Once Upon A Killer Mafia (14/17) A Writers Block:Endgame

[dd515087]

Gonna be kind of scattered, sry.

vote: UltrasPlot What are you plotting with this no lynch nonsense Ultra? (bad pun intended)

lmfao what kind of logic is this, also 4th vote, a bit too far for pressure, yes?

This is like my very first post... It is completely irrelevant, there was no info and I'm not a fan of no lynch on D1. That is why I voted you. Calm down,

So after we start a bandwagon on Ultra for voting No Lynch you go ahead and vote no lynch. Also, the mod changed it to 10 days. I'm not saying that not reading or just skimming over all the posts means you're scum, but it definitely doesn't give off a town vibe to me

Mhm, like mafia would take the risk... framing yet another townie (AoG1.0), means nothing whatsoever, also speaking of a bandwagon in a positive sense[/quote]
I don't even understand this...

8 pages of no post later... he comes back with jokes but no content. 2 more pages later...

I have never played a mafia game with this many long posts. Geez.
I'm sorry I have had a very busy schedule recently. Went through the most recent posts though.

Streaker wrote:

Zivel wrote:

UltrasPlot wrote:
Fck it, I'm fullclaiming. I am a Lover/Mason.

Gj forcing me to reveal myself, mafia.

I know Lover is a scum safeclaim but fakeclaiming doesn't help us here does it?

Hmmm I am a lover, and my partner and I are confirmed town. And no, you are not my partner....

Scum slip? Tell me why the hell would you pick lovers to fake claim in a group this large of non vanilla? Did you really think there would not be a pair of lovers to counter claim you?

Lol? Wel now this is interesting for sure. In my eyes, this just warrants an Ultra lynch even more.

Now I was willing to let go on Ultra (for today), and replace my vote on the second scum (imo) being Virus.

@PCM, I can understand you feeling i'm too agressive on Ultra, but don't accuse me of going for an 'easy' case. It's anything but easy as nobody is giving a crap to lynch him, while i'm trying to persuade everyone to lynch him.

With the situation as it is, I don't feel we can let go of Ultra's claim (and the counterclaim that followed). Would there be 2 pairs of lovers in this game? Unlikely, not impossible. Mafia would never counterclaim here (I think).
The only game that I have ever played with lovers is PYP and that was the result of Cupid's actions and it ended up being terrible for the town.
Also, if you believe it's unlikely that there are two pairs of lovers, it's more unlikely that there are 3... And no neither Ultra or Ziv is my lover. Ultra seems very scummy for claiming that he is a lover first. Ziv gets townie points for coming forward to counterclaim

lol gj claiming lover 3rd ytf would you do this[/quote]
First of all, wtf is up with this quoting? It's not difficult to do it right. Second, Why would I do this? This has been explained many times. IT HELPED YOU THAT I CLAIMED BTW. I didn't understand the mechanics of the game (neither did anyone else) so I outed myself so that we wouldn't hit scum. THIRD, I don't play D1 until I see fit, that's just how I do, SORRY if you play differently. FOURTH (and most important) This isn't a joke... I posted 3 or 4 times at this time and you pick one of them to be joke? And then on the one immediately after you take it as a real post? It's next for anyone who can't follow:

New thought: what if all of us who have claimed lovers are town and this is just an evil twist rishaed is throwing on us... We could all be screwed
I'm tired and going to bed, I have gone through almost everything. Here are some general reads:

1.Hotshot53- leaning town
2.Pancakemix - Neutral/ leaning town
3.mtamburini - town
4.Streaker - not sure about you yet, going to have to go back through all your posts
5.Virus90- scummy
6.aage - town
7.Storrzerg - was town at first, but the more I read the more scummy he seems... going to go back through
8.Ultrasplot - scummy
9.Zivel - leaning town
10.Whatsausage - scummy
11.Army of God - scummy
12.Anamainiacks - leaning town
13.Crasp - need to find more posts
14.dd515087 - charming, easy on the eyes, I would have his children
(14.dd515187 was town, dissapeared. he played more active last game and he was mafia there.)
^ streaker's read from a couple days ago - decided to include it because it was the only one on me that didn't say "he's scum for being inactive" IIRC
15.Anarkistsdream - Neutral, leaning scum
16.Strikewolf - probably the town mayor honestly
17.Crazymilkshake5 - uhh... I don't remember seeing anyone with this name

If anyone has comments or concerns or would like to know more, you can reach me on this forum (possibly )

any backup? also using your relative inactivity to 'clean' yourself, lol.

