The Thing TOWN WINS!

[TrafalgarLaw01]

We're basically at Lylo regardless tomorrow. 5v3. Mislynch 4 v. 3. Recruitment 3 v 4. Or no lynch 5 v.3. Then recruitment 4 v. 4. So we'd have to rely on Vig to kill cult N3 to stand a chance and each night is one more night where the vig may have been recruited. Based on multiple of you iclaiming when the only person here guaranteed to be who they said they are being MacReady our vig, the recruiter likely has a fairly short list of who could be vig already. For what its worth, I did try to say D1 that giving out claims in this game was useless and potentially bad for town but point is, I don't like our odds of the vig being town after N2. So yes, I'm in favor of using our vig kill while I still believe we have it to limit the numbers and give ourselves the better odds at picking out the cult.

I have 3 people who I can confidently say are not the recruiter. Myself, Dega and Ragian. Using our 4 remaining shots (lynch, vig, BT, Lynch) on 6 remaining people gives us a 2 in 3 chance of hitting the recruiter along the line + chance vig will still be town to hit them N3. From Ragian and Degas perspective it would be a 4 in 7 chance. I further commented on who I felt were highest on my list to increase those chances. In hindsight, it may have been a mistake to specify who should be BTed tomorrow and if you look back, you will see that I've backed off that position some but I will stick to the rest.

5v3 is a Lylo yes. But we have to get 1 Bad guy not the recruiter necesarilly (Of course getting the recruiter is better). Gotta agree probably claims so far have not been really helpfull but I was forced to give all the info about myself.

in a 4v3 scenario if the BT comes negative its gonna be a lynch but we might not get the recruiter. So using Lynch Vig, BT Lynch can rally get us a to lose situation in D3 even hitting a bad guy.

[TrafalgarLaw01]

We're basically at Lylo regardless tomorrow. 5v3. Mislynch 4 v. 3. Recruitment 3 v 4. Or no lynch 5 v.3. Then recruitment 4 v. 4. So we'd have to rely on Vig to kill cult N3 to stand a chance and each night is one more night where the vig may have been recruited. Based on multiple of you iclaiming when the only person here guaranteed to be who they said they are being MacReady our vig, the recruiter likely has a fairly short list of who could be vig already. For what its worth, I did try to say D1 that giving out claims in this game was useless and potentially bad for town but point is, I don't like our odds of the vig being town after N2. So yes, I'm in favor of using our vig kill while I still believe we have it to limit the numbers and give ourselves the better odds at picking out the cult.

I have 3 people who I can confidently say are not the recruiter. Myself, Dega and Ragian. Using our 4 remaining shots (lynch, vig, BT, Lynch) on 6 remaining people gives us a 2 in 3 chance of hitting the recruiter along the line + chance vig will still be town to hit them N3. From Ragian and Degas perspective it would be a 4 in 7 chance. I further commented on who I felt were highest on my list to increase those chances. In hindsight, it may have been a mistake to specify who should be BTed tomorrow and if you look back, you will see that I've backed off that position some but I will stick to the rest.

5v3 is a Lylo yes. But we have to get 1 Bad guy not the recruiter necesarilly (Of course getting the recruiter is better). Gotta agree probably claims so far have not been really helpfull but I was forced to give all the info about myself.

in a 4v3 scenario if the BT comes negative its gonna be a lynch but we might not get the recruiter. So using Lynch Vig, BT Lynch can rally get us a to lose situation in D3 even hitting a bad guy.

Fixing - I mean if it comes positive - the lynch gonna go on the positive one, but might not be the recruiter, so game over for town

[SoN!c]

This Traf plan is not a "town win" plan, it's just a "Thing escape" plan. "No vig", "massive claim" tomorrow (a massive claim including the vig revealing himself will lead to noThing).


R.J. MacReady (vig i suppose)

but all the rest (including the Thing will say "vanilla scientist" if you ask me)

and with 11 main characters in The Thing movie everybody has a unique character name like:

Childs
Nauls
Dr. Blair
Palmer
George Bennings
Vance Norris
Dr. Copper
Garry
Windows
Fuchs

Consider Traf is the Thing and why he wants "no vig" tonight. it's just a "Thing escape" plan

[Charle]

Wow, so many posts on a Sunday, you guys should spend more time with your families!

