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Re: Iran successfully defends crappy economy

Postby TeeGee on Sun Jun 23, 2019 8:26 pm

Dukasaur wrote:
mrswdk wrote:
riskllama wrote:do you think those crippling US sanctions might have anything to do w/Iran's "crappy" economy, HR? food for thought.


ikr

>Iran signs up to and complies with nuclear deal agreed by US, Russia, China, UK, France and Germany
>America puts extreme economic sanctions on Iran anyway
>America escalates sanctions
>Iranian economy driven into ground
>America moves troops into region and makes numerous comments about going to war with Iran
>Iran shoots down American drone
>HR: 'lol Iran is acting so unreasonable makes Trump look clever'


+1


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Re: Iran successfully defends crappy economy

Postby HitRed on Sun Jun 23, 2019 8:45 pm

Please quote me correctly.

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Re: Iran successfully defends crappy economy

Postby NomadPatriot on Sun Jun 23, 2019 10:20 pm

HitRed wrote:Please quote me correctly.

HitRed


I noticed that too.. I was wondering why he didn't actually use the quote function..

also notice they left out " Iran gets nuclear weapons in 10 years & has been supporting state sponsored terrorism from the little list..

-->
mrswdk wrote:
riskllama wrote:do you think those crippling US sanctions might have anything to do w/Iran's "crappy" economy, HR? food for thought.


ikr

>Iran signs up to and complies with nuclear deal agreed by US, Russia, China, UK, France and Germany
>America puts extreme economic sanctions on Iran anyway
>America escalates sanctions
>Iranian economy driven into ground
>America moves troops into region and makes numerous comments about going to war with Iran
>Iran shoots down American drone
>HR: 'lol Iran is acting so unreasonable makes Trump look clever'


let's keep defending the country who literally tosses gays off rooftops & supports burning people in cages.. sounds awesome...
Last edited by NomadPatriot on Sun Jun 23, 2019 10:34 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Iran successfully defends crappy economy

Postby NomadPatriot on Sun Jun 23, 2019 10:27 pm

Analysis: The Different Stages of Iranian Support for ISIS

In 2012, the United States Treasury Department exposed the extensive financial ties between Iran and al-Qaeda in Iraq (AQI), the terrorist organization that evolved into ISIS. The generous support Iran afforded ISIS in its formative years was part of a broader alliance that the Islamic Republic established with al-Qaeda over a decade ago.

http://www.thetower.org/2699-analysis-the-different-stages-of-iranian-support-for-isis/

ISIS -->burns people in cages alive.
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Re: Iran successfully defends crappy economy

Postby Dukasaur on Sun Jun 23, 2019 10:53 pm

NomadPatriot wrote:Analysis: The Different Stages of Iranian Support for ISIS

In 2012, the United States Treasury Department exposed the extensive financial ties between Iran and al-Qaeda in Iraq (AQI), the terrorist organization that evolved into ISIS. The generous support Iran afforded ISIS in its formative years was part of a broader alliance that the Islamic Republic established with al-Qaeda over a decade ago.

http://www.thetower.org/2699-analysis-the-different-stages-of-iranian-support-for-isis/

ISIS -->burns people in cages alive.


Nobody, but nobody, is denying that the Iranian regime are wicked, wicked assholes.

Thing is, what to do about that? The world is full of wicked asshole dictators. We can't overthrow them all. We have to coexist.

What the world agreed to in 2015 was a carrot-and-stick approach to dealing with Iran. As long as Iran became less threatening (ie. with the nukes) it would be rewarded with better relations (carrot). If it failed to do so, there would be a resumption of sanctions (stick). Over time, relations would get better and other deals would eventually follow, like on curbing terrorism.

What Trump has done is to throw the carrot in the garbage can and go with a pure stick-and-stick strategy. That does work, if the target is small and meek. Iran is neither small nor meek. With no carrot, it has no motive to behave itself. It's not going to show weakness and give in to the stick. In the end, the U.S. will either have to offer a carrot (which is where we were before Trump threw it out) or it will have to go all-in and invade.

