Conquer Club

Iron Butterfly wrote:Why do you need to debate about weather Rugbirn is scum? For Gods sake hes the same color as the hitman Betiko? TWINS?? Ya think?

I am most certainly not Vanilla.

Just because I'm 3rd party and the cousins were 3rd party doesn't mean we are related. Think about the show, what did Saul and the Salamanca cousins have in common - nothing! 3rd Party is just a catch all for unaffiliated factions. I can't understand why Strike put the Salamanca cousins as 3rd Party and NOT cartel - doesn't make sense from the show's perspective. But I assure you everything I have said is true, and I am NOT scum !!

jonty125 wrote:Huell Babineaux - Town Bodyguard

N1: Mets
N2: MoB
N3: MoB

Vote Jonty N1 Our doc died. N2 we still didn't have info on Rug/MoB. Why wouldn't you protect the claimed doc, as the only protective role left know to you. Something is wrong here.

Iron Butterfly wrote:I would be curious as to who rishad thinks is scum.

Also my list is Currently:
Jonty
Rugbirn
If one/both of those two pan out, one of the other protectives. 5 protective roles in a game of 18 is way too much.
Also with only one investigative cop who Rug could mess with I think his claim is effectively shot. What is the point of being able to frame mafia if the chances of them being investigated are useless. Also want his N3 action, he never gave it.

rishaed wrote:

Iron Butterfly wrote:I would be curious as to who rishad thinks is scum.

Also my list is Currently:
Jonty
Rugbirn
If one/both of those two pan out, one of the other protectives. 5 protective roles in a game of 18 is way too much.
Also with only one investigative cop who Rug could mess with I think his claim is effectively shot. What is the point of being able to frame mafia if the chances of them being investigated are useless. Also want his N3 action, he never gave it.

Not only did I give it once, I gave it TWICE look above 4 posts Rishaed

Rugbirn wrote:

rishaed wrote:

Iron Butterfly wrote:I would be curious as to who rishad thinks is scum.

Also my list is Currently:
Jonty
Rugbirn
If one/both of those two pan out, one of the other protectives. 5 protective roles in a game of 18 is way too much.
Also with only one investigative cop who Rug could mess with I think his claim is effectively shot. What is the point of being able to frame mafia if the chances of them being investigated are useless. Also want his N3 action, he never gave it.

Not only did I give it once, I gave it TWICE look above 4 posts Rishaed

>.> That you did it seems like I have been missing some things recently.

Waiting on Jonty and Virus to answer.

We'll probably have to wait a while since they are likely sleeping in Europe at this time.

rishaed wrote:

Rugbirn wrote:

rishaed wrote:

Iron Butterfly wrote:I would be curious as to who rishad thinks is scum.

Also my list is Currently:
Jonty
Rugbirn
If one/both of those two pan out, one of the other protectives. 5 protective roles in a game of 18 is way too much.
Also with only one investigative cop who Rug could mess with I think his claim is effectively shot. What is the point of being able to frame mafia if the chances of them being investigated are useless. Also want his N3 action, he never gave it.

Not only did I give it once, I gave it TWICE look above 4 posts Rishaed

>.> That you did it seems like I have been missing some things recently.

Rishaed how does your ability work? The vengeful part?

Iron Butterfly wrote:

rishaed wrote:

Rugbirn wrote:

rishaed wrote:

Iron Butterfly wrote:I would be curious as to who rishad thinks is scum.

Also my list is Currently:
Jonty
Rugbirn
If one/both of those two pan out, one of the other protectives. 5 protective roles in a game of 18 is way too much.
Also with only one investigative cop who Rug could mess with I think his claim is effectively shot. What is the point of being able to frame mafia if the chances of them being investigated are useless. Also want his N3 action, he never gave it.

Not only did I give it once, I gave it TWICE look above 4 posts Rishaed

>.> That you did it seems like I have been missing some things recently.

Rishaed how does your ability work? The vengeful part?

I get lynched, I kill one person. I get NK'd Im outta luck.

yes was sleeping in europe indeed
i protected rugbirn, since i am pretty convinced that his saul claim was true, and for me as DEA i would not protect heisenberg faction since i would be helped by the death of TFO or MOB since im kind of screwed anyway (i dont have abilitys and am 1 vs 2).
i have doubted to even take the offer, since im not sure if it was smart to throw my vote away to save someone else.

anyway, you all know who i doubt mostly i guess..

