Conquer Club

Wow, there's a ton of bad audio live versions on youtube. I nearly choked to death watching "turettes squirrel" on my search. Obviously the language is not suitable for work if you go watch it.

b.k. barunt wrote:You can't be serious. That's gotta be the most ridiculous comparison i've heard in a long time. "Rounded up by 'lawful' authorities and taken away" - they were dragged out of their homes, frequently beaten, raped, etc. and packed in railroad cars like a bunch of cattle. Many were killed before they could be "rounded up by 'lawful' authorities".

Never heard of "Glaus Nacht" (Not sure of the sp, anyhow it's German for "Glass Night")? So named because they broke every fucking window in the Jewish shops and homes. Did they do that to the Japanese?

No, I’m perfectly serious. I’m looking strictly at the POV of the average citizen at the time of the incident. Officers of the law were often brutal in their pursuit of their duty in that era. What happened afterward is not germane to the question of the response of the people at the time of the rounding up.

(Note: it’s “Kristallnacht” which is literally “Crystal Night”) These coordinated riots were actually a government smokescreen that was used to really put the screws on the population to allow the holocaust to take place, namely, the forced closure of Jewish newspapers, their expulsion from the state school system, removal of their rights of citizenship, their forced disarmament, and the creation of the concentration camp system.

Given the general deception on the part of the Nazi government, this only lends argument to my own argument that the average person would have not deliberately went against the lawful authority unless they were keenly aware of the massive con job on the part of their leader. The situation could be easily described by the current press secretary to the President of the United States, “never let a crisis go to waste.”

BigBallinStalin wrote:I heard about this one case where a woman in an alley was being raped. This alley had on either side tall residential blocks, apartments, or whatever they're called. So it's loud, and people look out the window and see what's happening, but no one called the police--I think they arrived an hour after the incident, because someone eventually called.

What's this phenomena called in Psychology? Anyone here remember?

Wasn't that taken from The Watchmen? Or was the Watchmen incident based on a real event?

strike wolf wrote:

BigBallinStalin wrote:I heard about this one case where a woman in an alley was being raped. This alley had on either side tall residential blocks, apartments, or whatever they're called. So it's loud, and people look out the window and see what's happening, but no one called the police--I think they arrived an hour after the incident, because someone eventually called.

What's this phenomena called in Psychology? Anyone here remember?

Wasn't that taken from The Watchmen? Or was the Watchmen incident based on a real event?

Real event. Kitty Genovese.

tzor if I'm following, you're saying that while the thing happened it looked much different if you were there, than it would even to a person that was there, looking back and having enough time to process things. It might have seemed normal at the time.

Still hard to imagine when seeing film of things being razed and pictures of arms and legs sticking out of the sides of a nazi cattle car. I can make a parallel to the internment here and the theft of property, still the distruction of property in front of the owner seems more traumatic to me.

I have watched programs with Japanese people that talk about it, they said they were told it was temporary and they could go back home after the war. They also said they believed it until they were released and found out the trught. Even though that was a lie and a horrible thing because they ended up being stripped of all their rightfull property. It's totally different like was suggested here.

Also it's well documented that there were cases where axis soldiers being held here claimed the Nazi prisoners were the only thing you'd have to fear as a prisoner of war in North American camps. I would have to think the Japanese internment camps would be similar in resonable treatment relative to the situation. Yes it was horrible but I can't compare it to Auswitz or what ever camp you name over in Europe.

2dimes wrote:tzor if I'm following, you're saying that while the thing happened it looked much different if you were there, than it would even to a person that was there, looking back and having enough time to process things. It might have seemed normal at the time.

Still hard to imagine when seeing film of things being razed and pictures of arms and legs sticking out of the sides of a nazi cattle car. I can make a parallel to the internment here and the theft of property, still the distruction of property in front of the owner seems more traumatic to me.

I have watched programs with Japanese people that talk about it, they said they were told it was temporary and they could go back home after the war. They also said they believed it until they were released and found out the trught. Even though that was a lie and a horrible thing because they ended up being stripped of all their rightfull property. It's totally different like was suggested here.

Also it's well documented that there were cases where axis soldiers being held here claimed the Nazi prisoners were the only thing you'd have to fear as a prisoner of war in North American camps. I would have to think the Japanese internment camps would be similar in resonable treatment relative to the situation. Yes it was horrible but I can't compare it to Auswitz or what ever camp you name over in Europe.

Great points.

As a German I can say, verily, that the British-backed fascist forces that took temporary control in my former country committed far worse atrocities against the Jews than the Canadian internment of Japanese in British Columbia during the 1940s.

