Caribbean Islands [Quenched]

DiM · Post by **DiM** » Fri May 11, 2007 4:20 pm

*i think spanish is worth 6
*remove turks<->holquin connection
*leeward is worth5
*overall i think the map has way too connections. there are plenty of borders.

but i'm not an expert in gameplay so feel free to ignore what i said. if you want good gameplay tips ask samus to take a look at the map.

abut the graphics

*make the valencia maracaibo connection more visible
*same for aruba to caracas
*the skull is disturbing. there something about it that i don't like. maybe try some different skulls.
*the legend has no logical order. please start from top left corner and proceed to the left. like reading a book.

edbeard · Post by **edbeard** » Fri May 11, 2007 6:54 pm

DiM wrote:*i think spanish is worth 6
*remove turks<->holquin connection
*leeward is worth5
*overall i think the map has way too connections. there are plenty of borders.

but i'm not an expert in gameplay so feel free to ignore what i said. if you want good gameplay tips ask samus to take a look at the map.

abut the graphics

*make the valencia maracaibo connection more visible
*same for aruba to caracas
*the skull is disturbing. there something about it that i don't like. maybe try some different skulls.
*the legend has no logical order. please start from top left corner and proceed to the left. like reading a book.

I know I need to remove one of the water routes in that bahamas, espanola, cuba area. I think the one you mentioned is the best choice.

I think the number of borders is key to the gameplay of the map. It's not like there's tons of them. I think you're overstating how many there are actually. The borders I have now are integral to moving around the map. With lots of fairly small continents, a key way to win as with any map is preventing these bonuses. As for the bonuses themselves I think they are good, but if anyone else posts in the thread......we'll see what other people think.

I'm assuming the hard to see borders are on the small map. I had increased the colour on them in an older version but forgot to do it here.

The skull is supposed to be disturbing. It's a dead person's head. This is war after all.

You're right about the legend and I had changed that already just not posted.

mibi · Post by **mibi** » Fri May 11, 2007 7:52 pm

I think the top edge on the legend is too straight... perhaps you could make it jagged.. by just erasing some parts or something.. like tears in an old map.

The blue and purple text in the legend is a bit hard to read, particularly because of their dark non-contrast border. The blue is worst than purple, which I can make out to be Venezuela, but i dont know what the blue is.

otherwise it looks good.

AndyDufresne · Post by **AndyDufresne** » Fri May 11, 2007 9:07 pm

I like the general look of the map, nice and bright. It's got a wonderful feel to it visually I think.

That said, I don't think the current pictures of the boats and flags works with the map. You've got two ideas fighting there. Realistic looking boats and flags, and the rest of the map is quite visually different. I'd look for more of a 'clipart-esque' image of a boat, or create one that is visually similar for the map, and perhaps create your own flags, so they don't clash.

--Andy

edbeard · Post by **edbeard** » Sat May 12, 2007 6:25 pm

new flags. new ships.

legend now jagged/torn

johloh · Post by **johloh** » Sat May 12, 2007 6:29 pm

is there a reason youre calling the blue bonus 'espanola'? Ive heard that island called 'hispaniola' but not espanola.

edbeard · Post by **edbeard** » Sat May 12, 2007 6:32 pm

johloh wrote:is there a reason youre calling the blue bonus 'espanola'? Ive heard that island called 'hispaniola' but not espanola.

Española is the spanish name for Hispaniola

AndyDufresne · Post by **AndyDufresne** » Sat May 12, 2007 9:05 pm

Well lets see...

I'll make a few quick visual comments. The new boats and flags look ten-hundred times more appropriate for the map now, don't you think? Maybe consider continent unique ships (I.E. British ships don't look like those of the Spanish).

The skull and crossbones doesn't seem to quite have the same feel as the other images now. It looks almost a little too menacing. Perhaps try a different image, or create your own (if you created the boats and flags, kudos to you!)

Regarding the title, it looks alright, I'm not sure how you can improve it. There isn't a lot of room to work with. If you had more space, I'd consider making a parchment/treasure map background for the title, similar to the legend down below. And speaking of the legend background, I like the general idea of the scroll, but it may look a little too 'real' compared to the other visuals. But maybe not also!