If the U.S. invades, we know how that will go. Vietnam, Iraq, Afghanistan. The Iranian military will be utterly crushed by the superior firepower of the American forces. Then, having won the war, the U.S. will have no idea how to win the peace. It will be stuck policing a resentful population that will start out grateful but will grow more hostile with every month that the occupation continues. The bloodshed will continue, the drain on the American taxpayer will continue, and after years or decades of wasted effort you'll pull out and leave the place in the hands of someone not much better than the people you took it away from.
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Re: Iran successfully defends crappy economy

Postby NomadPatriot on Sun Jun 23, 2019 11:03 pm

Dukasaur wrote:
NomadPatriot wrote:Analysis: The Different Stages of Iranian Support for ISIS

In 2012, the United States Treasury Department exposed the extensive financial ties between Iran and al-Qaeda in Iraq (AQI), the terrorist organization that evolved into ISIS. The generous support Iran afforded ISIS in its formative years was part of a broader alliance that the Islamic Republic established with al-Qaeda over a decade ago.

http://www.thetower.org/2699-analysis-the-different-stages-of-iranian-support-for-isis/

ISIS -->burns people in cages alive.


Nobody, but nobody, is denying that the Iranian regime are wicked, wicked assholes.

Thing is, what to do about that? The world is full of wicked asshole dictators. We can't overthrow them all. We have to coexist.

What the world agreed to in 2015 was a carrot-and-stick approach to dealing with Iran. As long as Iran became less threatening (ie. with the nukes) it would be rewarded with better relations (carrot). If it failed to do so, there would be a resumption of sanctions (stick). Over time, relations would get better and other deals would eventually follow, like on curbing terrorism.

What Trump has done is to throw the carrot in the garbage can and go with a pure stick-and-stick strategy. That does work, if the target is small and meek. Iran is neither small nor meek. With no carrot, it has no motive to behave itself. It's not going to show weakness and give in to the stick. In the end, the U.S. will either have to offer a carrot (which is where we were before Trump threw it out) or it will have to go all-in and invade.

If the U.S. invades, we know how that will go. Vietnam, Iraq, Afghanistan. The Iranian military will be utterly crushed by the superior firepower of the American forces. Then, having won the war, the U.S. will have no idea how to win the peace. It will be stuck policing a resentful population that will start out grateful but will grow more hostile with every month that the occupation continues. The bloodshed will continue, the drain on the American taxpayer will continue, and after years or decades of wasted effort you'll pull out and leave the place in the hands of someone not much better than the people you took it away from.


just let me know the last time Iran gave 2 shits about the carrot...….

if you meet Iran in a potential battlefield and hold out a carrot.. they are going to beat you with their stick... '
you bring a stick to a stick fight.. the US stick is thankfully made of Uranium. Iran's is a Oiley Steel Rod..
we don't want Iran to have a Uranium stick in 10 years....
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Re: Iran successfully defends crappy economy

Postby Dukasaur on Sun Jun 23, 2019 11:10 pm

NomadPatriot wrote:
Dukasaur wrote:
NomadPatriot wrote:Analysis: The Different Stages of Iranian Support for ISIS

In 2012, the United States Treasury Department exposed the extensive financial ties between Iran and al-Qaeda in Iraq (AQI), the terrorist organization that evolved into ISIS. The generous support Iran afforded ISIS in its formative years was part of a broader alliance that the Islamic Republic established with al-Qaeda over a decade ago.

http://www.thetower.org/2699-analysis-the-different-stages-of-iranian-support-for-isis/

ISIS -->burns people in cages alive.


Nobody, but nobody, is denying that the Iranian regime are wicked, wicked assholes.

Thing is, what to do about that? The world is full of wicked asshole dictators. We can't overthrow them all. We have to coexist.

