EW's Semi-Open Matrix Madness

[SoN!c]

Always happy to make you smile Charle Still that feeling you already know Max is gonna flip town..

[Charle]

Always happy to make you smile Charle Still that feeling you already know Max is gonna flip town..

I wish I knew. I also really want to hear what Max is going to say (if he is going to) and I am very happy to change to Kong as well. Will go what Town decides.

[SoN!c]

Always happy to make you smile Charle Still that feeling you already know Max is gonna flip town..

I wish I knew. I also really want to hear what Max is going to say (if he is going to) and I am very happy to change to Kong as well. Will go what Town decides.

I picture myself you typing a PM to your fellow scummates "For a moment i was in trouble here but i think i got away with it"

On another note: according to your previous post PMC initiated the lynch idea on Max then. Now he is not voting Max however and that while the urge to hammer is present..

Is that because PMC knows - when Max flips town-, the rest of town will look at the lynchwagon assuming there will be scum in there?

[Votanic]

Very interesting that Max has towait to come back to say whatever it is he's going to say...
Is he waiting to discuss it first with scum-mates?
Perhaps an inactive scum-mate?

[strike wolf]

Ok, looks like pmc and Sonic can end this day for us.

Doc will save Votanic obviously tonight, but scum will probably block Vot as well, so our best bet will be if Max turns Scum Blocker. Our Doc cannot save tomorrow but if we lynch clever from now on, the game might be over soon.

Woah!!!

Doc will save Votanic obviously tonight...

How do you know we have a Doc?!

Oh my word!! Have you missed this? Am I the only one playing here? A few RL days ago, before you revealed who you visited, we did not know whether it would have been matrix B or 2, we gave our blocker a day to come forward and if we have doc he obviously should have stayed quiet. We gave it actually 2 days, blocker did not reveal himself so we could assume we have doctor. Only after that you revealed that you visited King that brought us back to square 1.

Vot, let's move forward. Our blocker (if we have one) had a day to come forward, so we can assume we have the doctor which is good news if our assumptions are correct. Doc to save Vot tonight.

I suggest we lynch the person who you visited, there is a damn good chance that he is scum.

This is dumb. Neither blocker nor doc should reveal right now.

[strike wolf]

I don't think it's dev and neither does sonic FOS on sonic and Rag.

Finally, we disagree on something. But hey, at least mine isn't just a vote but an honest attempt at looking at gameplay.

---

Yea. Real Life has been a pain lately. Short sum: I think Dev is a bad case. It feels like pinning everything on a random inactive on a day when (as Son!c correctly alluded to) is very pivotal and we need to lynch scum today or this game will be very tough for us to dig back out of and steal the win from Scum. Kong has been just as inactive as Dev but imo scummier. Take this post for example:

Well to be clear, I stated explicitly earlier that I was and have indeed been "bandwagoning" on votes because I believe it makes the most sense for town to get a lynch off, and so that has been my modus operandi thus far as well as why I've been the first on different motions like the lynch pack one or most recently with swang to make a move and stick my neck out so we get information in the absence of useful power roles (for instance once I was the first to publicly support PMC's lynch gang we had a motley crew soon to follow in quick succession, some of whom I imagine are scum).

Regarding you specifically good sir, I don't actually have any particularly grand suspicions beyond that other people have noted you to be playing strangely (which I took their word for and you haven't refuted to my knowledge) and the minor gaff Charles pointed out earlier. I could definitely believe you are town and its unclear to me who is being lynced, but I wanted to ensure we'd have a lynch at the end of the day on one of the more suspicious seeming townsfolk.

The wording at the end looks more than a little like a Freudian slip. Inadvertantly acknowledging that he has not been looking for actual potential scum but the "more suspicious seeming townsfolk." Which is where any smart scum would be trying to direct the lynch.

Vote Kong

Rich coming from you. Where's your post in which you Freudian slipped writing scum instead of town or vice versa?

1. There was no Freudian Slip. I sped read and misread the post as I acknowledged at the time


2. Very odd of you to hold onto that until now and then try to suddenly make it a point. Honestly, you seem to be more aggressive towards me today since I've started going after Kong. Protecting your scum partner?

[SoN!c]

https://www.timeanddate.com/countdown/g ... nt=cursive the clock is ticking!

So the obvious choice will be Max. Could it be there is no scum in the wagon because scum knows we will be looking at the wagon when Max flips town? I believe so!

