The Fight for Alexander's Empire [Quenched]

Mr. K · Post by **Mr. K** » Mon Jun 12, 2006 1:17 pm

I am probably going to kill myself right about now. I had a huge response... and I got logged out. So more than halfway through re-writing it, I hit the backspace button, but apparently I wasn't in the textbox and I got taken back to the forum. I clicked forward and everything was gone again.... Dear lord, I know I should be more careful but i've had a lot of years forumming and i've never been at a forum that logs you out.............

Here we go again.....3rd times a charm.

The general tone of the last two tries was that some of these complaints are getting repetitive without paying respect to the responses I've given. A lot of them are just a matter of preference. A lot of them I've already responded to. If I have to address every issue that is brought up, people should have the courtesy to address what I have already said about it before bringing up the issue over again.

As far as the waters go, it really is a matter of preference. I know its not as big of a deal as its being made out to be. The places in the Aegean that are touching foreign territories are because not only would it be incredibly difficult for me to give them their own waters, but it would be illogical. Those small places are entirely surrounded by the empire. It wouldn't be logical for them to be able to control the tiny straights and coasts around them when such a massive empire has completely engulfed them.
It really is a matter of preference. Basically, its either looking a little goofy (to some people, personally I think it looks fine) vs. it being illogical (and inaccurate at that). I'm going to pick the second option, its the option I like better, I've given my reasons, I've responded to the reasons against it, and I know its not really a big enough issue that I need to address it over and over again.

As far as the bonuses go, I've responded to this a number of times. You can't tell me that it can only be a maximum of 6. It is a 9 and 9 continent, which can be expanded to 11 and 5. Look at the classic map, Asia is a 12 and 5 and it has a bonus of 7. So at the surface, it should be a 7, not a 5. But it goes a lot further than that, as I've already explained. First off, 9 and 9 is going to be ridiculously hard to control. 11 and 5 makes it a lot easier, but like I've said, it is going to be a really difficult battle if someone from Antigonus is trying to rip away the Aegean AND the Mediterranean from whoever owns Ptolomy and Kassander. If you're going to complain about something I've already addressed, please don't just complain without even saying anything about what I've already said.

I tried a few different Alexander horse statues, and my favorite was the statue of this one. I didn't like any of the other ones. I also looked through many different coins. If I use one coin, its probably going to be the gold one.

Also, I already explained the sun in Macedonia when I first posted it. I also explained the mountains.

*makes sure to copy post before hitting submit*

Mr. K · Post by **Mr. K** » Tue Jun 13, 2006 6:42 pm

Okay, well if theres nothing else. I believe i've addressed every concern (major and minor).

No one seemed to really agree on what they liked for the art, so I just went with what I liked best.

Mr. K · Post by **Mr. K** » Tue Jun 13, 2006 6:44 pm

And if anyones still having trouble reading Kassander, heres a brighter version..

AndyDufresne · Post by **AndyDufresne** » Tue Jun 13, 2006 8:23 pm

Final Forge

---The Fight for Alexander's Empire Map has reached the ‘Final Forge’ Stage. I've revived this thread from the pits of the Foundry furnace and have examined the contents. Nearly every major concern has been addressed. If there are any other current concerns, please make your voice heard. There will be two days for you to post any objections; if no one has posted any protest after two days the map will be deemed finished with the 'Foundry Brand' of approval and will be submitted for live play. If after two days there is still discussion going on it may continue until said discussion has reached the conclusion that the map has reached its final and polished version.

Post questions and concerns if any.

--Andy

AndyDufresne · Post by **AndyDufresne** » Tue Jun 13, 2006 8:29 pm

And to start things off...

---The lighter version is horrendous, I'd stay away from it. I think Kassander is easily read, but you could always look into slightly more readable tones for the legend, while staying true to the continental color.

---Have you considered using different sized mountains, so you don't get the repeated ice cream cone shape? I think it would help add uniqueness to the mountains.

---Also, 'Caria' on the map looks more like 'Cana'.

---And I'm afraid the Makedonian sun might be confusing, but simply in the way more so. That area is heavily congested, and it is really an uneeded addition.

---And I'm concerned about the XML of the map. Can you post an image of where the numbers are going to be, so we can see if Kassander is tightly packed? Also to see how the colors do without the army shadows behind them.

--Andy

rocksolid · Post by **rocksolid** » Tue Jun 13, 2006 8:53 pm

Boo army shadows. Join the anti-army shadow revolution.

AndyDufresne · Post by **AndyDufresne** » Tue Jun 13, 2006 8:55 pm

I don't mind them not being there, I just want to make sure the number values are easily read.

--Andy

reverend_kyle · Post by **reverend_kyle** » Tue Jun 13, 2006 9:09 pm

AndyDufresne wrote::P I don't mind them not being there, I just want to make sure the number values are easily read.

--Andy

i agree.

