Conquer Club

the map is now live, so i've opened some games up for anyone interested....

Game 7602195

Game 7602205

Game 7602206

Game 7602208

This map is hilarious.

Game 7602890

2010-09-08 15:36:03 - Game has been initialized
2010-09-08 15:36:05 - the.killing.44 received 1 troops for holding Max Kevin MK6
2010-09-08 15:36:05 - the.killing.44 received 3 troops for holding Batter 2 MK6
2010-09-08 15:36:05 - the.killing.44 received 8 troops for 24 regions
2010-09-08 15:36:17 - ManBungalow received -1 troops for holding Batter 1 Leg Gully
2010-09-08 15:36:17 - ManBungalow received -1 troops for holding Batter 1 Square Leg
2010-09-08 15:36:17 - ManBungalow received -1 troops for holding Batter 1 Mid-Wicket
2010-09-08 15:36:17 - ManBungalow received -1 troops for holding Batter 1 Wicket-keeper
2010-09-08 15:36:17 - ManBungalow received 8 troops for 24 regions

Just code the batters neutral?

the.killing.44 wrote:This map is hilarious.

Game 7602890

2010-09-08 15:36:03 - Game has been initialized
2010-09-08 15:36:05 - the.killing.44 received 1 troops for holding Max Kevin MK6
2010-09-08 15:36:05 - the.killing.44 received 3 troops for holding Batter 2 MK6
2010-09-08 15:36:05 - the.killing.44 received 8 troops for 24 regions
2010-09-08 15:36:17 - ManBungalow received -1 troops for holding Batter 1 Leg Gully
2010-09-08 15:36:17 - ManBungalow received -1 troops for holding Batter 1 Square Leg
2010-09-08 15:36:17 - ManBungalow received -1 troops for holding Batter 1 Mid-Wicket
2010-09-08 15:36:17 - ManBungalow received -1 troops for holding Batter 1 Wicket-keeper
2010-09-08 15:36:17 - ManBungalow received 8 troops for 24 regions

You should have plenty of "balls" to bowl then.

2010-09-08 14:53:46 - ManBungalow received -1 troops for holding Batter 1 Leg Gully
2010-09-08 14:53:46 - ManBungalow received -1 troops for holding Batter 1 Square Leg
2010-09-08 14:53:46 - ManBungalow received -1 troops for holding Batter 1 Mid-Wicket
2010-09-08 14:53:46 - ManBungalow received -1 troops for holding Batter 2 Deep Mid-On
2010-09-08 14:53:46 - ManBungalow received -1 troops for holding Batter 2 Extra Cover
2010-09-08 14:53:46 - ManBungalow received -1 troops for holding Batter 2 Point
2010-09-08 14:53:46 - ManBungalow received -1 troops for holding Batter 1 Wicket-keeper
2010-09-08 14:53:46 - ManBungalow received 5 troops for 16 regions

Lol

It also looks like Mosa & Lefu border. This isn't the case.

MK6 is to far away from it's spot. Now it looks like MK6 is Max.

And indeed, those drops are hilarious.

[Game]7602250 [/Game]

yikes, my partner drops -4 for his batter plus fielders! plus our opponent drops the +4 bowler....maybe a few changes are in order!

that aside, love your work, cairnsy....been waiting for this map for months!

Nephilim wrote:Game 7602250

You're welcome

I'm not sure about the +4 for the bowler. It seems like its a huge bonus that can be dropped. I'll try and post more once I've played more then one round...

why is it Mike Atherton and Tong Greig ?

wouldn't Richie be a more iconic option ?

greenoaks wrote:why is it Mike Atherton and Tong Greig ?

wouldn't Richie be a more iconic option ?

I guess you mean Richie Benaud. No. This is supposed to a match being played at Lords MCC.
Mike was a natural starter englishman, Richie Benaud, i can't stand the man and his voice besides ue's aussie, and Tony's a S African, so that i went with the international flava.

Richie is an English tv caller, he started there and then channel 9 hired him for down here as well.

its a pretty good gig, when its winter here he goes north for the English summer and when it gets a bit cold up there he flys south for the Australian summer.

greenoaks wrote:Richie is an English tv caller, he started there and then channel 9 hired him for down here as well.

its a pretty good gig, when its winter here he goes north for the English summer and when it gets a bit cold up there he flys south for the Australian summer.

He might be an English TV Caller, but he also does it here, and you might like to check this page out.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Richie_Benaud

Congratulations to cairns for successfully creating and releasing the first sports themed map on CC!

Okay Cairns,

As you might realise, I'm a great fan of your maps on this site. Just looking at the image, I think that this map has potential to be great fun and make use of some fairly unique gameplay features.
In my opinion, the only real issues entail the various bonuses in the field itself (and the Mosa-Lefu border).

I feel that the Bowler should start neutral every time or have a lower auto-deployment bonus. Being able to begin with 4 bonus troops really punches a hole in the strategic aspect of this game. And due to the sheer number of borders that region has, it seems likely to affect a large number of games.

But as has already been made clear, the biggest flaw in the gameplay is the ability to begin your first turn with a whole bunch of negative bonuses for holding the fielders.

There are four solutions to this issue which I can suggest:

1] All fielders start neutral
This probably isn't such a good idea, as no player will have much incentive to attack any of the regions on the field.

2] Each player starts with an equal number of fielders as defined by the XML
A better option this time, but still makes it possible for a player to play late in round 1 and have only 2 troops to deploy. (unlikely, but you never know).

3] Fielders start neutral and each player begins with an equal number of 'Deep' (orange) regions
My favourite option. Having these troops in the field gives a player incentive to take fielders and other associated bonuses. It also makes the +2 (Bat, Field, Four) bonus much more useful and interesting.