What the world agreed to in 2015 was a carrot-and-stick approach to dealing with Iran. As long as Iran became less threatening (ie. with the nukes) it would be rewarded with better relations (carrot). If it failed to do so, there would be a resumption of sanctions (stick). Over time, relations would get better and other deals would eventually follow, like on curbing terrorism.

What Trump has done is to throw the carrot in the garbage can and go with a pure stick-and-stick strategy. That does work, if the target is small and meek. Iran is neither small nor meek. With no carrot, it has no motive to behave itself. It's not going to show weakness and give in to the stick. In the end, the U.S. will either have to offer a carrot (which is where we were before Trump threw it out) or it will have to go all-in and invade.

If the U.S. invades, we know how that will go. Vietnam, Iraq, Afghanistan. The Iranian military will be utterly crushed by the superior firepower of the American forces. Then, having won the war, the U.S. will have no idea how to win the peace. It will be stuck policing a resentful population that will start out grateful but will grow more hostile with every month that the occupation continues. The bloodshed will continue, the drain on the American taxpayer will continue, and after years or decades of wasted effort you'll pull out and leave the place in the hands of someone not much better than the people you took it away from.


just let me know the last time Iran gave 2 shits about the carrot...….

if you meet Iran in a potential battlefield and hold out a carrot.. they are going to beat you with their stick... '
you bring a stick to a stick fight.. the US stick is thankfully made of Uranium. Iran's is a Oiley Steel Rod..
we don't want Iran to have a Uranium stick in 10 years....

As of March 22nd, Iran had been fully complying with the nuclear deal.

https://www.armscontrol.org/act/2019-04/news/iaea-says-iran-abiding-nuclear-deal

That was pretty obviously a positive response to the carrot.
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Re: Iran successfully defends crappy economy

Postby HitRed on Sun Jun 23, 2019 11:38 pm

Iran, a theocracy, is supporting armed insurrection around the world. Currently NPR says they are sending arms shipments to 14 conflicts. Why trust them with nukes at all??? With their kind of record since 1979 I wouldn't buy them lunch.
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Re: Iran successfully defends crappy economy

Postby Dukasaur on Sun Jun 23, 2019 11:48 pm

HitRed wrote:Iran, a theocracy, is supporting armed insurrection around the world. Currently NPR says they are sending arms shipments to 14 conflicts. Why would you trust then with nukes at all??? With that kind of record since 1979 I wouldn't buy them lunch.

I wouldn't want to see them with nukes. Which is why it was a good thing that the world entered into a contract with them to stop developing nukes. By all the mountains of evidence, they were complying with the agreement.

Critics have made a big deal about the fact that the deal had a time limit, but there's no reason to think it wouldn't have been renewed in 2024. As long as the carrot was being granted (better trade with the West) Iran would have no reason to violate the agreement. Trade is tremendously important to everyone, but especially to a country with a lopsided oil-exporting economy like theirs.
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Re: Iran successfully defends crappy economy

Postby NomadPatriot on Sun Jun 23, 2019 11:50 pm

Dukasaur wrote:As of March 22nd, Iran had been fully complying with the nuclear deal.https://www.armscontrol.org/act/2019-04 ... r-dealThat was pretty obviously a positive response to the carrot.


the deal was made in 2015 and was only good for 10 years.. so it ends in 5.5 years..
Iran got tens of Billions of Dollars worth of assets unfrozen..

SO YEAH.. LET'S SEE HOW A CARROT WORKS WHEN THE DEAL IS UP & iRAN CAN LEGITIMATELY START MAKING NUKES...
nukes = f*ck you money..
carrots won't matter..
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Re: Iran successfully defends crappy economy

Postby Dukasaur on Sun Jun 23, 2019 11:57 pm

NomadPatriot wrote:
Dukasaur wrote:As of March 22nd, Iran had been fully complying with the nuclear deal.https://www.armscontrol.org/act/2019-04 ... r-dealThat was pretty obviously a positive response to the carrot.


the deal was made in 2015 and was only good for 10 years.. so it ends in 5.5 years..
Iran got tens of Billions of Dollars worth of assets unfrozen..