We still do not know if mac have the ability to burn somebody every night, or if he is recruited whether it can be used against us or not. Having this in mind, I have to completely agree with Strike again, we should definitely use our Vig kill if we have it available for us as explained below.

We're basically at Lylo regardless tomorrow. 5v3. Mislynch 4 v. 3. Recruitment 3 v 4. Or no lynch 5 v.3. Then recruitment 4 v. 4. So we'd have to rely on Vig to kill cult N3 to stand a chance and each night is one more night where the vig may have been recruited. Based on multiple of you iclaiming when the only person here guaranteed to be who they said they are being MacReady our vig, the recruiter likely has a fairly short list of who could be vig already. For what its worth, I did try to say D1 that giving out claims in this game was useless and potentially bad for town but point is, I don't like our odds of the vig being town after N2. So yes, I'm in favor of using our vig kill while I still believe we have it to limit the numbers and give ourselves the better odds at picking out the cult.

I have 3 people who I can confidently say are not the recruiter. Myself, Dega and Ragian. Using our 4 remaining shots (lynch, vig, BT, Lynch) on 6 remaining people gives us a 2 in 3 chance of hitting the recruiter along the line + chance vig will still be town to hit them N3. From Ragian and Degas perspective it would be a 4 in 7 chance. I further commented on who I felt were highest on my list to increase those chances. In hindsight, it may have been a mistake to specify who should be BTed tomorrow and if you look back, you will see that I've backed off that position some but I will stick to the rest.

I know I am town, and if I add my name to Strike's town start list above, we will use our 4 remaining shots on 5 remaining people, increasing the chances even more to hit the Thing.

Traf not wanting a vig kill tonight (if we still have a vig kill available) as well as my previous reasons and the fact that he again moved the lynch away from him (as I mentioned before, he is very influential and can do that easily), just confirmed my suspicion.

Sorry Ragian, I know the agreement was that we will go with you, but this is too obvious for me.

Vote

Traf

[Votanic]

I don't agree with Traf either on this. I don't see any reason to adamantly push for a 'no vig'.
Vigging tonight might very well be a great idea... but of course that depends on who gets vigged, doesn't it?

I get that finding the recruiter would be better than finding the recruited... though finding any scum with more certainty, is better than acting on no real evidence.
In any case, it doesn't help for players who aren't actually proven town to keep adding themselves to the proven town list. So far strike, Trav, and Charle have all glibly announced they are above suspicion. Actually, it doesn't work that way...

Btw, has it been definitely determined that the recruiting ability will not pass on to another cult member if the original one is killed? I remember some discussion about that, but I don't recall DDS confirming that. Okay, I see Sonic asking that question way back on page 4, but I don't see a DDS answer.

Anyway, we can all give the vigilante suggestions, but in the end he will (or will not) do what he will do... and from what I can gather. that will probably be either firing a flame thrower blindfolded... or even worse, taking the blindfold off and just roasting somebody that the vig finds personally annoying.

Anyway before the night, there is still the lynch to be decided. Unless we skip it two days in a row! Better to skip a vig than a lynch.
Traf's no vig campaign does make him seem scummier... maybe...
My own vote on Sonic is beginning to seem pointless, because despite complaints, most players seem to have accepted him as 'the new normal' or something.
And then of course, most of the other players might be scummy as hell too, despite their low profiles and polite behaviors.

[Ragian]

Soooooooo...what are you suggesting?

[Extreme Ways]

Wow, so many posts on a Sunday, you guys should spend more time with your families!

We still do not know if mac have the ability to burn somebody every night, or if he is recruited whether it can be used against us or not. Having this in mind, I have to completely agree with Strike again, we should definitely use our Vig kill if we have it available for us as explained below.

