Conquer Club

RjBeals wrote:Incandenza - The Chruchill speech is great, but there's not a chance of fitting in the map.

That's why clever writer-types like me hang around here...

The current text has 26 words. So here's a stab at the "good parts" version of Churchill's soundbite:

An "Iron Curtain" has descended across the Continent. Behind that line lie all the capitals of the ancient states of Central and Eastern Europe, and all are subject to control from Moscow.
- Winston Churchill, 1946

That's 32 words, plus 2 words and the date for the attribution.... could that perhaps be squeezed in?

Perhaps... I'll give it a shot.
(In a few days).

wow, this could be a fun map. Plenty of good starts, many directions to go in. And my cursory look at the bonuses doesn't bring up any real problem spots

The first thing that really bugs me is the text in the top left: beyond the lack of subject-verb agreement (Republics lie, they don't lies) it seems anachronistic to have this mid/late 20th-century map with a distinctly 16th century looking and sounding text on parchment. A good old metal plaque, placed there by and for the common man, or a kitchy 1950s propaganda piece, might be more appropriate... and damned cool looking.



Gameplay stuff: I can go either way with the stars attacking each other; it's good because it opens up play and doesn't allow anybody to get off to a luck start and set themselves up in an unbeatable position, but it has to make sense. Personally when I play a new map I like the idea that the elements of the map are based on some geo-political reality. Right now you have unpassable rivers that seem to end and begin without reason, which I can live with, but I'd like to see some logic behind the stars other than that it's good for gameplay. Airports? KGB posts? Capitals? What if there were one or two KGB posts that could attack (or bombard) three or four capitals? Make the KGB post in Moscow, which is in the center of a big region that would undesirable early in the game, and allow it to whack territories in some of the otherwise easy to hold regions.

Baltics: at five territories that'll be the toughest +2 on the map to get, and it's a tough expansion. Since it has a small +5 next door I wouldn't say bump it up to +3, but maybe since that is likely to be the last of the 'small' regions to be held for a bonus two of the territories could be merged to make it a four terit region?

more i look,then i find new and new mistakes-
YOu have POland Continent,and you add West Germany to these continent. Also to these continent you add Chechoslovakia too.

Romania Continent have part who not beling to romania-Hungaria and MOldova.
Many of your contnents have names who all ready belong to some territories.
Moscow country and territtory Moskva.
you definitly must change some country and territory names,and you must create new countries to.
i can try to find more proper names for countries and territories if you want. Its all depend of you.

ZeakCytho wrote:I'm not crazy about the star-portal things. Is it really necessary from a gameplay point of view? Someone more experienced with gameplay should probably address this. If it makes the gameplay much smoother, than go with it, but if it doesn't, I'm inclined to want to keep this map simple.

I'm not sure the scroll in the top left really fits the style of the rest of the map? It feels more like something from the 1700s than the Cold War. The text of the scroll is good, though.

I still feel the minimap box should not have a transparent background. Right now, it feels very odd to me that the background of the minimap is not what the background of that part of Eurasia looks like. I'd much prefer it if you shrunk the whole map instead of just the playable area. If you really don't want to do this, then could you not put the minimap in a box? That could also fix the problem. Or maybe I'm just crazy.

100% yes, you should work on this

Definitly something here with borders and country is wrong,when i start finding names,i realised that names and neighbour territory dont stay in right place? Something here is not correct.When i put correct three four names in territory where suppose to be,then i have one territory without names to fill. You need to fix borders.
Well its up to you,i can not put names in wrong territory.
I start these but then i stop.
[bigimg]http://i195.photobucket.com/albums/z188/Maqerdan/theironcurtainF.png[/bigimg]

qwert wrote:Definitly something here with borders and country is wrong,when i start finding names,i realised that names and neighbour territory dont stay in right place? Something here is not correct.When i put correct three four names in territory where suppose to be,then i have one territory without names to fill. You need to fix borders.
Well its up to you,i can not put names in wrong territory.
I start these but then i stop.

RjBeals (First Post) wrote:I also had to combine some regions that were just simply too small, as well as split up some regions that were just to large. I split them up by large cities. (Ex. KORI in the top right. That's all just 1 territ, which was too large, so I split it into 5, and made it a bonus region.