SO YEAH.. LET'S SEE HOW A CARROT WORKS WHEN THE DEAL IS UP & iRAN CAN LEGITIMATELY START MAKING NUKES...
nukes = f*ck you money..
carrots won't matter..


Like I said, there's no reason to assume the deal wouldn't have been renewed when it expired, and renewed again, and renewed again.

The value of nukes is pretty limited. The countries that have them generally spend a lot of money on them and get nothing in return. You can't fight a guerrilla war with nukes, so it's either M.A.D. all-out war or nothing.

The value of trade is huge, especially to an exporting country.

It's a no-brainer. Having good trade is worth more than nukes. As long as the deal was in place, it would be renewed every ten years.

Now that Trump tore up the deal, we're back to square one.
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Re: Iran successfully defends crappy economy

Postby NomadPatriot on Mon Jun 24, 2019 12:54 am

getting a renewed trade deal every 10 years = $50 billion dollars
being the 1st Muslim country to nuke someone... = priceless

only 9 countries have nukes.. only 1 is Muslim - Pakistan..

if Iran nuked the US.. the fallout would float over the Atlantic ocean..
if we retaliated & nuked Iran.. the fallout would float over Pakistan, India & China.. all 3 nuclear Superpowers...

the carrot isn't going to matter...
Iran geographically has basically got the USA checkmated as far as nukes are concerned
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Re: Iran successfully defends crappy economy

Postby mrswdk on Mon Jun 24, 2019 2:36 am

HitRed wrote:Iran, a theocracy, is supporting armed insurrection around the world. Currently NPR says they are sending arms shipments to 14 conflicts. Why trust them with nukes at all??? With their kind of record since 1979 I wouldn't buy them lunch.


Is this whole thread just a DY-esque attempt at satire?

Or did HR genuinely miss the part where America supported armed rebellions in Libya and Syria, is supporting the Saudis with troops and weapons as they continue to strafe Yemeni hospitals, directly overthrew governments in Iran and Afghanistan, etc.
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Re: Iran successfully defends crappy economy

Postby Bernie Sanders on Mon Jun 24, 2019 4:07 am

Bernie Sanders wrote:
NomadPatriot wrote:
spurgistan wrote:
HitRed wrote:I think a theocracy that exports weapons is a bit disjointed.


I wouldn't say the US isn't a theocracy just yet, but give us time.
y

pretty sure he wasn't referring to the United States.. :lol: :lol:


You read but don't comprehend. You write but you do it without thinking.

Just surprised why anyone would try to reply to your utter bullshit and moronic statements.

Does seem you have several Trump supporters who jump on your coat tails whenever the subject of Trump cums up. The Clown Posse!







HitRed wrote:Get back to work Bernie, those floors need to look mopped!



Don't get upset at me you Log Cabin Republican! You and others (most notably Saxitoxin) will sleep with anyone who backs thee most ridiculous and treasonous President in American history.
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Re: Iran successfully defends crappy economy

Postby Bernie Sanders on Mon Jun 24, 2019 4:19 am

mrswdk wrote:
HitRed wrote:Iran, a theocracy, is supporting armed insurrection around the world. Currently NPR says they are sending arms shipments to 14 conflicts. Why trust them with nukes at all??? With their kind of record since 1979 I wouldn't buy them lunch.


Is this whole thread just a DY-esque attempt at satire?

Or did HR genuinely miss the part where America supported armed rebellions in Libya and Syria, is supporting the Saudis with troops and weapons as they continue to strafe Yemeni hospitals, directly overthrew governments in Iran and Afghanistan, etc.



HR is just an empty headed partisan hack. As long as It's a Republican President in office they can do no harm and it's always Iran's fault.......or fukn Obama's fault.

HR actually doesn't know American direct interference and overthrow of a government in Iran back in the 1950s.