I doubt Rugbirn, vote Rugbirn

I didn't target cooldeals because I felt that between them MoB and Rugbirn, would somehow redirect/block the kill. Also to protect cooldeals I would actually have to target whom he was busdrived with (assuming MoB busdrived him). So I targeted, MoB, because a) MoB might swap himself with cooldeals so I was in effect targetting cooldeals and b) if MoB doesn't swap cooldeals and himself, I'm protecting town BD, which has got to be good.

And yes, I die to protect my target.

Official Vote Count

Jonty (2)-Rugbirn, Rishaed
Rugbirn (2)-Iron butterfly, Jonty125
Rishaed
Iron Butterfly
Mob Deadly
Virus90
Theforgivenone
Rodion

With 8 alive it takes 4 to lynch.

So, basically, allegedly protected players N3 were:
Rodion, by IB
Virus, by Rugbirn
Rugbirn, by Virus
MoB -> Jonty, by Jonty (we know Jonty's protection didn't work, since that would make Jonty die)

Virus, are you saying you had the option of taking the meth?

Jonty, back in N2 we didn't know MoB was a busdriver. You are applying D3 reasoning to retroactively justify a decision you took back in N2.

I think it needs to be made completely clear as well that NO ONE hammers without permission. We take to L2 and hold.

jonty125 wrote:I doubt Rugbirn, vote Rugbirn

I didn't target cooldeals because I felt that between them MoB and Rugbirn, would somehow redirect/block the kill. Also to protect cooldeals I would actually have to target whom he was busdrived with (assuming MoB busdrived him). So I targeted, MoB, because a) MoB might swap himself with cooldeals so I was in effect targetting cooldeals and b) if MoB doesn't swap cooldeals and himself, I'm protecting town BD, which has got to be good.

And yes, I die to protect my target.

Rodion wrote:Jonty, back in N2 we didn't know MoB was a busdriver. You are applying D3 reasoning to retroactively justify a decision you took back in N2.

I think it is near guaranteed jonty is scum

I think it may be a better play though to lynch the vengeful and have him kill jonty possibly?

Yes please no one lynch until we have all debated this as far as possible.

there was nothings said about meth and i had the option, i was able to choose.

virus90 wrote:there was nothings said about meth and i had the option, i was able to choose.

I dont recall having an option, but I deleted my PM.

Strike has the freedom to change it though, like I said, the Role PM was actually pretty ambiguous on what the effects of Meth were. Thats why we chose to test the waters first by mething ourselves

MoB Deadly wrote:

jonty125 wrote:I doubt Rugbirn, vote Rugbirn

I didn't target cooldeals because I felt that between them MoB and Rugbirn, would somehow redirect/block the kill. Also to protect cooldeals I would actually have to target whom he was busdrived with (assuming MoB busdrived him). So I targeted, MoB, because a) MoB might swap himself with cooldeals so I was in effect targetting cooldeals and b) if MoB doesn't swap cooldeals and himself, I'm protecting town BD, which has got to be good.

And yes, I die to protect my target.

Rodion wrote:Jonty, back in N2 we didn't know MoB was a busdriver. You are applying D3 reasoning to retroactively justify a decision you took back in N2.

I think it is near guaranteed jonty is scum

I think it may be a better play though to lynch the vengeful and have him kill jonty possibly?

Yes please no one lynch until we have all debated this as far as possible.

I have thought the same thing about rishaed. If he is telling the truth he can take out Jonty. If he lies we have scum anyway.

Disclaimer 1 - not going to account for the possibility I am mafia. It's too tiresome to consider possibilities that I know are false. If you wish to suggest a different course of action that accounts for me, feel free to mention them.
Disclaimer 2 - I'm focusing on catching mafia/cartel and having town win. I'm not concerned to what happens between MoB/TFO and Virus after town has won.
Disclaimer 3 - I'll be making small posts from time to time, as writing everything in one huge post would be too tiresome.
Disclaimer 4 - my idea is to write 5 scenarios, as follows:
We lynch Rishaed and he is mafia.
We lynch Rishaed, he is town, kills Jonty and Jonty is mafia.
We lynch Rishaed, he is town, kills Jonty and Jonty is town.
We lynch Jonty and he is mafia.
We lynch Jonty and he is town.

1 - We lynch Rishaed and he is mafia.

7 players alive.

IB jails Virus.
I block Rugbirn.
Jonty protects me.
You can give meth to MoB or yourself.
No busdriving to avoid shenanigans (unless you'd rather give the meth to yourself, in which case you swap MoB with TFO).

