[Abandoned] Xiangqi

[DearCyrus]

Lol. I wish I had friends...

[dolomite13]

I worry a little about loose the king and loose the game. I know this is a traditional way of ending a game like chess. However in chess you don't have a random event that can remove all forces from a random territory like Conquer Club's Nukes. Would it be better to say that you loose if you do not hold the General or either Adviser, or maybe that you need to hold at least one space of the castle. That way you can reclaim the General. Other than that lose condition the General seems a bit worthless except for his +1 auto deploy, maybe adding a provision that soldiers do not get their bonus unless you hold the general would make it seem more like the lose condition urgency.

Anyway that's my 13 cents worth.

=D13=

p.s. I rarely if ever play 1v1 games but this map makes me want to try it.

[koontz1973]

I get the idea about the general. I kept it in from the original game and have tried to keep as much from that as needed. I like the idea of lose the general and lose the bonuses but that would not work with the auto deploys, only the normal bonuses. I will see if I can find the wording to say that though as it makes sense. Also, with the losing condition, I will make it so you need to hold the general or an advisor. That means 3 regions need to be nuked or removed.

EDIT: Having tried to work these ideas into the map, I am not sure how to get them to work and keep the original idea of trying to stay as faithful as possible. I understand the nukes problem but this is not a problem as it is played for many maps with losing conditions. To change the idea to accommodate a single game play feature is not going to happen, and double so as nukes is not that common a setting. Even the idea of losing the bonuses seems a little doubtful now as you are losing a lot of what little you get.

Small update then. Text and Rank/File letters/numbers.

[Shannon Apple]

Gorgeous map. I love this new version.

I'm going to have to agree. No map out there is really meant to be played on every single setting. You kinda have to decide which settings work best for each map. I wouldn't sacrifice the gameplay for the sake of one setting that ideally shouldn't be used on this particular map. That's just me.

[generalhead]

The directions might be easier to read if you start from the middle and work your way out.
You start with general then advisors, but then you jump to chariots.
It might be better to go in order so people can follow the pieces from the middle out.
General
advisors
Elephant
Horse
Chariot
Cannon
soldier

I don't understand the red and blue box with the red arrows, it says castle pieces can move diagonally inside of the castle.
It is suppose to read all pieces can move diagonally inside of the castle?
If that is the case I might combine box 1 and 2 to say regular pieces can move north south east and west, can move diagonally inside of the castle
and can attack using their special moves or something to that effect.

I would eliminate the boxes showing the horse and elephant movement. Players should be able to get that from the instructions.

For the game play if a player tries to get all the bonus he can he can essentially get 15 to deploy before he crosses the river. Do you think that is the way most players would go. It would be neat to have it pretty even whether you go for all of the deploy or get a couple of the bonus pieces and try to cross the river. I just don't know if every game will be go for all of the pieces first or gain some of the pieces and then cross.
Some one would have to look at the bonus structure to see if those two are even which I am not very good at.

What brought that up is I originally thought +3 for the Chariots might be high, but then I realized the Cannons (which are getting a +1 auto deploy) were going to be bombarding the soldier pieces so then I realized a high deploy would probably be needed.

Can solder pieces attack north. It sounds they they can only attack south across the river, but then the instructions
below them say all pieces can attack north, south, east and west. This confused me.

When you hold a horse are all of your territories able to attack in a Y shape. Because essentially you are going to have territories where the playing pieces aren't. The pieces won't move so can you only attack In a Y when you are on on horse or when you own the horse all of your pieces can in a Y.
Same with the elephant.

[generalhead]

[quote="koontz1973"]I get the idea about the general. I kept it in from the original game and have tried to keep as much from that as needed. I like the idea of lose the general and lose the bonuses but that would not work with the auto deploys, only the normal bonuses. I will see if I can find the wording to say that though as it makes sense. Also, with the losing condition, I will make it so you need to hold the general or an advisor. That means 3 regions need to be nuked or removed.

EDIT: Having tried to work these ideas into the map, I am not sure how to get them to work and keep the original idea of trying to stay as faithful as possible. I understand the nukes problem but this is not a problem as it is played for many maps with losing conditions. To change the idea to accommodate a single game play feature is not going to happen, and double so as nukes is not that common a setting. Even the idea of losing the bonuses seems a little doubtful now as you are losing a lot of what little you get.