Max: 4 - Charle, Votanic, Dev, Kingm

That is also the best reason why i think Charle could be town and why Ragian and PMC could be very clever playing scummies. Scum knows we need to lynch somebody at this stage and if you are scum, it is always beter to stay out the lynchwagon when you can and certainly when you know it's gonna hit a townie.

And while Max and Kong are good MIA lynch candidates they would not be clever scum. Especially Max: anybody who says "Got a few things to say" but then doesn't say anything in a mafia game is conscientious stupid.

[pmchugh]

Oh Sonic, you are so wrong it is hilarious.

You do what you need to do, but we should try and hit scum today, going after me is going to loose you another day and another townie.

I am just waiting what Max will come up with. So by the way, my statement that I voted Max because of his name was a joke. I went for him after Vot revealed that he visited King and pmc suggested to kill Max in this post.

I would happily kill max at this point, only reason we haven't looked at him is people saying that he is in his town meta, when we have never seen his wolf meta.

This was hardly the biggest case I've made lol.

Also yeah you can't assume there is a doc because you came up with a plan to out the roleblocker if there was one and they didn't within 2 days, they could disagree with the plan or just not be paying attention.

[pmchugh]

https://www.timeanddate.com/countdown/generic?iso=20240707T235959&p0=16&font=cursive the clock is ticking!

So the obvious choice will be Max. Could it be there is no scum in the wagon because scum knows we will be looking at the wagon when Max flips town? I believe so!

Max: 4 - Charle, Votanic, Dev, Kingm

That is also the best reason why i think Charle could be town and why Ragian and PMC could be very clever playing scummies. Scum knows we need to lynch somebody at this stage and if you are scum, it is always beter to stay out the lynchwagon when you can and certainly when you know it's gonna hit a townie.

And while Max and Kong are good MIA lynch candidates they would not be clever scum. Especially Max: anybody who says "Got a few things to say" but then doesn't say anything in a mafia game is conscientious stupid.

I am not on the wagon cause I think kong is more likely scum because his play is out of character of previous games. Max play is weird and hard to read, hopefully he posts something in depth and not a one liner.

[SoN!c]

I am not on the wagon cause I think kong is more likely scum because his play is out of character of previous games. Max play is weird and hard to read, hopefully he posts something in depth and not a one liner.

Okay, im gonna follow you then - you have a good point when you say his play is out of character of previous games and Strike had a good input on him with his "seeming townsfolk" line; all and all Kong seems a way better lynch candidate then Max. And if Kong flips scum you would be very likely town. Still i have the feeling we are going for MIA candidates while scum is playing real clever.. Then again it's just one day before deadline

Vote Kong

[Votanic]

I am not on the wagon cause I think kong is more likely scum because his play is out of character of previous games. Max play is weird and hard to read, hopefully he posts something in depth and not a one liner.

Okay, im gonna follow you then - you have a good point when you say his play is out of character of previous games and Strike had a good input on him with his "seeming townsfolk" line; all and all Kong seems a way better lynch candidate then Max. And if Kong flips scum you would be very likely town. Still i have the feeling we are going for MIA candidates while scum is playing real clever.. Then again it's just one day before deadline

Vote Kong

Max's recent pitiful and pointless appearance is no better than Kong's complete absence, ...may be even worse.
Kong might just really be over mafia. His noob excitement has burned off, and now he's joined the vast majority that flees this madness like the plague.

But the problem about going after classically bad Town play that hypothetically wise Scum would know to avoid, ...is that the wine glasses can spin so easily around on that. So for both Town and Scum there is always going to be some precariously balanced benefit for minimal play both in game and in RL (i.e. The Easy Way).

So what's the other option? ...go after the decently Townish players? ...with no other evidence?! So tempted to use the word 'madness' twice in one post.
Besides, there are too many half-decent players out there, ...and each with their own spin on what 'half-decent' means.

For example, Charle has slipped the noose for me again. KingM's original soft-claim was that we are playing matrix line 2. That, plus his later claim of Inventor does imply the third PR is Doctor... Damn it. At least this game must show all future mods the societal & game balance necessity of funding the police.

Also still thinking about who KingM visited last night, and whom he claims he game the Role-block invention to, ...not that it is a crucial importance.
I just guess that he just guessed that player was Town, ... maybe, maybe not.
If he did give it to a Townie,then it's just a blind shot with a fair chance of misfiring.
...and if he gave it to Scum (cringe), then it's just an embarrassment of riches for the team that already has a full-time every-night Roleblocker!?!

Town Commiseration 'Unhappy Hour' Meeting is adjourned, ...(sob).

