rousseau72 wrote:This is one of my favorite maps. It has a learning curve but so do most great games. There is checkers for people who want simple games (or doodle the map) Conquer Rome has many subtle strategies and it takes a while to master. Its why I prefer chess and why I prefer maps like this. This map has the additional benefit of given the "feel" of the the historical context of its time better than almost any other map as well.
If you don't like it - then don't play it but please don't insult the map maker with your "impartial" views. Kudos to all the mapmakers who make CC what it is and especially to Kabanellas who does it exceptionally well.
I'm playing this map for the 1st time, and i read a GOOD chunk of this thread...and I still don't understand it. Don't get me wrong, I love the map and can't wait to figure it out...but i have a feeling i'm gonna need one of those yellow/black books title "Conquer Rome For Dummies"
One question (actually, i have a million) right off the bat that might help me: when i hover over the positions in the map key (vicarious seats, etc), the legend shows the corresponding locations on the map...but the bonuses and player match in the legend don't line up with who's actually occupying the lands on the map.
Game #15489528 is what I'm referencing. Green has all of Burdigala occupied, but the legend shows a neutral 2 in that seat. Me confused?
funk renegade wrote:I'm playing this map for the 1st time, and i read a GOOD chunk of this thread...and I still don't understand it. Don't get me wrong, I love the map and can't wait to figure it out...but i have a feeling i'm gonna need one of those yellow/black books title "Conquer Rome For Dummies"
One question (actually, i have a million) right off the bat that might help me: when i hover over the positions in the map key (vicarious seats, etc), the legend shows the corresponding locations on the map...but the bonuses and player match in the legend don't line up with who's actually occupying the lands on the map.
Game #15489528 is what I'm referencing. Green has all of Burdigala occupied, but the legend shows a neutral 2 in that seat. Me confused?
yes buddy, you have all the territories around burdigala, treverorum and londinum, but you didn't take the vicarious, you must attack the vicarious from the capitals (territories in yellow circle) for get the bonus....
I wrote this 2 years ago somewhere. Reading this back I could probably rewrite the strategy part a whole lot better but the map is complicated enough that you can't just follow any guide for it. But it should help as an intro anyway:
[spoiler=attack routs]
legionairs are important, they can attack any land in their region and can bombard adjacent tribal outposts
seats only attack in 1 direction(capitals ==> capital seats => praetors ==> augustus)
praetors bombard any legion or capital in their region
augustus can attack any capital or legion on the map and can attack all tribes on his side(west augustus ==> 4 western tribes, east augustus ==> 4 eastern tribes)
[/spoiler]
[spoiler= bonuses]
tribes auto +2, tribe outpost auto +1
legions auto +1
+1 for holding both imperial capitals(Rome and Constantinople)
vicarious seat of regional capital + 2 areas in region = +1
vicarious seat of regional capital + 4 areas in region= +2
vicarious seat of regional capital + 6 areas in region= +3
vicarious seat auto +1
praetor seat + 4 areas in region= +1
preator seat + 8 areas in region= +2
praetor seat + 12 areas in region= +3
augustus seat + regional capital= +1
augustus seat + legion= +1
augustus + imperial capital= +1
augustus + 1 tribe on that side= -3 (if you have at least 3 tribes on that side)
[/spoiler]
[spoiler= general tactics]No matter whether you play this map in team or in 1v1, the number of territories per person and the number of neutrals between each player will make sure you can't just focus on the enemy players by invading them. This map is all about taking bonuses.
1st couple of turns: I advise to attack vicarious seats and legions. Which ones you attack depends on which ones are easiest to defend. Keep in mind that the enemy might come down from the tribes later on. It's also important for you to attack vicarious seats in zones where you have at least 2 territories.
second turn: by then you'll have 5 troops on each of your tribe(s). Try and attack the outpost, if you fail, just wait for the auto +2 of next turn.
building up: Try and obtain supremacy in specific regions to augment your bonuses.
later in game: In time, after having taken vicarious seats, you should start trying to take praetors and/or augustus for more bonuses.
Finish the enemy off if it's basically gg: A lot of people tend to want to take every single region the enemy holds. The fastest way to eliminate the enemy though is to take victory objectives(2 imperial seats, 1 capital and 4 tribes). This ofcourse will most probably not work if you don't have supremacy.
