The Thing TOWN WINS!

[TrafalgarLaw01]

If Charle is saying the truth (And I think he is). Then we are in a great position - Go on BT me. then we have 2 in 3 to get the Thing

Yes we should be, I was just reading the unbandoned flamethrower again, wonder what was DDS's plan with that? Do you think we will not know when we are converted until you have a blood test?

But surely I would get a message or something telling me I do not have vig powers anymore, but I received nothing.

Well I havent got a pm from DDS either in all game. So afaik I'm still town. And if you havent received one you should be as well.

Unless converted ones does not get noticed. But that is highly unlikely. So I really like our position here

[strike wolf]

Well, Traf and Charle being in sync here doesn't make me feel they're less likely to be cult.

[degaston]

To my surprise, I have not received any mail from DDS. So I guess I still have my powers and can still torch, I am not converted.

Sorry, I don't believe you.
The Things can't have the flamethrower - it would be overpowered to have a recruit and a vig.
Town can't have two flamethrowers - it would be overpowered to have a lynch and two vigs.
You had the flamethrower for two nights, so it doesn't automatically change owners each night.
The only reason for DDS to post that is if you've been recruited and lost the flamethrower.
Traf immediately sticking up for you makes me think that he's cult, but him trying to draw the BT makes me think he is not the recruiter, and he's trying to save the actual recruiter.

[degaston]

To my surprise, I have not received any mail from DDS. So I guess I still have my powers and can still torch, I am not converted.

Sorry, I don't believe you.
The Things can't have the flamethrower - it would be overpowered to have a recruit and a vig.
Town can't have two flamethrowers - it would be overpowered to have a lynch and two vigs.
You had the flamethrower for two nights, so it doesn't automatically change owners each night.
The only reason for DDS to post that is if you've been recruited and lost the flamethrower.
Traf immediately sticking up for you makes me think that he's cult, but him trying to draw the BT makes me think he is not the recruiter, and he's trying to save the actual recruiter.

Sorry - that doesn't make sense - EW had to have been recruited N1, and Charle on N2. I'll have to rethink this.

[SoN!c]

To my surprise, I have not received any mail from DDS. So I guess I still have my powers and can still torch, I am not converted.

Sorry, I don't believe you.
The Things can't have the flamethrower - it would be overpowered to have a recruit and a vig.
Town can't have two flamethrowers - it would be overpowered to have a lynch and two vigs.
You had the flamethrower for two nights, so it doesn't automatically change owners each night.
The only reason for DDS to post that is if you've been recruited and lost the flamethrower.
Traf immediately sticking up for you makes me think that he's cult, but him trying to draw the BT makes me think he is not the recruiter, and he's trying to save the actual recruiter.

Deg, Traf is the Thing, EW was his N1 recruit, Charle his N2 recruit..

There are just 2 things with EW flamed.

You posted you don't believe Charle and you consider Traf cult. So thats 2 things. There is no third.

So follow your own logic and BT Traf. Please.

The game is played. Anybody believing the "slapstick sync" Charle is not recruited and still has his powers (the flamethrower) can join them being the three stooges.

[strike wolf]

Traf and charle can't both be recruits though.

I'm currently looking back through D2 EW posts. EW initially voted to BT Traf D2, pushed for it and even hesitated to change his BT choice when it probably would have been easy enough to switch his vote to Ragian. Afterwards, he even expressed that he was good with the idea of lynching Traf and vigging Son!c or vice versa. It was only later in the day that EW seemed to shift to feeling that Traf was town.

The person that EW did spend time fairly consistently defending D2 was Vot.

[SoN!c]

Traf and charle can't both be recruits though.

I'm currently looking back through D2 EW posts. EW initially voted to BT Traf D2, pushed for it and even hesitated to change his BT choice when it probably would have been easy enough to switch his vote to Ragian. Afterwards, he even expressed that he was good with the idea of lynching Traf and vigging Son!c or vice versa. It was only later in the day that EW seemed to shift to feeling that Traf was town.

The person that EW did spend time fairly consistently defending D2 was Vot.

Just look back at the post EW made when he posted "a SoN!c vote is not gonna happen" and Traf switched a bit later..

