D2 of The Reid technique Mafia Game

[hjelp]

@ Loose Canon

If you are town, in my opinion, vote on Devon.
Town are in big trouble if no lynch D2.
- If Devon is Mafia, Mafia won't vote on Devon, unless to protect Mafia by fake vote. But Mafia is decimated so it will hurt.
- If Devon is 3P, Mafia and Town will vote, 3P won't vote since Devon is 3P, well can do but lynch by own mean seems strange.
- If Devon is Town, Mafia and Town and 3P will vote, since

...
All town members must accept that scrutiny and suspicions are just part of being town. Reacting to suspicions by completely disregarding another player's input is counterproductive if you are town. I will repeat this important piece of knowledge again (ad nauseam): Town players must be willing to sacrifice themselves for the greater good (i.e. a town victory) ...

[Loose Canon]

Ragian,

I don't think Charle is Mafia, certainly not linked to EW Mafia because I think EW is 3P - I can't see Charle's play as being Mafia.

Hjelp,

I don't care if I'm in big trouble D3.
Devon may be Mafia, but I know why I'm more doubtful than some of that - and if he isn't Mafia or if he is I'll warrant you I'm still right on EW.

[Extreme Ways]

Mate, all those things are important. That is why you voice them for future reference. I don't see why that makes you want to go for the 3rd party. And yes, I'm aware of the obvious things like EW leading (alongside Charle on this one), that he is starting to make you and me look suspicious by saying a) that you're tunnelling and b) that I might be 3rd party.

I have no participation related issues with hammering Devon (the artichoke formerly known as Kingm) because they should've participated by now, and the cop claim is weak due to Charle. However, that has - as mentioned - raised an eyebrow over here at Camp Ragian. I'll break it down:
- Charle's reaction to Kingm's claim D1 is weird if Charle is indeed the cop.
- Charle claimed quite quickly D2. He wasn't even at L-2. One could get the idea that it was preplanned in a scummy nightchat and Charle sort of jumped the gun.
- EW and Charle are now linked and semi-cleared, using halrob as their vehicle. The smart thing about that is that halrob being town can only corroborate what EW and Charle are saying becayse he knows that he is town. EW and Charle, however, if scum, also know who is town and can therefore easily use halrob, resulting in them being semi cleared (were it not for vigilante town eyes) and linked to halrob.

Is this the line of thinking you're doing, Loose?

You're not wrong in your assumptions there, I agree with all of them. It's just that if we were scum it would be a terrible play. Charle wouldn't claim cop so early, and I wouldn't corroborate it. Strike has already died, and we both know this game wont have 4 total scum. A team Strike, Charle and EW will not play this desparate day 2 with Strike dead, especially if theres a killing third party.

Good process, just missing one tidbit imo

[Extreme Ways]

I guess the proof is in the pudding when I die. If Charle dies, I can still be scum "confirming" Charle to get the other cop claim out. I do hope it's fake but if it's not, we dont know any night results regardless.

[Extreme Ways]

That being said if Devon would use any of the words I know he is able to speak, I would have targeted him tonight and just got rid of Devante to resolve that uncertainty.

[Ragian]

We have a few more days. Let's have Devon in here before we off anyone! Anyone hammering without Devon getting his say must be punished D3. I PROMISE a hammer Monday. Son!c has prodded Devon. Let's cool our jets.

@EW, that's just WIFOM. "I wouldn't do that because it's a dumb move," makes it a brilliant move. However, Loose is just gunning for the 3rd party, so feck it. I don't believe you, though. You saying that it's good process makes it worse.

[Ragian]

@hjelp and whoever is voting: What's our play D3 if Devon flips scum or town respectively? If he flips 3rd party, then you don't have to bother. However, I want to know who he's aligned with or facing in both scenarios. Obviously, I'm not asking you to know-know, but I want your guesses. Let's play the long game here.

[Extreme Ways]

We have a few more days. Let's have Devon in here before we off anyone! Anyone hammering without Devon getting his say must be punished D3. I PROMISE a hammer Monday. Son!c has prodded Devon. Let's cool our jets.

@EW, that's just WIFOM. "I wouldn't do that because it's a dumb move," makes it a brilliant move. However, Loose is just gunning for the 3rd party, so feck it. I don't believe you, though. You saying that it's good process makes it worse.

Ok I'll remove from L-1 for you.
unvote

You can also apply Occam's razor to the whole play, imo. I mentioned Charle not killing anyone way before Charle got significant pressure, I dont tend to make statements like that which need to be played around. I dont tend to be so forward in the info I got overnight, even if I dripfed it to thread. I can change, sure, but it's a lot of small things that add up to "Charle just played d1 weird" instead of "EW is covering in advance for Charle".

