Conquer 4: Back in Development [Abandoned Again?]

WidowMakers · Post by **WidowMakers** » Sat Mar 03, 2007 10:26 am

I can't seem to find the XML. Is it posted? I would like to look at it.

Wisse · Post by **Wisse** » Sat Mar 03, 2007 10:30 am

the higest bonus you can get is 28 and than there are 2 countrys left

yeti_c · Post by **yeti_c** » Sat Mar 03, 2007 10:38 am

WidowMakers wrote:I can't seem to find the XML. Is it posted? I would like to look at it.

Send me a PM with your email address and I'll mail it to you...

C.

KEYOGI · Post by **KEYOGI** » Sat Mar 03, 2007 3:43 pm

qwert wrote:Interesting? Mising 1% in vote pool, these second pool where these mising

qwert wrote:You dont want to put vote pool, to people give hes vote for support , but when i want to create map, then i must to do these, its not fair

You're well aware that this thread previously had a poll.

The results of the poll were roughly 60% in favour so I asked for Andy to remove it so I could put up a new poll with the next update.

EvilOtto · Post by **EvilOtto** » Sat Mar 03, 2007 8:25 pm

I like this idea and is really a new game style for CC. The most protected spaces are the corners, so I imagine people will run for those. Sure, some players might start with 4 in a row, or close to 4 in a row, but they'll have to defend all four of those to hold it. That'll be hard, so you'll want to start in a corner or on an edge.

So here's the thought: what if there were some dead spaces? Visuallize the board as if someone was in the middle of a Connect Four game and there were some red and black chips filling some slots (no armies where the are chips). This would create some additional protected corners and add a lot more variety. Maybe the chips could have the CC star on them?

Placement something like ('x's are chips):
0000000
000x000
000x000
000xx00
0xxxx00

It would also make the board more recognizable as "connect four" without actually saying it.

KEYOGI · Post by **KEYOGI** » Sat Mar 03, 2007 8:45 pm

Nice idea, but I like the fact that there are 42 spaces. If there's more support for your idea and less spaces on the board, I have no problems incorporating it. Might sort out some of the problems with the bonuses that some people seem to have. In my opinion the bonus system works well though and I think getting +20 for a 4x4 block is justified.

EvilOtto · Post by **EvilOtto** » Sat Mar 03, 2007 9:05 pm

KEYOGI wrote:Nice idea, but I like the fact that there are 42 spaces.

Then make it 7x7 with 7 chips...
6x8 with 6 chips...
just sayin'.

oaktown · Post by **oaktown** » Sat Mar 03, 2007 9:06 pm

i like the blank spaces idea - maybe the map would have to go up to 7x7, with seven blanks? Just a thought, which you are free to ignore.

I understand the scoring system and I think it works fine. My concern is how is the bonuses are going to read when I start my turn. Some examples might help people get it. For example, if I held six spaces in a row I assume it would look something like:

oaktown receives +2 for hold A1-A4
oaktown receives +2 for hold A2-A5
oaktown receives +2 for hold A3-A6
oaktown receives -2 for holding A1-A5
oaktown receives -2 for holding A2-A6

?

yeti_c · Post by **yeti_c** » Sun Mar 04, 2007 7:39 am

oaktown wrote:i like the blank spaces idea - maybe the map would have to go up to 7x7, with seven blanks? Just a thought, which you are free to ignore.

I understand the scoring system and I think it works fine. My concern is how is the bonuses are going to read when I start my turn. Some examples might help people get it. For example, if I held six spaces in a row I assume it would look something like:

oaktown receives +2 for hold A1-A4
oaktown receives +2 for hold A2-A5
oaktown receives +2 for hold A3-A6
oaktown receives -2 for holding A1-A5
oaktown receives -2 for holding A2-A6

?

That is correct... sadly this is the only way of working it - similar to World 2 & USAPocalypse.

C.

Nerrimus · Post by **Nerrimus** » Sun Mar 04, 2007 8:47 am

Hey, thought I'd say a little something.

In USApoc, if you hold three irradiated countries, the game log shows this :

2007-03-04 06:58:19 - xxxxx receives -3 armies for holding irradiated territory

There are three continent bonuses, but if you check the xml, the continent's name are exactly the same. So the log groups them together as one.

