[TimWoodbury]

quite honestly yall killing me aint gonna help to figure anything out except for 1 of the catagorys i listed in one of my last posts. im just running free of my own will like the wind blows the leaves

[Ragian]

I don't know what anti-M means... I am more than happy to change from Marashu if he actually participates.

[Skittles!]

Says some things about the game. Posts a bit on irrelevant things about trainers that is unlikely to become important and finishes with no conclusion. His main contribute is saying that he leans town on Masket but leaves it open enough that he could vote him later on. My main takeaway? Skittles is one of the many players I still need to find time to reread because at the very least this post rubs me the wrong way.

And of course Nag's (who I also have added to the prod list, PM already sent) quad post back on page thirteen which also says next to nothing and finishes with a pot meet kettle vote on Legionnaire. Though on the other hand, the main point I note from the quad post was the first to really put down the Nark typo case as nothing so counter point.

Apparently trying to figure out how the game could possibly be laid out is a bad thing. It may be unimportant later in the game but it could also be important, I don't know and that's why I'm trying to get a discussion going on this. As I've mentioned numerous times, I haven't played mafia for years, so I'm rusty. My 'scumdar' (lol) isn't on point, and there are too many reasonable arguments going on that don't sway me one way or another because they aren't convincing me that well. While I know that I can unvote, I don't want to go jump on a bandwagon unless I'm 90% sure we will get the right pick for the day.

I just find it interesting that you literally ignore all the posts of mine that try and figure out what the make up of the game could be, being based on how Mandy wrote the rules and the intro post, as well as going off other people's ideas. Where do you think we should go from here? I don't want D1 to last much longer either. Make up a good argument that convinces me and I'll vote with you, until then start creating discussions.

[nagerous]

quite honestly yall killing me aint gonna help to figure anything out except for 1 of the catagorys i listed in one of my last posts. im just running free of my own will like the wind blows the leaves

Are you claiming third party?

[Skittles!]

I just started work but when I have a break I will post my thoughts on a few players that I think are highly suspicious.

[The1exile]

Hmm hmm hmm.

I can't agree with strike that speculating on day 1 arguments is more productive than either getting information on the roles through claims or forming theories on game setup. On the other han, I suppose we have a solid read on MM, so I'm willing to be convinced of another path, but not to unvote, yet.

Tim, your argument that killing you wouldn't give any extra information to town is a) wrong and b) worth less if you're not going to contribute anything of real value.

[nagerous]

Some people seem real intent on only talking about the theme and how it might work, which comes across as nothing more than people generating posts to not be scummarining and claim "I'm discussing relevant things!"

This. Reads based on behavior are much better than trying to find out game mechanics day 1. Game mechanics later in the game may expose some scum but it's really too early to know everything about the game to get much concrete about what's going on and with the "role claims are suicidal" stuck in my head, I'd rather not risk over exposing town roles at the moment.

So, look... To have 14 people vote, we are going to have to band together... I can't handle Day One lasting another damn week.

Right now, the top four people with votes are:
kwanton (3) - kwanton, Strike, Hotshot

Tim (4) - new guy, Wing, Serbia, madmitch

Minister Masket (5)- Yoshi, Anark, Exile, Talapus, BuJaber

Mitch (4) - Nagerous, dakky, legionnare, Samlen

I am willing to forego my vote on Minister Masket for the time, as I can't guarantee he is scum, though I can guarantee he is a trainer... If he is a good aligned trainer, I really don't want him killed. Although it may aid in putting to rest some other theories some of you folks have mentioned. It also makes you wonder what would happen to that trainers captured pokemon.

Out of the other three, Tim has the strongest case against him. But, if I vote now, it will look like OMGUS, so I will wait to hear from some others...

The point is, we HAVE to come to some sort of agreement, and right now, we are far too divided to make any forward momentum.

Let's try and end this Day One soon so we can gain whatever info we will have by the morning. Not that I am too excited about my prospects of living through the night.

I'd be willing to switch my case over to Tim in a heartbeat but I want to hear from Kwanton first as again, I do feel fluff posting is a good scum tell to press on. As of right now, he, The1Exile and Spurg actually need to be prodded (maybe others I've missed as well). Mitch I might consider as a second option but I don't really feel I have much of a read on him (though the fact that I seem to be able to town read him better than scum read him might in itself be a [weak] implication that he could be scum). Minister I am not willing to consider at the moment. You'd really have to change my mind again on him as the reread of him I did a few days ago made him seem more town with an innocent slip than scum making a mistake in my eyes.

Trying to keep this somewhat brief. This was the main long post that bugged me:

[spoiler=Skittles]

I have a strange feeling about Nark & Wing... they keep fighting, accusing each other, and then they both go into "ignore" mode... like they did a show and now they look like mortal enemies. If the assumption is correct that there are multiple trainers, pokemons, teams, whatever, they will get a free pass to the endgame since no one will link them together even if they're part of assumed Team Rocket. If one dies, no one will suspect the other. Pretty smart I'd say, so let's keep eyes open.

