Israel

[Votanic]

Instead of 'freedom of religion', start making religion a crime: 'God is Fraud'. Matters of faith would be treated only as cheap hustles and confidence schemes.

saxitoxin?! How could you...

Btw, Hitred, being a fellow zealot, I must inform you that I just received a divine vision from the tripartite deity of Athena, Nyarlahotep, and the Easter Bunny. This occurred while balancing on one foot on a Ouija board and swinging a set of glow-in-the-dark rosary beads over my head (Works every time).
You are in violation of holy scriptures, and other sacred esoteric dogma, and shall burn forever in the flame pits of Tartarus! I'm sorry to have to inform you of this but God's wrath is real. Just look at Gaza or those Israeli ravers, They weren't praying right either.

[jimboston]

Even if I was Captain Planet, I know it wouldn't be easy, especially considering the millennia of 'bad blood' tha has gone down.

So in your opening sentence you basically admit there’s no immediate solution.

Who was it who said,"Those who remember history, are doomed to repeat it"?

No one.

I guess the biggest thing I would do differently is call people on all their religious/cultural bullshit.

Instead of 'freedom of religion', start making religion a crime: 'God is Fraud'. Matters of faith would be treated only as cheap hustles and confidence schemes.

Good luck. Again this is fantasy.

You can walk through New York or San Fran or most cities in the USA and say this shit and survive.

Try saying this to the religious diehards (on either side) in the Middle East.
See how long you live.

I have to admit… this policy would bring the extreme Jews and extreme Muslims together, albeit only temporarily. Just long enough to revolt, remove you from power, and cut your head off. Then they will start fighting eachother again.

If anything fictional is passed off to the public as fact, people would be prosecuted for it.

I mean why... even after all the endless exposure to movies, television, computer games, RPGs, fantasy and science fiction novels, comic books, etc, etc.; why do religious people act like making up a fictional, mythological being with super powers is an exceptional thing to do. Anyone, can imagine a magical being, and then have a set of spells, rules, laws, edicts, wahtever, come out of his/her/its mouth.

I'm reminded of that quote by Michel de Montaigne

“Oh senseless man, who cannot possibly make a worm or a flea and yet will create Gods by the dozen!”

The only difference is now, thanks to genetic engineering, we just about can make worms and fleas, but still, you get what he's saying.
I also don't think that "gods by the dozen" part lets monotheism off the hook, but I could see how somebody might play that angle...

Maybe, as an exercise, every morning as soon as folks wake up, they could generate a new deity, and then at the end of the day, toss it out (like disposable contact lenses or paper plates).
On the next day, they would just make another one, if they still had a need or desire.

All very “intelligent” and “sophisticated”… I wish we could all be smart as you.

Honestly I agree with a lot of what you say… but it doesn’t matter what I think. It matters what the people in the Middle East think. The Muslim countries surrounding Israel would hate a Secular Atheist State much more than they hate Israel.

I think you know this approach would NOT bring peace to the Middle East. You just want to sound sophisticated, and talk about peace and secularism… but in reality you DON’T have a solution to the problems in Israel/Palestine. You just like to point out how other people are wrong.

Okay, okay, I do partly get their motivation. A lot of religious people like the temporal power social control con game of having an imaginary superfriend who likes you best ...some of them even start really believing in it! A good number probably even particularly like the way it gives them an always-ready excuse to get into a self-rightous huff and start demanding and fighting about everything. Wars, crusades, inquisitions, fatwas, beatings, bombings, exorcisms, witch hunts, book burning (and book writing...). The list goes on and on.

I agree, some leaders may know it’s BS and some don’t… it doesn’t matter what the leaders know. What matters is what the Masses BELIEVE.

OK… so you’ve offered no answer. Thanks!

[Dukasaur]

Instead of 'freedom of religion', start making religion a crime: 'God is Fraud'. Matters of faith would be treated only as cheap hustles and confidence schemes.

Love it!

I guess the biggest thing I would do differently is call people on all their religious/cultural bullshit.

Instead of 'freedom of religion', start making religion a crime: 'God is Fraud'. Matters of faith would be treated only as cheap hustles and confidence schemes.

If anything fictional is passed off to the public as fact, people would be prosecuted for it.

I mean why... even after all the endless exposure to movies, television, computer games, RPGs, fantasy and science fiction novels, comic books, etc, etc.; why do religious people act like making up a fictional, mythological being with super powers is an exceptional thing to do. Anyone, can imagine a magical being, and then have a set of spells, rules, laws, edicts, wahtever, come out of his/her/its mouth.

I'm reminded of that quote by Michel de Montaigne

“Oh senseless man, who cannot possibly make a worm or a flea and yet will create Gods by the dozen!”

The only difference is now, thanks to genetic engineering, we just about can make worms and fleas, but still, you get what he's saying.
I also don't think that "gods by the dozen" part lets monotheism off the hook, but I could see how somebody might play that angle...