Is it possible to negate a region from being nuked? Or is nuke generic where it covers all regions.
It might not be too bad loose the general and both advisors and loose the game because in a normal game you would have a couple of pieces
protecting the king, usually the king wouldn't be standing alone. You could always do lose the king and one advisor loose the game. I understand
that this takes away from the authenticity of the game which I don't like. What are the chances of some one playing nuke and pull the general region, it has to be pretty low. That wouldn't work though if you start on the general you already wouldn't hold the advisors. I vote keep it as it is.

[koontz1973]

Gorgeous map. I love this new version.

Thanks. Glad you like it and one day, I might just beat you on it.

The directions might be easier to read if you start from the middle and work your way out.
You start with general then advisors, but then you jump to chariots.
It might be better to go in order so people can follow the pieces from the middle out.
General
advisors
Elephant
Horse
Chariot
Cannon
soldier

Great point, I was working on what I thought was the most valuable pieces but this would clear it up. Think of it as a done deal.

I don't understand the red and blue box with the red arrows, it says castle pieces can move diagonally inside of the castle.
It is suppose to read all pieces can move diagonally inside of the castle?
If that is the case I might combine box 1 and 2 to say regular pieces can move north south east and west, can move diagonally inside of the castle
and can attack using their special moves or something to that effect.

I need something to show the castle as it is the only areas that you can move diagonally before you hold the horse. Some players may think it is ok strategy to try and head over fast and win with shock and awe tactics or not even get a horse on there side of the river. I see no difference in adding the "all" to the wording but will add it in. As for the special moves, players may miss out on a piece so while others can move in the Y shape or diagonally, they need to be expressed on the map as well as normal attack lines.

I would eliminate the boxes showing the horse and elephant movement. Players should be able to get that from the instructions.

As above, fills space and not everyone can read. They will stay. When we get the stamp, if iancanton says they can go, I will remove them.

For the game play if a player tries to get all the bonus he can he can essentially get 15 to deploy before he crosses the river. Do you think that is the way most players would go. It would be neat to have it pretty even whether you go for all of the deploy or get a couple of the bonus pieces and try to cross the river. I just don't know if every game will be go for all of the pieces first or gain some of the pieces and then cross.
Some one would have to look at the bonus structure to see if those two are even which I am not very good at.

What players will do is not something I can guess on. I would think of the map being played as a quick dash over in flat, grab as many bonuses in esc and no spoils but every player will play to there own strengths. How would you play this? and how would you react if you went for the bonuses and I dashed over? Also, remember, with the chariots, I can attack a huge line across the river hitting your bonuses and giving me a 3 line attack to the general.

What brought that up is I originally thought +3 for the Chariots might be high, but then I realized the Cannons (which are getting a +1 auto deploy) were going to be bombarding the soldier pieces so then I realized a high deploy would probably be needed.

Chariots get the high deploy or no one would go for them. Why head to the corner when you need to go across.

Can solder pieces attack north. It sounds they they can only attack south across the river, but then the instructions
below them say all pieces can attack north, south, east and west. This confused me.

Soldiers can only attack towards the river. Both sides have soldiers so this is north and south depending on the side you play. Will try to clear this up.

When you hold a horse are all of your territories able to attack in a Y shape. Because essentially you are going to have territories where the playing pieces aren't. The pieces won't move so can you only attack In a Y when you are on on horse or when you own the horse all of your pieces can in a Y.
Same with the elephant.

The game only allows the pieces to move like this. Like my knights map, I need to take some liberties with this or it will not work. I said on the players side of the river so all attacks will be able, not just from the piece itself.

Is it possible to negate a region from being nuked? Or is nuke generic where it covers all regions.

Covers all regions. A lot of maps have a losing condition and you can get nuked out of the game. But with 180 regions, the chances of getting the right card are very slim. In a game where both players keep all cards till they have 5 cards, you have a 5% chance of a player getting the right card. So for every 100 nuke games, 5 players might be lucky enough to get the correct card depending on how long the game goes.

[generalhead]

The one thing that was throwing me off is >>castle. all pieces move diagonally inside of the castle.<< I was missing the period. It could also just say >>All pieces move diagonally inside of the castle.<<. That was just me not seeing the period.

All else is cleared up .

I love the game play, can't wait to try it.

[koontz1973]

The one thing that was throwing me off is >>castle. all pieces move diagonally inside of the castle.<< I was missing the period. It could also just say >>All pieces move diagonally inside of the castle.<<. That was just me not seeing the period.