Yeah basically. I felt it necessary to claim because it was just the weirdest thing. I was ready to blow up Ultra with a counter claim, but Ziv had beat me to the punch and I just didn't know what to do.

you didn't know what to do so you risk an extra townie in the event that you die, .[/quote]
I dont understand anything you are saying above honestly. It's just too dumb for me to comprehend

I am, I am only allowed to talk to my lover at night though

Why the HECK would a moderator allow lover OC only at night? That doesn't help them at all... they can't even deliberate over lynch votes. I think he means the mafia qt lol.[/quote]

I DONT KNOW ASK THE MOD. That reasoning is just ridiculous. I've literally revealed my entire role and why (I believe) I can't talk at night. It really doesn't help, especially when my lover doesnt give a shit about this game

ALSO, somewhat related (and this goes for everyone)... but HOW DO YOU NOT KNOW WHO MY LOVER IS??? IT IS VERY OBVIOUS

[TheForgivenOne]

So, i put this as a slight defense from hotshot regarding my push on anark. Anark, yes i missed the joke, but at this point i clearly state "still doing nothing to contribute to the game" Hot shot doesn't comment on that, instead he comments on the joke side. which leads to his second comment being almost meaningless since i do give reason. The phrasing of his post, seems to indicate a strike down on my case on anark, and give credit to the generalization of my play.

Personally, I view this as a weak point. Granted that Anark hadn't done much, but I don't think HotShot not commenting on it is that... big. It seems like you are reaching here. Would him saying something like "Yeah, he's not contributing much" have meant that much?

Wow, this forum has been active, I guess having both storr and mtam in a game helps that lol. I would disagree with anark's vote against storr... that is how storr always plays, throwing any little thing against the wall, sees what sticks, how people reacts, tries to upset people, etc... not saying I like that play style, but that's what he does, so I don't get a scum read from it.

I still think ultra's trying to shut down conversation before it even started is the most scummy thing so far, so I will leave my vote there. I am not 100% opposed to a no lynch if at the end of the day everyone with pressure has legitimate sounding claims (although in that case I usually go for my default of an inactive/scummarizer), but doing it from the start has no town purpose.

Virus being absent, but visible visiting the boards could be suspicious... we'll see if the votes and the prod gets him going.

I agree with the FOS on streaker, depending on how ultra flips/claims (obviously if ultra turns out to be town, a bigger FOS on streaker than if ultra turns out to be scum)

I think that covers the major points of the day so far...

Ultra wasn't trying to shut down conversation, he kept trying to discuss why he felt no lynch was better over lynching. So his push on ultra seems a bit off from the conventional reasons of different policy. Specially since he continues to argue with ultra about why no lynch is worse than lynching.

This is his only mention of virus, before he sheeps my read. Which really isn't anything, again restating what has all ready been stated by others.

I just wanna bold this section, also to point out that hotshot did not follow up on streaker at all. I'd even go as far to say, that hotshot completely forgot he made this statement.

I didn't exactly agree with Ultra's view of NL'ing, But i'm in the middle of your argument. It seemed he was shutting down... his own conversation in a way. Voting adds conversation in my POV in a way that it helps get reads on people. I won't get into much detail, as this point is beyond old.

