Conquer Club

the fatty is a hipocrite, deep inside: he is gay for kwan.

I am against ALL marriage, not just gay ones.

unriggable wrote:

gryffin13 wrote:

the_fatty wrote:if there not gay then why care?

let's see if you are smart enough to comprehend this.

"When the Nazis came for the communists,
I remained silent;
I was not a communist.

When they locked up the social democrats,
I remained silent;
I was not a social democrat.

When they came for the trade unionists,
I did not speak out;
I was not a trade unionist.

When they came for the Jews,
I remained silent;
I wasn't a Jew.

When they came for me,
there was no one left to speak out."

- Martin Niemöller (translation)

The gays are coming. Watch out.

Seriously, what's going to happen? You're probably the same kind of person that thinks that if we legalize pot, there's a slippery slope; we'd then legalize cocaine, then heroine, etc. etc. etc. Or the type of person that thinks that if we nationalize healthcare for everybody, we'd slip into socialism. We let the gays marry, it's not like more gays will pop out of bushes and 'infect' the cities. It's not like the dudes who want to marry their dogs would want to make a law. It would end there. No questions asked.

unriggable, are you talking about me, or the fatty?

ok im a christian..but i am for gay marriage...
i know several people who are gay and the yare awesome guys and girls. i have nothing against any of them, sure god did intend for marriage to be between a man and a woman but gods rules are not bindin as such, they are guidelines and if you follow them you live your life better. having said that if gay people want to be together go for it. ps fatty back off on the homphob stuff mmmk

OnlyAmbrose wrote:Why the hell should the government be dictating who should get married? It's never made ANY sense to me. There is absolutely no reason why the government should have any say in this.

I think homosexual behavior is wrong, immoral, and against the Word of God, but I do not think that the government should have any say in a person's choice to do it or not. I would certainly be one to speak out against homosexuality, but I would NOT be one to speak in favor of the government stopping it.

Do you have anything to back up "wrong and immoral", or are you just saying "against the word of God" three times?

Neutrino wrote:

OnlyAmbrose wrote:Why the hell should the government be dictating who should get married? It's never made ANY sense to me. There is absolutely no reason why the government should have any say in this.

I think homosexual behavior is wrong, immoral, and against the Word of God, but I do not think that the government should have any say in a person's choice to do it or not. I would certainly be one to speak out against homosexuality, but I would NOT be one to speak in favor of the government stopping it.

Do you have anything to back up "wrong and immoral", or are you just saying "against the word of God" three times?

I guess you might say that. The distinction I was trying to make, I guess, between "wrong/immoral" and "The Word of God" is the distinction between Natural Law and Scriptural Law. But, given that they're both God's laws, I guess it's essentially the same thing.

unriggable wrote:Against the word of God? God makes the animals, right? So why are there gay penguins?

I'm not sure if you're trying to make a valid argument... but I guess I'll humor you, lol.

Animals have no soul. Therefore they cannot sin. There is no good or evil as applied exclusively to the behavior of animals.

But all of this is moot anyways, because it has nothing to do with whether or not gay marriage should be legal under the law of the United States of America.

I find it interesting that of 20 people who voted "no" only 3 or 4 have commented. I'll take that to mean that they have no basis for their beliefs so they won't try to stand up for them.

I have no problems against gay marriage. I believe the only explicit reference/condemnation of homosexuality comes from the book of Leviticus ("If a man has sexual relations with a man as one does with a woman, both of them have done what is detestable. They are to be put to death; their blood will be on their own heads." [20:13]). But, then again, Leviticus also prohibits cutting your sideburns (19:27) and eating shellfish (11:11-11:12). Skimming wikipedia a bit, it seems that any other mentions of homosexuality are simply references, but not laws. If you want to talk about whether or not homosexuality is moral, then it all boils down to whether it is genetic or a choice.

OnlyAmbrose wrote:
I guess you might say that. The distinction I was trying to make, I guess, between "wrong/immoral" and "The Word of God" is the distinction between Natural Law and Scriptural Law. But, given that they're both God's laws, I guess it's essentially the same thing.