Marvaddin · Post by **Marvaddin** » Wed Jun 14, 2006 12:07 am

Why should Antigonus receive the double of armies of the second higher bonus? I think its pretty ridiculous: 2, 2, 3, 3, 3, 4, >>>>>>>>> 8! In fact, we know its not a continent for the start. A good bonus will increase the fight, but no need to be that high. Did you see a way to get 17 armies defending 2 countries? If you do it by the opposing way, you will get a bonus of 11 only. I still think its not ok, but you of course can mantain it if you want.

And I didnt forget the seas. I was not counting them because they dont belong to any continents.

Mr. K · Post by **Mr. K** » Wed Jun 14, 2006 1:12 am

I'll get started on the XML and post a picture when I can.

How does everyone else feel about the sun. I realize its unneccessary, but personally I think it looks cool, and I don't really think it'll be in the way. But i'm not married to it if you all disagree.

AndyDufresne · Post by **AndyDufresne** » Wed Jun 14, 2006 1:15 am

I like the idea about it, but it might just be taking up much needed space. Also, have you looked into any other famous symbols for other areas? Perhaps like small pyramids for Egypt, etc?

--Andy

rocksolid · Post by **rocksolid** » Wed Jun 14, 2006 11:43 am

Might be difficult to differentiate pyramids from mountains.

AndyDufresne · Post by **AndyDufresne** » Wed Jun 14, 2006 1:31 pm

True, but as it stands, if he goes the route of keeping a symbol, I think having more than one should be looked into. Similar to all or nothing.

--Andy

rocksolid · Post by **rocksolid** » Wed Jun 14, 2006 1:35 pm

...though with that would bring the danger that players might assume the special sign for each region brings some gameplay significance to the territory in which it is found, especially if they're coming from WaW where all the maps have capital territories of each continent...or if they've associated such a graphic with a +1 because of city hall on the [cough] Montreal map...

AndyDufresne · Post by **AndyDufresne** » Wed Jun 14, 2006 1:36 pm

Hehe, maybe no symbols at all then would simply be the best route.

--Andy

rocksolid · Post by **rocksolid** » Wed Jun 14, 2006 1:44 pm

That might be true...but it would feel a little weird to have an Alexander-related map with no allusion to Makedonia...or to Babylon, for that matter...or the Khybar pass...or the Gordian knot...though if it's after his death and not about his life, maybe not so weird. If I were K, I'd be aching to keep the sun on this map somehow.

AndyDufresne · Post by **AndyDufresne** » Wed Jun 14, 2006 1:46 pm

Hm I like the idea of the sun, perhaps we can move it off the gameboard and make it an aesthetic feature, perhaps instead of the coin or in another spot.

--Andy

Mr. K · Post by **Mr. K** » Wed Jun 14, 2006 5:06 pm

I thought of moving it into the compass/coin's place but it didn't really look to good. As rocksolid said, i'm sort of itching to hold onto it. I like the suggestion of putting more on though. Other than pyramids, though, I can't really think of anything. I'm open to suggestions.

qeee1 · Post by **qeee1** » Wed Jun 14, 2006 5:27 pm

I like the sun where it is. But then I guess I haven't seen it with numbers on it yet.

EDIT: If you moved (the word) athens slightly over you'd probably have an easier time fitting in numbers.

Anyway, just called in when I saw it was final forging... and it looks good. Between this and Chariots and maybe one or two more we could have a nice go of classical themed maps running through Conquer Club.

Jota · Post by **Jota** » Wed Jun 14, 2006 5:34 pm

Not to mention Ancient Greece.

qeee1 · Post by **qeee1** » Wed Jun 14, 2006 5:39 pm

*slaps self on head*

(Duhr), yeah Ancient Greece was one of the maps that caused me to make that comment but then I somehow forgot about it by the time I got it typed out.

Mr. K · Post by **Mr. K** » Wed Jun 14, 2006 9:06 pm

So I wrote up the XML document, tested it, and got an error saying no continents and no countries found. So I kept tweaking it hoping to fix the code and it kept giving me the same error. Right before pulling my hair out, I decided to test the classic map's XML and it gave me the same error...

So yea, somethings wrong with the XML tester at the moment, so i'll get you guys a picture some other time.

Jota · Post by **Jota** » Wed Jun 14, 2006 10:02 pm

Hmm, that's odd. I just tested Classic.xml and got "Summary: 0 warnings and 0 errors detected".

Mr. K · Post by **Mr. K** » Thu Jun 15, 2006 4:45 pm

The blue territories are a bit difficult to see on Kassander, so i'll have to do something to fix that. Other than that, I just have to finely tune my XML and everthing else is fine. Crowding isn't an issue, and no other colors provide any difficulty reading anywhere.

AndyDufresne · Post by **AndyDufresne** » Thu Jun 15, 2006 4:57 pm

Sounds like it's coming along. Post the army value picture when you've time.

--Andy