4] Remove the negative bonus aspect
This could work nicely, but it might affect the gameplay plan you had in mind more than the other suggestions I have listed.


With all that said, this is your map - to change it or not is your decision. I'm just trying to help you push this into the realms of 'quality maps'.

Why not just make the batters neutral?

natty_dread wrote:Why not just make the batters neutral?

This too. I was going to suggest it, but it slipped my mind.

http://www.conquerclub.com/game.php?gam ... full_log=Y

:/

khazalid wrote:http://www.conquerclub.com/game.php?game=7602250&full_log=Y

:/

Easy break from batter 1 to MK 6 though, isn't it?


Right now the bowler being dropped is very unbalancing, as can be the combination of batter & fielder. I am thinking coding the batters to a 2 neutral maybe? Definitely code the bowler to a neutral though.

Easily the worst map on CC. I would love to be more constructive and start to list the reasons why, but there are way to many.

b00060 wrote:Easily the worst map on CC. I would love to be more constructive and start to list the reasons why, but there are way to many.

Why don't you just try, others have. It might improve things for others looking at you also.

Ok, for starters, you can have so many negative bonuses you don't even get a deploy.

The map is confusing as hell, as are the bonus structures which can end a game before it even begins based on the initial deploys. I can't think of two more important aspects to a successful map than that. You can actually start with upwards of an 8 troop differential on initial deploy. All the negative bonuses are ridiculous. You drop plus 4 and you win, end of story.

Just so everyone can see what I asked about in the chat in Game 7602206:

2010-09-10 00:22:17 - ender516: Say, cairnswk, the legend says "Add four runs on same line, bonus increases to +2", but BOB is telling me I have the -1 for Batter 2 and Deep Mid-On and the 2 for same plus Long-On 4.
2010-09-10 00:23:05 - ender516: Should the bonus with four runs override the basic batter/fielder negative bonus?

And by the way, I got the bowler in the drop, but I have not won.

b00060 wrote:You drop plus 4 and you win, end of story.

I guess there's more of the story to tell.

ManBungalow wrote:Okay Cairns,

As you might realise, I'm a great fan of your maps on this site. Just looking at the image, I think that this map has potential to be great fun and make use of some fairly unique gameplay features.
In my opinion, the only real issues entail the various bonuses in the field itself (and the Mosa-Lefu border).

Thanks for offering suggestions....I'm not sure that a lot cn be done about the Mosa-Lefu border. I had already jiggled with all that area from previous versions and the border configuration there is necessary to stop that from being a chain-link border layout. Unfortunately the available space also limits the configuration.
EDIT: Perhaps i misread you're issue on the mosa-lefu situation, and see that they don't border in the xml, which i will fix. Apologies.

I feel that the Bowler should start neutral every time or have a lower auto-deployment bonus. Being able to begin with 4 bonus troops really punches a hole in the strategic aspect of this game. And due to the sheer number of borders that region has, it seems likely to affect a large number of games.

OK. dropping the auto-deploy to +2 is achievable.

But as has already been made clear, the biggest flaw in the gameplay is the ability to begin your first turn with a whole bunch of negative bonuses for holding the fielders.

There are four solutions to this issue which I can suggest:

1] All fielders start neutral
This probably isn't such a good idea, as no player will have much incentive to attack any of the regions on the field.

This is not a good option since there would nobody playing in the field, which would mean you'd have to code all the batting team neutral also.

2] Each player starts with an equal number of fielders as defined by the XML
A better option this time, but still makes it possible for a player to play late in round 1 and have only 2 troops to deploy. (unlikely, but you never know).

Mmmm. Has merit, but if we can achieve something better without having to code the xml, 'twould be better.

3] Fielders start neutral and each player begins with an equal number of 'Deep' (orange) regions
My favourite option. Having these troops in the field gives a player incentive to take fielders and other associated bonuses. It also makes the +2 (Bat, Field, Four) bonus much more useful and interesting.

It doesn't achieve the game if you code the fielders neutral. And if you code orange 4 regions into the mix that would destroy the object of gaining a "4".

4] Remove the negative bonus aspect
This could work nicely, but it might affect the gameplay plan you had in mind more than the other suggestions I have listed.

Yes, it would destroy the gameplay objective of the batter being "caught out" for -1, if the batter gets stuck on the feilding position, and fails to take the "4" also.

With all that said, this is your map - to change it or not is your decision. I'm just trying to help you push this into the realms of 'quality maps'.

Appreciate your desire to improve, well done.

b00060 wrote:Ok, for starters, you can have so many negative bonuses you don't even get a deploy.

The map is confusing as hell,

Yes well. if you've played any of my more challenging maps you'll also find them confusing. But that also makes people think what is possible outside the box, which is why as you know, we have a lot of the inventive technologies that engratiate our lives.
But this is what beta is all about, trying to find some solutions to problems, but not take the challenge away.

as are the bonus structures which can end a game before it even begins based on the initial deploys. I can't think of two more important aspects to a successful map than that. You can actually start with upwards of an 8 troop differential on initial deploy. All the negative bonuses are ridiculous. You drop plus 4 and you win, end of story.

the negative bonuses are an important part of the overall objective of gameplay.
basically, if you're the batter and you aim for the orange "4" for the bonus, you have to go "over the head" of the attached fielder to get that bonus, otherwise you might get "caught out" (which is where the negative bonus comes in, same as in baseball).
So thanks for the input, and i hope you'll contribute more, right now the issues are being addressed with possible solutions that still retain the gameplay to make this a decent sports map. And getting this one sorted might give other ideas to the baseball map that is coming along.