Either way fact of the matter is that either Charle + Halrob are town, or Charle + EW are scum for you. In both cases Halrob remains town.

[Loose Canon]

Neither are necessarily town if you are warden 3p Ew.

You are the perfect 3p Ew.
Part detective part protective - or seemingly so.

We have 2 detective claims - 3 including you.
Charle gave scope for more to cover in amongst in desperation, or truth.

Nothing from protective yet.

My maths

9 players remaining.

1 3p
1 or 2 mafia
6 or 7 town

3p is the most tricky.
Experienced town goes for 3p, as best they can or goes for where they feel most evidence is.
In this case for me either/or is currently you.

[Loose Canon]

And Hjelp, if I have to die n2 or risk being lynched D3 for going down a tunnel others aren't exploring? Ok

Any questions?

[hjelp]

@hjelp and whoever is voting: What's our play D3 if Devon flips scum or town respectively? If he flips 3rd party, then you don't have to bother. However, I want to know who he's aligned with or facing in both scenarios. Obviously, I'm not asking you to know-know, but I want your guesses. Let's play the long game here.

@ Ragian
Well then. Let's play the long game here.
it will depend on the outcome if a lynch or no lynch D2.

If there are no more votes, it will indicate that
- Mafias already have voten, or don't want to vote if Devon is Mafia, hence no more vote.
- 3P already has voted, or Devon is 3P, or 3P has no interest in lynching a town or mafia, hence no more vote.
- Last townie to vote doesn't want to flip town, hence no more vote.
Do I forget any options ?
Which one is you?

You successfully steared away all suspiscions regardin Devante (D2).
and Devante did answer.
This is a classic - leading question about expected answer.

@Devante, can you confirm or deny that you are tied with another player in the game?

I had to reread my conditions to be sure but yes I can confirm that I am tied to another townie

Okay, and you know for a fact that the other person is town, right?

Yes. Unless when the role and information was given to me it was mixed up by the mod then the one I am tied to is town and the knowledge I have is separate from that Also keep in mind I was checking my conditions as I am trying to answer and provide as much info to town without violating them given the consequence of doing that. And thanks for the extra work in trying to do so here Sonic ;p

Followed by

I appreciate that you're going about this as smoothly as you can (if true). May you name the one you're tied with? May that person name you? May that person name himself?

I cannot, and have no idea if the other side can name me or himself. I would hope if they could have they would have by now to stop me trying to answer questions without killing two townies

So, we have take your word for it. Basically. There might not even be a person you're tied with. Ugh...

Moreover

@halrob, why do you think I should claim? Do you need a broader list to choose from tonight?

Regarding Charle

---
EW, if you detain me, can scum kill me tonight? If the answer is No, then I have a great strategy:
Doc, save you, you detain me, and we have a 100% true result of who I investigate. This means that 3P and Mafia is going to try and find the doc who should not reveal himself.

...

If EW or Charle dies and flips scum, the other one probably will, too.

I like Devante's defence and attitude.

@Charle, don't agree to night actions in the thread. What if scum has a roleblocker?

...
I only get to know that if I attempt to detain a cop, the results for that night only cannot be tampered with. The existence of that fact in my role indicates that false results were available, for example by a framer. Maybe there's a miller (==reads as scum to cop, but it actually town. Usually not aware of this himself) too in play.

FP'd by myself, I was meant to copy that previous post into this one.

If Doc saves me, then my result is the opposite. So for now I am certain that EW, Rob and I are town. That leaves us with 6 unconfirmed players of which 3 are probably scum/3p.

These are strong connections to that you don't want Town do implement Charle's plan. A townie wouldn't stop such.
I do believe that EW, Charle and halrob64 are townie's and their roles are as they say.
This is to say that I don't think you're a townie.
Are you trying to decide what will happen N2?
Then
- please tell me what's your (Mafia) play N2 if Devante flips scum?
- please tell me what's your (Mafia) play N2 if Ragian flips scum?

[hjelp]

Note: I wrote this during EW unvoted.

[Extreme Ways]

Neither are necessarily town if you are warden 3p Ew.

You are the perfect 3p Ew.
Part detective part protective - or seemingly so.

We have 2 detective claims - 3 including you.
Charle gave scope for more to cover in amongst in desperation, or truth.

Nothing from protective yet.

My maths

9 players remaining.

