Conquer Club

Kittens and Paper Towel Rolls

Glow-in-the-dark lawn darts.

Houses of Cards

weapons!

One-sided dice.

jbrettlip wrote:

Timminz wrote:CDO's.

Nothing wrong with CDO's. They are simply a way to arbitage interest rates. I think credit default swaps are worse, especially since you don't have to hold the security you are insuring against default. It is like a million people buying a life insurance policy on one individual that they don't even know. When that person dies, a million profit and the insurance provider would probably fail.

related note:

Time now to check what’s going on with that giant portfolio of foreclosed-upon homes that we, as taxpayers, own. Did you forget that we owned a giant portfolio of foreclosed-upon homes? Because we do. Anyway, the good news is that we may not have this portfolio for much longer. The bad news is that we’ll be relieved of it in one of the worst deals possible.

At any rate, Ken Layne points us to some recent news on that front:

The largest transfer of wealth from the public to private sector is about to begin. The federal government will be bulk-selling the massive portfolio of foreclosed homes now owned by HUD, Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac to private investors — vulture funds.

These homes, which are now the property of the U.S. government, the U.S. taxpayer, U.S. citizens collectively, are going to be sold to private investor conglomerates at extraordinarily large discounts to real value.

You and I will not be allowed to participate. These investors will come from the private-equity and hedge-fund community, Goldman Sachs and its derivatives, as well as foreign sovereign wealth funds that can bring a billion dollars or more to each transaction.

In the process, these investors will instantaneously become the largest improved real estate owners and landlords in the world. The U.S. taxpayer will get pennies on the dollar for these homes and then be allowed to rent them back at market rates.

fat people

"Entitlements"

Pirlo wrote:weapons!

of mass destruction

Army of GOD wrote:

PLAYER57832 wrote:Barney

As the owner of several Barney VHSs (I grew up in the 90s), I resent this.

Growing up in the 90s is no reason to still own the VHS's. You've had plenty of time to get rid of them!

Army of GOD wrote:fat people

Timminz wrote:

jbrettlip wrote:

Timminz wrote:CDO's.

Nothing wrong with CDO's. They are simply a way to arbitage interest rates. I think credit default swaps are worse, especially since you don't have to hold the security you are insuring against default. It is like a million people buying a life insurance policy on one individual that they don't even know. When that person dies, a million profit and the insurance provider would probably fail.

You're right, the way CDO's were managed (including credit default swaps, bogus ratings, etc) is far worse than simply the invention of the original objects.

So yeah, I'm changing my answer to, "credit default swaps".

securitization.

Phatscotty wrote:

jbrettlip wrote:

Timminz wrote:CDO's.

Nothing wrong with CDO's. They are simply a way to arbitage interest rates. I think credit default swaps are worse, especially since you don't have to hold the security you are insuring against default. It is like a million people buying a life insurance policy on one individual that they don't even know. When that person dies, a million profit and the insurance provider would probably fail.

related note:

Time now to check what’s going on with that giant portfolio of foreclosed-upon homes that we, as taxpayers, own. Did you forget that we owned a giant portfolio of foreclosed-upon homes? Because we do. Anyway, the good news is that we may not have this portfolio for much longer. The bad news is that we’ll be relieved of it in one of the worst deals possible.

At any rate, Ken Layne points us to some recent news on that front:

The largest transfer of wealth from the public to private sector is about to begin. The federal government will be bulk-selling the massive portfolio of foreclosed homes now owned by HUD, Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac to private investors — vulture funds.

These homes, which are now the property of the U.S. government, the U.S. taxpayer, U.S. citizens collectively, are going to be sold to private investor conglomerates at extraordinarily large discounts to real value.

You and I will not be allowed to participate. These investors will come from the private-equity and hedge-fund community, Goldman Sachs and its derivatives, as well as foreign sovereign wealth funds that can bring a billion dollars or more to each transaction.

In the process, these investors will instantaneously become the largest improved real estate owners and landlords in the world. The U.S. taxpayer will get pennies on the dollar for these homes and then be allowed to rent them back at market rates.

