Conquer Club

sailorseal wrote:

the.killing.44 wrote:

sailorseal wrote:Which territory does ullango attach to? Also make another place that connects north and south.
I don't think I will, excluding Ullongdo possibly being like an Isle of Man.
Also
1. Rework bonus scale
Well, how so?
EXAMPLE: Grey needs to defend for territs, bonus 4
while dark green needs to defend four territs, bonus three
Yes, but in a different way than what you say. I will change Yonggang-Do (brown-red) to 2 and P'yongang-Bukto (dark green) to 4, unless of course a route from Ullongdo to Hyesan is added.

2. Make another mountain range
Where, and why?
Between sepo and munchen because sepo can be attacked by 6 other territs
Maybe between Sep'o and Sownn.

.44

the.killing.44 wrote:

sailorseal wrote:

the.killing.44 wrote:

sailorseal wrote:Which territory does ullango attach to? Also make another place that connects north and south.
I don't think I will, excluding Ullongdo possibly being like an Isle of Man.
Also
1. Rework bonus scale
Well, how so?
EXAMPLE: Grey needs to defend for territs, bonus 4
while dark green needs to defend four territs, bonus three
Yes, but in a different way than what you say. I will change Yonggang-Do (brown-red) to 2 and P'yongang-Bukto (dark green) to 4, unless of course a route from Ullongdo to Hyesan is added.

2. Make another mountain range
Where, and why?
Between sepo and munchen because sepo can be attacked by 6 other territs
Maybe between Sep'o and Sownn.
I just wanted one of the territs blocked doesn't matter which

.44

Very good then

Hi .44 - this has been my first real chance to take a good look at this map, so let me lay it on you...

For starters, I'm glad to see somebody working on a Korea map. It's a good region for a CC map, and your basic layout looks pretty good. There are plenty of good places to start (or hide), the use of impassable borders looks good, and the DMZ in the center of the map is a nice twist which could set up some interesting North-South stand-offs. I even dig the color choice.

Right now the map suffers from a few very correctable flaws which I think are really holding you back from that next level... and i know of which I speak because they are all flaws I have been guilty of. For example, you've got to keep an eye on the game engine when drawing your territories - some territories, especially the DMZ, won't hold army counts, and when you size this image down for the small map you'll have both territory size and font legibility issues. In fact, the font is tough to read already - I can't make out the name of the island.

Next, I think you should really determine what role you think the DMZ territory should play on this board, and make changes to map accordingly. As I see it now, it will be a nuisance which can be avoided by taking the sea route from north to south. If you remove the sea route, the DMZ becomes a key passage between north and south, the taking of which involves some risk.

Personally I'd like to see you play up the north-south war theme on this one... instead of the easy north-south sea route, how about an airport in the south which can bombard - but not invade - the south, and a missile installation in the north which can likewise bombard southern territories. And if you're going to set up north-south gameplay, I'd suggest you lower some of the region bonuses (+3 for Honggang-Do seems high anyway) and instead give additional bonuses for united all of South Korea and all of North Korea. This would encourage a player to focus on one half of the map, thus setting up a war across the DMZ.

And i hate to mention mountains, since that's what I always get flack for on my maps, so I won't do it and will just say that I'm certain the graphics will continue to improve.

Thanks a ton for that, oak. I really like that bombardment idea — I'll work on it later (I'm going skiing now ). The mountains are more of a placeholder right now because I can't find anything that suits the map. Also, I'll keep experimenting with new fonts. v7 with the bombardments should be up tonight.

.44

I really like the overall look of this map. Its simple, but effective.

sailorseal wrote:

the.killing.44 wrote:

sailorseal wrote:

the.killing.44 wrote:

sailorseal wrote:2. Make another mountain range
Where, and why?
Between sepo and munchen because sepo can be attacked by 6 other territs
Maybe between Sep'o and Sownn.
I just wanted one of the territs blocked doesn't matter which

I disagree. Don't create mountains where they don't actually exist. The bonus for Pyongang-Namde is appropiate because you only have to protect 3 territories to defend it.

oaktown wrote:Next, I think you should really determine what role you think the DMZ territory should play on this board, and make changes to map accordingly. As I see it now, it will be a nuisance which can be avoided by taking the sea route from north to south. If you remove the sea route, the DMZ becomes a key passage between north and south, the taking of which involves some risk.

I like oaktown's suggestions. If the DMZ becomes a key passage, I think you should up the neutral armies to 10. It should be very difficult to pass.

lostatlimbo wrote:I disagree. Don't create mountains where they don't actually exist. The bonus for Pyongang-Namde is appropiate because you only have to protect 3 territories to defend it.
I go back to this:

I could easily make a small one between Sep'o and Kanggye, but farther South would be pushing it. And yes, I agree with you on the bonus.

lostatlimbo wrote:

oaktown wrote:Next, I think you should really determine what role you think the DMZ territory should play on this board, and make changes to map accordingly. As I see it now, it will be a nuisance which can be avoided by taking the sea route from north to south. If you remove the sea route, the DMZ becomes a key passage between north and south, the taking of which involves some risk.

I like oaktown's suggestions. If the DMZ becomes a key passage, I think you should up the neutral armies to 10. It should be very difficult to pass.
Yes, I do agree it should be upped. But maybe to 7 or 8, 10 does seem like a lot …

Thanks for your comment,
.44

oaktown wrote:In fact, the font is tough to read already - I can't make out the name of the island.
Personally I'd like to see you play up the north-south war theme on this one

I agree with both of these points in a very strong way

sailorseal wrote:

oaktown wrote:In fact, the font is tough to read already - I can't make out the name of the island.

