EW's Semi-Open Matrix Madness

[kongming3]

I'm on board with that, I've basically been planning on that anyway which is where my swang vote came from. I'm a firm believer that we should be lynching someone here and nothing anyone has said has convinced me otherwise.

[pmchugh]

The gang grows
1. PMC
2. Kong

[TrafalgarLaw01]

I'm on board with that, I've basically been planning on that anyway which is where my swang vote came from. I'm a firm believer that we should be lynching someone here and nothing anyone has said has convinced me otherwise.

I and I havent read anything that convice me of lynching D1. Most likely we will lynch a town and get 0 info out of it. Like unless thee is some sort of semi-solid case. I dont see any benefit on lynching D1

[TrafalgarLaw01]

Having said that

Vote No Lynch

[Loose Canon]

The gang grows
1. PMC
2. Kong

Its too bad we probably won't be able to combine our strategies.
I do think you are trying something PMC and that is better than not to - in my book.
I also think we should be seriously prepared to lynch in games generally.

However, I think no lynching is more consistent with my strategy, in this game.

Because I deduce with a very high degree of personal confidence that Vot is not a PR Townie he is the only player I would feel comfortable with D1 lynching which is why I have changed my vote from no lynch to Vot.

I also doubt you guys switching your votes to Vot would work.

But I'll hold firm on Vot as I will on the strategy I'm proposing.
And wish you good luck, nonetheless.

[Votanic]

The gang grows
1. PMC
2. Kong

Real possibility that PMC and Kong just cooked this up in their 24/7 scum-chat 5 minutes before posting...

But to give the Devil his due...
Am I to gather that the three lynch possibilities allowed in this hastily made (and not fully explained) pact are swang, DDS, and Devante?
Why those three? Yes, accusations of non-MO play have been made.. . and swang hardly participates (which actually is his MO...).
...and the even more central question: How/Who is going to decide when this bandwagon actually needs to lay down votes???

Also, a Factual Correction must be made. (Yes, an actual Fact! in this game, beleive it or not...)

I think each of at least the last 5 games has resulted in No Lynch and that has definitely become the overwhelming trend recently in CC Mafia.

In the Werewolf Game, there was a calculated (i.e. non-random) Day 1 lynch that led to the elimination of the Accursed Wolf Father and set town on the path to victory...
That is until Trafstard, decided to re-shuffle the deck because he didn't think having Town win was any fun (mods never do...). Traf probably got a medal for doing that.... such wretched BS.

@EW: Is this is for your doctoral dissertation?
Proposed Thesis: Run 10,000 (near-)mountainous mafia games, then run the results through the statistograph to see if there is any divergence from random.

I actually have more to say, ...but now I'm far too upset to type. I'll be back.

FPed by LC...

Because I deduce with a very high degree of personal confidence that Vot is not a PR Townie he is the only player I would feel comfortable with D1 lynching which is why I have changed my vote from no lynch to Vot.

The only reason you're voting for me because I keep reminding town how badly your plan sucks.... OMGUS too.
...and I love how you're willing to throw a vanilla townie under the bus just like that. (so, so, so not scummy at all) VANILLA LIVES MATTER.

[Kingm]

VANILLA LIVES MATTER.

Ok, this has to be "the line of the game" so far, I was almost in tears when I read that, I love it

[strike wolf]

Fair, I did forget about this game. But to also be fair, in every recent game that didn't have a day cop that got lucky and hit scum day 1, we've ended D1 with a no lynch.

[pmchugh]

Strike, wanna join our lynching crew? You inspired it!

The point is simple, the lynch crew will strike fear into the hearts of players and they will be forced to take sides, which will give us much more intel for following days than simply us all voting no lynch. Information is water, it is life, it is our chance to win. We have no cop, we have few useful PRs and a scum roleblocker lies in wait just in case we do anything useful, but we do have one thing, the power of the guillotine. Let us use it, let us use the only power we have, if we pick wisely we can take a giant leap towards victory and if we pick poorly, we will have lost a friend but their death would not be in vain as we would take one step closer to the key pieces of information that will win us the game.

Rise up, townies, awake from your vanilla slumber, pick up your pitchforks and strike fear into the enemies hearts.

[pmchugh]

The gang grows
1. PMC
2. Kong

Its too bad we probably won't be able to combine our strategies.
I do think you are trying something PMC and that is better than not to - in my book.
I also think we should be seriously prepared to lynch in games generally.

However, I think no lynching is more consistent with my strategy, in this game.

Because I deduce with a very high degree of personal confidence that Vot is not a PR Townie he is the only player I would feel comfortable with D1 lynching which is why I have changed my vote from no lynch to Vot.

I also doubt you guys switching your votes to Vot would work.

But I'll hold firm on Vot as I will on the strategy I'm proposing.
And wish you good luck, nonetheless.

I like vot as a candidate. Lets not get too bogged down in who just yet though. The first thing we must establish is the willingness to join forces to force a lynch, because without that, we can't lynch anyone, there are too many cowards among us for us to split our vote. Sign the pact, then we can argue for a given person.

I don't think this strategy conflicts with yours, worst case we force a PR claim.

[Votanic]

I don't think this strategy conflicts with yours, worst case we force a PR claim.

Ugh... of course not. Why would two doubtful, scum-like 'strategies' conflict. The more the merrier.