And in the bonus legend, maybe consider a slightly different font than the one you have. It can be difficult to read sometimes. If you could find a font that was similar yet easier to read, I think that would be a plus. But if not, it really isn't that bad.

One last thing, consider making the attack routes a little more prominent, they are very pleasing to the eye, but they might blend in a little too much with the sea.

Anyways, lets take a closer look at gameplay:

I think I count 42 countries, correct?

Cuba

Bahamas

Espanola

Geeward

Mindward

Columbia

Venezuela

British

Spanish

Well lets see...a few maps have tossed around the idea of lots of little bonuses similar to this one, but this idea seems to work pretty well, though it'd be nice to see a few variations in number of countries. Adding a continent with 7 countries, and one with 5 is something to consider. I'm not sure where you would do this, as I am not too familiar with the area and the regions that make up every area.

I like the general flow of the map, maybe consider adding a few more attack routes (these won't increase the number of borders for any continent):

Holquin // Turks

(Similar to the other triangle connection you have on the other side)

Holquin // Calicos

(If you choose to implement more attack routes, I'd choose only one of the additional Holquin routes)

Melchor de Navarrete // Maracaibo

(Unless you'd like the 'Colombia + Venezuela' continent (3 borders for bonus of 4) to be feasible)

La Vega // Melchor de Navarrete

(Increases movement from southern part of the map to the middle and top)

Robert Jenkins // La Vega

(If you moved the British boat closer to the island, otherwise it might just look weird

)

Good luck! You've got a nice start!

--Andy

edbeard · Post by **edbeard** » Sun May 13, 2007 5:52 pm

Changed the legend and it's font. Now there should be no mistakes as to the names. hehe.

Merged Columbia/Venezuela.

Trinidad and Tobago is considered part of Windward, so I changed that on the map.

Made water routes more prominent.

Removed skull in top right. I couldn't find anything suitable so it's blank for now.

Regarding adding more water routes. I'd like to see what other people think about it too. If I put back the Holquin/Turks connection, I think adding the Melchor to La Vega connection makes sense too. The only problem I think is blue might have too many connections

edit: no, the ships aren't mine. it is a very nice piece of clip art though.

KEYOGI · Post by **KEYOGI** » Mon May 14, 2007 6:52 pm

Does this new version look fun?

Yes
75% [ 40 ]
No
24% [ 13 ]

Total Votes : 53

johloh · Post by **johloh** » Mon May 14, 2007 7:50 pm

The new boats and flags look ten-hundred times more appropriate for the map now

ten-hundred times? i dunno if they look THAT good. but im liking them better.

:lol:

im digging the new style...the cartoony look is great. (boats, flags, legend background, and font)

some things to consider...
-the country textures dont really match the style...they look kinda dirty to me. especially espanola, all the white/gray just kinda looks pixely and not clean like the rest of the map.
-i dont think your compass rose matches the new style you got going...maybe look for a new one.
-the way the legend hits the bottom of the image doesnt look really finished, maybe a border? or a bottom of the paper? or something?

Epideme · Post by **Epideme** » Thu May 17, 2007 7:18 am

got to ask why there are more spanish ships than british given that the british had a much bigger fleet than the spanish and that spainish ships would be attacking from the same direction as the british ones

cairnswk · Post by **cairnswk** » Thu May 17, 2007 7:38 am

I too like the new style...one suggestion might be to curve the attack routes on the longer distance ones rather than have them all very straight...the island outlines are curved and it may simply sit better in the overall look of the map...give it a try and if you don't like it...OK.

edbeard · Post by **edbeard** » Thu May 17, 2007 2:46 pm

Johloh, I like how the continents look, but I did try and think of other ways to change them. I couldn't come up with anything remotely decent, so any specific suggestions are welcome, from anyone, are welcome. The only thing I really need to keep are the bright colours I already have.

I put a new compass and added lower border for the legend.

cairnswk, I tried the curved lines, but I like the uniform straight ones better.