All else is cleared up .

I love the game play, can't wait to try it.

Well, lets see how this works.
All things agreed on now added or changed.
[bigimg]http://imageshack.us/a/img42/2034/b5lz.jpg[/bigimg]

[generalhead]

The legend is a lot easier to follow.
Last thing I will pick on you about today.
The color of the wording of the legend is a little hard on the eyes (this is only my opinion). I don't know if it would help to have it a little more orange (like the color of the title) or give it a outer glow.

[koontz1973]

The legend is a lot easier to follow.
Last thing I will pick on you about today.
The color of the wording of the legend is a little hard on the eyes (this is only my opinion). I don't know if it would help to have it a little more orange (like the color of the title) or give it a outer glow.

Tried a hard glow for a change. Will look into getting it lighter and easier to read.

[koontz1973]

How is the text now?
[bigimg]http://imageshack.us/a/img191/3615/ssa0.jpg[/bigimg]

[betiko]

looks pretty interesting. is that an actual chess-like chinese game or you made up most of the concept?

[koontz1973]

looks pretty interesting. is that an actual chess-like chinese game or you made up most of the concept?

It is based on Chinese chess. All of the pieces are called the western names as I cannot pronounce the Chinese ones.

[DearCyrus]

How is the text now?

The contrast from the shadow has made the font much easier to follow. Good work!

[generalhead]

How is the text now?

The contrast from the shadow has made the font much easier to follow. Good work!

+1

[koontz1973]

How is the text now?

The contrast from the shadow has made the font much easier to follow. Good work!

+1

Thanks guys.

[dolomite13]

I am sorry I didn't get around to giving my 13 cents worth on this till now but here goes nothing.

Board Layout: I assume that you will have troops on every board piece as well as the places where lines cross. Which ways do the non existent pieces attack? is it N,S,E,W one space? If I hole the Elephant do they attack diagonal as well? I also think the numbers down the side should go up to 10 going up the side or start with 0 and go to 9 for reference.

General: Looks like the general can attack the two advisers (which I assume will start neutral) and can attack forward and diagonal. So E1 could attack D2, E2, F2 based on the note that all castle pieces can move diagonally. But the diagonal lines in the castle area do not represent this.

Advisers: Appear to be a +1 deployable bonus and a trigger to allow you to assault outside your castle area.

Elephants: Nice deployable bonus at +2 each and seems to grant all pieces on your side of the river diagonal attacks. Does this effect the Chariots (more about this when I get to the chariots). Also the elephants seem to be a conditional that that opens up Cannon bombardments, and allows you to assault across the river from the 5/6 row provided you have 2 soldiers. A bit complicated but understandable.

Horse: I think the bonus is a bit weak considering each elephant is +2 each and this is +2 if you hold both (maybe +5 for both). I assume this grants all locations on your side of the river this forward Y shaped attack. When you unlock across the river assaults will this grant the ability for 4 or 5 row to move that way across the river? or does this just grant things in the 1,2,3 rows this movement?

Chariots: Good bonus here. Looks like they can assault straight down their lines, A1 assaulting all the way up the board or across toward the other Chariot? and when you have Elephants it appears they get diagonal so A1 could assault diagonally to A5?

Cannons: I like the +1 autodeploy and the bombardments here. Looks like they get the bombardment regardless of how many soldiers you have so that's nice as well. Do you need to hold the Elephants to be allowed to bombard, you use the term attacks so its a bit confusing.

Soldiers: I like the bonus and tying it to spaces across the river will keep the bonus low till you cross. Once you get 3 locations you may have 5 soldiers and that would be +5 instantly.

I would love to see more consistent wording, move vs assault vs attack vs bombard and I would love to know how this looks with 88's or 888's.

I would also consider a +1/3 on your own side of the map which at 45 territories would grant a max of 15 troops as you move to control your side of the map as well. And possibly a bonus for holding your entire castle. I know these aren't really reminiscent of anything in the actual Chinese Chess game but would utilize the CC bonuses.

Great job thus far this has great potential as a fun and balanced 1v1 map.

=D13=

[Armandolas]

at a quick glance i would fade the plant just a bit more

[koontz1973]

@dolomite, working through your list of things.
@Armandolas, can do.

[DearCyrus]

Only one thing is standing out to me visually... The text "the river" seems a little out of place on the board. I get that the font looks liquid, but right now it looks as if it is on top of the board.
As far as game play, The basics seem understandable. I don't know the original game but it seems like you put a lot of thought into translating it into a CC map.