America should be punishing Saudi Arabia for their support of Sunni terrorism and the attack on the Trade Towers in 2001. Don't remember any Iraqis or Iranians being in those planes that were hijacked and used as bombs in 2001.

Maybe HitRed can explain why Iran is bad and Saudi Arabia is good, why Shitte is bad and Sunni is good?
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Re: Iran successfully defends crappy economy

Postby jimboston on Mon Jun 24, 2019 6:59 am

Haven’t you all said to me that it’s ridiculous to try to talk sense to NP.

He’s incapable of seeing the world in anyway other than Black and White.
I don;t know if it’s because he was born stoopid or if the ability to think has been beaten out of him by Fox and Friends.

‘Hey, let’s take are big Uranium stick around the school yard and smack anyone who looks at us funny!”

Next post, he’ll call me ‘Jimmy Butts’ and probably find some stoopid typo in my comment to insult.
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Re: Iran successfully defends crappy economy

Postby NomadPatriot on Mon Jun 24, 2019 8:25 am

the adults are actually debating topics in a civilized manner... bringing up points & counterpoints while quoting people directly. ( even Bernie is capable of achieving this feat... but he does resort to cursing which destroys any rational on his part )

Tue Jun 18, 2019 7:41 pm
jimboston wrote:It’s unfortunate that this place has degenerated this far. There was always baiting and insults... but a few years ago there seemed to be a few more people willing and interested in trying to actually discuss some of the topics of the day. Sad.



but I guess there will always be the random children who are screaming while rolling around on the floor having a temper tantrum because their outdated toys suck & no one wants to play with them...
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hilariously.. i do not need to call him Jimmy Butts anymore.. he has been trained to do it for me.. :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
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Re: Iran successfully defends crappy economy

Postby riskllama on Mon Jun 24, 2019 7:17 pm

*rationale
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Re: Iran successfully defends crappy economy

Postby jimboston on Tue Jun 25, 2019 7:58 am

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Re: Iran successfully defends crappy economy

Postby mrswdk on Tue Jun 25, 2019 10:33 am

Just one human example of the effects of American bullying on the lives of 100 million ordinary Iranians:

League of Legends players in Iran have reported being blocked from playing the game due to US sanctions on the country.

"Due to US laws and regulations, players in your country cannot access League of Legends at this time," says a message shared on the game's forums, where a player shared a message he claims he received when trying to log on to play in Iran.

The gamer who first posted about the block said they were "shocked" to be unable to play.

"Political problems between Iran and America is between governments," they wrote.

"Players and people have nothing to to with this."


https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/newsbeat-48750608
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Re: Iran successfully defends crappy economy

Postby mrswdk on Tue Jun 25, 2019 10:35 am

The National Iranian American Council shares its thoughts on America's economic warfare against Iran:

These sanctions are amounting to collective punishment against the entire Iranian population. Right now we’re seeing that the Iranian middle class is becoming impoverished, space for Iranian civil society is diminishing, the cost of everyday goods is going up, the cost of living is increasing, there’s been inflation, the currency has devalued.

So right now it’s causing immense economic hardship in Iran. And, right now, we see that the Trump administration and Secretary of State Pompeo, they often frame their rhetoric towards Iran about helping the Iranian people, and they have this idea that they promote, that these policies help the Iranian people, or they support the Iranian people against their authoritarian governments. When in reality, it’s crippling the space needed for peaceful democratic change in Iran, by impoverishing the middle class, which is the vehicle for economic and political development. It’s only creating a destructive situation inside the country.


https://truthout.org/audio/sanctions-am ... opulation/
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Re: Iran successfully defends crappy economy

Postby HitRed on Tue Jun 25, 2019 10:52 am

mrswdk wrote:The National Iranian American Council shares its thoughts on America's economic warfare against Iran:

These sanctions are amounting to collective punishment against the entire Iranian population. Right now we’re seeing that the Iranian middle class is becoming impoverished, space for Iranian civil society is diminishing, the cost of everyday goods is going up, the cost of living is increasing, there’s been inflation, the currency has devalued.