Regarding Epideme's comments. This is a game so I can't match exactly real life. Due to the size of the water where the spanish ships are it makes more sense to have more ships there. Additionally, it wouldn't make sense to put British Ships in that water because during the War of Jenkins' Ear, which I already stated I based the names of the ships from, the Spanish were in mostly a defensive position. They received attacks in Colombia, Panama and Cuba. Notice this is where the Spanish ships are generally located.

The only changes I've made are the compass and the border on the legend. I won't post up a new version, because I'd like to have an alternate version with different textures for the land. The only problem, like I said before, is that I've gone through this and come up with nothing. So, unless I'm newly inspired or a good suggestion comes, I will leave the texture as is.

edbeard · Post by **edbeard** » Fri May 18, 2007 5:53 pm

compass changed and added border to the bottom of the legend.

didnt change any of the textures because I couldn't come up with anything that I liked. I personally like the textures I have now, so I'll wait and see if more people dislike them

edbeard · Post by **edbeard** » Sat May 19, 2007 3:15 pm

One idea that I think looks pretty good is no texture on the land at all. I think it fits the cartoony style. I imagine some people will think it is somewhat boring. Either way, what do you think

Also, how do people feel about the new compass and the legend border?

P.S. Yes, I realize a few of my borders are now messed up. If people like the no texture land then I'll fix them.

johloh · Post by **johloh** » Sat May 19, 2007 3:30 pm

lookin' good...

I like the compass and the new legend border. you did exactly what I was getting at...

I personally prefer the no textures. maybe you should throw up a poll? I was going to comment on the borders but you saw that.

I do agree with cairns, I would like to see more swooping curves on the attack routes...also you might consider switching them to a dashed or dotted line...i dunno.

also valencia text looks a little weird because its the only country with the name inside. maybe move the army circle under and the text up? im not sure, but it stands out to my eye.

possibly would the compass look better under your name? maybe not. just throwing out a suggestion.

edbeard · Post by **edbeard** » Sat May 19, 2007 10:55 pm

I personally prefer the uniform straight lines for routes, but I think other people like these better and it's not a big deal for me.

I redid all the borders to make them uniform, somehow they all got messed up. Now I won't have to deal with the damn Border Police.

I made an Executive Decision and decided no texture is the way to go since it fits the map as a whole

Johloh regarding moving the compass, it makes the bottom left look naked, and I think it fits well down there anyway. Regarding Valencia text, it's stuck where it is because that's the only place it fits without crossing any borders or moving it an absurd distance away.

johloh · Post by **johloh** » Sun May 20, 2007 9:28 am

i not exactly sure which water route version i like better...straight or curvy...

and yes, i am in fact a member of the border police.

edbeard · Post by **edbeard** » Sun May 20, 2007 8:14 pm

johloh wrote:i not exactly sure which water route version i like better...straight or curvy...

the more I look, the more I like the curved lines. It makes some of the shorter paths easier to detect which solves that problem in the smaller version.

DiM · Post by **DiM** » Sun May 20, 2007 8:17 pm

the curved lines are better but some of them are pixelated. you might want to take a look and blur them a bit.

edbeard · Post by **edbeard** » Sun May 20, 2007 8:22 pm

DiM wrote:the curved lines are better but some of them are pixelated. you might want to take a look and blur them a bit.

Would you mind giving a specific example of where you see this? Because they look the same to me. thanks

DiM · Post by **DiM** » Sun May 20, 2007 8:25 pm

edbeard wrote:
DiM wrote:the curved lines are better but some of them are pixelated. you might want to take a look and blur them a bit.

Would you mind giving a specific example of where you see this? Because they look the same to me. thanks

these are the most pixelated:

calicos <-> george anson
george anson <-> robert jenkins
sebastian de eslava <-> melchor de navarette
melchor de navarette <-> blas de lezo
blas de lezo <-> martinique

edbeard · Post by **edbeard** » Sun May 20, 2007 10:19 pm

I think that does it

DiM · Post by **DiM** » Sun May 20, 2007 10:23 pm

much better.