[Abandoned] - Europe 1099 - The 1st Crusade

[Sardauk]

Historical Accuracy: Asia Minor is now Seljuk Turks and holds all the regions hold by Seljuk Turks before the arrival of the Crusaders

It's not historically accurate that the Seljuks hold Antioch in 1099 (included in the name of the map), IRL won a year earlier in a very important battle by the Franks. Make it part of Jerusalem instead, as one area.

Ideally, Christian Armenia should be present, as they were a minor player of the time.

Edit: And change borders in Scandinavia to how they were at the time. You just need to draw a couple of lines, and all would be fine. Wikipedia is your friend, if you don't have more relevant literature.

[el-presidente]

I wolld like to either see bonuses for holding more that one shield and jerusalem or have it be an objective map. You would need ot add some more of the cresent moon things (they have a name, don't they?) and then you could win by either holding all shields and jerusalem or all cresents and jerusalem, but I think that the cresents would be easier.




< el-presidente >

[thenobodies80]

For me only four last concerns:

1. I'm not sure that the legend and some region names will be readable in the small version.
2. In the small version you probably could have some difficult to find a correct position for circles (some regions are small and with long names)
3. If you start with Venice you could take the Rome-Jerusalem bonus in few turns. It could unbalance the game.
4. some bonuses have the + and others the - , probably you did the + to explain the autodeploy, but i think you could set all the bonuses with the +

I like your map!
Good work

TNBDS

[Beko the Great]

Hello!
First of all I want to apologize you for lack of activity in this map. Unfortunately I've been really busy in real life.
Anyway, here is version 9 of this map:

[bigimg]http://www.filefreak.com/pfiles/76801/europe1100v8.1.jpg[/bigimg]

What changed:
Attack Routes:
Added Sicily <-> Tunis and Sicily <-> Sardinia

Graphic Changes:
Jerusalem territory and borders - it's less hidden yet it's not perfect, anyway I would like to know if I'm going the right way.
Legend - More clear names and colors; Added + sign in all bonus so there are no doubts about legend!

Cheers!

[MrBenn]

The map continues to get better

I still have some concerns about symbols crossing borders (most notably Paris), and there are still several little niggles (such as the missing bit of border between Sweden and Norway), but you have (and continue to) present key map information and updates in a manner that is user friendly and consistent with the foundry standards.



Welcome to the Foundry Proper! Onwards and Upwards!

[Beko the Great]

I still have some concerns about symbols crossing borders (most notably Paris)

I shall extent the territory a little bit southwest to turn it clearer.

and there are still several little niggles (such as the missing bit of border between Sweden and Norway)

It was not in the latest version... Just a rubber in the wrong place

but you have (and continue to) present key map information and updates in a manner that is user friendly and consistent with the foundry standards.



Welcome to the Foundry Proper! Onwards and Upwards!

Thank you very much! And to all users, keep supporting this idea!

[pamoa]

Nice changes, good work

Paris, Al-Qahirah and Al-Madinah symbols are still on an other territory, you have to find a way to put them inside
names can cross the border but symbols should be in their respective territory

To be more coherent geographically and historically
rename Orleans as Dijon as it was the capital of the Duchy of Burgundy and do correspond more or less to the area you represent on your map

note that at that time there were the Duchy of Burgundy inside the French Kingdom and the Free County of Burgundy inside the Kingdom of Arles
named after it capital as the Kingdom of Burgundy ended about 845

Orleans is a city located south west of paris

[Beko the Great]

Nice changes, good work

To be more coherent geographically and historically
rename Orleans as Dijon as it was the capital of the Duchy of Burgundy and do correspond more or less to the area you represent on your map

note that at that time there were the Duchy of Burgundy inside the French Kingdom and the Free County of Burgundy inside the Kingdom of Arles
named after it capital as the Kingdom of Burgundy ended about 845

Orleans is a city located south west of paris

.
Thanks for the historical tips, central Europe history is not my strong point. I'll rename Orleans to Dijon.

Paris, Al-Qahirah and Al-Madinah symbols are still on an other territory, you have to find a way to put them inside
names can cross the border but symbols should be in their respective territory

Paris and Al-Qahira will be fixed, Al-Madinah is quite impossible due to it's location.

Cheers and thank you!

[pamoa]

np
I just saw there is a missing part of border between Norway and Sweden

[Beko the Great]

np
I just saw there is a missing part of border between Norway and Sweden

Mr Benn has noticed it too... Just a rubber at the wrong place... I shall make a new layer with new borders to fix all those problems.

[Beko the Great]

Hello all!
Here is the new version of this map.

[bigimg]http://img294.imageshack.us/img294/5851/europe1099v10.jpg[/bigimg]

What Changed:
- Borders:
Fixed Sweden-Norway border
Changed Paris borders.
- Territory names:
Orleans changed to Dijon

To Discuss:

Just an idea that occured to me: Territory names in native languages. Good/bad? I shall add a poll about it.
For example: Cordoba passes to Qurtuba (arabian name for the region), Lorraine passes to Lothringen (since it was posessed by Holy Roman Empire).
There are a few examples already in the map, such as Al-Qahirah, Al-Iskandaria, Al-Gharb... So we need some coherence. The main problem is the city of Jerusalem. Shall it have the Hebraic name? Yerushalaim, Arabian? Al-Quds, Latin? Hierosolyma. I would point to the hebraic name, as the politicaly correct one, yet the Latin name was the name used by the Roman Catholic Church the main responsible for the Crusades. Please feel free to give your opinions.