Only problem with this idea is that there was no night 0 in this game amd these are two people who have never played with each other. Would be impressive if they managed to coordinate that with no prior communication.

You're on point about the ignoring bit tho. Getting pissy because you can't handle snark and ignoring someone is not helpful.

I kind of agree with Dakky on this, it seems like they are being completely idiotic.. and for what reason? They may not have had any communication as night hasn't happened but they can still see if they are both mafia. While it can be a long shot, i'm still going to FOS Wing and Nark. Something just seems off. Then again, could just be personality clash and both are just being juvenile. Also, Nark, please don't post pictures of Trump again.. I'd rather not see his face.

I always believed Jessie was 17 as she stated so in an episode, but there was also some claim that Jessie/James were early 20's. Either way, they are not the same age as Ash. They are classified as trainers, again anyone who trains/battles pokemon is a trainer, however they are not trainers that have relation to professor Oak.

I'm actually not sure what your issue here is with that particular quote, Tal. Just based on around the pokemon universe is, there has to be both scum pokemon and scum trainers as Team Rocket have both. Meowth is a pokemon, Jessie and James are trainers. It seems apparent to me that by 'team' he meant Team rocket/Skull/Magma/Whatever, not team as in pokemon/trainer anyway. I think there will be a mix of things here, so i think we should stop getting bogged down with notions of "All pokemon are X! all trainers are Y!"

I also believed that Jesse and James were around 17/15, with Ash being around 11, Misty 13(?), and Brock 14? Don't quote me on that, but that's what I've always heard and thought as well.

I really don't understand this bandwagon on Minister. They're an older player, they always seemed a bit scummy when I played with them back in the day even though they were a simple townie. They slipped up a lot. I'm just not buying that the slip up was intentional and even if it was, he did try and semi-claim townie... Why are we trying to get rid of a townie when there are big enough to fry? Unless the people voting MM are trainers also and want to win (and be the very best!)

The way the arguments for and against people are going is really striking me as odd. I haven't played mafia in years so I'm obviously a bit rusty, but these arguments just don't swing me either way. I'm looking out for the ones being the most aggressive and pointing fingers every which way (hence the FOS on Nark and Wing)

Also:

I know I'm going to risk an OMGUS (funny how I remember that of all things) swipe but Vote Exile for foolishly assuming that all trainers will be scum when it flies in the face of the theme.

Can you name one Pokemon game where not every trainer is a piece of scum in both the literal and figurative sense?

If you mean scum but exploiting animals to fight, then yeah they're scum. But there are characters throughout the games and the anime that genuinely care for the wellbeing of Pokemon. It is usually only angry teens and children, or those in Team (insert name here) that are the baddies and scum. Considering this mafia game is based on Gen 1, most of the people encountered in the game and anime weren't bad guys, but I guess some had a mean streak.

I haven't yet decided who will get my vote for Day 1, I really need to reread the thread from the start to try and pick up clues.

[/spoiler]

Says some things about the game. Posts a bit on irrelevant things about trainers that is unlikely to become important and finishes with no conclusion. His main contribute is saying that he leans town on Masket but leaves it open enough that he could vote him later on. My main takeaway? Skittles is one of the many players I still need to find time to reread because at the very least this post rubs me the wrong way.

And of course Nag's (who I also have added to the prod list, PM already sent) quad post back on page thirteen which also says next to nothing and finishes with a pot meet kettle vote on Legionnaire. Though on the other hand, the main point I note from the quad post was the first to really put down the Nark typo case as nothing so counter point.

Sorry man I am posting on my pad right now, so it makes it hard to do block chains and copy lots of quotes etc, so quad posts are the way forward . Either way sending a PM wouldn't help, I only go on the site to check this game, nothing else.

[madmitch]

quite honestly yall killing me aint gonna help to figure anything out except for 1 of the catagorys i listed in one of my last posts. im just running free of my own will like the wind blows the leaves

Are you claiming third party?

I think he is claiming that he is a wild pokemon

[strike wolf]

Says some things about the game. Posts a bit on irrelevant things about trainers that is unlikely to become important and finishes with no conclusion. His main contribute is saying that he leans town on Masket but leaves it open enough that he could vote him later on. My main takeaway? Skittles is one of the many players I still need to find time to reread because at the very least this post rubs me the wrong way.

And of course Nag's (who I also have added to the prod list, PM already sent) quad post back on page thirteen which also says next to nothing and finishes with a pot meet kettle vote on Legionnaire. Though on the other hand, the main point I note from the quad post was the first to really put down the Nark typo case as nothing so counter point.

