BoganGod wrote: On a lighter note, want to tell everyone how many steps behind Atlantis your clan is?
There is simple solution to that, you wanna a war?
For the rest, I have said what I wanted, beating the dead horse ain't my thing.
Beating a dead horse is not your thing. Clearly avoiding questions is.
War vs OSA can put it to a vote. Don't see it happening until early march. In three at present + random cup/challenge/league wateva it is labeled. Starting another on Dec 14, and most of clan 35+ with kids so slow down and get on with rl over holidays. Any challenge needs to be booked and decided on in advance. Especially since Atlantis appears to be a time wasting target. Start a war, then wait, wait, wait some more. FaD has been the only recent exception. Well done [player]razorvich[/player] great work mate. War vs TOFU hasn't started yet. From memory they used to be good at organsing things in a timely fashion.
Sorry about your current ranking. Must be a reflection on the rest of your clan as you easily out play me(well most people manage that). Just kidding, you've played some tough opponents recently.
BoganGod wrote: On a lighter note, want to tell everyone how many steps behind Atlantis your clan is?
There is simple solution to that, you wanna a war?
For the rest, I have said what I wanted, beating the dead horse ain't my thing.
Beating a dead horse is not your thing. Clearly avoiding questions is.
War vs OSA can put it to a vote. Don't see it happening until early march. In three at present + random cup/challenge/league wateva it is labeled. Starting another on Dec 14, and most of clan 35+ with kids so slow down and get on with rl over holidays. Any challenge needs to be booked and decided on in advance. Especially since Atlantis appears to be a time wasting target. Start a war, then wait, wait, wait some more. FaD has been the only recent exception. Well done [player]razorvich[/player] great work mate. War vs TOFU hasn't started yet. From memory they used to be good at organsing things in a timely fashion.
Sorry about your current ranking. Must be a reflection on the rest of your clan as you easily out play me(well most people manage that). Just kidding, you've played some tough opponents recently.
Wish I could say I admire your reading skills. However you still haven't answered my question. Normally the french aren't quite this stupid, are you maybe belgian not french?
Just in case you missed it the past 5times.......
What would you be voting on? Would you consider the changes/options I've suggested?
Wish I could say I admire your reading skills. However you still haven't answered my question. Normally the french aren't quite this stupid, are you maybe belgian not french?
Just in case you missed it the past 5times.......
What would you be voting on? Would you consider the changes/options I've suggested?
First of all I will repeat all I said, cause maybe you have missed it.
VOTING-to keep the format as it is or make the change OPTIONS-to be discussed after we have format
not sure what you want me to say out loud here?
yes you are ranked no.5, yes you should be in top tier immediately, even if we play qualifications for top tier
it's not up to me, when all clans make the vote whether to change the format or not, then all other things can be discussed
Qwert asked me to give input about a week or so ago, and I just let it slip while I did things. Here's some thoughts (some of which, I've likely said earlier in the thread).
1. I don't believe that the premier league has to be so exclusive. I would get rid of the 18 team format and make it 24-36 teams (the more inclusive, the better), with each clan playing each other just once (not twice). And, I go back to my former Idea of getting rid of the home/away series and use x maps for each clan and x maps neutral (random).
2. There seems to be a concensus that a third league that locks clans out of the premier league for two cycles is a bad idea. And on that note, we should use two second leagues if necessary. But, if the premier league is expanded as I advocate, then one second league is most certainly sufficient.
3. qwert, you created a league that is based upon cl5 results. But, many clans who are higher ranked in the rankings were not knowingly competing for CL6 positioning. I would favor one final play-in. And clans that come later (whether they be new or had skipped a season would be required to start in the second league).
4. And, I reiterate the point, that this one map per competition stuff needs to go. Put a three match expiration date on maps or something like that. CL is becoming random league and we already have a random league for random enthusiasts.
ViperOverLord wrote:Qwert asked me to give input about a week or so ago, and I just let it slip while I did things. Here's some thoughts (some of which, I've likely said earlier in the thread).