[/spoiler]
[spoiler= 1v1 tips]
initial drop: You'll both start off with 3 initial troops to drop. I suggest you drop each of 'm individually on a territory in order to take legions or vicarious seats(preferably seats).
praetors: Try and take praetor seats as soon as possible, but do not let it stand in the way of you protecting your capitals, seats and legions. So do not rush it too much. By taking praetor seats you'll be able to directly target the enemy's bonuses and growth potential by bombarding his legions and regional capitals. It is helpful to hold preators in every one of the 4 colored preafectura. This way you can bombard bonuses in each area.
augustus: If you have both your tribes in one part of the empire(west or east), then it's preferred not to take the augustus seat of that part of the empire too soon as it can cost you -6 every turn.
slowly building up: In time after having taken legions, capitals and some seats you can start targeting your enemy by driving him away from your own bonus or targeting him in his bonuses.
[/spoiler]
[spoiler= team]On this map team games are very similar to single games. You each have to try and grab bonuses. There are however a couple of points to keep in mind.
Augustus and tribes: If you want to take fully advantage of the augustus seat and the tribe bonuses, you will have to try and pass your bonuses to your teammates. Let one person take all the tribes on that side(preferable inside 1 turn to not lose too many troops due to -3 per tribe) and immediately the next turn the teammate will have to take the augustus seat to prevent his friend from getting a -12(-3 * 4 seats). This way one of you will get the full benefit of the tribes and the other the full benefit of the augustus seat, without it's disadvantage.
praetors: Try and take praetor seats as soon as possible, but do not let it stand in the way of you protecting your capitals, seats and legions. So do not rush it too much. By taking praetor seats you'll be able to directly target the enemy's bonuses and growth potential by bombarding his legions and regional capitals. It is helpful to hold preators in every one of the 4 colored preafectura. This way you can bombard bonuses in each area.
bonuses: I personally prefer going after a few bonuses first. Pushing people under 12 territories doesn't help as only territories + seats count for territory count bonuses. And even when playing 4v4 people start with 9 territories, so takign someone out early won't be easy.
[/spoiler]
[spoiler= extra remarks]
Trench(legions): In trench it'll be important to hold legions. They can attack any area in it's region. This has the advantage that you can concentrate your army on 1 spot, where your autodeploy will also drop.
Trench(Augustus): A fun trick is to take an augustus seat, invade the tribes and then leave behind 1 troop on the augustus seat. This way the enemy(if positioned on a praetor) will be able to take the imperial seat but not attack your tribes immediately. Then next turn you'll be in possession of all 4 tribes who get +2 each and you retake the augustus seat, again leaving behind just 1 troop. You repeat this turn after turn so you keep getting those tribe bonuses without the annoying -3, your enemy doesn't get augustus bonuses and he won't be able to attack your tribes. This tactic offcourse is very risky. Not every enemy is stupid enough to keep falling for this trick and you risk the enemy putting a whole army on the augustus seat and you not being able to take it back.
Trench(Tribes): Another aspect about tribes you should keep in mind is that in trench you won't be able to invade the barbarian tribe and the barbarian outpost alltogether if you only hold the imperial seat. What will often happen if you only take the tribe, is that your enemy will take it back from the outpost. It is thus advised to attack the tribe and take enough army along or simultaneously bombard the outpost from the adjacent legion.
Trench(Praetor): Always hold a praetor in trench in case the enemy takes the victory objectives.
Fog: In fog you may be able to take the game objectives unnoticed. This is why holding praetors in fog is even more important. You won't just be able to see the positions of the enemy on legions and capitals, but also whether or not they hold the imperial seats.
Augustus + tribes: Make sure to watch out for the -3 you receive from the tribes when holding augustus.
funk renegade wrote:I'm playing this map for the 1st time, and i read a GOOD chunk of this thread...and I still don't understand it. Don't get me wrong, I love the map and can't wait to figure it out...but i have a feeling i'm gonna need one of those yellow/black books title "Conquer Rome For Dummies"
One question (actually, i have a million) right off the bat that might help me: when i hover over the positions in the map key (vicarious seats, etc), the legend shows the corresponding locations on the map...but the bonuses and player match in the legend don't line up with who's actually occupying the lands on the map.
