Conquer Club

Posted: **Sat Aug 27, 2011 4:36 pm**

Metsfanmax wrote:
watsy wrote:i support to never change the dice from standard dice ever again it always changes the play and mixes up the pattern sending out all the 6's and 1's together i almost quit last year over this did not renew for awhile

stop messing around with the dice flow and let us play the game we all love

I'm sorry if you thought that we were changing the actual dice. Let me assure you that in no way are we actually altering the gameplay -- the only thing that we have changed recently is the image of the dice displayed in your browser. The algorithm we use to determine the results is the same great one we've had for a while!

This. The graphics don't change the outcome.

-Sully

Posted: **Sun Aug 28, 2011 8:25 pm**

It does something to the pattern as I have said before dice lose the random flow and I am putting it down to when the dice graphics are changed it triggers something maybe to random pattern to start from the beginning again ? It will be a few weeks then it will be back to normal
Attackers advantage will go it is no good attacking unless you have twice what the defenders army is and then defenders rolling almost prefect 6's

Posted: **Sun Aug 28, 2011 9:01 pm**

watsy wrote:It does something to the pattern as I have said before dice lose the random flow and I am putting it down to when the dice graphics are changed it triggers something maybe to random pattern to start from the beginning again ? It will be a few weeks then it will be back to normal
Attackers advantage will go it is no good attacking unless you have twice what the defenders army is and then defenders rolling almost prefect 6's

If this is the case, it would be mere coincidence. The numbers are retrieved from a different website that has absolutely nothing to do with the dice graphics.

-Sully

Posted: **Mon Aug 29, 2011 5:03 am**

last time dice went like this was

http://www.conquerclub.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=57&t=129550

can you tell me if the dice graphics did change then to ?

i check every time i see the straight 6's rolling out for defenders to find that the dice graphics have changed ? again dice not bad just not random

Posted: **Mon Aug 29, 2011 11:30 am**

watsy wrote:last time dice went like this was

http://www.conquerclub.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=57&t=129550

can you tell me if the dice graphics did change then to ?

i check every time i see the straight 6's rolling out for defenders to find that the dice graphics have changed ? again dice not bad just not random

The dice ARE mathematically random. What you, and most other people complain about, is that they aren't balanced.

Something being balanced (the actual outcome matching the mathematical probability) and something being random (not correlated with other data and / or not being predictable) aren't the same thing.

Also, changing the graphic that appears for each roll of the die, has absolutely nothing to do with how the dice are calculated.

Posted: **Mon Aug 29, 2011 11:53 am**

blakebowling can you answer my question on sunday Qct 24th 2010 was a set of non standard graphics in play or not ?

why is it not attacker advantage anymore ?

Postby watsy on Sun Oct 24, 2010 9:19 pm

if the answer is no that put a end to my way of thinking ? if yes well we will see

Posted: **Mon Aug 29, 2011 11:58 am**

I support going back to standard dice as soon as possible

Posted: **Mon Aug 29, 2011 12:09 pm**

watsy wrote:blakebowling can you answer my question on sunday Qct 24th 2010 was a set of non standard graphics in play or not ?

Regular dice graphics were in effect on that date. The next change to the graphics was on October 30 2010, when the Halloween graphics were implemented.

Posted: **Mon Aug 29, 2011 12:14 pm**

watsy wrote:why is it not attacker advantage anymore ?

It has always been defender advantage. Even in the board game that is somewhat similar.

Posted: **Mon Aug 29, 2011 1:44 pm**

Ok no link just bad luck for me

Posted: **Mon Aug 29, 2011 1:49 pm**

watsy wrote:Ok no link just bad luck for me

and me

AT the moment though it appears to be more than just bad luck, in the last week i have also had some very streaky good luck, but mostly bad

Posted: **Mon Aug 29, 2011 4:00 pm**

blakebowling wrote:
watsy wrote:why is it not attacker advantage anymore ?

It has always been defender advantage. Even in the board game that is somewhat similar.