[SoN!c]

I agree Vot. But that is the game at hand and we have to play with the cards that we have here.

Are you certain Kingm is town? I believe 100% that you are the town 3-shot tracker.

But while you know 100% the info you got from your PR from the mod, we only got that info bit by bit partially from you, it's like 75% in different chunks, and although i understand very well why you did not lay it all in the open at once: assumption is the mother of all f*ck ups. The rest of town thinks Kingm is town because you "confirmed him". At least i do.

"He gave something (the role block invention) to LC is what i made out of it all (because you posted "why did you gave it to him??" but not so sure anymore it was LC) but anyway King must be town inventor as he soft claims...

So i assume you got a mod result like "Kingm gave an object to X" - but did he "gave something" or did he just visited X? If he just visited the chances are way higher that he is mafia watcher, mafia tracker or mafia blocker.

"I just guess that he just guessed that player was Town, ... maybe, maybe not." It's impossible to guess that on N2.

[Votanic]

I agree Vot. But that is the game at hand and we have to play with the cards that we have here.

Are you certain Kingm is town? I believe 100% that you are the town 3-shot tracker.

But while you know 100% the info you got from your PR from the mod, we only got that info bit by bit partially from you, it's like 75% in different chunks, and although i understand very well why you did not lay it all in the open at once: assumption is the mother of all f*ck ups. The rest of town thinks Kingm is town because you "confirmed him". At least i do.

"He gave something (the role block invention) to LC is what i made out of it all (because you posted "why did you gave it to him??" but not so sure anymore it was LC) but anyway King must be town inventor as he soft claims...

So i assume you got a mod result like "Kingm gave an object to X" - but did he "gave something" or did he just visited X? If he just visited the chances are way higher that he is mafia watcher, mafia tracker or mafia blocker.

"I just guess that he just guessed that player was Town, ... maybe, maybe not." It's impossible to guess that on N2.

What has confirmed KingM and myself is that no contradictory claim has arisen. It now seems to make sense that the third (and most valuable) PR is the Doctor and that he is most wisely not coming forward.
Also note, as Tracker, I only know that KingM visited somebody (Player Y). I don't actually know what occurred, but the Inventor scenario seems to make sense.
As I said before, it seems that KingM just had to guess on the towniness of the invention recipient.
Yes, that is a gamble, but so is just letting the inventions languish unused, ...and possibly being killed off before giving them to anybody.
Besides, like I also said before, Scum getting one more role-block when they can already do one every night isn't even that much more of an advantage.

[SoN!c]

So, I'm at L-2. Time to claim I guess. Vanilla Town here.

Got a few things to say, I'll post tomorrow/later.

Still no Max in here saying whatever it is he is going to say??? Look Max, if you don't show up soon and say just that, then we have to lynch you just out of principle

So your" saying whatever the few things are that your going to say Kick out timer" is here (football field own goal theme):

https://www.timeanddate.com/countdown/a ... sive&csz=1

Max, say it, say whatever you feel, be whoever you are, but ffs say it. This is not serious. Lmao

[Devante]

I have a feeling Max might turn out town and this lynch ends up a waste but I'm more annoyed that nothing has been posted after he said he would so I'm leaving my vote as it is. Although I would have been happy to try getting Kong more involved with a vote there but that doesn't seem to be triggering anything either. Gotta say this games been frustrating.

[pmchugh]

I have a feeling Max might turn out town and this lynch ends up a waste but I'm more annoyed that nothing has been posted after he said he would so I'm leaving my vote as it is. Although I would have been happy to try getting Kong more involved with a vote there but that doesn't seem to be triggering anything either. Gotta say this games been frustrating.

Glass houses and stones come to mind!

[Devante]

lol I’m assuming that’s a jab at my being MIA for so long and if so that’s fair enough won’t hold it against you. But we’re into July now so RL for me is a little easier to put time into CC so trying to contribute more. Was just hoping to get Max in here hopefully to contribute something

[Ragian]

Back from festival. unvote

No one seems to agree with me on Devante. I have a few pages to catch up with. Gimme a few (and some breakfast).

[Ragian]

I really don't like saying this because vot isn't actually bad at this game, but you don't like mafia. Mafia is a social deduction game, thats the whole point. You make educated guesses.

I get the idea that some people think working only off of 'psychological vibes' is a more sophisticated or pure way to play, ...but it's not.
Even actual lie-detectors are largely a pseudo-scinece that only works if the authorities can dupe people into believing in them.
Very much like religion in that regard.
Real deduction requires real evidence... Ask Holmes, Poirot, Marple, Columbo... Ask anybody.

