Conquer Club

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HI, I'll be replacing TSL, I have been following this thread, I personally think saf shouldn't be lynched but I would lynch him over a no lynch, he's at L-3 so I may place my vote on him if a hammer is needed.

What I hate about this whole situation saf is that you seem to be blatantly telling all of us right now that regardless, you'll do things your way, keep the most choice info to yourself, and you flipflop on who it is that gets info when you discuss it with us. Statistically speaking,you should side with us right now because we are the majority in the game as town must vastly outnumber scum. Yet time and again you make it obvious you are going to do whats best for you regardless even though town is winning currently. That makes no sense. I don't think Haggis had a bad plan but to go and say what you did here:

safariguy5 wrote:Let me ask you a hypothetical question. What if I agree and don't follow through? Tomorrow the HoTK is going to out himself and say "hey, safari didn't send me two actions, let's lynch him." Here's the thing with making deals, I don't necessarily have to abide by them. At this point in the game, the HoTK and Cersi are too valuable to their respective sides to out themselves to kill 1 little third party survivor. So I could technically agree to anything, and what would town do if I don't follow through on it?

Well, I don't think it's hypothetical at all. You've made it apparent you are going to do it your way regardless of what we say and with the info you keep the potential for screwing us is huge. I voted because I think the cons outweigh the pros on your ability for town in the long run. The vote on you will stay though because your general attitude about your ability to town is frieghtening. Regardless of what town or scum say you are obviously in this for yourself.

strike wolf wrote:unvote vote safari

I do not do this because of Haggis' or Bleed's reasonings but because as I originally stated my fear at the beginning may have been that this was just an attempt to try to get the HotK or the king himself to claim prematurely and Safari seems to be calling for the HoTK to claim. Also I'm finding a lot of discrepancies in Safari's posts where he switches back and forth where he has to send one action to the HOTking, one to the Godfather and keep one to himself and posts where he seems to be saying that is not the case.

Where did I say that? I said that I get to choose what to do with the third action. Some people have been trying to cut deals with me and I've been explaining why I won't do so.

Talapus wrote:What I hate about this whole situation saf is that you seem to be blatantly telling all of us right now that regardless, you'll do things your way, keep the most choice info to yourself, and you flipflop on who it is that gets info when you discuss it with us. Statistically speaking,you should side with us right now because we are the majority in the game as town must vastly outnumber scum. Yet time and again you make it obvious you are going to do whats best for you regardless even though town is winning currently. That makes no sense. I don't think Haggis had a bad plan but to go and say what you did here:

safariguy5 wrote:Let me ask you a hypothetical question. What if I agree and don't follow through? Tomorrow the HoTK is going to out himself and say "hey, safari didn't send me two actions, let's lynch him." Here's the thing with making deals, I don't necessarily have to abide by them. At this point in the game, the HoTK and Cersi are too valuable to their respective sides to out themselves to kill 1 little third party survivor. So I could technically agree to anything, and what would town do if I don't follow through on it?

Well, I don't think it's hypothetical at all. You've made it apparent you are going to do it your way regardless of what we say and with the info you keep the potential for screwing us is huge. I voted because I think the cons outweigh the pros on your ability for town in the long run. The vote on you will stay though because your general attitude about your ability to town is frieghtening. Regardless of what town or scum say you are obviously in this for yourself.

Why am I not cutting deals with town? Simply because if I do, then I rise to the top of the mafia hit list. Nobody is going to guarantee me doc protection for the rest of the game. All anyone has offered is that "maybe" the doc will protect me. As of right now, town has actively called for my lynch, suggested that the vig off me, and basically said I'm a town traitor with no value to the town at all and compared me to a SKer.

Excuuuuse me for being defensive. You want to negotiate with someone, don't threaten their life with it. In fact, I said earlier on in the day that I didn't fear a mafia NK as much as I did a town lynch. You are only making it more clear. You want my help? Take the gun off my head and maybe we'll talk. I'd rather die than see town try and coerce me to help them. You killing me is mostly helping mafia, not town.

And for the record, if you had actually read my suggestions on how to play HoTK, it's basically a stronger version of follow the cop. And I never said I requested this to be done, it was a possibly strategy that shows I do have value to town. Unlike say, a SKer.

Sorry I haven't been very active, I agree, like I said previously, info scum gets from an outside source is bad since it reinforces potential fake claims for them, and he must give them decent info since they can pick him off whenever. The way safari has been acting it seems like he perceives town as the greater threat even though he is unable to see at this point who is on any given side. I discussed my take on probability and so forth on page 8, so now with the deadline in place and it being day one, I feel it is the best time to avoid error.
Unvote vote safariguy

/ wrote:Sorry I haven't been very active, I agree, like I said previously, info scum gets from an outside source is bad since it reinforces potential fake claims for them, and he must give them decent info since they can pick him off whenever. The way safari has been acting it seems like he perceives town as the greater threat even though he is unable to see at this point who is on any given side. I discussed my take on probability and so forth on page 8, so now with the deadline in place and it being day one, I feel it is the best time to avoid error.
Unvote vote safariguy

Quite simply, town is able, more likely, and currently trying to kill me. I doubt mafia would try to NK me. And the vote patterns up to now are confirming that.