Presumably by Natural Law you mean Physical Law, yes?
How can something be wrong/immoral according to any of the various Physical Laws? Being eaten by a bear is neither wrong, nor immoral from the bear's point of view (from your point of view it's very wrong, but I don't see how you can claim it's immoral) and the actual laws themselves certainly don't care. As far as we can tell, the Second Law of Thermodynamics neither cares, nor has any additional impact whether you are homosexual or not.

OnlyAmbrose wrote:I'm not sure if you're trying to make a valid argument... but I guess I'll humor you, lol.

Animals have no soul. Therefore they cannot sin. There is no good or evil as applied exclusively to the behavior of animals.

Then why would God code these animals to perform homosexual acts if it personally despises them?

America is...

ONE NATION UNDER GOD.

That is the god of the bible.

Why do gays want to be married?

I think it is because they want life to be easier on them. Like for insurance purposes or something. I am not sure why they want to have a union that was made by God for people who are not the same sex. The bible says men shouldn't lay with men.

If they want to adopt some sort of ritual that is marriage like, they are allowed to do that, however the USA will not recognize it, because We are one nation under god. The bible has no mention of same sex marriages.

I could not vote on this issue, because I don't know why gays want to be married?

If it is for the reason that they want a commitment on paper,or insurance and other benefits, like taxes and community property, I say yes, they should be able to do that.

If it is because they believe that it is important to make a commitment before God and witnesses, then NO because the bible does not talk, allow or condone gays being married.

They should be able to have some sort of Legal and Binding Acknowledgment, However, it shouldn't be called a marriage.
They need to leave God and the bible out of their Legal commitment.

I like the idea of a Civil Union, that is a good way to call it.

And all the legal aspects and benefits that come from being married should be made to accept All Civil Unions.

Beastly wrote:America is...

ONE NATION UNDER GOD.

That is the god of the bible.

Why do gays want to be married?

I think it is because they want life to be easier on them. Like for insurance purposes or something. I am not sure why they want to have a union that was made by God for people who are not the same sex. The bible says men shouldn't lay with men.

If they want to adopt some sort of ritual that is marriage like, they are allowed to do that, however the USA will not recognize it, because We are one nation under god. The bible has no mention of same sex marriages.

I could not vote on this issue, because I don't know why gays want to be married?

If it is for the reason that they want a commitment on paper,or insurance and other benefits, like taxes and community property, I say yes, they should be able to do that.

If it is because they believe that it is important to make a commitment before God and witnesses, then NO because the bible does not talk, allow or condone gays being married.

They should be able to have some sort of Legal and Binding Acknowledgment, However, it shouldn't be called a marriage.
They need to leave God and the bible out of their Legal commitment.

I like the idea of a Civil Union, that is a good way to call it.

And all the legal aspects and benefits that come from being married should be made to accept All Civil Unions.

you're right the bible does say “Thou shalt not lie with mankind, as with womankind: it is abomination.” - Leviticus 18:22

it also says "For six days work may be done, but on the seventh day you shall have a holy day, a sabbath of complete rest to the LORD; whoever does any work on it shall be put to death.” - Exodus 35:2

have you ever worked on sunday? should we kill you?

and it also says "If a man sells his daughter as a female slave, she is not to go free as the male slaves do.” - Exodus 21:7

funny though, I had this thought that our "NATION UNDER GOD" abolished slavery. Am I wrong?

So which is it? Does our country follow the laws of the bible and its god or not?

gryffin13 wrote:

Beastly wrote:America is...

ONE NATION UNDER GOD.

That is the god of the bible.

Why do gays want to be married?

I think it is because they want life to be easier on them. Like for insurance purposes or something. I am not sure why they want to have a union that was made by God for people who are not the same sex. The bible says men shouldn't lay with men.

If they want to adopt some sort of ritual that is marriage like, they are allowed to do that, however the USA will not recognize it, because We are one nation under god. The bible has no mention of same sex marriages.