Valid point on Streaker. +1 on a FoS against HotShot for not following up on that.

comments in green

well im there, dont you worry.
kind of disturbing that mtam thinks im an easy read, makes me doubt if im really that bad a player...
the lack of confidence in this response to mtamb, makes me think virus isn't town.
also i disagree with the logic of: "he is online --> so he has definatly read everything and is supposed to write a message" sometimes reading 3 pages and responding is not alligned with the time frame you have in mind at that moment for the game, but maybe thats just me. (also that is exactly the point why i removed that ability in whatsapp, cause people say your online so why dont you respond... so i might decide to do the same here soon, im pretty sure its a tactical adventage for mafia to disable that ability)
Fairly long winded response which is just well i dont' know. since you don't actually say why you didn't respond. you just said "somtimes" If its a tactical advantage for mafia, why would you disable it then? if your town what do you have to hide?


and besides i hate day 1, and im usually highly inactive day 1. last game proved why thats better for me (i got caught being scum that game while being active), so i generally dont comment to much day 1 since i am a bit to straight forward for some people and i always get some votes on me for speaking out what i think (or being enthousiastic )

This is incredibly false. While you may choose to be inactive day 1 (which is not good for town) You did not get caught for being "active"
You got caught not reading the rules (which prompted you to respond)
You then tried to throw dirt on storr/tambo (you said something 100% that wasn't true, so a lie now) which leads to more pressure
Then you admitted to "laying low" aka playing inactive in hopes the case would "go away" (which results in MORE pressure)
This results in your claim, which majority of town felt it was ok to have a 1 shot vig die (mafia vig)

"active" is not what you played last game. You purposely went "inactive" last game to avoid pressure. It seems the pattern may have returned this game... Hence the extended wait for you to post this game.




anyway about this game,
Ultra is pointing on a no lynch for arguments i think are valid, although i dont agree. so basicly i dont want to vote ultra.
also i disagree with hotshot reasoning of the day 1 mislynch --> does it provide information about the mafia? in my opinion, it is not that hard for mafia to split votes among several people day 1, generally day 1 a town majority decides to lynch someone, even if they target a mafia player generaly some of the mafia are on that wagon aswell, just to gain town creds, and later be able to say that they lynched that person SO they are town. so in my opinion it is possible that day 1 voting patterns give information, but it is also easily rigged.

So the discussion you have on the game so far is "i don't wanna vote on ultra" because his arguments are "valid" are mafia unable to make valid arguments? there is no further discussion from virus about ultra, just a simple 1 liner.

Secondly we have him discussing miss-lynch and the value in it. (well him not believing in the value) So it seems funny that he thinks ultras points are valid on no lynch. But doesn't agree with no lynch. Thus virus would want a lynch today, yet says there isn't much value in a miss lynched town. It seems like an odd train of thoughts. Either way, what he talks about is not really telling on what he thinks about the game. Its just his idea of what value a lynch has. So as of this point we are (what 4 days in?) and this is the only post he has, and its really that's it.....

Its honestly surprising that no one else bothered to speak up about virus...

I would have to agree with all of storr's' points here.

Ultra has been posting and contributing more recently, so I'll let his NL vote slide as a newbie (on these forums) mistake for now, and remove my vote unvote

Streaker and DD for their relative inactivity other than joining the bandwagon get FOS, but for now virus and his one post admitting he's trying to be less active day 1 so he doesn't get lynched by his activity deserves a vote and pressure. vote virus

FP 3 times... As far as Nark, some of the things he said in his posts definitely gave me a scum vibe, but other things he said sounded more towny... so I will give him a FOS but stay voting virus for now

This section is fairly important, details my main reasons of pushing virus, and what hotshot had to say about virus. Also to note, how hotshot follows me with his agreement. (no lover claim form him at this moment) Also look, he does bring up streakers name again, but doesn't do anything with it. Just points out the inactivity. hot shot doesn't have anything to add about virus as of this point. Also at this point, i've stopped pressuring virus and followed zivel to push pcm. yet he makes no mention of this. Considering this, why has hotshot not bothered to talk to me about virus? I made this case, that he felt was a damn good one, and he isn't concerned that i'm not keeping the pressure on virus?.

This I'm back and forth with. Yes, he mentioned Streaker again and went nowhere with it, which I still find odd.