Qwert - first of all thanks for the work you put into the image above. I know that the region & some borders are not correct. I couldn't keep true to the original borders because of the size of some of them. But the East German & Czech region I thought was too small to have as a bonus region. Maybe I can put the larger borders to keep them a bit sepearte, but include them in the bonus region, so a 2 territ region doesn't get a bonus. As far as the names you suggested - I'll use them instead of what I got. Thanks again for all the work.

As far as other comments = I'll look consider & respond better when I get a chance.

I'm not a big fan of the lines used on the paper in the "here lies" section. The lines don't really fit the rest of the graphics. Have you tried doing a smooth gradient instead of those lines, with a rough paper texture to make it look good?

wcaclimbing wrote:I'm not a big fan of the lines used on the paper in the "here lies" section. The lines don't really fit the rest of the graphics. Have you tried doing a smooth gradient instead of those lines, with a rough paper texture to make it look good?

I think RJ is reworking that entire corner of the map...

Qwert - first of all thanks for the work you put into the image above. I know that the region & some borders are not correct. I couldn't keep true to the original borders because of the size of some of them. But the East German & Czech region I thought was too small to have as a bonus region. Maybe I can put the larger borders to keep them a bit sepearte, but include them in the bonus region, so a 2 territ region doesn't get a bonus. As far as the names you suggested - I'll use them instead of what I got. Thanks again for all the work.

As far as other comments = I'll look consider & respond better when I get a chance.er]

For me its quit strange that you POland bonus add Germany and Chehoslovakia ,and Romania and Hungaria. These give quit wrong picture of map. IF im in your place i will definitly redesign map to be more proper,but its up to you.

First I'd like to say that this looks great already

I've skimmed through the thread and I understand that you are not trying to make it 100% correct (when compared to real borders and regions) so I won't complain that Kaliningrad shouldn't be part of Baltic States (it has never been) and that Saaremaa & Hiiumaa shouldn't connect to Latvia as there's no connection between them

Anyway, rant aside that has very little to do with the map, I think that 2 bonus for Baltics is too little. Yeah, it has only 2 places to defend but you do have to grab 5 terrs for that. Sorry if it is not the right time nor place for it but just noticed the map and couldn't stop myself commenting

[bigimg]http://www.rjbeals.com/ironcurtain/Untitled-10.jpg[/bigimg]

UDPATES:

• Well... seems the poll has spoken. The stars have been removed and the gameplay will be straightforward.
• lightly darkened the lighter region shades.
• Added the Winston Churchill speech suggested by Incandenza to the bottom left.
• Baltics are still worth +2, but I added the 2nd water route so the islands are now linked 2 ways.
• Used the banner propoganda to add the title in the top left.
• Used bolded borders and a slightly different color shade to differentiate East-Germany and Czechoslovakia from Poland - but kept the bonus region the same.
• Same for Hungary and Basarabia from Romainia.
• Used a solid/striped background behind the mini-map legend.
• Changed font style for mini-map legend. Now it's even smaller.
• Renamed several regions based on Qwerts suggestions. Now they should all be cities, and spelled in English translation. (Example: Moskva is now Moscow)

amazzony - thanks for commenting. Of course it's the right time to comment on whatever you wish. You posted a bit too soon though as I was updating this as you typed.

DISCUSSIONS:

• I'm happy with the colors - DiM and others - are we all okay with them?
• Impassible borders are not based on real life. Added for gameplay - are they okay? Should more be added - or removed?
• How's the title?
• How's the explanation. For a first timer on this map, does the blurb explain the map's region well enough? Oaktown - you okay with the grammar?
• What about the min-map font & background?

There are still two Oryols.

Not much else that I don't like on this map

ZeakCytho wrote:There are still two Oryols.

Crap.

But I'm sure there will be more adjusting of names. It's the part I'm not so good at. I'll get that pesky 2nd Oryol and change it to qwerts map up top.

stamps stamps stamps stamps stamps stamps stamps

colours are great
impassable borders must stay
title is better but...
minimap font is very very small but who cares
minimap background a bit of theme

pamoa wrote:=D> stamps stamps stamps stamps stamps stamps stamps

colours are great
impassable borders must stay
title is better but...
minimap font is very very small but who cares
minimap background a bit of theme

I think i will try and enlarge the font. At normal viewing distance, it's too hard to read. I have to sit up close to the monitor to read it. Hmm.. and a theme for the background. I'll see what i can do. thanks P.