I agree with both of these points in a very strong way

Hmm, as I recall you were one of the top supporters of the font…ah yes. Page 5:

sailorseal wrote:4. THE FONTS ARE AWESOME!

In any case, I will keep looking into fonts that suit the map, and I am working on the bombardment symbols now.

.44

They are awesome that doesn't mean I know what they say...

sailorseal wrote:They are awesome that doesn't mean I know what they say...

Alright, it is most certainly implied, for if you cannot read something generally they aren't, "AWESOME."
Anyway, just PM if you're commenting about this, I'll have v7 up shortly

.44

44 - this map is definitely making good progress, but I'm not quite sure it's ready for the next stage just yet, as you have a couple of major issues to resolve.

The first one is legibility - if people can't read the map, it's going to be an uphill struggle all the way. The legibility includes allowing space for territory names as well as the army numbers

Secondly, it would be nice to see a draft that plays up on the North/South divide, if that's the direction you want to take.

Have I mentioned that I do like the colour scheme you've settled on? The things that need a bit of work graphically, are the borders - they seem unnecessarily thick, and the sea routes look a bit 'jaggedy'.

I'm sure I've said before that you can afford to crop in more tightly to the playable area to eliminate a lot of the wasted space. You can afford to shrink the mini-map too, once you get a more legible font

Alright, new font, revamped gameplay — how does everyone like it? I got oak approval on the bombardments , still need to finetune the bonuses, etc.


UPDATES:

• new font
• added bombardment feature
• N. Korea + S. Korea bonuses
• vertical Korean for more key space

TO-DO:

• small map
• test 88s
• make DMZ able to fit 88
• better missile logo … I do know it's crude
• better mountains though I can't find any good ones …

Feedback from everyone?

.44

Love the plane and the missile idea, ROCK ON!

hm... interesting update. i prefered the long range attack routes, because the neutral 7 is kinda tough to work around...

whitestazn88 wrote:hm... interesting update. i prefered the long range attack routes, because the neutral 7 is kinda tough to work around...

I was thinking about that myself, and came to the conclusion of: I'll most likely make it 5 or 6 neutrals, but keep the bombardment. I like to think of this ATM as a simple Arms Race! - without the auto-deploys and such. I do think it is different enough — am I correct?

Anyway, I have found a better missile and will make v7.1 up soon. Thanks for the input, guys.

.44

UPDATE:

• new missile

Howsit look?

.44

I haven't read the entire 8 pages, so ignore if the following has already been said:

The Korean geography looks wrong (looks stouter and wider)
Everything looks a bit crude and hand drawn (but not in a good way that doodle earth manages to do), for example the DMZ is oddly drawn.
The assault routes dont look good, would a dotted line be better, or at least a line that doesnt touch both territories?
Instead of calling it the korean peninsula, why not just korea?
The gameplay looks good, a bit of a twist compared on arms race.

gho wrote:I haven't read the entire 8 pages, so ignore if the following has already been said:

The Korean geography looks wrong (looks stouter and wider)
Yep, I stretched it out a bit to be able to fit the text better.
Everything looks a bit crude and hand drawn (but not in a good way that doodle earth manages to do), for example the DMZ is oddly drawn.
I take that you're referring to the borders, right? Yeah I know the DMZ is a bit weird — I'm fixing that to fit #s atm.
The assault routes dont look good, would a dotted line be better, or at least a line that doesnt touch both territories?
I don't really like the route either … still trying to find something good.
Instead of calling it the korean peninsula, why not just korea?
It was originally that, but since it's both N. and S. I made it Peninsula. It seems more appropriate — if more people like 'Korea' better I'll change it.
The gameplay looks good, a bit of a twist compared on arms race.
Yep .

Thanks for the interest.

.44

try making the minimap look more like the real one, maybe take a screenshot of it

looking great

LED ZEPPELINER wrote:try making the minimap look more like the real one, maybe take a screenshot of it

Umm, not really sure what you mean here. I took the map border layer, duplicated it, and shrunk it. Then I went over it with a different brush, which is what you're probably referring to. The point of the minimap isn't for the exact accuracy, only to show the names and bonuses of each province.

.44

mabey add the same texture to the mini map as the one on the map, that might satisfy ledzeppliner

the.killing.44 wrote:

LED ZEPPELINER wrote:try making the minimap look more like the real one, maybe take a screenshot of it

Umm, not really sure what you mean here. I took the map border layer, duplicated it, and shrunk it. Then I went over it with a different brush, which is what you're probably referring to. The point of the minimap isn't for the exact accuracy, only to show the names and bonuses of each province.

.44

ok but maybe fix the dmz on it

LED ZEPPELINER wrote:ok but maybe fix the dmz on it
done

tlane wrote:mabey add the same texture to the mini map as the one on the map, that might satisfy ledzeppliner
Eh, I don't think so. Like I said before, the minimap is for clarity because of the both similar and confusing province names. Efficiency over beauty, here

I do have a question — do I need to clarify what N. and S. Korea are? Personally I believe that's a given, especially since I put "separated by DMZ".

.44

UPDATES:

• added 88s

Well, all's well with the 88s. I might make Ullongdo a bit bigger to accommodate the #s. Goyang's target is a bit hard to see. Capitals will start neu, DMZ n7. How do people like the font? I think it's ok, but I hate the "Z"

I've kinda hit a wall here — gimil said he'd comment but he went out of town
On to the small map, I suppose.
Please bring your comments here!

.44