But I don't really agree with the argument on not following on Virus. At this point Virus had one post. One. It's hard to make much of a case out of 1 post from a player. So I don't see this as a major point.

With some pressure, virus made a few posts... after making all his reads, he then threw out a virtually random vote on someone he thought was "slightly scummy" and then admits he didn't build a case on zivel and wasn't actually trying to get other people to vote zivel either. (Even though the leading candidates for lynch aren't ones he suspects, he doesn't try to offer much of an alternative.)

sheeped everything i stated earlier, in far less detail. He isn't even trying to interact at this point with anyone to figure out someones alignment.
viewtopic.php?f=213&t=&start=325#p4579133

Nothing to say here.

I agree with aage here... ultra tried to make himself seem so important... and now basically it turns out that if we lynch him, and he's telling the truth, we basically are only lynching a vanilla towny. I still think that ultra and virus are scum, but to be on the safer side, I would prefer to lynch ultra and see what happens... best case scenario, we get scum, worst case scenario virus dies (basically a vanilla other than the 1-person bodyguard), and ultra is confirmed town. I would prefer that risk than the possible kill 2 scum (or 1 scum if they are lying and not actually lovers), or kill 2 townies if we are wrong. At least with the ultra lynch, worst case scenario we have a confirmed town and only 1 town dead. So for that reason I will unvote, vote ultra

I think his follow up here on ultra is fairly scummy. with "only losing a vt" I don't believe hotshot is trying to solve the game, or develop any cases. Just tons of agreement with what others have said, and imo not trying to figure out the game. I find most of his opinions very simple minded that go along the lines of "policy" (ultra case why ultra should be lynched) or simple as activity/ following what someone else has said (me pushing virus). he does throw a few comments out here and there as to "o this is weird/scummy" but really doesn't do anything with them, at least enough to develop his own case against someone.

I also want people to look closely at hotshots lack of discussion with other conversations about his suspects. Never does he interact with me about virus, Someone I felt was scummy and lead the case against him, and Ultra, where i was probably his biggest defender on his actions, and why he was town. yet not once does he address any defense i make of ultra. Specially near the end, when he switches back to ultra.

I'm going to address this with HotShot's reply. See below.

Well, since it looks like the vote is between AoG and DD, with ultra in a relatively distant third, as I said before I would rather an AoG lynch than a DD lynch, so I will unvote, vote AoG

When the ultra lynch is not going to happen we have his final input.

Summary of Hotshots actions day 1. 3rd to vote Ultra for policy.
3rd person to vote virus, (after crasp and myself unvoted)
100% agreed with my entire reason on virus, not once, but several times.
makes no effort to talk to me about the case, or convince me to stay with virus. he is content to let me pressure pcm, and do what ever.
Switches to Ultra, for weak reasons. he doesn't address any defense of ultra that has been given, instead is content again to follow others.
Throws plenty of doubt on peoples actions, with no follow up.
Doesn't take a stance on someone being town.

List of people he threw scum on
Ultra
storr
streaker
virus
nark
dd5
Aog

list of people hotshot town read
0

Not much to say here either.

I agree with aage here... ultra tried to make himself seem so important... and now basically it turns out that if we lynch him, and he's telling the truth, we basically are only lynching a vanilla towny. I still think that ultra and virus are scum, but to be on the safer side, I would prefer to lynch ultra and see what happens... best case scenario, we get scum, worst case scenario virus dies (basically a vanilla other than the 1-person bodyguard), and ultra is confirmed town. I would prefer that risk than the possible kill 2 scum (or 1 scum if they are lying and not actually lovers), or kill 2 townies if we are wrong. At least with the ultra lynch, worst case scenario we have a confirmed town and only 1 town dead. So for that reason I will unvote, vote ultra

I think his follow up here on ultra is fairly scummy. with "only losing a vt" I don't believe hotshot is trying to solve the game, or develop any cases. Just tons of agreement with what others have said, and imo not trying to figure out the game. I find most of his opinions very simple minded that go along the lines of "policy" (ultra case why ultra should be lynched) or simple as activity/ following what someone else has said (me pushing virus). he does throw a few comments out here and there as to "o this is weird/scummy" but really doesn't do anything with them, at least enough to develop his own case against someone.