Humh. Sorry Saf, wish things had turned out a bit better for you here. I guess I would have played my cards differently if I was in your place and waited a day to claim. Even still, this shouldn't have happened like this and it is an absolute waste of a day.

Speaking of which, I've got a pretty good idea who's on my bandwagon.

1. Townies who are afraid I might give mafia their night action.

2. Mafia who are afraid I might give town their night action.

3. Submarining Town

4. Submarining Mafia

Who's probably not on my bandwagon?

1. HoTK

2. Queen Cersi

3. Town who think I might benefit them

4. Mafia who think I might benefit them.

So yeah, good luck figuring out who is who for a lynch target tomorrow guys. Not to mention you're probably going to be at least 1 townie down.

edocsil wrote:Humh. Sorry Saf, wish things had turned out a bit better for you here. I guess I would have played my cards differently if I was in your place and waited a day to claim. Even still, this shouldn't have happened like this and it is an absolute waste of a day.

Yeah, it's just like the Rodion/Bleed issue in Unknown, except that town isn't gaining anything from my death.

How is this like bleed vs. Rodion?

strike wolf wrote:How is this like bleed vs. Rodion?

The argument drags out for a long time, there's some opinion that we should move on and talk about other things, yet the topic always comes back to the original claim.

Except that I'm not a cult, and town does stand to benefit from my powers, while Rodion turned out to be recruited cult. And this is Day 1, so the motivations for voting me I think tend to come out of fear of the unknown and general laziness to do actual scumhunting.

I think i see what you are saying but I don't see enough reason to move my vote. Not like it seems to matters at this point, unless the deadline is extended this looks like it's headed for a no lynch.

Safariguy, your role is just too unpredictable. Your information gathering means that if we let you live now, you could potentially out all of our power roles if the mafia start winning. At any point later on, you could tell who has investigative abilities, killing abilities, and all manner of things. Granted, you could turn on scum as well, but right now we can't anticipate that. We have no idea where the next few kills are going to go to.

Had you just kept your mouth shut for a few days, then you could've gathered up enough information to blackmail your way to an easy victory. Your role is very powerful, but you doomed yourself by letting us know so early.

vote safariguy

Vote count
safariguy-9- daze, talapus, chapcrap, bgthebrain, haggis, bleed, strikewolf, /, squirrel
kwanton-2-saxlad, nagerous
edocsil-1- safariguy,
chap-3- pancakemix, naxus, edoc
talapus-1-rodion


With 18 alive takes 10 to lynch. Saf is at L-1
24 hours until the deadline.

Mr. Squirrel wrote:Safariguy, your role is just too unpredictable. Your information gathering means that if we let you live now, you could potentially out all of our power roles if the mafia start winning. At any point later on, you could tell who has investigative abilities, killing abilities, and all manner of things. Granted, you could turn on scum as well, but right now we can't anticipate that. We have no idea where the next few kills are going to go to.

Had you just kept your mouth shut for a few days, then you could've gathered up enough information to blackmail your way to an easy victory. Your role is very powerful, but you doomed yourself by letting us know so early.

vote safariguy

A. That's assuming, I'm not Nked early.

B. That's also assuming there's no SKer or vig to kill me anyways.

safariguy5 wrote:Is it blackmail? Probably. But as Rodion so eloquently put it in Clue...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IMk5sMHj58I

safariguy5 wrote:I'd rather die than see town try and coerce me to help them.

I'm giving you one last chance to "play to win the game". You can take Haggis' "meta-promise" as a fair compromise: you'll basically be putting your whole mafia reputation on the line. If you agree to his terms (which are smoother than my original ones), fine. The fact that a lie would mean we'd never trust you again on any sort of gambit should be enough to generate trust.

If you'd rather die, let me know: I'm ready to hammer.

Rodion wrote:

safariguy5 wrote:Is it blackmail? Probably. But as Rodion so eloquently put it in Clue...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IMk5sMHj58I

safariguy5 wrote:I'd rather die than see town try and coerce me to help them.

I'm giving you one last chance to "play to win the game". You can take Haggis' "meta-promise" as a fair compromise: you'll basically be putting your whole mafia reputation on the line. If you agree to his terms (which are smoother than my original ones), fine. The fact that a lie would mean we'd never trust you again on any sort of gambit should be enough to generate trust.

If you'd rather die, let me know: I'm ready to hammer.

I request Doc protection tonight, in exchange for 2 night actions to HoTK. Will negotiate on a night by night basis, no deals throughout the game.

Meh. Pointless lynch is still pointless. I will have no part in it. I'd just like to state for the record that my problems with this stem not from probabilities but from the fact that we know for certain we're no lynching mafia.

safariguy5 wrote:

Rodion wrote:

safariguy5 wrote:Is it blackmail? Probably. But as Rodion so eloquently put it in Clue...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IMk5sMHj58I

safariguy5 wrote:I'd rather die than see town try and coerce me to help them.