PMC, what you are trying to pull is nothing knew.
You're just trying to start a railroad, hoist your locomotive bandwagon onto the tracks and run it straight to the lynch-gallow...
Gee, who is going to be the lucky sacrifice to furhter your supposed town aims... You mentioned DDS, swang, Devante...
But now it looks like it's me, because I'm the only one calling your BS.

Of course, it just couldn't be you, you need to stick around and call the shots and be the conductor, right?

Seriously, why don't you volunteer and put the lynch-rope around your neck.
I mean if your so convinced that that a quasi-random bandwagon-lynch is going to supply Town with oodles of valuable, scum-finding data, then you should be happy to sacrifice yourself for Town. I mean, if that is really the team you're playing for...

[pmchugh]

I do not take my name off the table, join me in the pact and then we can decide who it is.

[Votanic]

I do not take my name off the table, join me in the pact and then we can decide who it is.

I already said as much to you, way back on page 1, remember?

I fully intend to unvote my 'no lynch'... WHEN/IF I HAVE GOOD REASON!

...and lo-and-behold, I have done just that.
So far, LC's counting scheme is the closest thing Ive seen to either a scum-tell or Sonic-level town mishap... but evidently you don't agree.

[Charle]

I surely also want to join the lynch pack. I also hear what traf is all about by keeping our numbers higher is basically all we have, but then again, the lower numbers bringing us closer to lynching scum as well. So even when we lynch a townie tonight, tomorrow the chances are a bit better to hit scum and so will every day going forward.

So definitely I am for lynching D1, specially because we do not have real PR to work with.

[Ragian]

I'm all for signing. Lynching will yield information. I don't understand Traf's weird thought that a lynch will reveal no information.

[pmchugh]

1. PMC
2. Kong
3. Charle
4. Rag
5. Strike?

It's 8 to lynch but conceivably could get there with 6 or 7 considering no lynch votes are only at 4 at the moment.

We have 6 days left, if we could get just a couple more in the next day or two then we can move on to picking our target.

[Charle]

Hush.

Votecount:
No Lynch (3) - kingm, Devante, Pixar
Swang (3) - fusi, kongming, PMC
Devante (3) - Charle, Strike, Swang
DDS (2) - Max, Ragian
PMChugh (1) - DDS
Loose Canon (1) - Votanic
Votanic (1) - Loose

With 15 alive, it takes 8 to lynch.

Hmm so Loose has the avility to have 2 votes??

Fixed.

See my initial 3 count on NL was correct

With the count above there are 4 "No Lynchers" traf included and 11 "Lynchers". Now it is just to get the 11 to work together, some of them obviously scum. I like this idea a lot pmc, it is really going to be interesting what this will bring to the table.

[pmchugh]

I think there is a third group though, selective lynchers. Like vot is not currently voting no lynch and he is willing to lynch Loose, but he is not prepared to switch votes/bandwagon to ensure we get a lynch target.

[Votanic]

I think there is a third group though, selective lynchers.

lol...

"selective lynchers!?!?!" (please, note the scare quotes)
Whatever are these 'selective lynchers' of which you speak??
Certainly you can't mean to suggest that there are players who only think some other players are scummy... and thus will only vote for them?!

...and as for PMC's sign-up list, I wonder what are the odds that its members will vote for somebody 'on-the-list' vs 'off-the-list'??
Indeed, it might be wise to get on the list merely for one's own self-preservation...
I'm sure some (or all?) of SCUM have already signed up. They know a good deal when they see it!

@PMC, LC, etc: Trying to 'game' the game is lame. There is no substitute for critical thinking and constant vigilance.
@ EW: ...and power roles. These 'pure rhetoric' games have no hard center...

[Loose Canon]

You might want to consider something along the lines of the following in the lynch pact.

There's no reason when posting your lynch votes in bold red, you can't also post your most townie in say green.
The baton of choosing the lynchee (if you don't lynch scum) maybe in the next vote could pass onto the "most townie" amongst you.

Yes some will say it has the disadvantage of being manipulatable by scum, but something like this,if not this, might be considered?

[TrafalgarLaw01]

I'm sure some (or all?) of SCUM have already signed up. They know a good deal when they see it!

Maybe 1, but all? that would be the dumbest scum ever tbh

[Votanic]

...post your most townie in say green.
The baton of choosing the lynchee (if you don't lynch scum) maybe in the next vote could pass onto the "most townie" amongst you.

Whaa..?? Now there's a 'baton' too?
I call dibs on the Giant Green Baton!!

[kongming3]

Perhaps we should also make our own seperate chat, a "pro-town" chat that only we can access at all times.

[Ragian]

I think several people have called for lists a couple of times. Would be nice if everyone did so.

[Loose Canon]

OK then.

I don't have a scummy list, I've tried not to think about scumminess at all.

But some things did stand out for me.

I really hope I haven't got this wrong or that Vot hasn't tried to be too too clever - but there was a point when I couldn't believe he was town with a power role - and I stick that if he is town he is only Vanilla Town.

Charle made a super observant observation - and I commend Charle for that.
However that doesn't place him in any list at all for me.

I like what PMC has tried to do , I don't mind that he has argued against me in fact I like that too.
Doesn't place him in any list for me too though.

I also really liked it when Strike was counterarguing me and when he called out Vot on something.
There was something about the speed that Strike both counterargued me and called out Vot, that makes me think it was more spontaneous than calculated.
So I'm actually edging town on Strike.

And finally I commend Traf for being able to say things but without me being able to get any instinct whatsoever on his alignment.
He truly would be formidable at a poker table.