That's awesome! Not only did these firms cash in on (and cause) the collapse. Now they get to cash in again, on the rebuilding.

They may have fucked tens of millions of people out of their retirement saving, and such, but at least they made (and continue to make) good bank doing it. That is the whole point to life, isn't it?

Timminz wrote:
That's awesome! Not only did these firms cash in on (and cause) the collapse. Now they get to cash in again, on the rebuilding.

They may have fucked tens of millions of people out of their retirement saving, and such, but at least they made (and continue to make) good bank doing it. That is the whole point to life, isn't it?

And, of course Obama utterly failed to even partially reverse the damage Bush did.

Its not social security and Medicare that are truly bankrupting our country.. its the company bailouts.. and a COMPLETE failure to protect average citizens from complete abuse by the banks.

There was a thread about a guy who actually won a lawsuit against B of A .. they had forclosed even though he never even had a loan. Sure, it was funny, but sad that it did not lead to B of A being utterly shut down. If I tried to steal someone else's house through fraud, I would go to jail. B of A was able to cut a check and see the matter go away.

AND that doesn't even touch on the people who did have loans, who got into hard times and tried to have their loans renegotiated in reasonable ways, etc.

Where is the cry of the so-called "liberal elite"??? Why aren't people protesting in the streets over all this garbage?

Oh yeah.. they probably never heard about it. If they did, then well.. the failure is just of government, not big bad corporations ... After all, they are "job providers", the ones we are supposed to support!

PLAYER57832 wrote:

Timminz wrote:
That's awesome! Not only did these firms cash in on (and cause) the collapse. Now they get to cash in again, on the rebuilding.

They may have fucked tens of millions of people out of their retirement saving, and such, but at least they made (and continue to make) good bank doing it. That is the whole point to life, isn't it?

And, of course Obama utterly failed to even partially reverse the damage Bush did.

Its not social security and Medicare that are truly bankrupting our country.. its the company bailouts.. and a COMPLETE failure to protect average citizens from complete abuse by the banks.

There was a thread about a guy who actually won a lawsuit against B of A .. they had forclosed even though he never even had a loan. Sure, it was funny, but sad that it did not lead to B of A being utterly shut down. If I tried to steal someone else's house through fraud, I would go to jail. B of A was able to cut a check and see the matter go away.

AND that doesn't even touch on the people who did have loans, who got into hard times and tried to have their loans renegotiated in reasonable ways, etc.

Where is the cry of the so-called "liberal elite"??? Why aren't people protesting in the streets over all this garbage?

Oh yeah.. they probably never heard about it. If they did, then well.. the failure is just of government, not big bad corporations ... After all, they are "job providers", the ones we are supposed to support!

Wow, this is so far crazy it is hard to respond to. TARP has been repaid with interest by the majority of the banks (and in full by all the largest). Medicare and SS account for 85 trillion in projected deficits. And you think banks are the problem? No one was forced to buy a house they couldn't afford. No one was "tricked" into stuff on a systemic basis. Sure there were some unscrupulous real estate lenders etc, but to claim the whole industry is fraudulent is sheer stupidity.

What about the people who bought homes, pay on them and are honoring their contract as written? Should they get something or just the people who violate the contract?

jbrettlip wrote:

PLAYER57832 wrote:

Timminz wrote:
That's awesome! Not only did these firms cash in on (and cause) the collapse. Now they get to cash in again, on the rebuilding.

They may have fucked tens of millions of people out of their retirement saving, and such, but at least they made (and continue to make) good bank doing it. That is the whole point to life, isn't it?

And, of course Obama utterly failed to even partially reverse the damage Bush did.

Its not social security and Medicare that are truly bankrupting our country.. its the company bailouts.. and a COMPLETE failure to protect average citizens from complete abuse by the banks.

There was a thread about a guy who actually won a lawsuit against B of A .. they had forclosed even though he never even had a loan. Sure, it was funny, but sad that it did not lead to B of A being utterly shut down. If I tried to steal someone else's house through fraud, I would go to jail. B of A was able to cut a check and see the matter go away.