1. I don't believe that the premier league has to be so exclusive. I would get rid of the 18 team format and make it 24-36 teams (the more inclusive, the better), with each clan playing each other just once (not twice). And, I go back to my former Idea of getting rid of the home/away series and use x maps for each clan and x maps neutral (random).
2. There seems to be a concensus that a third league that locks clans out of the premier league for two cycles is a bad idea. And on that note, we should use two second leagues if necessary. But, if the premier league is expanded as I advocate, then one second league is most certainly sufficient.
3. qwert, you created a league that is based upon cl5 results. But, many clans who are higher ranked in the rankings were not knowingly competing for CL6 positioning. I would favor one final play-in. And clans that come later (whether they be new or had skipped a season would be required to start in the second league).
4. And, I reiterate the point, that this one map per competition stuff needs to go. Put a three match expiration date on maps or something like that. CL is becoming random league and we already have a random league for random enthusiasts.
thanks for answering.
Last edited by Qwert on Wed Mar 19, 2014 2:47 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Donelladan wrote:Will the options be put to vote or will you decide alone?
I will certainly not decide alone. Whether there will be voting on the format or not has not been decided yet.
As far as I understand the usual route is the TO coming up with the format (with help from the CDs and by listening to clan leaders and members), then it will be posted in the CD & Friends Forum. I can imagine that some clan representatives will have some remarks and suggestions at that point, which will be heard. I can also imagine that voting may be an option for some features of the format at that point. For now I won't promise anything though, besides, that would not be my decision alone.
Basically the idea is not to make big changes, rather some adjustments, with the idea that we can use the CL6 format for the next few years without changing everything every year.
Basically the idea is not to make big changes, rather some adjustments
I think the main point in this topic was wether to change or not the system of selection for 1st, 2nd and 3rd league. And it seems to me it would be a big changes in the clan league.
If you are serious with the "no big changes" then I guess we keep the old system of preliminary matchs to select clans for 1st league and so on rather than a promotion relegation system-
Basically the idea is not to make big changes, rather some adjustments
I think the main point in this topic was wether to change or not the system of selection for 1st, 2nd and 3rd league. And it seems to me it would be a big changes in the clan league.
If you are serious with the "no big changes" then I guess we keep the old system of preliminary matchs to select clans for 1st league and so on rather than a promotion relegation system-
1.- Everything depends on your definition of "big change".
2.- I'm not getting into details until we have something more solid to present.
3.- Main thing is that you all know I'm taking notice of what's said in this thread.
I will be the TO for CL6. Currently the other CDs and I are looking into the format.
We will try and avoid making drastic changes, but we are certainly looking at the comments and suggestions here.
Lx Clan Tournament Director
this its something new,, previous year everybody can compete to be TO and present formats, then clans vote. But only me present format, and other quit, so there its no voting process happens. For me its will be interesting to see what format you will have to present .
Whatever is decided the ultimate vote will be by entries. Whilst the clan membership my be in favour of whatever the format is, if it's too close to CL5 then one of them will have to step up to run it, far too much hassle from the admin side of things.
If nothing else works, a total pig-headed unwillingness to look facts in the face will see us through
Vid_FISO wrote:Whatever is decided the ultimate vote will be by entries. Whilst the clan membership my be in favour of whatever the format is, if it's too close to CL5 then one of them will have to step up to run it, far too much hassle from the admin side of things.
Not too sure what you mean there VF ?
The competition will be run by the TO with divisional assistants to help. I can't see that changing at all.
Vid_FISO wrote:Whatever is decided the ultimate vote will be by entries. Whilst the clan membership my be in favour of whatever the format is, if it's too close to CL5 then one of them will have to step up to run it, far too much hassle from the admin side of things.
Not too sure what you mean there VF ?
The competition will be run by the TO with divisional assistants to help. I can't see that changing at all.
The severe map restrictions and the "correct" tags were the biggest hassle. Whether it's a full war or a skirmish, home maps need to be home maps, not least worst of what's left.