Maybe, as an exercise, every morning as soon as folks wake up, they could generate a new deity, and then at the end of the day, toss it out (like disposable contact lenses or paper plates).
On the next day, they would just make another one, if they still had a need or desire.

Excellent ideas all!

Not going to happen, unfortunately. Why? Because....

Okay, okay, I do partly get their motivation. A lot of religious people like the temporal power social control con game of having an imaginary superfriend who likes you best ...some of them even start really believing in it! A good number probably even particularly like the way it gives them an always-ready excuse to get into a self-rightous huff and start demanding and fighting about everything. Wars, crusades, inquisitions, fatwas, beatings, bombings, exorcisms, witch hunts, book burning (and book writing...). The list goes on and on.

Evolution has made us a violently competitive tribal species. If we couldn't murder other people because they grovel before a different imaginary goblin than we do, we'd have to create other reasons to murder them.

Put 20 people in a room and they immediately choose up sides and start to fight about something. The Apple users versus the Samsung users. The Nike-wearers versus the Reebok-wearers. Everybody versus the Philadelphia Flyers fans.

[bigtoughralf]

Even the BBC is casting doubt on the Israeli government's claims that Al-Shifa Hospital is home to a secret terrorist breeding chamber:

www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-67453105

The Israeli army has now killed more civilians in one month of fighting in Gaza than the Russian army has killed in 1.5 years of fighting in Ukraine, over claims that are every bit as dubious.

When will Netanyahu's name be going up alongside Putin's on the West's international arrest warrant lists?

[jimboston]

When will Netanyahu's name be going up alongside Putin's on the West's international arrest warrant lists?

When he commits a war crime. Since he hasn’t then this is seriously premature.

BTW… I am sure there will be criminal acts committed by Israel soldiers. This happens in war.
This is not the Policy of the Israel Gov’t; like it was of Hamas.
Hamas apparently had an Officer in Charge of Rapes.

https://nationalpost.com/news/hamas-massacre

https://economictimes.indiatimes.com/ne ... 187025.cms

[Lonous]

Hamas apparently had an Officer in Charge of Rapes.
https://nationalpost.com/news/hamas-massacre
https://economictimes.indiatimes.com/ne ... 187025.cms

When I am analyzing info about the Russia-Ukraine war, I find it useful to not use sources that are Russian or Ukrainian.
You should try that.
Because all you posted with your two links are 'Jewish News Syndicate' and "Israel claims: "

[HitRed]

Heard

I provide a way. – God

[jimboston]

Hamas apparently had an Officer in Charge of Rapes.
https://nationalpost.com/news/hamas-massacre
https://economictimes.indiatimes.com/ne ... 187025.cms

When I am analyzing info about the Russia-Ukraine war, I find it useful to not use sources that are Russian or Ukrainian.
You should try that.
Because all you posted with your two links are 'Jewish News Syndicate' and "Israel claims: "

I understand the potential for bias.

Russia is known for spurious claims. Israel is biased but not know for outright lies.

Right now the only sources reporting from Gaza with any degree of reliability are the Israeli sources.

[bigtoughralf]

Israel is biased but not know for outright lies.

Right now the only sources reporting from Gaza with any degree of reliability are the Israeli sources.

[bigtoughralf]

When will Netanyahu's name be going up alongside Putin's on the West's international arrest warrant lists?

When he commits a war crime.

The UN High Commissioner for Human Rights has explicitly accused the Israeli government of multiple war crimes during the current conflict, including putting a siege on Gaza, forcibly transferring civilians out of Gaza, and bombing civilian sites such as schools and hospitals.

Guess you have two options here:

• Agree that Israel has committed war crimes in Gaza and an arrest warrant should be issued for Netanyahu
• Claim that your expertise on the laws of war and the current Israel-Palestine conflict is greater than that of the UN

Let us know which option you choose!

[Pack Rat]

When will Netanyahu's name be going up alongside Putin's on the West's international arrest warrant lists?

When he commits a war crime.

The UN High Commissioner for Human Rights has explicitly accused the Israeli government of multiple war crimes during the current conflict, including putting a siege on Gaza, forcibly transferring civilians out of Gaza, and bombing civilian sites such as schools and hospitals.

Guess you have two options here:

• Agree that Israel has committed war crimes in Gaza and an arrest warrant should be issued for Netanyahu
• Claim that your expertise on the laws of war and the current Israel-Palestine conflict is greater than that of the UN

Let us know which option you choose!

Says the Putin apologist...

[jimboston]

When will Netanyahu's name be going up alongside Putin's on the West's international arrest warrant lists?

When he commits a war crime.

The UN High Commissioner for Human Rights has explicitly accused the Israeli government of multiple war crimes during the current conflict, including putting a siege on Gaza, forcibly transferring civilians out of Gaza, and bombing civilian sites such as schools and hospitals.