So instead of showing this :

2007-03-08 14:23:49 - xxxxx receives 2 armies for holding four in a row
2007-03-08 14:23:49 - xxxxx receives 2 armies for holding four in a row
2007-03-08 14:23:49 - xxxxx receives 2 armies for holding four in a row
2007-03-08 14:23:49 - xxxxx receives 2 armies for holding four in a row
2007-03-08 14:23:49 - xxxxx receives -2 armies for holding five in a row
2007-03-08 14:23:49 - xxxxx receives -2 armies for holding five in a row

As long as you name ALL bonuses as four-in-a-row (even those which are five-in-a-row, etc.) I think it would show

2007-03-08 14:23:49 - xxxxx receives 4 armies for holding four in a row.

My 2 cents. ( I'm broke now D: )

yeti_c · Post by **yeti_c** » Sun Mar 04, 2007 9:37 am

Nerrimus wrote:Hey, thought I'd say a little something.

In USApoc, if you hold three irradiated countries, the game log shows this :

2007-03-04 06:58:19 - xxxxx receives -3 armies for holding irradiated territory

There are three continent bonuses, but if you check the xml, the continent's name are exactly the same. So the log groups them together as one.

So instead of showing this :

2007-03-08 14:23:49 - xxxxx receives 2 armies for holding four in a row
2007-03-08 14:23:49 - xxxxx receives 2 armies for holding four in a row
2007-03-08 14:23:49 - xxxxx receives 2 armies for holding four in a row
2007-03-08 14:23:49 - xxxxx receives 2 armies for holding four in a row
2007-03-08 14:23:49 - xxxxx receives -2 armies for holding five in a row
2007-03-08 14:23:49 - xxxxx receives -2 armies for holding five in a row

As long as you name ALL bonuses as four-in-a-row (even those which are five-in-a-row, etc.) I think it would show

2007-03-08 14:23:49 - xxxxx receives 4 armies for holding four in a row.

My 2 cents. ( I'm broke now D: )

Interesting...

At the moment they are all named "Connect 4", "Connect 5" & "Connect 7"...

I will change them all to be the same - that way you only get 1 log per bonus set and a final answer to how many you got... (instead of +2+2+2-2-2!!)

Cheers Nerrimus. (Note I'd not played Apocalypse - just assumed!)

C.

KEYOGI · Post by **KEYOGI** » Tue Mar 06, 2007 2:30 am

Update - March 6

Without CC Star

With CC Star

Changes this Update
- Grey tone for all background, now inlcuding behind Bonus Guide
- Increased size of labels 1-6 and A-G.
- Added description of attack system
- Added an alternative title with CC star

Previous Updates
- Poll to determine viability [approx 60% in favour]
- XML completed
- Moved A-G labels from top to bottom
- Swapped order of 1-6 labels on side
- Reworded game description
- Fixed bonus guide
- Cosmetic changes
- Changed colour scheme to CC style
- Put a light grey behind numbers

Comments
I'm quite happy with the CC style and the new addition of the star to the title. It really didn't fit well in the Bonus Guide so that's why I've placed it in the title. I was unsure on the wording of the attack description, but decided to use the terms "across, down and diagonally" to fit in the the Bonus Guide. But looking at it now it seems misleading, suggesting you can't attack up. I originally had horizontally and vertically instead of across and down but it took up so much room. I guess it's something I'll have to work on.

Now, I was originally going to put up a poll so people could choose between the Classic blue look or the CC style. But I'm happy with the CC style and it seems the majority of opinion is the same. However, if people would prefer me to put a poll up I'll do so, including an option to vote on star or no star.

If anyone can think of an update I've forgotten to add to the previous list, can you please bring it to my attention. I'll post the XML next update, I just need to find a decent file hosting site first.

Coleman · Post by **Coleman** » Tue Mar 06, 2007 2:36 am

Like the map!

antjo · Post by **antjo** » Tue Mar 06, 2007 3:19 am

i think this game should start without any armies on the board
every turn, every player just gets three armies, and the he have to place them like in the 4game
wich means the pieces or armies have to fall dowwn

Teya · Post by **Teya** » Tue Mar 06, 2007 3:35 am

Coleman wrote:What are your labels in the xml for bonuses? I would like it if everything was labeled the same so you don't get spamed if you have a power block (like rows).

This has been discussed. It is even on this page.

Coleman · Post by **Coleman** » Tue Mar 06, 2007 3:49 am

Teya wrote:
Coleman wrote:What are your labels in the xml for bonuses? I would like it if everything was labeled the same so you don't get spamed if you have a power block (like rows).

This has been discussed. It is even on this page.

Well now he knows it is important if two people decided to mention it. :wink:

yeti_c · Post by **yeti_c** » Tue Mar 06, 2007 4:13 am

KEYOGI wrote:Update - March 6

I was unsure on the wording of the attack description, but decided to use the terms "across, down and diagonally" to fit in the the Bonus Guide. But looking at it now it seems misleading, suggesting you can't attack up. I originally had horizontally and vertically instead of across and down but it took up so much room. I guess it's something I'll have to work on.