I could not vote on this issue, because I don't know why gays want to be married?

If it is for the reason that they want a commitment on paper,or insurance and other benefits, like taxes and community property, I say yes, they should be able to do that.

If it is because they believe that it is important to make a commitment before God and witnesses, then NO because the bible does not talk, allow or condone gays being married.

They should be able to have some sort of Legal and Binding Acknowledgment, However, it shouldn't be called a marriage.
They need to leave God and the bible out of their Legal commitment.

I like the idea of a Civil Union, that is a good way to call it.

And all the legal aspects and benefits that come from being married should be made to accept All Civil Unions.

you're right the bible does say “Thou shalt not lie with mankind, as with womankind: it is abomination.” - Leviticus 18:22

it also says "For six days work may be done, but on the seventh day you shall have a holy day, a sabbath of complete rest to the LORD; whoever does any work on it shall be put to death.” - Exodus 35:2

have you ever worked on sunday? should we kill you?

and it also says "If a man sells his daughter as a female slave, she is not to go free as the male slaves do.” - Exodus 21:7

funny though, I had this thought that our "NATION UNDER GOD" abolished slavery. Am I wrong?

So which is it? Does our country follow the laws of the bible and its god or not?

Actually the Sabbath was originaly Saturday so all those who had part time jobs in College are in trouble

Beastly wrote:America is...

ONE NATION UNDER GOD.

That is the god of the bible.

I fail to see why that would be the God of the Bible, as I don't doubt there are many non-religious or non-christian people in teh us of a.

Why do gays want to be married?

I think it is because they want life to be easier on them. Like for insurance purposes or something.

Because they don't want different rules from other people just because of their preferences.

I am not sure why they want to have a union that was made by God for people who are not the same sex. The bible says men shouldn't lay with men.
If they want to adopt some sort of ritual that is marriage like, they are allowed to do that, however the USA will not recognize it, because We are one nation under god. The bible has no mention of same sex marriages.

Why are christians always hogging the term marriage as something invented by them? Because they sure as hell didn't.
In this modern western world, marriage is mainly a legal and personal thing. The state only needs to know you're married and it gives a rat's ass whether you're a hindu, muslim or christian. And many people do it as a form of devotion and commitment to their partner, not God.

If it is for the reason that they want a commitment on paper,or insurance and other benefits, like taxes and community property, I say yes, they should be able to do that.

Add to that: "Not being discriminated against" and you're pretty spot on.

If it is because they believe that it is important to make a commitment before God and witnesses, then NO because the bible does not talk, allow or condone gays being married.

If I get married I'm not making a commitment to God either, but it sure as hell will be called marriage. And that's what gays are asking.

They should be able to have some sort of Legal and Binding Acknowledgment, However, it shouldn't be called a marriage.
They need to leave God and the bible out of their Legal commitment.

MARRIAGE IS NOT A CHRISTIAN TERM!

Beastly wrote:America is...

ONE NATION UNDER GOD.

That is the god of the bible.

Why do gays want to be married?

I think it is because they want life to be easier on them. Like for insurance purposes or something. I am not sure why they want to have a union that was made by God for people who are not the same sex. The bible says men shouldn't lay with men.

If they want to adopt some sort of ritual that is marriage like, they are allowed to do that, however the USA will not recognize it, because We are one nation under god. The bible has no mention of same sex marriages.

I could not vote on this issue, because I don't know why gays want to be married?

If it is for the reason that they want a commitment on paper,or insurance and other benefits, like taxes and community property, I say yes, they should be able to do that.

If it is because they believe that it is important to make a commitment before God and witnesses, then NO because the bible does not talk, allow or condone gays being married.

They should be able to have some sort of Legal and Binding Acknowledgment, However, it shouldn't be called a marriage.
They need to leave God and the bible out of their Legal commitment.

I like the idea of a Civil Union, that is a good way to call it.

And all the legal aspects and benefits that come from being married should be made to accept All Civil Unions.