Simply on a matter of scale, the Canadians only interred 14,000 Japanese relative to the millions of Jews the British-backed Nazi regime persecuted.

The atrocities of the Nazis against Jews, Roma and Homosexuals simply cannot be compared to those of the Canadians against the Japanese. They are on different levels entirely.

Um, yeah. So I'm thinking the 'merican camps were probably worse than the Canuck ones but still not as far removed as the Nazi ones. Regardless of who backed them.

Would part of the confusion stem from "British Columbia" vs. "British Backed"? I guess it could be tough to keep that whole thing straight.

Snorri1234 wrote:

strike wolf wrote:

BigBallinStalin wrote:I heard about this one case where a woman in an alley was being raped. This alley had on either side tall residential blocks, apartments, or whatever they're called. So it's loud, and people look out the window and see what's happening, but no one called the police--I think they arrived an hour after the incident, because someone eventually called.

What's this phenomena called in Psychology? Anyone here remember?

Wasn't that taken from The Watchmen? Or was the Watchmen incident based on a real event?

Real event. Kitty Genovese.

This really did happen. There was also a woman raped in the middle of traffic and no one did anything. A few years ago a man died on the subway and his corpse rode the subway all day before anyone bothered to notice.

I do not miss New York.

2dimes wrote:Um, yeah. So I'm thinking the 'merican camps were probably worse than the Canuck ones but still not as far removed as the Nazi ones. Regardless of who backed them.

So, "um", "yeah", that's what you're "thinking", huh? Well, a "gut feeling" is good enough for a Ph.D. dissertation at the Univ. of Windsor so I'll agree to accept your slightly unconventional standards of evidence. Not having had my precious little head filled to the brim by the CBC with glowing stories of my nations innate goodness and universal popularity I'll acknowledge this may simply be a - in the words of Thomas Sewell - "Conflict of Visions."

Though, I'd honestly forgot the Americans had such camps. I just recall reading horror stories of Canadian torture camps that were operated in B.C. to terrorize Canada's non-white minority population. I suppose that's where the Canadian Airborne Regiment got their inspiration from when they were using Somali kids as target practice.

Oh no you di'nt say dat, Saxi! --- Oh helzz yes, I did!

2dimes wrote:Would part of the confusion stem from "British Columbia" vs. "British Backed"? I guess it could be tough to keep that whole thing straight.

Hmmm ... not sure what you're referring to here. Then again, I'm not sure you're sure what you're referring to here either. Would I be correct?

Thanks, 2dimes!
- Saxi!
Unofficial CC Happiness Ombudsman

saxitoxin wrote:
Though, I'd honestly forgot the Americans had such camps. I just recall reading horror stories of Canadian torture camps that were operated in B.C. to terrorize Canada's non-white minority population. I suppose that's where the Canadian Airborne Regiment got their inspiration from when they were using Somali kids as target practice.

Thanks, 2dimes!
- Saxi!
Unofficial CC Happiness Ombudsman

Happiness Ombudsman Fail

Symmetry wrote:

saxitoxin wrote:
So, "um", "yeah", that's what you're "thinking", huh? Well, a "gut feeling" is good enough for a Ph.D. dissertation at the Univ. of Windsor so I'll agree to accept your slightly unconventional standards of evidence. Not having had my precious little head filled to the brim by the CBC with glowing stories of my nations innate goodness and universal popularity I'll acknowledge this may simply be a - in the words of Thomas Sewell - "Conflict of Visions."

Though, I'd honestly forgot the Americans had such camps. I just recall reading horror stories of Canadian torture camps that were operated in B.C. to terrorize Canada's non-white minority population. I suppose that's where the Canadian Airborne Regiment got their inspiration from when they were using Somali kids as target practice.

Oh no you di'nt say dat, Saxi! --- Oh helzz yes, I did!

2dimes wrote:Would part of the confusion stem from "British Columbia" vs. "British Backed"? I guess it could be tough to keep that whole thing straight.

Hmmm ... not sure what you're referring to here. Then again, I'm not sure you're sure what you're referring to here either. Would I be correct?

Thanks, 2dimes!
- Saxi!
Unofficial CC Happiness Ombudsman

Happiness Ombudsman Fail

Sorry, as anyone who has been around CC knows, Canadians are my weak spot.

Having gone tete-a-tete with Canadian imperialists in Angola in the '70's and seeing, first hand, their great crimes against humanity it doesn't take much to push me over the edge in calling-out their inherent national racism. Further, as a former mental health professional it unhinges me to know the uncorrected delusion they have as to how the rest of the world views them which is not in sync with reality.

However, I know that an inclusive society can only be built when we handle these corrective educational opportunities in a private, dignified manner and I blame myself if sometimes the mere sight of a Maple Leaf causes me a knee-jerk reaction.