I'm giving you one last chance to "play to win the game". You can take Haggis' "meta-promise" as a fair compromise: you'll basically be putting your whole mafia reputation on the line. If you agree to his terms (which are smoother than my original ones), fine. The fact that a lie would mean we'd never trust you again on any sort of gambit should be enough to generate trust.

If you'd rather die, let me know: I'm ready to hammer.

I request Doc protection tonight, in exchange for 2 night actions to HoTK. Will negotiate on a night by night basis, no deals throughout the game.

The problem of a night by night negotiation is that once you make it to D2 you can effectively blackmail us. If we sign on the dotted line we will get help for one night, but will have to face the consequences for the remainder of the game. I'd rather pressure you to commit to a longterm deal.

pancakemix wrote:Meh. Pointless lynch is still pointless. I will have no part in it. I'd just like to state for the record that my problems with this stem not from probabilities but from the fact that we know for certain we're no lynching mafia.

Just because he isn't mafia technically, if we let him live there is a good chance he will become a mafia sympathizer. And regardless of what side he joins, he still has to give scum at least one bit of information. Just one or two bad pieces of information could seriously cripple town.

Rodion wrote:

safariguy5 wrote:

Rodion wrote:

safariguy5 wrote:Is it blackmail? Probably. But as Rodion so eloquently put it in Clue...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IMk5sMHj58I

safariguy5 wrote:I'd rather die than see town try and coerce me to help them.

I'm giving you one last chance to "play to win the game". You can take Haggis' "meta-promise" as a fair compromise: you'll basically be putting your whole mafia reputation on the line. If you agree to his terms (which are smoother than my original ones), fine. The fact that a lie would mean we'd never trust you again on any sort of gambit should be enough to generate trust.

If you'd rather die, let me know: I'm ready to hammer.

I request Doc protection tonight, in exchange for 2 night actions to HoTK. Will negotiate on a night by night basis, no deals throughout the game.

The problem of a night by night negotiation is that once you make it to D2 you can effectively blackmail us. If we sign on the dotted line we will get help for one night, but will have to face the consequences for the remainder of the game. I'd rather pressure you to commit to a longterm deal.

Yeah, but coercing a deal out of me isn't going to make me more willing to play ball. If town plays well and gets some mafia lynches, then the possibility of me becoming a mafia sympathizer becomes lower. I mean, town has a lot more members, it would take several mistakes for the balance to swing towards mafia. If I commit now, then not only are you tying up your doctor for the time being, mafia still are getting information. This way, you're only protecting me for now, you can easily switch to someone else later and not cut deals with me. That gives me flexibility and the doctor flexibility.

I'm honestly saddened by how paranoid the people in this game are.

naxus wrote:I'm honestly saddened by how paranoid the people in this game are.

Well my friends say I have problems with being paranoid but I'll drop the hammer vote Saf

Vote count
safariguy-10- daze, talapus, chapcrap, bgthebrain, haggis, bleed, strikewolf, /, squirrel, jonty
kwanton-2-saxlad, nagerous
edocsil-1- safariguy,
chap-3- pancakemix, naxus, edoc
talapus-1-rodion
That's a lynch. Scene coming.

Ned Stark
Upon his arrival into King's Landing Ned Stark was immediately rushed through small councils and meeting the others who made the city tick. Many new faces, many faces that were new the last time that Ned looked upon them. The discussions and introductions were pleasant enough, but Ned knew that many were facades and he longed for the North again, where he dealt with the straightforward, honest and honourable men. Though the city proved to be otherwise, one unlikely member of the small council was very honest in his abilities and disdain for the political game of the others.

The plump foreign eunuch had given others enough cause to distrust him with those attributes, but Ned saw how quickly this city would turn upon one of its own. Calls of treason, conspiracy and others were made. People quickly remembered that Varys worked for the Mad King and how he turned on him when he was ousted by Robert Baratheon and his allies, and people wondered if he would do the same if another challenger rose. To make matters worse Varys refused to bow to pressure and swear direct allegiance to the King Robert Baratheon and him only. As the day progressed, he was dragged before the king, looking defiant and brave as fat eunuch could.
Ned Stark rose and asked: "Tell me something Varys, who do you truly serve?"
The eunuch looked up: "The realm my lord. Someone has to"
A murmur went through the crowd and shouts of treason intensified. Ser Ilyn Payne, the executioner, brought out the sword and Varys struggled until the end. Ned distrusted the man but the liked the style of the execution little. The King had ordered the death as the crowd shouted for it, but he had refused to look at the eunuch's last moments.

Safariguy5-Varys-Master of Whisperers has been lynched

After the execution Ned found Robert amongst his wine, a troubling common place for him.
"Was that wise? Varys often spoke of his little birds that provided him with much information, he could have proven to be useful" he asked
"And he could have just as easily sold us out, Ned." Robert appeared both resigned "There's a war coming, Ned. I don't know who we'll be fighting, but it's coming"
A long silence filled the air. Ned knew he was right, that the peace that Robert Baratheon had created when he stepped onto the Iron Throne was unraveling but he did not know what to say. He saw the last shafts of sunlight slowly disappear and the Stark words ran through his head. Winter is coming.

Night 1 has begun. Send in your night actions, you have approximately 3 days to do so.