So you're saying gay marriage for fraudulant purposes is acceptable, but not so if the two ACTUALLY love each other?

Chris7He wrote:So you're saying gay marriage for fraudulant purposes is acceptable, but not so if the two ACTUALLY love each other?

Sounds reasonable to me... what's the problem here?

Beastly wrote:America is...

ONE NATION UNDER GOD.

That is the god of the bible.

Look at the treaty of tripoli.

"As the Government of the United States of America is not, in any sense, founded on the Christian religion; as it has in itself no character of enmity against the laws, religion, or tranquillity, of Musselmen; and as the said States never have entered into any war or act of hostility against any Mehomitan nation, it is declared by the parties that no pretext arising from religious opinions shall ever produce an interruption of the harmony existing between the two countries."

Sure, it's a treaty and has no legal value, but these are written by the same people who created the country and shows their intentions very, very well.

When it says "rights endowed by the creator" it is not a reference to God, but rather that rights are not given to people by government or other people (because if it were written that way then the government could just as easily take them away), they are just part of everybody.

Three reasons why Gay Marriage should be legal (and also why the term "Civil Union" is an illegal cop-out):

Reason the First: There is no consensus as to whether or not homosexual couples who marry have any effect on the stability of the institution of marriage as a whole. The idea of protecting the institution from people who want to be institutionalized is akin to opening a restaurant and then not letting anyone eat any food.

Reason the Second: Gay Marriage should be made legal simply because there's no really good reason why it should be illegal. There is no statement to back this up, simply because I think this is the most obvious reason.

Reason the Third: Gay Marriage alternatives (i.e. Civil Unions) are separate entities from the legal term marriage. Under the Supreme Court decision Brown v. Board of Education, the "Separate, but Equal" doctrine was declared to be unconstitutional. In other words, denying specific rights to a group of people based on their difference from the majority, but giving them rights that are "just as good" isn't just as good. Either everyone is treated equally, or the system breaks down. You can't have different water fountains for whites and non-whites, and you can't have different forms of marriage for heterosexuals and non-heterosexuals.



That's my statement.

vtmarik wrote:Three reasons why Gay Marriage should be legal (and also why the term "Civil Union" is an illegal cop-out):

Reason the First: There is no consensus as to whether or not homosexual couples who marry have any effect on the stability of the institution of marriage as a whole. The idea of protecting the institution from people who want to be institutionalized is akin to opening a restaurant and then not letting anyone eat any food.

Reason the Second: Gay Marriage should be made legal simply because there's no really good reason why it should be illegal. There is no statement to back this up, simply because I think this is the most obvious reason.

Reason the Third: Gay Marriage alternatives (i.e. Civil Unions) are separate entities from the legal term marriage. Under the Supreme Court decision Brown v. Board of Education, the "Separate, but Equal" doctrine was declared to be unconstitutional. In other words, denying specific rights to a group of people based on their difference from the majority, but giving them rights that are "just as good" isn't just as good. Either everyone is treated equally, or the system breaks down. You can't have different water fountains for whites and non-whites, and you can't have different forms of marriage for heterosexuals and non-heterosexuals.



That's my statement.

I fully agree.

Beastly wrote:America is...

ONE NATION UNDER GOD.

That is the god of the bible.

::cough choke hack:: What?!

I could write 10 paragraphs on why I think it should be legal, but it would only be pretty much what people alreay have said and I have a feeling that few people would actually read the whole thing.. lol

All I'm trying to say is: yes to legalizing gay marriage!

If you legalise gay marriage they might have gay sex, thus giving birth to a load of gay babies. Very soon it'd be an epidemic and we'd be overrun with gays.

Or something.

lol yeah, you make a good point there.. Wouldn't want that to happen

Ariel* wrote:lol yeah, you make a good point there.. Wouldn't want that to happen

I would! The most fun I've ever had has been with gay people!

hecter wrote:

Ariel* wrote:lol yeah, you make a good point there.. Wouldn't want that to happen

I would! The most fun I've ever had has been with gay people!

lol I'm sure..