I'm going to give myself a verbal warning on this one, gang.

Sorry,
Sad Saxi

saxitoxin wrote:

Symmetry wrote:

saxitoxin wrote:
So, "um", "yeah", that's what you're "thinking", huh? Well, a "gut feeling" is good enough for a Ph.D. dissertation at the Univ. of Windsor so I'll agree to accept your slightly unconventional standards of evidence. Not having had my precious little head filled to the brim by the CBC with glowing stories of my nations innate goodness and universal popularity I'll acknowledge this may simply be a - in the words of Thomas Sewell - "Conflict of Visions."

Though, I'd honestly forgot the Americans had such camps. I just recall reading horror stories of Canadian torture camps that were operated in B.C. to terrorize Canada's non-white minority population. I suppose that's where the Canadian Airborne Regiment got their inspiration from when they were using Somali kids as target practice.

Oh no you di'nt say dat, Saxi! --- Oh helzz yes, I did!

2dimes wrote:Would part of the confusion stem from "British Columbia" vs. "British Backed"? I guess it could be tough to keep that whole thing straight.

Hmmm ... not sure what you're referring to here. Then again, I'm not sure you're sure what you're referring to here either. Would I be correct?

Thanks, 2dimes!
- Saxi!
Unofficial CC Happiness Ombudsman

Happiness Ombudsman Fail

Sorry, as anyone who has been around CC knows, Canadians are my weak spot.

Having gone tete-a-tete with Canadian imperialists in Angola in the '70's and seeing, first hand, their great crimes against humanity it doesn't take much to push me over the edge in calling-out their inherent national racism. Further, as a former mental health professional it unhinges me to know the uncorrected delusion they have as to how the rest of the world views them which is not in sync with reality.

However, I know that an inclusive society can only be built when we handle these corrective educational opportunities in a private, dignified manner and I blame myself if sometimes the mere sight of a Maple Leaf causes me a knee-jerk reaction.

I'm going to give myself a verbal warning on this one, gang.

Sorry,
Sad Saxi

Sometimes the road to social justice leads to short turns towards unhappy moments.

BigBallinStalin wrote:

saxitoxin wrote:

Symmetry wrote:

saxitoxin wrote:
So, "um", "yeah", that's what you're "thinking", huh? Well, a "gut feeling" is good enough for a Ph.D. dissertation at the Univ. of Windsor so I'll agree to accept your slightly unconventional standards of evidence. Not having had my precious little head filled to the brim by the CBC with glowing stories of my nations innate goodness and universal popularity I'll acknowledge this may simply be a - in the words of Thomas Sewell - "Conflict of Visions."

Though, I'd honestly forgot the Americans had such camps. I just recall reading horror stories of Canadian torture camps that were operated in B.C. to terrorize Canada's non-white minority population. I suppose that's where the Canadian Airborne Regiment got their inspiration from when they were using Somali kids as target practice.

Oh no you di'nt say dat, Saxi! --- Oh helzz yes, I did!

2dimes wrote:Would part of the confusion stem from "British Columbia" vs. "British Backed"? I guess it could be tough to keep that whole thing straight.

Hmmm ... not sure what you're referring to here. Then again, I'm not sure you're sure what you're referring to here either. Would I be correct?

Thanks, 2dimes!
- Saxi!
Unofficial CC Happiness Ombudsman

Happiness Ombudsman Fail

Sorry, as anyone who has been around CC knows, Canadians are my weak spot.

Having gone tete-a-tete with Canadian imperialists in Angola in the '70's and seeing, first hand, their great crimes against humanity it doesn't take much to push me over the edge in calling-out their inherent national racism. Further, as a former mental health professional it unhinges me to know the uncorrected delusion they have as to how the rest of the world views them which is not in sync with reality.

However, I know that an inclusive society can only be built when we handle these corrective educational opportunities in a private, dignified manner and I blame myself if sometimes the mere sight of a Maple Leaf causes me a knee-jerk reaction.

I'm going to give myself a verbal warning on this one, gang.

Sorry,
Sad Saxi

Sometimes the road to social justice leads to short turns towards unhappy moments.

Thanks, BBS. Could really use a cyber-hug here right now.

saxitoxin wrote:

saxitoxin wrote:

BigBallinStalin wrote:

saxitoxin wrote:

2dimes wrote:Would part of the confusion stem from "British Columbia" vs. "British Backed"? I guess it could be tough to keep that whole thing straight.

Hmmm ... not sure what you're referring to here. Then again, I'm not sure you're sure what you're referring to here either. Would I be correct?