We're basically at Lylo regardless tomorrow. 5v3. Mislynch 4 v. 3. Recruitment 3 v 4. Or no lynch 5 v.3. Then recruitment 4 v. 4. So we'd have to rely on Vig to kill cult N3 to stand a chance and each night is one more night where the vig may have been recruited. Based on multiple of you iclaiming when the only person here guaranteed to be who they said they are being MacReady our vig, the recruiter likely has a fairly short list of who could be vig already. For what its worth, I did try to say D1 that giving out claims in this game was useless and potentially bad for town but point is, I don't like our odds of the vig being town after N2. So yes, I'm in favor of using our vig kill while I still believe we have it to limit the numbers and give ourselves the better odds at picking out the cult.

I have 3 people who I can confidently say are not the recruiter. Myself, Dega and Ragian. Using our 4 remaining shots (lynch, vig, BT, Lynch) on 6 remaining people gives us a 2 in 3 chance of hitting the recruiter along the line + chance vig will still be town to hit them N3. From Ragian and Degas perspective it would be a 4 in 7 chance. I further commented on who I felt were highest on my list to increase those chances. In hindsight, it may have been a mistake to specify who should be BTed tomorrow and if you look back, you will see that I've backed off that position some but I will stick to the rest.

I know I am town, and if I add my name to Strike's town start list above, we will use our 4 remaining shots on 5 remaining people, increasing the chances even more to hit the Thing.

Traf not wanting a vig kill tonight (if we still have a vig kill available) as well as my previous reasons and the fact that he again moved the lynch away from him (as I mentioned before, he is very influential and can do that easily), just confirmed my suspicion.

Sorry Ragian, I know the agreement was that we will go with you, but this is too obvious for me.

Vote

Traf

How do you know Strike is town???

[Extreme Ways]

@DDS, please don't end today this week. If possible, could we have till Monday?

I hadn't planned on ending Day 2 today due to the holiday and folks getting busy/sick.

BUT, with that being said: Deadline is now set to December 8, Friday, 5 PM -UTC7

We still have half a week to decide on who to lynch, so your vote on Sonic is still fine. I doubt something will get speedhammered if we get to L-2 or L-1, but I'm keeping my vote to my chest because it's better to be safe than sorry.

[Charle]

How do you know Strike is town??? [/quote]

I don't think it will be very clever play from the Thing to promote a vig kill for the same reasons as explained above.

[strike wolf]

I don't agree with Traf either on this. I don't see any reason to adamantly push for a 'no vig'.
Vigging tonight might very well be a great idea... but of course that depends on who gets vigged, doesn't it?

I get that finding the recruiter would be better than finding the recruited... though finding any scum with more certainty, is better than acting on no real evidence.
In any case, it doesn't help for players who aren't actually proven town to keep adding themselves to the proven town list. So far strike, Trav, and Charle have all glibly announced they are above suspicion. Actually, it doesn't work that way...

Btw, has it been definitely determined that the recruiting ability will not pass on to another cult member if the original one is killed? I remember some discussion about that, but I don't recall DDS confirming that. Okay, I see Sonic asking that question way back on page 4, but I don't see a DDS answer.

Anyway, we can all give the vigilante suggestions, but in the end he will (or will not) do what he will do... and from what I can gather. that will probably be either firing a flame thrower blindfolded... or even worse, taking the blindfold off and just roasting somebody that the vig finds personally annoying.

Anyway before the night, there is still the lynch to be decided. Unless we skip it two days in a row! Better to skip a vig than a lynch.
Traf's no vig campaign does make him seem scummier... maybe...
My own vote on Sonic is beginning to seem pointless, because despite complaints, most players seem to have accepted him as 'the new normal' or something.
And then of course, most of the other players might be scummy as hell too, despite their low profiles and polite behaviors.

I'm not saying that I should be beyond reproach. I'm saying that from my own perspective, I know I'm not the recruiter and because of BTs I know Dega and Ragian aren't either. From your perspective if you're town, you should know that you, Dega and Ragian are not the recruiter. Make sense?

Honestly, if the recruiting power can pass between players than we are screwed. That's way too powerful as we'd basically have to lynch correctly every day starting D2 and get a lucky vig shot off to stand a chance. It puts us into a position where we'd basically have to use our vig kill every night with any incorrect shot speeding up a cult win. So, I don't think DDS would do that to us. DDS can clarify though if Im wrong

@Charle: It would only be 4 out of 5 if you believe 100% I am town. Do you?