If nothing else works, a total pig-headed unwillingness to look facts in the face will see us through
I think there needs to be a discussion on the map limitation. The intention when we reduced the limit to one was to simply make it more interesting and discourage the use of the same maps over and over. If the clans simply haven't enjoyed/appreciated that limit then it should be changed. Whether that is back to the old limit of twice per phase, or something else needs to be discussed.
Vid_FISO wrote:Whatever is decided the ultimate vote will be by entries. Whilst the clan membership my be in favour of whatever the format is, if it's too close to CL5 then one of them will have to step up to run it, far too much hassle from the admin side of things.
Not too sure what you mean there VF ?
The competition will be run by the TO with divisional assistants to help. I can't see that changing at all.
The severe map restrictions and the "correct" tags were the biggest hassle. Whether it's a full war or a skirmish, home maps need to be home maps, not least worst of what's left.
CD hat off - CL5 TO hat on
I agree with you on both counts. As a DD and then TO I saw that many clans were turning the competition into another Random League. I'm not sure if it was because some CL's just couldn't be bothered to select maps or if it was because they were hoping to get maps that their clans were more familiar with. Either way I personally think that this wouldn't have happened if there were less restrictions on map use.
Having the correct tags certainly made the job of TO slightly easier. However from the date I took over no clans were asked to remake games because of incorrect tags. It took me a little longer to find the games on occaisions, but I managed it ok. It's certainly not a major issue.
CD hat back on
We are aware that a large number of folks would like to see changes to the map count in future Clan Leagues, so I'm absolutely sure that this will be discussed with all of the CL's and hopefully a consensus can be reached. If not then that is one possible change that could go to a vote.
As for the game tags. Again I'm sure that something can be done to make it easier for everyone. This may involve a simpler format and / or some flexibility shown by the TO and DD's.
Basically the idea is not to make big changes, rather some adjustments
I think the main point in this topic was wether to change or not the system of selection for 1st, 2nd and 3rd league. And it seems to me it would be a big changes in the clan league.
If you are serious with the "no big changes" then I guess we keep the old system of preliminary matchs to select clans for 1st league and so on rather than a promotion relegation system-
1.- Everything depends on your definition of "big change".
2.- I'm not getting into details until we have something more solid to present.
3.- Main thing is that you all know I'm taking notice of what's said in this thread.
Patience people, I'm working on it.
Lx
I don't understand your mentality. People are very interested in "big changes"; particularly, the concept of a two tier relegation/advancement system. It's hard to gauge if the majority want it at this point; but that is easily ascertainable.
Keefie wrote: Having the correct tags certainly made the job of TO slightly easier. However from the date I took over no clans were asked to remake games because of incorrect tags. It took me a little longer to find the games on occaisions, but I managed it ok. It's certainly not a major issue.
CD hat back on
We are aware that a large number of folks would like to see changes to the map count in future Clan Leagues, so I'm absolutely sure that this will be discussed with all of the CL's and hopefully a consensus can be reached. If not then that is one possible change that could go to a vote.
As for the game tags. Again I'm sure that something can be done to make it easier for everyone. This may involve a simpler format and / or some flexibility shown by the TO and DD's.
Hope that helps.
K
All CLs are very capable of running war threads, we have the new system of whoever is running the war thread posting the game numbers to a dedicated thread. No need for micro-management, let the CLs do what they do in normal wars, no need for anyone else to be doing this. A result reported 20 minutes or 20 hours after it's finished still has the same result.
Basically the idea is not to make big changes, rather some adjustments
I think the main point in this topic was wether to change or not the system of selection for 1st, 2nd and 3rd league. And it seems to me it would be a big changes in the clan league.
If you are serious with the "no big changes" then I guess we keep the old system of preliminary matchs to select clans for 1st league and so on rather than a promotion relegation system-
1.- Everything depends on your definition of "big change".
2.- I'm not getting into details until we have something more solid to present.
3.- Main thing is that you all know I'm taking notice of what's said in this thread.
Patience people, I'm working on it.
Lx
I don't understand your mentality. People are very interested in "big changes"; particularly, the concept of a two tier relegation/advancement system. It's hard to gauge if the majority want it at this point; but that is easily ascertainable.