Real deduction requires real evidence. Ask these fictional characters. You're killing me, man

@Strike, it was meant as a joke By all means go for Kong. I was already voting Devante, so thinking I'd take a stab at you for one vote on Kong is colouring me worse than I am at this game.

Very interesting that Max has towait to come back to say whatever it is he's going to say...
Is he waiting to discuss it first with scum-mates?
Perhaps an inactive scum-mate?

Talk about some hard evidence there

@Sonic, how many have you voted for over the last three pages?

@king, could you point me in a direction, please.

@Max, where's your insight? We're running low on time.

[SoN!c]

@Sonic, how many have you voted for over the last three pages?

Fair enough Ragian but do take into account im just in here for 8 days

So i had to cramp everything into those 8 days as deadline is today and the town choice was already "made" between Max or Kong in a way

In a nutshell: i think we are looking for 3 active clever scum who are enjoying this game very much because town is so much in the dark ..clueless

Yes those 3 active clever scum are you, PMC and Charle. The chance being right on all 3 is small however but im thinking there must be 2 scum between the 3 of you.

Kong: seems a townie that has gone AWOL because he lost interest
Dev: it could be a strategy but hard to believe all in all so another townie
Max: on par for his usual game and no scum would say "Got a few things to say, I'll post tomorrow/later" and then say nothing.
Fusi: seems more out then in too because he thinks we town are getting nowhere - he did not vote while deadline is today?
Strike: trying but RL distracted townie, and i like his posts for when he is in here

In a nutshell: these are all townie's who have given up like Pixar did just the level of giving up varies. But nobody believes we are going to land this.

Then we have;
Vot: our only active town confirmed townie
King: no counterclaim on his claimed inventor matrix

Leaving 3:
Let's face it: only 3 players - next to our confirmed town- have not given up: Ragian, PMC and Charle:


Charle: he is enjoying this game too much so the only way i can see that your having this much fun in here is when your scum
PMC: playing the perfect scum game
You: well, you seem a bit off instead of regular play - it's just a feeling Rag

Putting a vote out on Kong to see what happened (trying to get him in here) and see what Fusi would do but a Max that doesnt say anything deserves a lynch out of principle too.. And in the end i can't say i know it's the three of you, sure i could be a mile off. But that is the fun of the game.

[Ragian]

If it helps, I feel off after three festivals in three weeks

I disagree with some of your conjecture, and I can sort of agree with other stuff. I just think it's problematic that your entire view of this game hinges on the belief that scum would be among the active rather than the inactive. How do you reach that conclusion?

[SoN!c]

If it helps, I feel off after three festivals in three weeks

I disagree with some of your conjecture, and I can sort of agree with other stuff. I just think it's problematic that your entire view of this game hinges on the belief that scum would be among the active rather than the inactive. How do you reach that conclusion?

It's just a theory in the end but that is all we have to go on. Scum have day chat so they will be pm'ing each other from the start and time to time at least. And that creates a sense of togetherness. Then in the weeks that followed those 3 scum would see town crumbling down in despair what created a sense of invincibility and a good feeling all around..Scum must have been enjoying themselves making fun with some town moves. So when enjoying it, then you pm each other more, and you stay triggered to read the thread a lot more generating in turn more triggers to reply in the thread while town is dropping out and losing interest..

Do you have a better theory to get us out of this mess?

[Ragian]

I cannot tell if it's better, but I laid out my detailed case on Devante. You even voted alongside me at some point, so I presume that you read it.

I've also stated my suspicion of Fusi. Neither is getting much traction, however.

[SoN!c]

I cannot tell if it's better, but I laid out my detailed case on Devante. You even voted alongside me at some point, so I presume that you read it.

I've also stated my suspicion of Fusi. Neither is getting much traction, however.

Devante -playing as scum- would mean he made such stupid mistakes in the beginning of the game (on purpose) just to continue playing the easy way as scum (being MIA).
That would be such a lowball strategy win in the end that i cannot match it with the man Devante is.

Fusi could be scum. Ofcourse he could be. But if he is it's called "well played"

Tick tock on the clock, deadline is less then 12 hours out and Max missed his.

[Ragian]

How does one make mistakes on purpose. Surely, they're not mistakes, then. I don't know why you'd think that mistakes are beyond Devante, but I'm looking at what there is rather than having a personal relationship with the dude. Like with DDS D1.