You sir don't understand risk/odds...The attacker has the advantage because he rolls more dice

Posted: **Mon Aug 29, 2011 4:06 pm**

i agree attacker advantage attacker rolls 60% of the dice have to work this out and comeback to you

Posted: **Mon Aug 29, 2011 6:23 pm**

lord voldemort wrote:
blakebowling wrote:
watsy wrote:why is it not attacker advantage anymore ?

It has always been defender advantage. Even in the board game that is somewhat similar.

You sir don't understand risk/odds...The attacker has the advantage because he rolls more dice

Lovo's right. The attackers have a higher probability of winning a roll, but not by too much.

-Sully

Posted: **Mon Aug 29, 2011 7:47 pm**

lord voldemort wrote:
blakebowling wrote:
watsy wrote:why is it not attacker advantage anymore ?

It has always been defender advantage. Even in the board game that is somewhat similar.

You sir don't understand risk/odds...The attacker has the advantage because he rolls more dice

By defender advantage, I mean that defenders win ties. Probabilistic-ally, the attacker is better because he gets more dice.

Posted: **Mon Aug 29, 2011 11:26 pm**

i'm sure the same people that "support" these dice will never complain if they never see them again. as a matter of fact i bet if you never activate these dice, no one will quit CC because they don't see pumpkin dice on halloween.

i rarely look at the dice, but when i lose bad i like to check them out. one problem i have is i'm color blind. all these funky colors make it near impossible to read. i just don't bother.

i'm not going to quit playing because of these silly dice that whoever decided to put them up thinks they're just the best thing in the world. but i just don't see how they add any extra pleasure to the site. there is a banner right? can't whoever cares about this just do the artwork for the banner or something. maybe you could make a community festive sig that everyone who feels gay (gay as in happy) can proudly display.

i'm just saying.

Posted: **Tue Aug 30, 2011 2:15 pm**

odds for dice in risk

Odds of winning various dice combinations in Risk

Attacker: one die; Defender: one die:

Attacker wins 15 out of 36 (41.67 %)
Defender wins 21 out of 36 (58.33 %)

Attacker: two dice; Defender: one die:

Attacker wins 125 out of 216 (57.87 %)
Defender wins 91 out of 216 (42.13 %)

Attacker: three dice; Defender: one die:

Attacker wins 855 out of 1296 (65.97 %)
Defender wins 441 out of 1296 (34.03 %)

Attacker: one die; Defender: two dice:

Attacker wins 55 out of 216 (25.46 %)
Defender wins 161 out of 216 (74.54 %)

Attacker: two dice; Defender: two dice:

Attacker wins both: 295 out of 1296 (22.76 %)
Defender wins both: 581 out of 1296 (44.83 %)
Both win one: 420 out of 1296 (32.41 %)

Attacker: three dice; Defender: two dice:

Attacker wins both: 2890 out of 7776 (37.17 %)
Defender wins both: 2275 out of 7776 (29.26 %)
Both win one: 2611 out of 7776 (33.58 %)

Sample interpretation of the last data above (three vs. two). If an attacker starts with 1000 armies and a defender starts with 1000 armies and a 3 vs. 2 attack is ensued, the results should be (given fair dice): after 100 rolls, each side will have lost 1 army about 34 times. The defender will have lost 2 armies about 37 times, and the attacker will have lost 2 armies 29 times. Therefore, after 100 rolls, the attacker should have 908 armies left, and the defender should have 892 armies left.

Conclusion: heads up with three dice versus 2 dice, the attacker has an advantage in the long run. Similar interpretations can be made for the remainder of the data, which can be summarized as follows:

Attacker 1 versus defender 1: defender has the advantage, winning about 4 out of 7 battles
Attacker 2 versus defender 1: attacker has the advantage, winning about 4 out of 7 battles
Attacker 3 versus defender 1: attacker has the advantage, winning about 2 out of 3 battles
Attacker 1 versus defender 2: defender has the advantage, winning about 3 out of 4 battles
Attacker 2 versus defender 2: defender has the advantage, winning about 3 out of 5 battles
Attacker 3 versus defender 2: attacker has the advantage, but the advantage is much more narrow than any of the battles described above. The attacker's advantage is such that he will win about 7 out of 13 battles on average.

not by much but it is a attackers advantage overall

Posted: **Thu Sep 01, 2011 4:53 am**

[Option to keep normal dice during events]

Concise description:

Every time there is a holiday or event on CL the dice are themed. They are often brightly coloured (eg pink at Valentines, Orange at Halloween) and very difficult to read.
The net result is that CC themed events become something to endure for a % of the user base.