Slapstick - but sunday evening. Enjoying a Nice bottle of wine here

[SoN!c]

I'm changing my mind and going out on a limb and saying that Traf is not the recruiter. Can still be recruit, see also point 2

Traf is doing two things:
1) Providing his reads and gameplans for if/when he dies. Because he's most likely to be lynched rn, he's suggesting a vision of how to move forwards that makes sense. Whether to vig/not vig is ultimately a bit of a gut call: do we think that the odds of vig hitting his shot outweigh the downside of having to lynch recruiter if he misses? I think I disagree with Traf, but his reasoning is sound and that's important.
2) Traf is not steering this lynch too hard on someone else. This could be because his prime target (Sonic) is the recruiter, but a recruiter would always try to kill off a recruit and stay alive that way. Traf posts readlists, but hasn't changed his vote.

Maybe Traf is a recruit with a recruiter who is not very trusted, or maybe Trafs a townie who doesn't know who to try to pivot a lynch to seeing that the light push onto Sonic wasn't getting the most of traction. And also because Traf himself seems to... kinda trust Sonic's alignment to be town?

EW D2 (converted) hinting Traf to pivot his vote..saying "Traf is not the recruiter"...(CONVERTED) saying "im changing my mind"

[Votanic]

Alot to process shere, but at least we have fresh new facts.

So Swang wan't scum and EW was...
Get on a randwagon, buy a lottery ticket, our chances are pretty much the same.
I'll admit I was ready to hammer Swang myself, but real evidence was scant yesterday. Town was just clutching at straws.

EW played like a good townie to me, similar to strike actually. Though I'm not pointing a finger... playing like good town is just Mafia 101.

BTing Charle seems like the necessary next step....
Maybe the abandoned flamethrower means that Charle is out of fuel and can't vig anymore?
I doubt it would be directly saying that Charles was converted, because that would be like DDS giving the game away.
Still, Charle is very likely to be converted.

That idea that players are not told when they are converted would be a crazy concept ... but then DDS did also allow players to vote for themselves which also seemed odd.

[Ragian]

I'm fucked... going out as an external examiner tomorrow morning in order to cover for an ill coworker, so I'm out till after tomorrow.

Just making sure to BT Votanic

Never read such a non-committal post before. "Not pointing a finger".

[SoN!c]

I'm fucked... going out as an external examiner tomorrow morning in order to cover for an ill coworker, so I'm out till after tomorrow.

Just making sure to BT Votanic

Never read such a non-committal post before. "Not pointing a finger".

You got town BT Deg D1 choice and lynch Swang town D2 choice. Both were wrong. Now im asking as a friend to BT Traf

[SoN!c]

BT Traf
Lynch Traf


Slapstick is getting me.

So i get it - you dont wanna BT Traf to see me right from D1.., but i'll say this: its gonna turn out to be Traf and i'll ridicule you all for not wanting to BT him. Humiliation galore on you all. Except Strike. SoN!c signing off, never to play another mafia game here.

[Votanic]

I'm fucked... going out as an external examiner tomorrow morning in order to cover for an ill coworker, so I'm out till after tomorrow.

Just making sure to BT Votanic

Never read such a non-committal post before. "Not pointing a finger".

Rag, you are all for being committal*, too bad you can't be correct as well.

*Committal but fickle. I love how you pulled out of your own randwagon (after the hammer) just so you could then point the finger at me for saying I would be willing to hammer Swang.

The Ragian Method: Y did X and is therefore scum.
Where X is anything that anyone could possibly ever do in a Mafia/Cult game
and Y is whomever Rag has a beef with.

Y me?

[strike wolf]

Frankly, I agree with Ragian here. The only consensus you come to in that post is that we should BT Charle, someone we can be fairly confident isn't the recruiter. You also pull a "Well i would have voted ____ but also I thought the case was pretty weak" stunt which is a classic scum tell.

The only reason I'm not switching my BT vote yet is that the way Traf came into agreement with Charle on what looks like a pretty weak excuse is pretty suspicious to me in and of itself.

[Charle]

Guys, I think we are going off the track. We need to find the Thing. I am Mac and not the Thing, whether I am converted or not is irrelevant at this stage and not going to help us at all. I only mentioned that because I expected to be converted but did not receive any mail from DDS. We should not waste votes, but rather try and find the Thing.

I must say the fact that Strike now want to waste a BT on me sounds like he is trying to move the focus somewhere else?

[degaston]

I must say the fact that Strike now want to waste a BT on me sounds like he is trying to move the focus somewhere else?

Strike was not wanting to BT you, that was Votanic. Strike was criticizing Votanic for that.

[TrafalgarLaw01]

We should not BT Charle. He proved he is not the recruiter even if he is converted now does not matter.