Game #15489528 is what I'm referencing. Green has all of Burdigala occupied, but the legend shows a neutral 2 in that seat. Me confused?
yes buddy, you have all the territories around burdigala, treverorum and londinum, but you didn't take the vicarious, you must attack the vicarious from the capitals (territories in yellow circle) for get the bonus....
I still don't follow. So I need to occupy the capital of it's respective vicarious seats to get the bonus? Basically occupy the capital and the vicarious?
Can you spell it out in terms of lands? Like "to collect the burdigala bonus, you have to attack burdigala from <???>"....or...."you have to occupy lands <x> and <y> to collect the burdigala bonus"
i apologize if it's not that easy to explain...or if collecting a bonus isn't that black and white. If it's more complex then that, i may need 20+ more games on the board to start to understand
funk renegade wrote: I still don't follow. So I need to occupy the capital of it's respective vicarious seats to get the bonus? Basically occupy the capital and the vicarious?
Yes, that's correct.
Both the capital of the province and the vicarius. Think of the capital as the ruling seat, and the vicarious as the actual ruler. To think of it another way: In order to control the province, you need to control both the actual person in charge and his headquarters.
ps. Nice job, waauw!
pps. Nice catch, Oneyed!
“Life is a shipwreck, but we must not forget to sing in the lifeboats.” ― Voltaire
funk renegade wrote: I still don't follow. So I need to occupy the capital of it's respective vicarious seats to get the bonus? Basically occupy the capital and the vicarious?
Yes, that's correct.
Both the capital of the province and the vicarius. Think of the capital as the ruling seat, and the vicarious as the actual ruler. To think of it another way: In order to control the province, you need to control both the actual person in charge and his headquarters.
ps. Nice job, waauw!
pps. Nice catch, Oneyed!
you do not need to hold capital to gain bonus (if you hold another 2 regions of diocese). from capital of diocese (province) you can one way attack its vicarious. when you hold vicarious you gain +1 army for every 2 its regions. capital is in this case the same region as another regions of diocese, so if you lost capital but you still hold 2 regions of diocese and vicarious you gain +1 army.
Hold either a vicarious seat AND 2+ of its associated territories; or a prefect/praetorian seat AND 4+ of its associated territories; or an augustus AND 1+ of its associated capitals and legions.
Each one of those +'s with its corresponding government post gives you another +1. There is no territory-bonus without them.
I don't really play games on this site anymore, but this is still by far my favorite map. Kab, you made all the best maps that made this place what it was back in the day. Cheers on a job well done buddy.
tkr4lf wrote:I don't really play games on this site anymore, but this is still by far my favorite map. Kab, you made all the best maps that made this place what it was back in the day. Cheers on a job well done buddy.
Thank you, it was a pleasure doing it for this community!
If you hold the west emperor and any of the 4 tribes on the west side you get -3 /tribe. If you hold the east emperor and any of the 4 tribes on the east side you get -3/tribe.
Donelladan wrote:If you hold the west emperor and any of the 4 tribes on the west side you get -3 /tribe. If you hold the east emperor and any of the 4 tribes on the east side you get -3/tribe.
ironbuttaxe wrote:Can barbarian tribes be taken via outposts?
There are two ways to interpret your question.
If you hold the outpost but lose the tribe, then "yes" you can retake the tribe from the outpost.
On the other hand, if you mean "can I take a tribe from a neighbouring province by passing through the outpost, then the answer is "no". The attacks between the outposts and the provinces are one-way. If you hold neither the tribe or the outpost, the only way to take the tribe is directly through the Emperor.
“Life is a shipwreck, but we must not forget to sing in the lifeboats.” ― Voltaire
Machiavello wrote:I love the map, just don't understand how to conquer a Barbarian Tribe or a Barbarian Outpost. Can you help me? Thanks
You need to work your way from the Capitals (Golden circle territories) up to the Vicarious, the Praetor, and then Western or Eastern Augustus.. all contained on the mini-map in the upper right. The Western Augustus can take all the barbarian camps to the west, the East does the ones over there.
Legions in the same area as a barbarian outpost can bombard it, but that won't help you get to the camp.
???