Guess you have two options here:

• Agree that Israel has committed war crimes in Gaza and an arrest warrant should be issued for Netanyahu
• Claim that your expertise on the laws of war and the current Israel-Palestine conflict is greater than that of the UN

Let us know which option you choose!

The UN is joke… Iran is on the UN Human Rights Council.

https://www.europarl.europa.eu/doceo/do ... 36_EN.html

[bigtoughralf]

I see jim's gone with option B: he is more of an expert in international humanitarian law than the UN High Commissioner for Human Rights.

What other secret talents does jim have? Is he also an astrophysicist capable of disproving all of Stephen Hawking's main theories? Or perhaps he'll be drawing on his theological training* to overturn the central tenets of Catholic doctrine? Either way, we can't wait to find out!


*a OneNote full of Bible quotes

[HitRed]

September 18 Adoration

Message from Jesus

I have the way to eternal life. My way is favored and highly to be praised by my Heavenly Father for all who seek the way of life. Come to me and follow after me in my footsteps to eternal life. My ways are not like human ways. Follow the path of the Lord your God for the road that leads to life everlasting. Glory and praise be to the Father in Heaven for those who accept the way of the Lord.

[mookiemcgee]

Oh wow yes, what these Jews and Muslims really need is an outsider christian to tell them how to live their lives.

[Pack Rat]

Oh wow yes, what these Jews and Muslims really need is an outsider christian to tell them how to live their lives.

We have the Taliban Christian Congressmen telling us what to do, why not the Jews and Muslims?

[Dukasaur]

When will Netanyahu's name be going up alongside Putin's on the West's international arrest warrant lists?

When he commits a war crime.

The UN High Commissioner for Human Rights has explicitly accused the Israeli government of multiple war crimes during the current conflict, including putting a siege on Gaza, forcibly transferring civilians out of Gaza, and bombing civilian sites such as schools and hospitals.

Guess you have two options here:

• Agree that Israel has committed war crimes in Gaza and an arrest warrant should be issued for Netanyahu
• Claim that your expertise on the laws of war and the current Israel-Palestine conflict is greater than that of the UN

Let us know which option you choose!

Expertise is not the issue. Deliberate malfeasance is. It's simple to look at the composition of the Human Rights Council and evaluate how much credibility these people have on the subject of human rights:

Bolivia -- torture state, fairly mild compared to some of the others on the list, but still a torture state
China -- world's largest dictatorship, holds something between 2 and 3 million people in concentration camps, slave labour is common
Côte d’Ivoire -- a democracy, fairly corrupt, regularly has civil wars, but not as bad as some of the states on this list
Cuba -- One of the last communist dictatorships in the world, has a royal hard-on for any country friendly to the U.S.
France -- decent democracy
Gabon -- last free election was in 1991. Recently there was a military coup where one dictator replaced another. Too soon to evaluate how evil he will be.
Malawi -- decent democracy
Mexico -- borderline democracy, one of the most corrupt on earth, majority of government officials owned by criminal gangs
Nepal -- from 1996 to 2006 Nepal ranked as the country with the most citizens arrested and killed without explanation or due process. Has been unseated from this questionable throne, but still ranks high on the list of the world's repressive torture states.
Pakistan -- Another torture state, and a traditional ally of Iran
Russian Federation -- Putin. 'nuff said.
Senegal -- in transition from being a borderline democracy to being a dictatorship. Political opposition was outlawed on July 31st this year.
Ukraine -- democracy, history of corruption but slowly improving
United Kingdom -- decent democracy
Uzbekistan -- has been an absolute dictatorship since 2016. Signs of moderation, but still a dictatorship.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Decent democracies -- 3
Borderline democracies -- 3
Borderline dictatorships -- 3
Extreme dictatorships -- 6

[jusplay4fun]

I see jim's gone with option B: he is more of an expert in international humanitarian law than the UN High Commissioner for Human Rights.

What other secret talents does jim have? Is he also an astrophysicist capable of disproving all of Stephen Hawking's main theories? Or perhaps he'll be drawing on his theological training* to overturn the central tenets of Catholic doctrine? Either way, we can't wait to find out!


*a OneNote full of Bible quotes

Having read jimb attempting to discuss both Catholicism and Physics, I can vouch that he knows little of either subject. Try some other suggestion that might carry validity. Maybe he can discuss knots on sailing ships or selling nuts.

[bigtoughralf]

The UN High Commissioner for Human Rights has explicitly accused the Israeli government of multiple war crimes during the current conflict, including putting a siege on Gaza, forcibly transferring civilians out of Gaza, and bombing civilian sites such as schools and hospitals.