[Charle]

I must say the fact that Strike now want to waste a BT on me sounds like he is trying to move the focus somewhere else?

Strike was not wanting to BT you, that was Votanic. Strike was criticizing Votanic for that.

Oh ok, sorry Strike!

[degaston]

I guess BT can be the best for me at this time. But will analyse further later.

If Charle is saying the truth (And I think he is). Then we are in a great position - Go on BT me. then we have 2 in 3 to get the Thing

Why would you want us to BT you?
If you are town, then it's a waste of a BT.

[TrafalgarLaw01]

I guess BT can be the best for me at this time. But will analyse further later.

If Charle is saying the truth (And I think he is). Then we are in a great position - Go on BT me. then we have 2 in 3 to get the Thing

Why would you want us to BT you?
If you are town, then it's a waste of a BT.

Simple there is 4 candidates to be the Thing - Me, Sonic, Strike and Vot

I am not trusted for whatever reason and also hammering swang (this clearly a mistake on my part). If I am not BTed I'm very likely to be lynched. Being town I know lynching a town its not good. If I am the most likely to be lynched I rather be BT so we have the chance to get the thing and with Charle power as he claims not being converted (I believe him) its 2 in 3 to get the Thing

[TrafalgarLaw01]

Also I mentioned yesterday BTs have many ways to be used. Not always looking for a positive BT is the best. for instance if we were in the 4v3 scenario we would want a negative BT. Now this is a different case so we could consider what is best if a negative or positive BT

[Votanic]

Frankly, I agree with Ragian here. The only consensus you come to in that post is that we should BT Charle, someone we can be fairly confident isn't the recruiter. You also pull a "Well i would have voted ____ but also I thought the case was pretty weak" stunt which is a classic scum tell.

The only reason I'm not switching my BT vote yet is that the way Traf came into agreement with Charle on what looks like a pretty weak excuse is pretty suspicious to me in and of itself.

I'm confused? How does admitting that an unproven vote is both a risk but also a necessity make me scummy?
Especially since my hesitancy was proven wise. Yesterday's lynch was a loss for town.

Again, not pointing a finger at anyone randomly... but waiting longer was wise since we had not heard from Swang.
Also I was curious to see who else was willing to put up a lynch vote...

Make no mistake about it. the Swang lynch was another randwagon for town. Only scum knew for sure...
These were the 5 who voted: Rag, Sonic, EW, Dega, Traf. One was town, One was scum, Dega is can't be the recruiter...
So that leaves Sonic and Traf... I guess Day 3 is going to be a lot like day 2...

[SoN!c]

Frankly, I agree with Ragian here. The only consensus you come to in that post is that we should BT Charle, someone we can be fairly confident isn't the recruiter. You also pull a "Well i would have voted ____ but also I thought the case was pretty weak" stunt which is a classic scum tell.

The only reason I'm not switching my BT vote yet is that the way Traf came into agreement with Charle on what looks like a pretty weak excuse is pretty suspicious to me in and of itself.

I'm confused? How does admitting that an unproven vote is both a risk but also a necessity make me scummy?
Especially since my hesitancy was proven wise. Yesterday's lynch was a loss for town.

Again, not pointing a finger at anyone randomly... but waiting longer was wise since we had not heard from Swang.
Also I was curious to see who else was willing to put up a lynch vote...

Make no mistake about it. the Swang lynch was another randwagon for town. Only scum knew for sure...
These were the 5 who voted: Rag, Sonic, EW, Dega, Traf. One was town, One was scum, Dega is can't be the recruiter...
So that leaves Sonic and Traf... I guess Day 3 is going to be a lot like day 2...

Votanic, me and Deg were following Ragian all day.

EW voted just after my post (the one i made just before end D2 pointing at him being the recruit (EW ignored it and voted to distract rest of town), Traf "panic" voted to hammer Swang.

Swang (back up vig) was voting Traf btw..

The game is played, Traf is the Thing, EW and Charle the recruits.

[Votanic]

Votanic, me and Deg were following Ragian all day.

EW voted just after my post (the one i made just before end D2 pointing at him being the recruit (EW ignored it and voted to distract rest of town), Traf "panic" voted to hammer Swang.

Swang (back up vig) was voting Traf btw..

The game is played, Traf is the Thing, EW and Charle the recruits.

Fair is fair, you build a consistent argument here.
I've never said Traf was town myself, only that the evidence was weak.

[Ragian]

@Sonic, let's say we BT Traf and he comes up town. What do we do, then?