I also want people to look closely at hotshots lack of discussion with other conversations about his suspects. Never does he interact with me about virus, Someone I felt was scummy and lead the case against him, and Ultra, where i was probably his biggest defender on his actions, and why he was town. yet not once does he address any defense i make of ultra. Specially near the end, when he switches back to ultra.

Yes, I was trying to "solve the game", I felt that ultra/virus was scummy, but since it wasn't a sure thing I felt the safest route was to lynch ultra... less risk, and virtually the same reward. It was day 1... there wasn't much to discuss other than what had already been discussed by 5 other people. I don't know what you want me to do, create things out of thin air like you do occasionally? And again, you are one of the only people who "discuss" cases with third parties directly. People usually only discuss cases with you when you ask them specifically about it, and you never tried to discuss the case with me, either. If you thought Ultra was so town, why did you want to lynch virus when he said he was ultra's lover? Obviously you couldn't even convince yourself that ultra was town.

Eh, Bullshit. I highly doubt you are going to agree with 100% with every single word someone says in a post. I've found ways to add to arguments even though "Everything" has been said. I'd rather see you find a way to make a post as to why you agree with someone's argument. Or if you see a slight flaw, comment on it. That 5th person found a way to add to the discussion, I'm sure you could have done so as well. Just seems lazy to me.

Nothing more needed to be said about virus, he had only made one post at that point, so I didn't need to write a second book about it. I stated why I was voting him, he admitted he was trying to play under the radar. I didn't have any strong feelings on the pcm case either way, so I didn't have anything worth commenting on it. By making a post, I am talking to everyone, including you... I don't usually directly talk to people about a case on a third party like you do, in fact, most people don't.


I don't think virus states he is playing under the radar this game. He says he isn't going to wagon to stay under the radar. Not sure where you are getting that bit.

Actually, he kinda did in a way.

and besides i hate day 1, and im usually highly inactive day 1. last game proved why thats better for me (i got caught being scum that game while being active), so i generally dont comment to much day 1 since i am a bit to straight forward for some people and i always get some votes on me for speaking out what i think (or being enthousiastic )

For Day 1, he's admitting to staying under the radar. **Edited Later on** You commented on this later on. I've played with Virus a few times, and if I remember correctly, he's used this strategy (Being inactive/quiet D1) almost everytime. But it has been awhile since I've actually played a whole game, so I could be thinking of someone else**

I have commented and interjected on every case and discussion that has been made so far, much more than some others have done. I didn't defend zivel because there was no real case made on him, everyone agreed he was town, so there was no need to "defend" him.


No, you can't claim you had a town read on zivel, when you made posts like this. I would even go as far to say, that this is obvious why you didn't defend zivel, because you left him open as a scum option. (post was on the 7th) Also the last time you talk about zivel.

Agree 100%. Hotshot, you essentially said you had no town reads, yet from this post, you basically say you read him as town.

That's all I got for tonight on this case. I had mentioned earlier that I basically none of his posts stuck, this is what I mean:

I mentioned I was reading the thread before I was subbed in. Each player that had been posting had posts that "Stuck" with me, where I could easily recall it. If I thought "What has Player X done.." I could recall a post or more that they had made.

When I subbed in, my original thought was "... I honestly can't recall one post HotShot has made". I had to go back and look. I was going to make a comment on it when I subbed in, but thought it was paranoia on my part, plus there was more important things to go on. So to me he was posting, well, fluff. It was posting, but nothing really in it that was important.

ebwop

FOS Storr for not showing the information when it was a matter of ctrl+c and ctrl+v...
This push on hotshot is getting unnerving.

I advise you all not to vote hotshot until storr comes out and gives his explanation.

This just seems lazy on your part. Stupid FoS in my eyes.

