Conquer Club

yeti_c wrote:

MrBenn wrote:The 'bonus route' idea is a good one, but results in the coloured regions becoming unbalanced...
ie Brown suddenly becomes crucially important, as all the shortest paths go through it.
The green and purple regions are on the periphery, and so will be less contested (possibly).

I'm not too sure what to suggest though...

I think a better idea - would be to make 4 or 5 routes that don't intersect...



C.

How and where do I write that on the legend?

WM

"Holding one of 4 secret routes: +454"

Or something.

I still think that shortest only is probably better...

C.

yeti_c wrote:"Holding one of 4 secret routes: +454"

Or something.

I still think that shortest only is probably better...

C.

I like shortest route more than secret route for this reason.
Anyone with eyes can count the shortest route. If you are uninformed and don't know what XML or OB is you will never know until it tis too late.

I will stay with the shortest route idea unless someone can come up with a really good reason to have more and how to write it so that everyone (with/without bob) can understand and figure out the path.

WM

WidowMakers wrote:

yeti_c wrote:"Holding one of 4 secret routes: +454"

Or something.

I still think that shortest only is probably better...

C.

I like shortest route more than secret route for this reason.
Anyone with eyes can count the shortest route. If you are uninformed and don't know what XML or OB is you will never know until it tis too late.

I will stay with the shortest route idea unless someone can come up with a really good reason to have more and how to write it so that everyone (with/without bob) can understand and figure out the path.

WM

Agree

C.

yes, it's either the shortest route, or all possible routes (you could off course move/add/adjust a few border territories so you'll only have 4 possible routes)

so the best bet would be to just add the shortest routes (make sure there is only 1 or 2 shortest routes though) unless off course someone comes up with a really neat idea to write down all the possible routes without having 200.000 lines of XML and making bob so slow it needs 10 minutes to load (like on Conquerman for example, hmm wonder if conquerman could use an XML update btw)

creating 'secret routes' is never a good option, because i think it's unfair for players that don't know the map and play for the first time, and are pretty much newbies that don't know where/how to find the XML or maybe don't even know what XML is.


BTW: the map has officially 3 shortest routes, all EXACTLY 40 blocks from start to finish, including start + Finish:

the routes are:

zimmah wrote:(like on Conquerman for example, hmm wonder if conquerman could use an XML update btw)

Yes it could - but Lack needs to change something first - before it can be done.

C.

I like the idea of giving a bonus for the shortest route for gameplay reasons. That is, it might bring gameplay into the center of the board. My strategy would be to start building strength in a protected corner. A large bonus for a route cutting through the center could lure some into the middle of the board.

LMR

laci_mae wrote:I like the idea of giving a bonus for the shortest route for gameplay reasons. That is, it might bring gameplay into the center of the board. My strategy would be to start building strength in a protected corner. A large bonus for a route cutting through the center could lure some into the middle of the board.

LMR

Yes. I am planning on only doing the shortest route. I may need to change some stuff around to make that work.

I will not be around this weekend so there will be no updates. I will post as soon as I have a new legend and layout .

WM

WidowMakers wrote:

laci_mae wrote:I like the idea of giving a bonus for the shortest route for gameplay reasons. That is, it might bring gameplay into the center of the board. My strategy would be to start building strength in a protected corner. A large bonus for a route cutting through the center could lure some into the middle of the board.

LMR

Yes. I am planning on only doing the shortest route. I may need to change some stuff around to make that work.

I will not be around this weekend so there will be no updates. I will post as soon as I have a new legend and layout .

WM

like i said in fact there are 3 shortest routes, all the minumum of 40 territories, given the fact it's a 20 by 20 map, it's the absolute mimumum. but there are 3 possible routes that are all the shortest possible route.

I think it would make most sense as an objective. If you get start to finish, you complete the maze. Plus with 454 armies, you're likely to win anyway.

zimmah wrote:BTW: the map has officially 3 shortest routes, all EXACTLY 40 blocks from start to finish, including start + Finish:

the routes are:

Code: Select all

Route 1: start -> C1 -> F1 -> F2 -> G2 -> G3 -> K3 -> K6 -> M6 -> M7 -> O7 -> O12 -> Q12 -> Q16 -> R16 -> R18 -> S18 -> S19 -> U19 -> Finish
Route 2: start -> C1 -> F1 -> F2 -> G2 -> G3 -> K3 -> K6 -> M6 -> M7 -> Q7 -> Q16 -> R16 -> R18 -> S18 -> S19 -> U19 -> Finish
Route 3: start -> C1 -> F1 -> F2 -> G2 -> G3 -> K3 -> K6 -> M6 -> M7 -> Q7 -> Q10 -> S10 -> S14 -> U14 -> U16 -> W16 -> W18 -> Finish

Actually the first route and second route have 39.
The reason is the 1st and 2nd paths go to the finish line before hitting the last column.
That last column adds another tert.
But I did change it so that there is only 1 route with 39.