[generalhead]

Only one thing is standing out to me visually... The text "the river" seems a little out of place on the board. I get that the font looks liquid, but right now it looks as if it is on top of the board.
As far as game play, The basics seem understandable. I don't know the original game but it seems like you put a lot of thought into translating it into a CC map.

I think without the word river the board would be too bland. The board has already had so much stripped off of it. Koontz could remove it one time and post the map without it to see what it would look like. I vote keep it for now but wouldn't mind if it was posted once without it.

[koontz1973]

I am sorry I didn't get around to giving my 13 cents worth on this till now but here goes nothing.

Board Layout: I assume that you will have troops on every board piece as well as the places where lines cross. Which ways do the non existent pieces attack? is it N,S,E,W one space? If I hole the Elephant do they attack diagonal as well? I also think the numbers down the side should go up to 10 going up the side or start with 0 and go to 9 for reference.

General: Looks like the general can attack the two advisers (which I assume will start neutral) and can attack forward and diagonal. So E1 could attack D2, E2, F2 based on the note that all castle pieces can move diagonally. But the diagonal lines in the castle area do not represent this.

Advisers: Appear to be a +1 deployable bonus and a trigger to allow you to assault outside your castle area.

Elephants: Nice deployable bonus at +2 each and seems to grant all pieces on your side of the river diagonal attacks. Does this effect the Chariots (more about this when I get to the chariots). Also the elephants seem to be a conditional that that opens up Cannon bombardments, and allows you to assault across the river from the 5/6 row provided you have 2 soldiers. A bit complicated but understandable.

Horse: I think the bonus is a bit weak considering each elephant is +2 each and this is +2 if you hold both (maybe +5 for both). I assume this grants all locations on your side of the river this forward Y shaped attack. When you unlock across the river assaults will this grant the ability for 4 or 5 row to move that way across the river? or does this just grant things in the 1,2,3 rows this movement?

Chariots: Good bonus here. Looks like they can assault straight down their lines, A1 assaulting all the way up the board or across toward the other Chariot? and when you have Elephants it appears they get diagonal so A1 could assault diagonally to A5?

Cannons: I like the +1 autodeploy and the bombardments here. Looks like they get the bombardment regardless of how many soldiers you have so that's nice as well. Do you need to hold the Elephants to be allowed to bombard, you use the term attacks so its a bit confusing.

Soldiers: I like the bonus and tying it to spaces across the river will keep the bonus low till you cross. Once you get 3 locations you may have 5 soldiers and that would be +5 instantly.

I would love to see more consistent wording, move vs assault vs attack vs bombard and I would love to know how this looks with 88's or 888's.

I would also consider a +1/3 on your own side of the map which at 45 territories would grant a max of 15 troops as you move to control your side of the map as well. And possibly a bonus for holding your entire castle. I know these aren't really reminiscent of anything in the actual Chinese Chess game but would utilize the CC bonuses.

Great job thus far this has great potential as a fun and balanced 1v1 map.

=D13=

Think I got everything you wanted.

at a quick glance i would fade the plant just a bit more

Done for 20%

Only one thing is standing out to me visually... The text "the river" seems a little out of place on the board. I get that the font looks liquid, but right now it looks as if it is on top of the board.
As far as game play, The basics seem understandable. I don't know the original game but it seems like you put a lot of thought into translating it into a CC map.

I think without the word river the board would be too bland. The board has already had so much stripped off of it. Koontz could remove it one time and post the map without it to see what it would look like. I vote keep it for now but wouldn't mind if it was posted once without it.

Cyrus is right. It was because the name was running over the attack lines. Moved the wording to between them. Not really liking this so will play with it some more later on.

Here is the next version. Only the text has really changed. Added the neutrals and starting positions map underneath.
[bigimg]http://imageshack.us/a/img811/5056/3dhr.jpg[/bigimg]
[bigimg]http://imageshack.us/a/img34/7349/y66g.jpg[/bigimg]

[generalhead]

were you not using the highlights for the castles?
I thought it looked pretty good with the highlights.

[koontz1973]

were you not using the highlights for the castles?
I thought it looked pretty good with the highlights.

Just forgot to turn the layer back on when doing the last lot of adjustments.
[bigimg]http://imageshack.us/a/img822/7997/637h.jpg[/bigimg]