FOW, what we are and arnt allowed say in the chat, HELP!

[liamo6969]

right, i have seen games and been in some where players have claimed that somebody broke the rules by saying too much about their strength, borders and locations in public chat.

Does anybody know what the crack is here, are they sore losers or is their rules!

[PLAYER57832]

I have not found official rules yet. Like a lot of things, it is up to individual play.

HOWEVER, I would consider anyone who talked about anyone else's position (except in within team chat, of course) to be a poor sport. Perhaps not technically cheating, but pretty close. I would give them a 1 and likely put them on my ignore list.

Some people like to put stuff out that may or may not be true. They see this as "strategy". I just consider it baloney that I would rather just avoid. I LIKE honesty. I would probably give these folks a "2" under the current rating system. I might not put them on my ignore list (I might, especially if they did other stuff I did not like), but would probably more or less avoid playing with them.


The only real exception might be in a 1v1 (or when the game is reduced to 1v1) when one person is quite obviously losing, particularly in Realms, a lot of folks will give their position away just to finish the game more quickly. In Realms 1, this can speed up the game by 3-4 turns without changing the outcome. In Realms 2 it usually makes no difference or might speed it up by one turn at most.

A not quite the same case would be where a game has gone on for a while and one person just wants to leave. They may give away their position. This would benefit those who come after them much more than others, so I would consider it poor sportsmanship. Quitting, unless one has to go somewhere or such, I would consider to be a bad attitude. So, I might give the person a 3 (maybe a 2) in fair play and a 2 in attitude.

[The1exile]

Sore losers, I think. (no offence to player)

[barterer2002]

I don't believe there is any codification of FOW rules but as with most things there is an etiquitte to follow. Generally it is poor etiquitte to expose an opponent's position in game chat. I'd tend to view it as talking during your golf partner's backswing. Not a rule against it but its sure to piss them off and rightly so.

[wicked]

There are no official rules against revealing information in fog of war games.

[DiM]

you can say whatever you want but be prepared for others to be pissed if you disclose their location strength and any other private info.

[Kaplowitz]

I say, do what you need to do in order to win. That's the nature of the game .

[Gypsys Kiss]

I have never passed (or seen being passed) information regarding info regarding another players strength or lack of. However, I dont see it as cheating, more a gathering of intelligence. And honesty in a war game is like honour among thieves. Total bollocks in other words.

[Visaoni]

I generally don't play FOW, but I don't see what the problem is. Well, I can see why some people don't like it, but it is a war game. Alls fair in love and war right? But the reason I don't think it is so bad is because people can lie about it. You have to be prepared to take any information somebody says in game chat and analyze the hell out of it. It could help you win the game, or it could be a trap or a diversion. I think that just because it opens up such a big new tactical realm that there is nothing wrong with it. If you are concerned with ratings though you may want to ask people first in game chat to see if everybody is cool with it. Then if you like using disinformation and whatnot then just take note of who likes it and get a group together.

[Mac2012Michigan]

Well what about this...

Your spread in Europe, Asia, and Aussy. You hold like Western Europe or East Africa possibly and you see Player B has 6 on North Africa. You look in the game box and it says Player B recieves 2 armies for holding ?, can you tell other plays by saying that blue is holding SA/Aussy because the game box is saying that he is holding a continent?

To me it seems fair because the game box is available to all players and he might have only 1 army holding Venezuala, possible to trick bordering player C that he doesn't hold SA or some else is in SA trying to take over. Then you can tell everyone the good news and have Player B spoiled in his bonus

[wacicha]

To win a war you need info or your enemies to have the wrong info. That is what fog of war is all about, Disinformation. If some one says something is it truly true or Dis information. The fog does not let you see. Use this Dis information to your good....

[Blastshot]

I will tell you exactly the same thing i tell other people when i disclose information, i will use deception to the best of my abilities, i will break every unwritten rule, and i will use every little advantage i can get to win. You may call me a poor sport, i call myself creative.

[liamo6969]

so most of you seem to think that giving away a players position is not honourable.

And just to be clear what about informing other players that player X is building up masses of armies on his borders but not actually saying where the borders lie??

[lancehoch]

so most of you seem to think that giving away a players position is not honourable.

And just to be clear what about informing other players that player X is building up masses of armies on his borders but not actually saying where the borders lie??

It is legal. Some people will frown upon it, just like someone will frown upon every other action you take. This might upset more people however. Personally, I would never do this, because it also gives away information about your position.

[MeDeFe]

A large part of the game is diplomacy and manipulating others, fow just adds a few possibilities for deception.

[Thezzaruz]

And honesty in a war game is like honour among thieves. Total bollocks in other words.

I fully agree. When I play I expect alliances (spoken or not, even secret ones actually), I expect chat/hints/suggestions on where to deploy/attack and I expect info being shared in FoW games (I put no trust in such info though).

The only "diplomacy" I really frown upon is players that tries to order me to do things. Secret alliances gets reported as it is against site rules.

[liamo6969]

so basically ignore the moany people and say what you want??? its like an aliance against dat person, da alliance is sharing info which everybody can naturally see in the game log. thanks all! was a bit of a shadowy subject when i was looking itno it but now i pretty much get it!!

[liamo6969]

actually, will people leave bad ratings and shit for saying too much?

Hate when losers do that cause u out play them!!!!!!!!!!