1A - someone dies

Virus dead = IB mafia ->town wins
Jonty dead = IB mafia ->town wins
IB dead = Jonty mafia ->town wins
Rodion dead = Jonty mafia ->town wins
Rugbirn dead = Jonty or IB mafia*
MOB/TFO dead = Jonty or IB mafia*

*Entering D5 with 6 alive and, worst case scenario, 2 suspects, we can even mislynch and have Jonty/IB kill someone N5. We'd be down to 4 players D6 and 100% sure about who to lynch, Town wins.

1B - no death

No lynch. Go back to night and follow the same protocol. Idea is that either:
I) there is a nightkill, reverting to 1A. Town wins.
II) no NKs ever occur and we keep no-lynching indefinitely. MoB/TFO will keep getting meth actions until they eventually get a cop and figure the truth (it may take "infinite" days, though). Town wins.#

2 - We lynch Rishaed, he is town, kills Jonty and Jonty is mafia.

6 players alive. 1 mafia.

IB jails Virus.
I block Rugbirn.
You can give meth to MoB or yourself.
No busdriving to avoid shenanigans (unless you'd rather give the meth to yourself, in which case you swap MoB with TFO).

2A - someone dies = IB is mafia -> town wins
2B - no death = infinite days until TFO meths a cop. -> town wins

3 - We lynch Rishaed, he is town, kills Jonty and Jonty is town.

This opens up a huge can of worms, so I'll skip it for now.

4 - We lynch Jonty and Jonty is mafia.

IB jails Rishaed.
I block Virus.
Rugbirn protects IB.

Any deaths = Rishaed and Virus are cleared
Rishaed dies = IB mafia
Rugbirn dies = IB mafia
IB dies = Rugbirn mafia
TFO/MOB/Virus dies = IB or Rugbirn mafia

No deaths = 7 players alive, only 1 mafia and we can still use Rishaed for a double-lynch (that is, if he's town ; if he is mafia, it's an instant win). Or we can try infinite days.

Rodion wrote:No deaths = 7 players alive, only 1 mafia and we can still use Rishaed for a double-lynch (that is, if he's town ; if he is mafia, it's an instant win). Or we can try infinite days.

Or better. Lynch Rugbirn. 6 players left. I block Virus, IB blocks Rishaed. Any death = IB mafia, town wins. No deaths = Rishaed lynch and Rishaed, if town, kills IB. IF this is not endgame, I'll block Virus and he is lynched the next day. Town wins.

I am out of town until Sunday night. I do have wifi at my hotel, but I'm in a tournament, so won't be at the hotel except for nights.

OK, I got the day MoB claimed wrong, I must have protected him due to his towniness.

With a dead doctor and a claimed cop you'd go for MoB over CD, sure.

I'd rather just kill Jonty and have IB jail Rishaed so we can potentially use his vengeful ability tomorrow. I'll block Rugbirn. Meth/busdriving only between TFO/MoB.

If there is a death (assuming Jonty flipped mafia, which is 99% guaranteed at this point), Rugbirn and Rishaed are cleared of being the final mafia (or cartel, depending on what Jonty flipped) and the final killer has to be IB, Virus (if DEA is solo) or me (just accounting for me). There will be 6 players alive on D5, only one being mafia and many night actions to guarantee a good N5, in which Rugbirn will be unblocked and free to aid with protections.
No death just means 7 players alive on D5, only one being mafia and many night actions to guarantee a good N5.

Yeah, this is my final plan (it's better than yesterday's). Would like to hear/read everyone's thoughts.

Rodion wrote:With a dead doctor and a claimed cop you'd go for MoB over CD, sure.

I'd rather just kill Jonty and have IB jail Rishaed so we can potentially use his vengeful ability tomorrow. I'll block Rugbirn. Meth/busdriving only between TFO/MoB.

If there is a death (assuming Jonty flipped mafia, which is 99% guaranteed at this point), Rugbirn and Rishaed are cleared of being the final mafia (or cartel, depending on what Jonty flipped) and the final killer has to be IB, Virus (if DEA is solo) or me (just accounting for me). There will be 6 players alive on D5, only one being mafia and many night actions to guarantee a good N5, in which Rugbirn will be unblocked and free to aid with protections.
No death just means 7 players alive on D5, only one being mafia and many night actions to guarantee a good N5.

Yeah, this is my final plan (it's better than yesterday's). Would like to hear/read everyone's thoughts.

I obviously dislike it.