How's about... "Attack any adjacent square in all directions" or something similar? Or "Attack any adjacent square in all directions including diagonals" if you want to explicitly mention diagonals.

C.

Teya · Post by **Teya** » Tue Mar 06, 2007 5:50 am

Coleman wrote:
Teya wrote:
Coleman wrote:What are your labels in the xml for bonuses? I would like it if everything was labeled the same so you don't get spamed if you have a power block (like rows).

This has been discussed. It is even on this page.

Well now he knows it is important if two people decided to mention it.

yeti_c wrote:
oaktown wrote:i like the blank spaces idea - maybe the map would have to go up to 7x7, with seven blanks? Just a thought, which you are free to ignore.

I understand the scoring system and I think it works fine. My concern is how is the bonuses are going to read when I start my turn. Some examples might help people get it. For example, if I held six spaces in a row I assume it would look something like:

oaktown receives +2 for hold A1-A4
oaktown receives +2 for hold A2-A5
oaktown receives +2 for hold A3-A6
oaktown receives -2 for holding A1-A5
oaktown receives -2 for holding A2-A6

?

That is correct... sadly this is the only way of working it - similar to World 2 & USAPocalypse.

C.

The answer was also on that page.

yeti_c · Post by **yeti_c** » Tue Mar 06, 2007 8:20 am

Teya wrote:The answer was also on that page.

And it's done in the XML too... Keyogi has the new XML to upload...

C.

KEYOGI · Post by **KEYOGI** » Thu Mar 08, 2007 4:01 am

Update - March 8

Changes this Update
- New attack description
- Minor object placement adjustments

Previous Updates
- Poll to determine viability [approx 60% in favour]
- XML completed
- Moved A-G labels from top to bottom
- Swapped order of 1-6 labels on side
- Reworded game description
- Fixed bonus guide
- Cosmetic changes
- Changed colour scheme to CC style
- Put a light grey behind numbers
- Grey tone for all background, now inlcuding behind Bonus Guide
- Increased size of labels 1-6 and A-G.
- Added description of attack system
- Added an alternative title with CC star

Comments
- I haven't posted the XML as promised since I haven't been able to find a decent file hosting site.
- There's been no additional support for a 7x7 board, so we'll stick with the board layout as it is for now. I think 7x 6 works well enough anyway.
- I've toyed around with the Bonus Guide, but I think the current method works best and provides the simplest explanation of the bonus system.
- I don't know what else to do with this map. Maybe I should put a magnifying glass or other object hovering over the map to make it more appealing.

Captain Crash · Post by **Captain Crash** » Thu Mar 08, 2007 5:54 am

Love your work Keyogi!

Minor issue only:
Is it just me or do the army numbers look like they are rotated slightly anti-clockwise? (Leaning to the left)

Don't want people (Andy) to thing I'm being a little bit previous or anything but ... would this be approaching 'Final Forge'?

Again:

Well done Keyogi!

Nerrimus · Post by **Nerrimus** » Thu Mar 08, 2007 9:13 am

Have you made a large map yet?

Wisse · Post by **Wisse** » Thu Mar 08, 2007 11:22 am

keyogie you can get 28 bonus can't you?

Molacole · Post by **Molacole** » Thu Mar 08, 2007 11:28 am

you should change the name of your map to connect 4 on crack!

looks good man, real good. Should be a blast to get some esc. games going on this one.

Marvaddin · Post by **Marvaddin** » Thu Mar 08, 2007 2:49 pm

I cant believe this idea come this far. I know you have some support, but its still completely terrible in my opinion. Well, looks like we finally will have a map to compete with crossword for the less played title... You will see how confusing this one will be when its on.

Anyway, if its coming, lets give it a hand. The info added to the map is not good:

1) Attack adjacent spaces in any direction -> adjacent? If you look to the map, the distance between a circle and the others in diagonal is much bigger than the one between it and upper, lower, right, left circles. How about use "surrounding spaces"?

2) Hold 4 adjacent spaces in a line for a bonus of +2 -> line? Isnt it horizontal? How about "in any direction"?

Other point: Two bonuses may only share a single space :shock:

In any line, we have ABCDEFG territories. So, if 4 adjacent spaces give a bonus of +2, ABCD is worthy +2, as BCDE, CDEF, and DEFG. So, I think a complete line gives a total bonus of +8, unless I have missed some info, because I didnt read all the thread, but in this case the map is not informing about that. Can you clarify the situation about this?