Guess you have two options here:

• Agree that Israel has committed war crimes in Gaza and an arrest warrant should be issued for Netanyahu
• Claim that your expertise on the laws of war and the current Israel-Palestine conflict is greater than that of the UN

Let us know which option you choose!

Expertise is not the issue. Deliberate malfeasance is. It's simple to look at the composition of the Human Rights Council ..

I'm not talking about the UN Human Rights Council, I'm talking about the UN High Commissioner for Human Rights. I've highlighted that part of my earlier post in red, in case that helps.

Are you also saying you think the UN High Commissioner for Human Rights has less expertise in international humanitarian law than you, or do you agree with him when he says Israel has committed multiple war crimes during the ongoing conflict?

[Dukasaur]

The UN High Commissioner for Human Rights has explicitly accused the Israeli government of multiple war crimes during the current conflict, including putting a siege on Gaza, forcibly transferring civilians out of Gaza, and bombing civilian sites such as schools and hospitals.

Guess you have two options here:

• Agree that Israel has committed war crimes in Gaza and an arrest warrant should be issued for Netanyahu
• Claim that your expertise on the laws of war and the current Israel-Palestine conflict is greater than that of the UN

Let us know which option you choose!

Expertise is not the issue. Deliberate malfeasance is. It's simple to look at the composition of the Human Rights Council ..

I'm not talking about the UN Human Rights Council, I'm talking about the UN High Commissioner for Human Rights. I've highlighted that part of my earlier post in red, in case that helps.

Are you also saying you think the UN High Commissioner for Human Rights has less expertise in international humanitarian law than you, or do you agree with him when he says Israel has committed multiple war crimes during the ongoing conflict?

I have no doubt of his expertise. I'm also confident in his lack of objectivity. He's a political hack who lives in an insulated bubble of other political hacks and has never had to address real-world problems.

An enemy as cynical as Hamas, who screens every military emplacement behind a wall of innocent civilians, was completely unforeseen when the Geneva Conventions were being negotiated.

There was no doubt from Day 1 of this war that rooting out Hamas would involved horrible casualties, many of them innocent civilians. That is a consequence of their government's decision to deliberately put them in harm's way and sacrifice them as pawns for PR gain.

[jimboston]

I see jim's gone with option B: he is more of an expert in international humanitarian law than the UN High Commissioner for Human Rights.

What other secret talents does jim have? Is he also an astrophysicist capable of disproving all of Stephen Hawking's main theories? Or perhaps he'll be drawing on his theological training* to overturn the central tenets of Catholic doctrine? Either way, we can't wait to find out!


*a OneNote full of Bible quotes

Having read jimb attempting to discuss both Catholicism and Physics, I can vouch that he knows little of either subject. Try some other suggestion that might carry validity. Maybe he can discuss knots on sailing ships or selling nuts.

Well if you can vouch for it…

[jimboston]

Duk… facts and reality don’t matter to Ralph.

He’ll deny them and find another Hack with a title to agree.

I believe and hope the majority of the public (in the US where it matters) will continue to support Israel and recognize that the lies of Hamas are just political BS. Their PR play is assisted by idiots like the HC of Human Rights in the UN; Lefty Politicians, and cynical Chinese Spy’s like Ralph.

I do see many young people falling for this BS. This is worrisome to me for a few reasons. One close to home is I have a daughter at a small Northeast College… and like most small Northeast Colleges it is very liberal. I want her to see all sides but I don’t want her indoctrinated.

[bigtoughralf]

- jim: 'facts and reality don’t matter to Ralph'

- also jim: 'the UN is part of a global pro-Hamas conspiracy that only myself, Duk and Benjamin Netanyahu are clever enough to see through'

Are either of you going to answer the question or are you just going to keep playing this game of 'try to discredit the messenger'?

[Pack Rat]

Duk… facts and reality don’t matter to Ralph.

He’ll deny them and find another Hack with a title to agree.

I believe and hope the majority of the public (in the US where it matters) will continue to support Israel and recognize that the lies of Hamas are just political BS. Their PR play is assisted by idiots like the HC of Human Rights in the UN; Lefty Politicians, and cynical Chinese Spy’s like Ralph.

I do see many young people falling for this BS. This is worrisome to me for a few reasons. One close to home is I have a daughter at a small Northeast College… and like most small Northeast Colleges it is very liberal. I want her to see all sides but I don’t want her indoctrinated.

The so-called lefties in America, would be considered Centrists in Europe.

Oh my, I'm scared that my daughter might turned into a leftie and see me as a rightwing dinosaur

Guess your indoctrination of a young woman was not as intensive as you thought.

Israel must get rid of Netanyahu and make serious plans for a 2 State solution. Hamas as a government entity will be removed, but not the ideology among the Palestinian children and young adults. We can not allow Israel to police Gaza after this war comes to a conclusion. The U.N. and the corrupt regimes of the Gulf will need to pour in money to rebuild Gaza.