[Aline_Cedrac]

Dear comrade, I agree with your idea! Having the native names in this historical context will make the whole map look much more realistic and its background accurate! It's really good! And I'm looking forward to play on it!
Keep on the excellent work!

Kisses ,

Aline

[pamoa]

What was England native language in 1099 French as spoken by Normans nobles, english, danish,...
What is Jerusalem native language ?!?
How will you write Arab names ?
And for the Byzantine empire at least you must change the name in English in either Empire of the Romans or Empire of the Greeks
native language would be Greek

The Byzantine Empire or Eastern Roman Empire, known to its inhabitants as the Roman Empire, the Empire of the Romans (Greek: Βασιλεία τῶν Ῥωμαίων, Basileía tôn Rhōmaíōn), Romania (Ῥωμανία, Rhōmanía), or Romais (Ῥωμαΐς Rhōmaís), was the continuation of the Roman Empire during the Middle Ages, centered on its capital of Constantinople, and ruled by Emperors in direct succession to the Roman Emperors. The Empire preserved Roman legal traditions, but due to its Hellenization (especially in the later periods),[4][5] it became known to some of its contemporaries[6] as the Empire of the Greeks.[7][8] In the Islamic world it was known primarily as روم (Rûm "Rome").[9] The term "Byzantine Empire" postdates the Empire itself, and was popularized by historians during the 16th-19th centuries.

[Beko the Great]

What was England native language in 1099 French as spoken by Normans nobles, english, danish,...
What is Jerusalem native language ?!?
How will you write Arab names ?
And for the Byzantine empire at least you must change the name in English in either Empire of the Romans or Empire of the Greeks
native language would be Greek

The Byzantine Empire or Eastern Roman Empire, known to its inhabitants as the Roman Empire, the Empire of the Romans (Greek: Βασιλεία τῶν Ῥωμαίων, Basileía tôn Rhōmaíōn), Romania (Ῥωμανία, Rhōmanía), or Romais (Ῥωμαΐς Rhōmaís), was the continuation of the Roman Empire during the Middle Ages, centered on its capital of Constantinople, and ruled by Emperors in direct succession to the Roman Emperors. The Empire preserved Roman legal traditions, but due to its Hellenization (especially in the later periods),[4][5] it became known to some of its contemporaries[6] as the Empire of the Greeks.[7][8] In the Islamic world it was known primarily as روم (Rûm "Rome").[9] The term "Byzantine Empire" postdates the Empire itself, and was popularized by historians during the 16th-19th centuries.

Well English names... In english (unless someone knows them in arcaic english), or wales in welsh and ireland like "eire" would be nice too. Anyways, arabian names, arab phonetic, ocidental font, the same with bizantion, I guess the better name for Jerusalem is Yerushalayim, which is the Hebrew one. About Byzantine the exact same thing... Let's see what can we get on practic.

Cheers!

[pamoa]

Can you show us a proposition as a list?

[Beko the Great]

Can you show us a proposition as a list?

I'm just doing my research job in order to do so

[Teflon Kris]

Quick gameplay question about bonuses:
Do you get +2 for Rome + Jerusalem and another +2 if you have a shield (i.e. +4)?

[Beko the Great]

Quick gameplay question about bonuses:
Do you get +2 for Rome + Jerusalem and another +2 if you have a shield (i.e. +4)?

Actualy in the first post it was +2 for Rome + Jerusalem but it's +1 and yes it's cumulative: i.e +3

Thanks for participating in this discution

[iancanton]

if u hold jerusalem plus 3 crescents, then do u receive +3 bonus, just like age of realms, or is +1 the maximum bonus for crescents? u need to explain this clearly on the map.

ian.

[Beko the Great]

if u hold jerusalem plus 3 crescents, then do u receive +3 bonus, just like age of realms, or is +1 the maximum bonus for crescents? u need to explain this clearly on the map.

ian.

Yep it's cumulative like age of Realms!

[sailorseal]

I would like this map to retain more of it's old texture. The new green symbol does not seem to fit, it's to bright and sticks out, I would make it fit in better. I would make Jerusalem and Rome start neutral. I don't see a bonus for the top of Africa. Maybe add test, in a very low opacity, the names of each bonus area, on the bonus area. I would also like to see the texture on the yellow bonus go throughout the map.
Nice Map!

[miniwally]

When are you getting rid of the one way attacks?

[Beko the Great]

When are you getting rid of the one way attacks?

Why should I do so?

[miniwally]

cause there was nothing stopping the moors attacking spain during the crusades

[Beko the Great]

cause there was nothing stopping the moors attacking spain during the crusades

Well tell that to Afonso Henriques or other hero's of the "Reconquista". There was nothing stopping them yet the mean direction was fleeing to south. That's what one way attacks mean... And I think this one way attacks add awesomeness to gameplay