Unvote

[TrafalgarLaw01]

Wow, so many posts on a Sunday, you guys should spend more time with your families!

We still do not know if mac have the ability to burn somebody every night, or if he is recruited whether it can be used against us or not. Having this in mind, I have to completely agree with Strike again, we should definitely use our Vig kill if we have it available for us as explained below.

We're basically at Lylo regardless tomorrow. 5v3. Mislynch 4 v. 3. Recruitment 3 v 4. Or no lynch 5 v.3. Then recruitment 4 v. 4. So we'd have to rely on Vig to kill cult N3 to stand a chance and each night is one more night where the vig may have been recruited. Based on multiple of you iclaiming when the only person here guaranteed to be who they said they are being MacReady our vig, the recruiter likely has a fairly short list of who could be vig already. For what its worth, I did try to say D1 that giving out claims in this game was useless and potentially bad for town but point is, I don't like our odds of the vig being town after N2. So yes, I'm in favor of using our vig kill while I still believe we have it to limit the numbers and give ourselves the better odds at picking out the cult.

I have 3 people who I can confidently say are not the recruiter. Myself, Dega and Ragian. Using our 4 remaining shots (lynch, vig, BT, Lynch) on 6 remaining people gives us a 2 in 3 chance of hitting the recruiter along the line + chance vig will still be town to hit them N3. From Ragian and Degas perspective it would be a 4 in 7 chance. I further commented on who I felt were highest on my list to increase those chances. In hindsight, it may have been a mistake to specify who should be BTed tomorrow and if you look back, you will see that I've backed off that position some but I will stick to the rest.

I know I am town, and if I add my name to Strike's town start list above, we will use our 4 remaining shots on 5 remaining people, increasing the chances even more to hit the Thing.

Traf not wanting a vig kill tonight (if we still have a vig kill available) as well as my previous reasons and the fact that he again moved the lynch away from him (as I mentioned before, he is very influential and can do that easily), just confirmed my suspicion.

Sorry Ragian, I know the agreement was that we will go with you, but this is too obvious for me.

Vote

Traf

Tell me you do see the differencen in both scenarios of just lynch and lynch vig? Or can you be sure you will get a bad guy with one of them?

[SoN!c]

"Tell me you do see the differencen in both scenarios of just lynch and lynch vig? Or can you be sure you will get a bad guy with one of them?"

Yes, tonight is probably last vig chance..And 5 townies needing 5 votes against 3 Things tomorrow is gonna be very hard...

So lynch D2 and vig N2 are our best chances. 2 chances to hit The Thing.

Saying you can't be sure is not helping because you will never be sure.

And "no vig" even on me if you get lynched (your words a few pages back) doest make sense. If you are true town thinking im The Thing (your voting for me!) then you should be happy i would get vigged..

It only makes sense as Thing escape plan

[SoN!c]

Because now you need to steer the lynch and vig vote away..

Steering the lynch on me still means your defeat if you get vigged right after.. hence the strong "no vig" campaign

[TrafalgarLaw01]

Because now you need to steer the lynch and vig vote away..

Steering the lynch on me still means your defeat if you get vigged right after.. hence the strong "no vig" campaign

Lmao I have even state many time that if I get lynched They shouldnt vig you. Cause I dont want to take the risk of maybe losing 2 townies. But you again twisting things

[SoN!c]

And you can never answer the questions or change subjet. Or even worst manipulate things. So now for real wont answer you anymore so people can vome to their own conclusion.

Ps. I still defend the no vig tonight

Perhaps i understood it wrong buy you said "i still defend the no vig tonight"

So clarify please:

Say if you get lynched do you want a vig tonight y/n?

How can you explain voting for me and at the same time say "no vig on SoN!c" as could be town?

[TrafalgarLaw01]

And you can never answer the questions or change subjet. Or even worst manipulate things. So now for real wont answer you anymore so people can vome to their own conclusion.