Wonderful how you always manage to make things personal Viper.
My mentality has nothing to do with this. I'm working within the framework provided by the site and the department. Apart from that, I have no intention to make the CL into what I would like it to be. On the contrary, I would like to make it what the clan world would like it to be, within the above mentioned framework.
That's why I posted that I'm looking at this thread. And it's obvious that "some" people are very interested in big changes, not necessarily people in general. In fact, reading through this and other threads, I get the impression that many people are tired of the CL changing every edition. I agree though, that it's hard to gauge atm.
Vid_FISO wrote:All CLs are very capable of running war threads, we have the new system of whoever is running the war thread posting the game numbers to a dedicated thread. No need for micro-management.
Unfortunately you are incorrect. Several clan leaders in CL5 were not even capable of posting their home games, away player line-up, get games filled and/or respond to PMs by the Division Directors. All this caused a lot of work (micro-management) for the opponents, Division Directors and the TO. But that's all behind the scenes, so maybe you never noticed....
Vid_FISO wrote:All CLs are very capable of running war threads, we have the new system of whoever is running the war thread posting the game numbers to a dedicated thread. No need for micro-management.
Unfortunately you are incorrect. Several clan leaders in CL5 were not even capable of posting their home games, away player line-up, get games filled and/or respond to PMs by the Division Directors. All this caused a lot of work (micro-management) for the opponents, Division Directors and the TO. But that's all behind the scenes, so maybe you never noticed....
Lx
Lindax is correct on this....There was a lot of extra work done behind the scenes. I will say the majority did a great job...but there was always a few clans I had to bug on a regular basis and sometimes still didn't get what was needed.
Vid_FISO wrote:I'm aware of what happened, frequently with some clans, possibly an idea to consider why it happened than just assume it is the norm?
Nobody assumes it's the norm. On the contrary, the norm is that clans and clan leaders are on the ball.
It's simply a reality that some clans or clan leaders are not on the ball as much as they should be and it creates a lot of work behind the scenes to keep things going.
Basically the idea is not to make big changes, rather some adjustments
I think the main point in this topic was wether to change or not the system of selection for 1st, 2nd and 3rd league. And it seems to me it would be a big changes in the clan league.
If you are serious with the "no big changes" then I guess we keep the old system of preliminary matchs to select clans for 1st league and so on rather than a promotion relegation system-
1.- Everything depends on your definition of "big change".
2.- I'm not getting into details until we have something more solid to present.
3.- Main thing is that you all know I'm taking notice of what's said in this thread.
Patience people, I'm working on it.
Lx
I don't understand your mentality. People are very interested in "big changes"; particularly, the concept of a two tier relegation/advancement system. It's hard to gauge if the majority want it at this point; but that is easily ascertainable.
Wonderful how you always manage to make things personal Viper.
My mentality has nothing to do with this. I'm working within the framework provided by the site and the department. Apart from that, I have no intention to make the CL into what I would like it to be. On the contrary, I would like to make it what the clan world would like it to be, within the above mentioned framework.
That's why I posted that I'm looking at this thread. And it's obvious that "some" people are very interested in big changes, not necessarily people in general. In fact, reading through this and other threads, I get the impression that many people are tired of the CL changing every edition. I agree though, that it's hard to gauge atm.
Lx
I did not make it personal, whatsoever. That's your own biased (mis)perception. Stating that you have a 'mentality' is not a personal dig. It is an adequate and rational summation with regards to the context of CL5 and your stated designs. Your stated 'mentality' is 'no big changes.'
The site and the department has announced no absolute 'framework' to us. And since we're the people running the clans, it seems to me we should be aware if there's some sort of 'framework.' So, do tell us if that is the case. I think it would be prudent for us to know of this 'framework' that is allegedly so rigid.
The truth of the matter is that if you judge by this thread in particular; people were very very very receptive to the promotion/relegation system; and then you just suddenly decreed 'no big changes.' That is counter productive to the spirit of everyone having a real say in the scope of the competitions.