AND that doesn't even touch on the people who did have loans, who got into hard times and tried to have their loans renegotiated in reasonable ways, etc.

Where is the cry of the so-called "liberal elite"??? Why aren't people protesting in the streets over all this garbage?

Oh yeah.. they probably never heard about it. If they did, then well.. the failure is just of government, not big bad corporations ... After all, they are "job providers", the ones we are supposed to support!

Wow, this is so far crazy it is hard to respond to. TARP has been repaid with interest by the majority of the banks (and in full by all the largest).

and have NO real restrictions that or culpability for the damage they caused. Instead millions of hard working citizens are seeing their homes seized and the bankst hat got the largess of all of our tax dollars won't even really negotiate new loans comminserate with the drop in prices that they, the BANKS caused to happen from the start.

jbrettlip wrote:[Medicare and SS account for 85 trillion in projected deficits. And you think banks are the problem?

These were fully funded or would have been, had prior administrations not decided it was OK to "borrow" our money to fill the pockets of their cronies by offering high end tax breaks and deals.. oh yeah, "deals" that have seen our US jobs migrate overseas, without a real cry or limit from the legislators WE supposedly elected.

jbrettlip wrote:No one was forced to buy a house they couldn't afford. No one was "tricked" into stuff on a systemic basis.

A. Absolutely not true. Countrywide (which B of A bought and is therefore no responsible for), in particular was rife with outright abuse and very, very aggressive loan practices. People should not have to be attorneys or banking experts to buy a house.
B. A lot of people now in trouble bought houses they COULD afford, but then the market changed, or they lost jobs, etc. The banks were happy to make money, are STILL making money, thanks to loans from taxpayers, but now its "too much" to ask them to even halfway reduce mortgages so they are no longer "underwater", so people can even sell homes they cannot afford, etc. No, these banks would rather just foreclose, leave the neighborhoods to disintegrate and ruin the credit of people truly trying to pay.

jbrettlip wrote:[Sure there were some unscrupulous real estate lenders etc, but to claim the whole industry is fraudulent is sheer stupidity.

No, but apparently your right wing media isn't giving you the whole picture.

jbrettlip wrote:[What about the people who bought homes, pay on them and are honoring their contract as written? Should they get something or just the people who violate the contract?

THOSE ARE the people now being screwed...

AND.. this goes well beyond banks. GM, etc.. none of those corporations have been held to a standard of truly fulfilling the ecnomic promises people believe they made. Of course, in truth, the only real promise made since Reagan is that the wealthier will keep getting more wealth and power.. Reagan at least did know it should be temporary. He is at fault for starting it, but he did know it would have to be paid in the end. Sadly, no one since has bothered with that part. Far easier to just blame "liberals" who are actually just slighly less rightist coporate cronies.

Timminz wrote:

Phatscotty wrote:

jbrettlip wrote:

Timminz wrote:CDO's.

Nothing wrong with CDO's. They are simply a way to arbitage interest rates. I think credit default swaps are worse, especially since you don't have to hold the security you are insuring against default. It is like a million people buying a life insurance policy on one individual that they don't even know. When that person dies, a million profit and the insurance provider would probably fail.

related note:

Time now to check what’s going on with that giant portfolio of foreclosed-upon homes that we, as taxpayers, own. Did you forget that we owned a giant portfolio of foreclosed-upon homes? Because we do. Anyway, the good news is that we may not have this portfolio for much longer. The bad news is that we’ll be relieved of it in one of the worst deals possible.

At any rate, Ken Layne points us to some recent news on that front:

The largest transfer of wealth from the public to private sector is about to begin. The federal government will be bulk-selling the massive portfolio of foreclosed homes now owned by HUD, Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac to private investors — vulture funds.

These homes, which are now the property of the U.S. government, the U.S. taxpayer, U.S. citizens collectively, are going to be sold to private investor conglomerates at extraordinarily large discounts to real value.

You and I will not be allowed to participate. These investors will come from the private-equity and hedge-fund community, Goldman Sachs and its derivatives, as well as foreign sovereign wealth funds that can bring a billion dollars or more to each transaction.