Ps. I still defend the no vig tonight

Perhaps i understood it wrong buy you said "i still defend the no vig tonight"

So clarify please:

Say if you get lynched do you want a vig tonight y/n?

I've said it many times not only there.
No lynch and vig.

If I'm lynched either they shouldt vig - absolutely not.

I think you are one of the bad guys ? I still think so - Should they vig you? No - why? Cause as everyone here I can't be 100% sure cause I dont want to take the risk of losing 2 townies and end up a situation where we must lynch the recruiter on D3 or game is over.

That sums up everything I have said so far. But seems some people really don't care about maybe losing 2 townies, don't care or are actually psuhing for it.

[SoN!c]

Its like saying "lynching a townie is ok" but "vigging a townie is not"...

Ragian: lynch that Thing

[TrafalgarLaw01]

Its like saying "lynching a townie is ok" but "vigging a townie is not"...

Ragian: lynch that Thing

It's like saying losing a townie we can live on losing two we cannot - But again twisting things

[SoN!c]

Its like saying "lynching a townie is ok" but "vigging a townie is not"...

Ragian: lynch that Thing

It's like saying losing a townie we can live on losing two we cannot - But again twisting things

So why do we even need to lynch then D2? If we are gonna find the Thing on D3?

[TrafalgarLaw01]

Seriously Sonic if for some reason you end up being townie (And I seriously doubt it at this point) You are even worst than Lose and rememeber he wanted to swap trades and out cop D2.

FP By last Sonic Question but doesnt changed what I wrote. When Did I said No lynch today? and when did I said we are gonna find the Thing D3?

[SoN!c]

Seriously Sonic if for some reason you end up being townie (And I seriously doubt it at this point) You are even worst than Lose and rememeber he wanted to swap trades and out cop D2.

FP By last Sonic Question but doesnt changed what I wrote. When Did I said No lynch today? and when did I said we are gonna find the Thing D3?

Sorry Traf but im 100% sure your The Thing. Your jumping away on all sides like a cornered Thing.

I like the idea lynch you and vig me if im wrong because i wont be wrong. Your "massive claim D3 just before BT" and giving town false hope on D4 is not a town Traf. Its a Thing Traf


How can you explain voting for me and at the same time say "no vig on SoN!c" as could be town?

[TrafalgarLaw01]

Sorry Traf but im 100% sure your The Thing. Your jumping away on all sides like a cornered Thing.

I like the idea lynch you and vig me if im wrong because i wont be wrong. Your "massive claim D3 just before BT" and giving town false hope on D4 is not a town Traf. Its a Thing Traf

Again this is the most stupid thing to say if you are town. Unless you have actual info (Which I'm sure you don't cause u are wrong) Why would you say if "I'm wrong lynch me" - Even if you really are town this si stupid. You will get 2 townies killed.

Everyonce can see how you twist things but again you get away with it why? Cause you are to "scummy to be scum" "cause you play it horribly anyways" or whatever. At least admit you have twisted things to your own convenience. So we know you actually can read and its not that you don't get it.

[SoN!c]

Sorry Traf but im 100% sure your The Thing. Your jumping away on all sides like a cornered Thing.

I like the idea lynch you and vig me if im wrong because i wont be wrong. Your "massive claim D3 just before BT" and giving town false hope on D4 is not a town Traf. Its a Thing Traf

Again this is the most stupid thing to say if you are town. Unless you have actual info (Which I'm sure you don't cause u are wrong) Why would you say if "I'm wrong lynch me" - Even if you really are town this si stupid. You will get 2 townies killed.

Everyonce can see how you twist things but again you get away with it why? Cause you are to "scummy to be scum" "cause you play it horribly anyways" or whatever. At least admit you have twisted things to your own convenience. So we know you actually can read and its not that you don't get it.

But how can town know this? No way. So other townies can only be sure if both die. Well im more then happy to die for town because town needs to survive and the Thing must die

[TrafalgarLaw01]

Final post of D2 summing up all my thoughts about this game cause I'm really getting tired of this situation. (Will only answer questions if I dont think they are stupid)

I'm vanilla town - Gary of the Scientific Team

Current situation 7v2 - 1 recruiter - I serioulsy doubt the recruiter power can be transfered otherwise it's almost imposible to win for town. If this is the case we are fighting a lost battle.