Love the update, RjBeals, absolutely love it. I think the borders look fine, and the slight difference in color over in the Poland/Germany/Czech area works wonderfully. Excellent solution.

I really like the curtain

But I'm I the only one who has problems reading Churchill text? I mean, I get it because I know what it says but if somebody who has no idea what it says then it might be a bit difficult font IMO (though it fits with the style very well).

I don't like the curtain. Makes me think that the Iron Curtain is this little plaything I can have a little kitten bat around when he's bored. We're talking one of the most fearsome extensions of military and political power in history. The iron fence idea was terrific, and I miss the hammer and sickle oh so-so much.

Otherwise, I like the map changes a lot, particularly the new speech.

amazzony wrote:I really like the curtain

But I'm I the only one who has problems reading Churchill text? I mean, I get it because I know what it says but if somebody who has no idea what it says then it might be a bit difficult font IMO (though it fits with the style very well).

Thanks guys.
I was kind of wondering the same thing. the text may be a little too much. I'll try a more plain style. If it's hard to read on the large map, the small map will be even worse.

And I think I'm going to take out the czech/germany borders in the minimap.

Cheers guys and gals.

TaCktiX wrote:I don't like the curtain. Makes me think that the Iron Curtain is this little plaything I can have a little kitten bat around when he's bored. We're talking one of the most fearsome extensions of military and political power in history. The iron fence idea was terrific, and I miss the hammer and sickle oh so-so much.

We're talking about a game here actually. I'm not sure I follow the kitchen bat thing - but I get the point. It's not supposed to be a curtain, but a propaganda banner. The hammer/sickle for sure needs to be added back - just not sure where.

TaCktiX wrote:I don't like the curtain. Makes me think that the Iron Curtain is this little plaything I can have a little kitten bat around when he's bored. We're talking one of the most fearsome extensions of military and political power in history. The iron fence idea was terrific, and I miss the hammer and sickle oh so-so much.

I agree that the fence was terrific and gave this correct feeling to the map.
But the curtain fits perfectly there... when I saw it then I was "omg, this looks like it jumped out from the soviet time". The style goes exactly with the badges that my grandfather has shown me from soviet time. I don't know how to explain but it's exactly what I've seen and fits under category soviet "stuff"

Budapest, Miskloc, and Basarabia have different color from the rest of Hungary-Romania and yet are part of the bonus?

Can the same be said of Berlin,Leipzig, Prague, and Bratislavia with the E. Germany Czechloslovakia Poland bonus?

If not, then I don't get having the dead territories. Having dead ones in the middle of the map I would "get" because they almost become passable impassables... but I don't get having them on the edge.

The Winston Churchill Text is pretty blurry on my screen too... It's even a bit multi-colored.
Does anyone else see 20 or so dots in the bottom corner of the mini-map?

TaCktiX wrote:I don't like the curtain. Makes me think that the Iron Curtain is this little plaything I can have a little kitten bat around when he's bored. We're talking one of the most fearsome extensions of military and political power in history. The iron fence idea was terrific, and I miss the hammer and sickle oh so-so much.

I liked the original fence-thing that you had going.

RjBeals wrote:The hammer/sickle for sure needs to be added back - just not sure where.

Yes.

And seriously, where the heck are the stamps?

Hey Beals, great looking map, I'm surprised it's not stamped yet.

Just a few points, I may be wrong, as I don't know the spelling of these places post-WWII:

1) Should Svedlovsk be Sverdlovsk? (Both the territory and continent)
2) Should Kalanin (north of Moscow) be Kalinin?
3) Kori continent, do you mean Komi?
4) Arkhangelesk continent should be Arkhangelsk?

That's all I can see that differs from the names I usually associate with those places. Of course, I'm not looking from the perspective of 1946+, and I certainly am not East European, so I may well be wrong on all counts.

One other quick point, you have the Slavic/Balkan states (which are out of play area) divided into the modern boundaries, but post-WWII that region was one entity under the name Yugoslavia.

Great map though, it's about time someone made another large territory count map with plenty of continents. It allows for very diverse gameplay.

Not ignoring the posts above - but I wanted to post this image for some feedback. Do you prefer the new title with stars? or the banner?