[Draconian_Intel]

I find it somewhat ironic that half the people are saying the rating system sucks, and the other half are worrying about the ratings they get and complaining that they didn't get 5's from everyone. It is possible that what you consider a "bad" rating is that person saying that you were average. The ratings are highly subjective, because different players interpret the scores as meaning different things, and because different players consider different things acceptable. I admit, I have not been playing this game for very long (by the way, this is my first post, so I hope its a good one), but I think people need to worry a little less about the ratings others leave them.

Now that I have got that out of my system, I can answer the actual question. I read the rules page when I joined (only a few days ago), and there was nothing in the rules against it. I figure, leaking information is just another strategy, even if it is a somewhat dishonorable one. I think I would personally avoid using it in most situations, but I totally understand why others would do it.

Thanks for reading this, and I hope it gives a little more insight into this topic.

[Soloman]

To win a war you need info or your enemies to have the wrong info. That is what fog of war is all about, Disinformation. If some one says something is it truly true or Dis information. The fog does not let you see. Use this Dis information to your good....

see that makes no sense especially if the enemy is dead they should have nothing to say ergo"dead men tell no tales" I have found most location revelations come from people who are already eliminated and have no stragteic value other then in their pathetic minds getting a final FU to the person who eliminated them. People should not be allowed to discuss in chat positions same as they cannot see position.that holds even more true for the eliminated they should be locked out of the game from that point...

[detlef]

I find it somewhat ironic that half the people are saying the rating system sucks, and the other half are worrying about the ratings they get and complaining that they didn't get 5's from everyone. It is possible that what you consider a "bad" rating is that person saying that you were average. The ratings are highly subjective, because different players interpret the scores as meaning different things, and because different players consider different things acceptable. I admit, I have not been playing this game for very long (by the way, this is my first post, so I hope its a good one), but I think people need to worry a little less about the ratings others leave them.

Now that I have got that out of my system, I can answer the actual question. I read the rules page when I joined (only a few days ago), and there was nothing in the rules against it. I figure, leaking information is just another strategy, even if it is a somewhat dishonorable one. I think I would personally avoid using it in most situations, but I totally understand why others would do it.

Thanks for reading this, and I hope it gives a little more insight into this topic.

He shoots he scores!

Seriously, I think the FOW deal is crystal clear. It's a shady tactic that is not against the rules. If you're hell bent on winning the "honorable way" then don't do it. If that doesn't bother you, have at it. In general, I'm more inclined to option #1 but, understanding I enter every FOW game understanding it's allowed so I'm not shocked by it. Freestyle has dozens of shady tactics that make this one seem rather tame. Enough so that I choose not to play that format.

But don't let the threat of possibly getting bad ratings stop you, since they mean basically nothing anyway. That you're even asking means you understand the issue at hand and know why somebody would be pissed if you did it. You just need to decide for yourself what kind of player you are.

[Thezzaruz]

People should not be allowed to discuss in chat positions same as they cannot see position.that holds even more true for the eliminated they should be locked out of the game from that point...

I agree that eliminated players shouldn't reveal info, if you're out then you should stay out tbh. Those still in it though I see no reason that they shouldn't be allowed to inform/disinform or cooperate/backstab each other.

[thellama73]

I don't give away others' positions in Fog of War because I feel it is against the spirit of the gaame. However, that is a personal choice and if others choose to play differently I don't really fault them for that.

[HannibalSmith]

Announcing people's strength or position in Fog of War = Foe List

It's their right to squeal -- and it is my right to never play with them again.

Fog of War games where everyone stays true to the spirit of the game makes for better Fog of War games. Even when you lose.

Snitches fuel in-game and in-chat fights, alliances, truces, etc, and generally everything that has the ability to ruin a game and make for a truly miserable experience.

[Visaoni]

People should not be allowed to discuss in chat positions same as they cannot see position.that holds even more true for the eliminated they should be locked out of the game from that point...

I agree that eliminated players shouldn't reveal info, if you're out then you should stay out tbh. Those still in it though I see no reason that they shouldn't be allowed to inform/disinform or cooperate/backstab each other.

Exactly what I think. Eliminated players have no business saying anything about positions or troop strength or anything strategic. That is just being a whiny little bitch because they got eliminated. However, for people still in play, it is a very viable tactic. I understand how some people would feel this violates the honorable way of playing, and normally I agree that honorable is the way to go, but in this case I disagree. It isn't dishonorable to use disinformation. I think FoW has great potential for strategy, even if chat were disabled. But with people allowed to use chat to talk about their position, or other's positions, and more importantly lie about it, I think it brings in an even larger strategic element. In this case it is not dishonorable because it is bringing in a whole new level of strategy. Dishonorable things are cheap tactics that let people cheese through a game. Making the scope of the game much larger however, is exactly the opposite. They are not using exploits or loopholes to make things easier on themselves. They are going through the trouble of figuring out how giving away/making up certain information will help them. It really is bringing the game to a whole new level.

Honestly, I have a bigger problem with the game log being enabled in FoW than I do people being allowed to disclose information, true or false, about others. Having it enabled makes a large part of FoW strategy just log reading. It isn't a bad thing, in fact it can (sort of) bring a small element of strategy into it. I just hate that in order to play FoW well you must dedicate a lot of time to scrolling through game logs.