Specifics/Details:

Allow users an option to keep normal dice during the event.
OR
Max the amount of the time the dice are changed to 24 hours or less.

How this will benefit the site and/or other comments:

Some users just want to play and enjoy their games, and have no interest in events such as whatever caused the most recent dice change.
This actually impacts on the quality of the game as the dice are no longer easily readable when changed.
A simple solution would seem to be to allow an option for users to choose to keep regular dice.

Posted: **Thu Sep 01, 2011 9:44 pm**

If the event dice were, in general, easier to read, would you still push for this option?

Posted: **Thu Sep 01, 2011 10:23 pm**

Metsfanmax wrote:If the event dice were, in general, easier to read, would you still push for this option?

I guess it depends how you define 'easier'. My preference would be to have the same dice, all the time. Simple, easy to read, no fuss. Not broken, don't fix.

Posted: **Thu Sep 01, 2011 11:20 pm**

stavros.maginty wrote:
Metsfanmax wrote:If the event dice were, in general, easier to read, would you still push for this option?

I guess it depends how you define 'easier'. My preference would be to have the same dice, all the time. Simple, easy to read, no fuss. Not broken, don't fix.

What I mean is, if the dice were all equally easy to read.

Posted: **Thu Sep 01, 2011 11:22 pm**

Metsfanmax wrote:If the event dice were, in general, easier to read, would you still push for this option?

I think what most are saying is they do not like change for the simple fact of changing them. They are also saying it adds nothing to the game play and makes them harder to read. Some people just do not like them. Having the option not to use them seems like a great idea to me for those who do not like them or cannot see them in the case of color blind people.

Posted: **Thu Sep 01, 2011 11:23 pm**

Metsfanmax wrote:
stavros.maginty wrote:
Metsfanmax wrote:If the event dice were, in general, easier to read, would you still push for this option?

I guess it depends how you define 'easier'. My preference would be to have the same dice, all the time. Simple, easy to read, no fuss. Not broken, don't fix.

What I mean is, if the dice were all equally easy to read.

But that is just it. To some they are not, so unless they are totally redone, which I doubt then people will not be able to see them properly.

Posted: **Thu Sep 01, 2011 11:30 pm**

Bruceswar wrote:
Metsfanmax wrote:
stavros.maginty wrote:
Metsfanmax wrote:If the event dice were, in general, easier to read, would you still push for this option?

I guess it depends how you define 'easier'. My preference would be to have the same dice, all the time. Simple, easy to read, no fuss. Not broken, don't fix.

What I mean is, if the dice were all equally easy to read.

But that is just it. To some they are not, so unless they are totally redone, which I doubt then people will not be able to see them properly.

I was asking a hypothetical question to make a point about his post. Namely, that he claimed in the post it was about legibility, but his response makes it clear that even if he could read them without real effort, he wouldn't want to just because it's change. I just want people to be honest about their arguments. If you don't want change, then just say that; the point about legibility is not that important because we can have the dice redone.

Posted: **Fri Sep 02, 2011 1:40 am**

Bruceswar wrote:
Metsfanmax wrote:If the event dice were, in general, easier to read, would you still push for this option?

I think what most are saying is they do not like change for the simple fact of changing them. They are also saying it adds nothing to the game play and makes them harder to read. Some people just do not like them. Having the option not to use them seems like a great idea to me for those who do not like them or cannot see them in the case of color blind people.

We generally try to make sure the graphics are colorblind-friendly.

-Sully

Conquer Club

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Option to keep regular dice during CC events

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