Here is the image
I also unadjusted the groups so that the 39 is the shortest and the only one with 39.
Red dots = 20
Blue dots = 19
Yellow dots = 20
Red + Blue = 39 = shortest

i like the short route bonus idea but i also think it should be somehow marked otherwise we'll have tons of reports from people that will not count properly.

also i like the idea of removing the bonus for shortest route and making it an objective.

OK here is V14

Fixes:

• adjusted the legend
• changed the Start to finish text to include the start and finish territories
• Changed the Start/Finish bonus to 454. The same as the # of terts on the map.
• Adjusted the map color group so there is only 1 39 territory path from start to finish (including them both). The borders and subgroups remained the same

Are there any other questions of suggestions. The legend is full so I don't really think new bonuses or instructions is a good idea.

What is everyone opinion on:

• The Subgroup bonuses?
• The layout?
• The colors?
• The territory bonuses (currently 1 per 10 terts)?
• The entire color group bonuses?
• Neutral respawn count (currently 30)
• Anything Else?

WM

DiM wrote:i like the short route bonus idea but i also think it should be somehow marked otherwise we'll have tons of reports from people that will not count properly.

also i like the idea of removing the bonus for shortest route and making it an objective.

So instead of +454 it reads. Hold shortest route to win the game?

I still think the route should not be marked. It adds a little mystery to the map and makes people need to count. Plus once you find it, it is easy.

EDIT: Here is Version 15

No +454 Bonus
Hold shortest to WIN. Added Dotted line to shot path



WM

Spelling:

"Overides" only has one "r".

cicero wrote:Spelling:

"Overides" only has one "r".

Not in the XML it doesn't!!!!

The last image has doube 'rr's

http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/override

http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/overrides

C.

yeti_c wrote:

cicero wrote:Spelling:

"Overides" only has one "r".

Not in the XML it doesn't!!!!

The last image has doube 'rr's

http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/override

http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/overrides

C.

Two rr's is what google spelling is giving me as well.

Is that the only issue cicero? Cause if it is, I am happy.

WM

i like the dotted line. it fits nicely.

and even if you make it as an objective or just as a big bonus keep the dotted line. mystery and stuff isn't something people want on the maps

just 1 question. why 454 and not 150 or 500?. 454 seems like a random number.

DiM wrote:i like the dotted line. it fits nicely.

and even if you make it as an objective or just as a big bonus keep the dotted line. mystery and stuff isn't something people want on the maps

just 1 question. why 454 and not 150 or 500?. 454 seems like a random number.

454 territories.

C.

I ahve just been informed by lack that teh XML update needed for this map will not be for some time.

So in the mean time, I would like to get everything set and once the XML update is ready we can be done.

What is everyone opinion on:

• The Subgroup bonuses?
• The layout?
• The colors?
• The territory bonuses (currently 1 per 10 terts)?
• The entire color group bonuses?
• Neutral respawn count (currently 30)
• Hold shortest route = WIN THE GAME or +454 bonus?
• Anything Else?

yeti_c wrote:

DiM wrote:i like the dotted line. it fits nicely.

and even if you make it as an objective or just as a big bonus keep the dotted line. mystery and stuff isn't something people want on the maps

just 1 question. why 454 and not 150 or 500?. 454 seems like a random number.

454 territories.

C.

Yes 454 territories. I do like the bonus more than the WIN CONDITION. What is everyones else's opinion?

WM

I like the win condition, it the most realistic. That is the point of a maze

Sorry for not keeping up but why do you need an XML update to get this map finished?

gimil wrote:Sorry for not keeping up but why do you need an XML update to get this map finished?

Currently XML does not allow a neutral to start with one value (say 6) and respawn with another (say 15)

So that is why.

WM

It seems purer to the map concept for the shortest route to be an objective.
It seems that gameplay may well be served better by a shortest route bonus ... and yes, 454, why not ?
[cue DiM ...]



And just to let you know ...

[really important part of post]
oops!
I checked the spelling of "overrides" earlier when the map images showed "overides" and made a mental note that the spelling needed changing.

Then you changed it in the latest image and my brain coincidentally decided it was time to present the mental note that the spelling needed changing.

... so, that's how it happened.

[/really important part of post]

If it's an objective - I severely doubt anyone will go for it - as it's nigh on impossible to hold...

If it's a bonus - then I think it's more likely...

(I know it's the same - but the psychology of "winning" the game - and getting a huge bonus are different for people to break it)

C.