So right now it’s causing immense economic hardship in Iran. And, right now, we see that the Trump administration and Secretary of State Pompeo, they often frame their rhetoric towards Iran about helping the Iranian people, and they have this idea that they promote, that these policies help the Iranian people, or they support the Iranian people against their authoritarian governments. When in reality, it’s crippling the space needed for peaceful democratic change in Iran, by impoverishing the middle class, which is the vehicle for economic and political development. It’s only creating a destructive situation inside the country.


https://truthout.org/audio/sanctions-am ... opulation/


Sounds biased. What's the Philippines perspective?
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Re: Iran successfully defends crappy economy

Postby mrswdk on Tue Jun 25, 2019 10:54 am

HitRed wrote:
mrswdk wrote:The National Iranian American Council shares its thoughts on America's economic warfare against Iran:

These sanctions are amounting to collective punishment against the entire Iranian population. Right now we’re seeing that the Iranian middle class is becoming impoverished, space for Iranian civil society is diminishing, the cost of everyday goods is going up, the cost of living is increasing, there’s been inflation, the currency has devalued.

So right now it’s causing immense economic hardship in Iran. And, right now, we see that the Trump administration and Secretary of State Pompeo, they often frame their rhetoric towards Iran about helping the Iranian people, and they have this idea that they promote, that these policies help the Iranian people, or they support the Iranian people against their authoritarian governments. When in reality, it’s crippling the space needed for peaceful democratic change in Iran, by impoverishing the middle class, which is the vehicle for economic and political development. It’s only creating a destructive situation inside the country.


https://truthout.org/audio/sanctions-am ... opulation/


Sounds biased. Maybe the Philippines perspective would be more neutral.


mrswdk wrote:>Iran signs up to and complies with nuclear deal agreed by US, Russia, China, UK, France and Germany
>America puts extreme economic sanctions on Iran anyway
>America escalates sanctions
>Iranian economy driven into ground
>America moves troops into region and makes numerous comments about going to war with Iran
>Iran shoots down American drone
>HR: 'lol Iran is acting so unreasonable makes Trump look clever'
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Re: Iran successfully defends crappy economy

Postby HitRed on Tue Jun 25, 2019 10:57 am

mrswdk wrote:
HitRed wrote:
mrswdk wrote:The National Iranian American Council shares its thoughts on America's economic warfare against Iran:

These sanctions are amounting to collective punishment against the entire Iranian population. Right now we’re seeing that the Iranian middle class is becoming impoverished, space for Iranian civil society is diminishing, the cost of everyday goods is going up, the cost of living is increasing, there’s been inflation, the currency has devalued.

So right now it’s causing immense economic hardship in Iran. And, right now, we see that the Trump administration and Secretary of State Pompeo, they often frame their rhetoric towards Iran about helping the Iranian people, and they have this idea that they promote, that these policies help the Iranian people, or they support the Iranian people against their authoritarian governments. When in reality, it’s crippling the space needed for peaceful democratic change in Iran, by impoverishing the middle class, which is the vehicle for economic and political development. It’s only creating a destructive situation inside the country.


https://truthout.org/audio/sanctions-am ... opulation/


Sounds biased. Maybe the Philippines perspective would be more neutral.


mrswdk wrote:>Iran signs up to and complies with nuclear deal agreed by US, Russia, China, UK, France and Germany
>America puts extreme economic sanctions on Iran anyway
>America escalates sanctions
>Iranian economy driven into ground
>America moves troops into region and makes numerous comments about going to war with Iran
>Iran shoots down American drone
>HR: 'lol Iran is acting so unreasonable makes Trump look clever'


HitRed wrote:Please quote me correctly.

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Re: Iran successfully defends crappy economy

Postby mrswdk on Tue Jun 25, 2019 10:59 am

HitRed wrote:When in doubt, dodge the question.

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