1 3p
1 or 2 mafia
6 or 7 town

3p is the most tricky.
Experienced town goes for 3p, as best they can or goes for where they feel most evidence is.
In this case for me either/or is currently you.

I am not a detective I am not a detective I am not a detective

I never said I was, either. I am a roleblocker with changes. A jailkeeper with changes. Not a cop with changes.

[hjelp]

And Hjelp, if I have to die n2 or risk being lynched D3 for going down a tunnel others aren't exploring? Ok

Any questions?

I do believe that EW, Charle and halrob64 are townie's and their roles are as they say.

[Extreme Ways]

I will read hjelp in the morning it is late.

[hjelp]

Official vote count:



Devon: (4) Charle, EW, Halrob, Hjelp
Loose Canon: (1) Devante
EW: (1) Loose Canon




With 9 alive it takes 5 to lynch!


I will prod Devon if he has anything to say L-1

The votes on Devon are four townies.

[Devante]

UNVOTE

I agree on lynching Devon but will hold off on putting him in place to be hammered since Sonic prodded him and it gives him a chance to speak

[SoN!c]

Official vote count:


Devon: (3) Charle, Halrob, Hjelp
EW: (1) Loose Canon




With 9 alive it takes 5 to lynch!

COUNTDOWN TIMER:
https://www.timeanddate.com/countdown/to?iso=20251117T195759&p0=421&msg=D2+OF+THE+REID&font=cursive

(73 hours remaining)

Scheduled CC Down Time is Mon Nov 17, 09:00 - 14:00 CCT (62hr remaining)

[Loose Canon]

Sonic, can you prod Darin too please.

So Devante who do you think will be on the menu tonight then?

[Devon99]

Wakey wakey people, your suspicions of me are based on my/kingm's 50% Cop claim and past interactions. I want to clarify my position now so everyone can make an informed vote. I was hoping to keep my role secret, until such time as it actually became useful.

But on 4 votes you have forced my hand, so I’ll clarify: I’m a backup Cop of sorts — hence the consistant 50% vanilla claim. I'm still vanilla and will be until certain conditions have been met.
When that happens i get to "audit" the town cop cases but only every other night. I'm the FBI investigator.

[Devon99]

So full clarity that means that I (the FBI) do not get called in to investigate unless the primary Cop is "unable to act" — either because:

the Cop dies,
or the Cop can no longer do it's duty". I have no clue what that means but if that happens i'll be informed and have cop and "audit" powers. Auditing the cops cases (his night investigations) i can only do "on every other night", (starting the second night of my investigative powers).

On the nights I’m doing the audit I’ll be informed whether the Cop’s earlier result was accurate or inaccurate — that is, "if the player’s true guilt matched what the Cop was told". Example: “I’m auditing the Cop’s Night 1 investigation.” I will then receive a full report on the cop's night 1 target.

So with Charle alive and producing results, I’m basically a failsafe.
If scum kills or "gets to Charle" (whatever that means), I take over and have the power to save town.

My read on the current pushes :

Devante’s immediate 180 pivot after Charle’s claim felt like panic, not analysis.

Loose Canon is theory-spamming and doesn’t match a stable Town thought process — that’s more “trying to see what sticks.”

Ragian always lightly accuses someone, then immediately softens or walks it back. Textbook hedging.

EW has some superpower that he got Charle the cop right out of 10 in the first night? Why did he ward Charle?

And honestly, since everyone wants to talk about “suspicious behavior,” can we address the giant hole in the thread right now?

BUT Where is Darin? Darin’s slot is way scummier than people are giving it credit for.

We’re going in circles over people who at least posted, while Darin has contributed absolutely nothing meaningful. No reads, no reactions, no stance on the Cop situation — nothing.

The only people who gain from this level of invisibility in a claim war are the ones who already know the flip outcomes.

Town needs information to work through claims.
Scum and 3P don’t.

And Darin is playing like someone who doesn’t need to solve anything, so get onboard with this townies.

Vote Darin

[Ragian]

So, what I note from the following is a) hjelp refuses to give any idea about what to do if Devon were to flip either or. That's usual two-faced scum behaviour right there. Scum don't want to be accountable for their actions.

I also noted that b) Devon has finally chimed in with a backup role, which might be true, but backup claims are popular as scum fake claims because usually they don't step on anyone's toes.

Darin hasn't participated, but targeting Darin - who is usually very quiet in the few games I have with him - is too easy. Darin could be scum or town (and, I guess, 3rd party), but we have almost no gameplay to base that on.

@Devon, if you were to vote for anyone else, who would it be?

I think, if Devon were to be lynched flipping town, that hjelp is scum.