We cannot afford to lose 2 townies on D2 with lynch and vig - Why?

'D3 scenario with 2 townies dead plus a convertion' - 4 town 3 bad guys - so failing to lynch the recruiter on d3 means games over for town. Even with a negative BT it means Deg, Rag and the Bted are clear but still 4 people to look up so 1 in 4 to get the Thing - Bad odds for town.

What I suggest - Just Lynch no vig (YES; EVEN IF I AM THE LYNCHED ONE) - Cause I don't play it personal but for the greater good unlike some people that take things personal and even from cc games.

'D3 Scenario with only 1 town dead plus a convertion' 5 town 3 Bad Guys - If the BT of D3 comes negative it means Deg, Rag and the BTed are cleared - We need to lynch a bad guy but not necesarily the recruiter to keep in the game. It means 3 in 6 as the BTed is the only one cleared 50% much better than 25%. No Vig Again.

'D4 with one bad guy killed and one townie recruited' 4town 3Bad Guys - We need to kill the recruiter - As You all see same scenario than D3 with lynch and Vig - Except its better - Deg, Rag, BTD3 and BTD4 (if negative) are cleared 1 in 3 to find the Thing again 33,3% better than 25% plus if the vig hasnt been converted we can have a last chance here.

Oviously if we happen to lynch a bad guy on D2 the situation is even better, but I'm considering worst case scenario.

So in case people lynch me I will leave my thoughts on everyone so people can revisit this post.

Towniest to Scummiest in order.

Rag - Townie, trying to find things and overall trustable until D2. So his post are the most safe to read back.

Deg. Town D1- He claism was not recruited D2 - I actually believe it, but of course can't be 100% sure and could be recruited D3.

EW. I found EW scummy at first. But within his playstyle. I found his comment about why the massclaim can total fail if the Vig was already recruited earned him a lot of townie points. He still wanted Lynch and Vig (But I think is cause he think he will actully hit a bad guy).

Vot - Yes he had the argument with Rag, but I find looking into flavor does not make it scum. he had the chance to hammer me but he dident.

Strike - First to suggest Lynch and vig. But at least he did debate the point and made his points. We disagree but that is not a bad thing. But also I don't completly buy he is 100% town. If he is not the thing makes a perfect target for be recruited as well.

Swang - Was the first to cast a vote on D1 but overall radio silent so pretty hard to read. But was fast on the lynch and vig, mainly cause it impplied vigging Sonic so not sure here. But also questions if the Vot-Son forth and back was a stand or not? Overall more toughtfull but not at least considering what I'm suggesting place him this down.

Charle - Pretty fast to jumpon wagons not add much and actually follow up plays that in my eyes are harmful to town.

Sonic - He is either the worst town ever or he takes advantage of his Tick playstile to get away with shit like twisting things and posting nonsense to stirr things, FP by sonic so addressing this one here - Happy to die for town even if you are wrong - again really stupid saying you are fine with the tought of 2 townies dead.

Swang and Strike can be swapped but would need to look with more detail.

And that's it.

[TrafalgarLaw01]

'D3 scenario with 2 townies dead plus a convertion' - 4 town 3 bad guys - so failing to lynch the recruiter on d3 means games over for town. Even with a negative BT it means Deg, Rag and the Bted are clear but still 4 people to look up so 1 in 4 to get the Thing - Bad odds for town.

What I suggest - Just Lynch no vig (YES; EVEN IF I AM THE LYNCHED ONE) - Cause I don't play it personal but for the greater good unlike some people that take things personal and even from cc games.

'D3 Scenario with only 1 town dead plus a convertion' 5 town 3 Bad Guys - If the BT of D3 comes negative it means Deg, Rag and the BTed are cleared - We need to lynch a bad guy but not necesarily the recruiter to keep in the game. It means 3 in 7 as the BTed is the only one cleared. 42%much better than 25%. No Vig Again.

Fixing as I did one mistake with numbers