Thanks, 2dimes!
- Saxi!
Unofficial CC Happiness Ombudsman

Sorry, as anyone who has been around CC knows, Canadians are my weak spot.

Having gone tete-a-tete with Canadian imperialists in Angola in the '70's and seeing, first hand, their great crimes against humanity it doesn't take much to push me over the edge in calling-out their inherent national racism. Further, as a former mental health professional it unhinges me to know the uncorrected delusion they have as to how the rest of the world views them which is not in sync with reality.

However, I know that an inclusive society can only be built when we handle these corrective educational opportunities in a private, dignified manner and I blame myself if sometimes the mere sight of a Maple Leaf causes me a knee-jerk reaction.

I'm going to give myself a verbal warning on this one, gang.

Sorry,
Sad Saxi

Sometimes the road to social justice leads to short turns towards unhappy moments.

Thanks, BBS. Could really use a cyber-hug here right now.

How bout a T-Shirt instead?

BigBallinStalin wrote:
Sometimes the road to social justice leads to short turns towards unhappy moments.

Thanks, BBS. Could really use a cyber-hug here right now.[/quote]

How bout a T-Shirt instead?

[/quote]

REPORTED FOR FLAMING AND BAITING

Thanks, BBS!
- Saxi!
Unofficial CC Happiness Ombudsman

This is what happens when we entrust happiness to unofficial, unelected ombudsmen. We need greater government oversight if we are to restore the public's faith in happiness.

Symmetry wrote:This is what happens when we entrust happiness to unofficial, unelected ombudsmen. We need greater government oversight if we are to restore the public's faith in happiness.

EXCUSE ME, however, I am the originator of happiness on Conquer Club.

I will not countenance any reform package to alter the ombudsman system that has worked long and successfully on CC unless a consensus can first be built with all relevant stakeholders including public sector trade unions, business leaders and community groups.

This Discussion is Over - PERIOD

Thanks, Symmetry!
Saxi!
Unofficial CC Happiness Ombudsman

Happiness is detrimental to one's health. Whenever you become happy, you feel a high. Soon, you will be craving this high more and more until finally...
boom, you're dead.

muy_thaiguy wrote:Happiness is detrimental to one's health. Whenever you become happy, you feel a high. Soon, you will be craving this high more and more until finally...
boom, you're dead.

you just provided an excellent summary of the first chapter of On Fear by Jiddu Krishnamurti

you could be an elderly, frail, Indian cult leader if the fancy struck

saxitoxin wrote:

muy_thaiguy wrote:Happiness is detrimental to one's health. Whenever you become happy, you feel a high. Soon, you will be craving this high more and more until finally...
boom, you're dead.

you just provided an excellent summary of the first chapter of On Fear by Jiddu Krishnamurti

you could be an elderly, frail, Indian cult leader if the fancy struck

No, you're a Jiddu!

2dimes wrote:tzor if I'm following, you're saying that while the thing happened it looked much different if you were there, than it would even to a person that was there, looking back and having enough time to process things. It might have seemed normal at the time.

Still hard to imagine when seeing film of things being razed and pictures of arms and legs sticking out of the sides of a nazi cattle car. I can make a parallel to the internment here and the theft of property, still the distruction of property in front of the owner seems more traumatic to me.

First of all, I was never talking about the crammed conditions of the transportation of Jews to the death camps. A condition that would have been harder to ignore because of the severity of the situation (using cramped transports was common at the time, especially in the transport of prisioners of war from the camp to the city in order to work on the damaged buildings that the Americans carpet bombed by night and the British percision bombed during the day. But those cars were not as extreeme as the ones used for the internment of Jews.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uFRTgoN5o-c

How was anyone supposed to know he was dying, and not just passed out drunk? This video makes it look much less sensational than the media is making it out to be.

tzor I am aware you were never talking about the transportation of people to the camps. bk mentions it. I went back and grabbed a part of his ramblings.

packed in railroad cars like a bunch of cattle.

I have only seen photographs and can't ignore it. I don't see how anyone in the area could. There must have been quite a sound comming from them also. I certainly can imagine most people not wanting to get involved out of fear.

2dimes wrote:I have only seen photographs and can't ignore it. I don't see how anyone in the area could.

Where do you live that homes are built abutting rail freight yards?

In the case of Japanese put in concentration camps by Canadians, however, it was obvious to everyone and no one tried to stop it.

saxitoxin wrote:Where do you live that homes are built abutting rail freight yards?

I don't live that close to a rail road and my rail road only has a minor freight load. IIRC, however there are a lot of areas around Chicago that are built that way. Some communities are so divided that when the freight train passes by "you can't get there from here," literally for hours.