In the process, these investors will instantaneously become the largest improved real estate owners and landlords in the world. The U.S. taxpayer will get pennies on the dollar for these homes and then be allowed to rent them back at market rates.

That's awesome! Not only did these firms cash in on (and cause) the collapse. Now they get to cash in again, on the rebuilding.

They may have fucked tens of millions of people out of their retirement saving, and such, but at least they made (and continue to make) good bank doing it. That is the whole point to life, isn't it?

Thank God we can trust our government, whose politicians always align their interests with the public good!

Claiming God is on your side.

Phatscotty wrote:Claiming God is on your side.

My God told me to chop off your nutsack for such blasphemy, heresy, and all sorts of things you might not have done but will nevertheless be held accountable for!

I am not good at the quotes, so here are my responses.
1. Millions of people getting their homes seized is due to them not paying the contracts they signed. It isn't like somewhere in the fine print there is a line that reads "B of A gets your house in 2011". Honor your contract, and there are no problems (other the anecdotal paperwork story you told).
2. Medicare and SS don't work. They can never be fully funded as long as people can take out more than they put in. They are ponzi schemes. You really don't grasp this, in fact, you said the way to fix SS was to allow the illegals to start paying into the system. Unless we go Logan's run on people and start shooting them at 64, SS is a failure.
3. You don't have to be a lawyer to buy a house. I bought mine without one. It is a simple transaction. Aggressive loans are not fraudulent loans. Aggressive lending is also not abusive. The government was backing the loans. That is who you should be blaming. Without the government support, those loans aren't written. b) Yes, circumstances do change. But a lot of people that were foreclosed on simply walked away. Those people should be in jail. And if you think that isn't true, explain why the IRS changed its tax rules to benefit people who do just that.
4. YEah, it is Fox News' fault. None of these are talking points from them. Actually most of the people I listen to are so anti Tarp it is ridiculous. They ignore the fact that it was probably one of the more successful programs the government had (the initial programs that recapitalized the banks and unfroze liquidity markets.)
5 The wealthier do get wealthier. That is a fact of capitalism and compound interest. When you have 300 years of family money and investment, you will have more money in interest income than you can spend. Buffett pays less in tax rate due to his buying muni bonds, and getting income from dividends. People on my street can't live off their dividend income. At least not yet, but it is my goal eventually.

jbrettlip wrote:I am not good at the quotes, so here are my responses.
1. Millions of people getting their homes seized is due to them not paying the contracts they signed. It isn't like somewhere in the fine print there is a line that reads "B of A gets your house in 2011". Honor your contract, and there are no problems (other the anecdotal paperwork story you told).
2. Medicare and SS don't work. They can never be fully funded as long as people can take out more than they put in. They are ponzi schemes. You really don't grasp this, in fact, you said the way to fix SS was to allow the illegals to start paying into the system. Unless we go Logan's run on people and start shooting them at 64, SS is a failure.
3. You don't have to be a lawyer to buy a house. I bought mine without one. It is a simple transaction. Aggressive loans are not fraudulent loans. Aggressive lending is also not abusive. The government was backing the loans. That is who you should be blaming. Without the government support, those loans aren't written. b) Yes, circumstances do change. But a lot of people that were foreclosed on simply walked away. Those people should be in jail. And if you think that isn't true, explain why the IRS changed its tax rules to benefit people who do just that.
4. YEah, it is Fox News' fault. None of these are talking points from them. Actually most of the people I listen to are so anti Tarp it is ridiculous. They ignore the fact that it was probably one of the more successful programs the government had (the initial programs that recapitalized the banks and unfroze liquidity markets.)
5 The wealthier do get wealthier. That is a fact of capitalism and compound interest. When you have 300 years of family money and investment, you will have more money in interest income than you can spend. Buffett pays less in tax rate due to his buying muni bonds, and getting income from dividends. People on my street can't live off their dividend income. At least not yet, but it is my goal eventually.

Excuse me, sir, but does this post belong to you? I think it's lost.

food additives. they cause cancer and other health side effects. the more organic the better.