Apparently trying to figure out how the game could possibly be laid out is a bad thing. It may be unimportant later in the game but it could also be important, I don't know and that's why I'm trying to get a discussion going on this. As I've mentioned numerous times, I haven't played mafia for years, so I'm rusty. My 'scumdar' (lol) isn't on point, and there are too many reasonable arguments going on that don't sway me one way or another because they aren't convincing me that well. While I know that I can unvote, I don't want to go jump on a bandwagon unless I'm 90% sure we will get the right pick for the day.

I just find it interesting that you literally ignore all the posts of mine that try and figure out what the make up of the game could be, being based on how Mandy wrote the rules and the intro post, as well as going off other people's ideas. Where do you think we should go from here? I don't want D1 to last much longer either. Make up a good argument that convinces me and I'll vote with you, until then start creating discussions.

Fair enough. I'm not here to condemn you based on one post.

@exile: day 1 cases are often wrong but they set information forward for future days. In a game this size and what I imagine of its complexity, game specifics are going to be difficult nail down without a couple of deaths first. Now I don't intend to shut down game mechanics discussion entirely but I do feel there is a bit too much of it at the moment.

[Anarkistsdream]

I don't know what anti-M means... I am more than happy to change from Marashu if he actually participates.

Anti means against...

M was a shortening of Marashu's name...

He has one vote... so, again, all you are doing is wasting time, because nothing you are doing is going to get 13 other people to join your cause... Don't give it up, but do something that may actually have a real effect.

quite honestly yall killing me aint gonna help to figure anything out except for 1 of the catagorys i listed in one of my last posts. im just running free of my own will like the wind blows the leaves

Are you claiming third party?

I think he is claiming that he is a wild pokemon

And by Nagerous not knowing that, he just outed himself as trainer.

[Anarkistsdream]

Or claimed pokemon

[Ragian]

I don't know what anti-M means... I am more than happy to change from Marashu if he actually participates.

Anti means against...

[Serbia]

My main scum right now would be Kwan, Tim and possibly Serbia. Serbia beyond what others have said, just gives off the feeling he is connected to Tim. Backing him up on the team rocket vote. Being a bit wishy washy on where he stands on Tim. It just doesn't sit quite right.

You realize I've voted for Tim, right? As far as the rest, I'll admit that I'm not happy with my play so far. It's not my first mafia game, but is my first in years, so I'm rusty, and my play thus far has definitely shown that. My play will get better.

Tim's walk-back is scummy. He wasn't the first to bring up Team Rocket, which as I've said, not knowing anything about Pokemon other than Pikachu being a yellow mouse type thing, I had never heard of before. Once I found that they're a central part of the story, I could understand dakky suggesting they'd be here, as pretty much every has agreed they would be, and then given that, really find Tim's question and immediate attempt to distance himself from it to be suspect.

I've detailed why I feel he's scummier right now than MM in a previous. For me, it's between Tim and mitch.

[BuJaber]

WHY does Tal's post make sense to you? This quote of yours comes after my rebuttal to Tal's argument, where I pointed out that Masket did NOT reject the idea that Team rocket would be trainers, and that actually he stated that they would have trainers. So, what is your explanation here? did you not read my post or did you not agree with my assessment? I may have directed that post at Tal himself but since you have taken it upon yourself to agree with his position the onus is also on you to defend that position. So, where did Masket say that Team rocket had no trainers? What is your response to my counter-argument to Tal's masket case?
And if you agree with Tal's position why did you not respond tomy remarks on that particular case?

It looks like I may have misunderstood this post, when I first read it I thought he was saying that all trainers in the game are town, but he didn't say that exactly he said most of them are:

I can see I've picked up a few votes, but for anyone else watching, I think Mandy's story clue here is important.
Those kid trainers are almost 100% certain to be 'town' trainers. As for Team Rocket, while yes, it's likely they'll be here, it's by no means guaranteed. Giovanni I would say is likely sitting in the 'godfather' role, but he was never really a 'trainer' per se. More like a businessman who constantly got he lackies doing his work for him.

Don't think he's been mentioned yet but Gary Oak might be here too, maybe in a 3rd party capacity.

In a nutshell, I don't believe those are good enough odds to target what you believe is a trainer. You're more likely to hit town.

My other reasons for voting him still stand though. HOWEVER:

quite honestly yall killing me aint gonna help to figure anything out except for 1 of the catagorys i listed in one of my last posts. im just running free of my own will like the wind blows the leaves

Are you claiming third party?

I think he is claiming that he is a wild pokemon

And by Nagerous not knowing that, he just outed himself as trainer.

So now we know Minister and Nag are almost guaranteed trainers. Scum or not, we'd have to figure it out.

But Tim's quoted post TOGETHER with the whole Team Rocket question/back off situation that his case is built on, and the fact that Tim tends to post something to the effect of "go on then kill me, hahaha" whenever he's caught just made Tim's case the most solid one we've had so far imo.

Unvote Vote Tim

[The Weird One]

Apologies for continued activity...reading up, presently...an excessive amount of text is probably incoming, shortly.