I need to reread DD's case, but I do agree his role seems strange. Regarding his last bit of claiming: That's how I assumed Commuter worked. Can't use it consecutively. That's how I will generally assume the role works.

@Regarding my activity: I am disappointed that I haven't been able to post more. Next month and a half I don't have tournaments, so I should have more time.

Edit** Oh, DD post. Ill make comments on his last post.

Edit again... not much in there. Son of a biscuit. Agree the quoting is fucked. Ultra, learn to quote.

Yeah basically. I felt it necessary to claim because it was just the weirdest thing. I was ready to blow up Ultra with a counter claim, but Ziv had beat me to the punch and I just didn't know what to do.

you didn't know what to do so you risk an extra townie in the event that you die, .

I dont understand anything you are saying above honestly. It's just too dumb for me to comprehend

He's essentially saying since you outed yourself, you're risking your Lover dying. I think he assumes if you die, your Lover dies.

I'll be here for part of tomorrow (Won't be on in the afternoon).

[TheForgivenOne]

EBWOP: Basically, my two "Nothing to say here" is because my brain is fried.

[dd515087]

He's essentially saying since you outed yourself, you're risking your Lover dying. I think he assumes if you die, your Lover dies.

I'll be here for part of tomorrow (Won't be on in the afternoon).

Oh no I think that if I die, my lover will too as well. Too bad there is no reason for mafia not to NK me right? It's not like I was trying to hide the limitation on my commuter role for this very reason right? That would just be dumb.

[pancakemix]

Again, difference and nice try at deflecting pressure off hotshot. What about the point that hotshot didn't have any town reads, or defend any accusations.

Why is it that when I disagree with an argument, it's "deflecting"?I'm not just going to follow the leader. You have to convince me. That's the game. You also need to start by addressing my vote on you, based on my argument yesterday.

Well, you could explain what i could do differently to help the formatting, but i feel the colors help separate players comments, and make things easier to read. I fail to see how different colors "complicates things"

Do what I do^^. You know who's talking, no annoying colors. Copy. Paste. Highlight. Quote button. Type ="name" after "quote" inside the brackets. Done.

@pcm, can you explain what hotshot has done to help town? anything in particular that he did well to help solve the situation day 1? Things in your opinion that he did that was pro town?

I know he didn't do anything earth-shattering, but let's be honest: 1) all you've done is harp on him since D1 and 2) PYP is the only instance I can think of of him doing something that earth-shattering early game (and that's a serious exception).

I think any case on AoG 2.0 is now more solid as he's trying to wagon hotshot...

thats fine, but don't get sidetracked.. hotshot needs to be lynched today

Ridiculous.

We got confirmed mafia guys!

Assuming his claim were true he would just commute leaving no reason to not shoot him.

1. Commuting is usually nonconsecutive, meaning if he used it last night he couldn't tonight
2. If he did commute, then it would be a wasted shot on your part
3. You probably still shouldn't do it.

hey, how about you push hotshot, till something happens, then re look aog after he has time to do something. your push on aog isn't accomplishing anything right now, so at least work with me so something can be accomplished.

What happened to what you did to me? Y'know, asking people what they thought and considering you target's arguments? This lynch feels like it's more about you than it is about HotShot.

Clearly outline your case on Hotshot in one post and I may well be convinced. As of right now Hotshot seems less scummy than AoG / dd / mtam.

i have, be useful and vote hotshot

I'd also like to point out these posts are useless and generate no new content, especially when your response to HotShot's counters is "NO".

OK so we have two potential situations here with Storr and HotShot, since the case has like nothing to it:
1) Storr is cop or masoned to a cop and knows HotShot is mafia
2) Storr is mafia and trying to get us to mislynch without much content
3) These two cases determine whether or not AoG is scum.

AoG and Storr must be of the same orientation, therefore.
We lynch AoG 2.0. In case he flips town, I shoot HotShot and dd (your case is terrible). If he flips mafia, I shoot dd and Storr.

I don't know where you're getting that third point.

You're absolutely right there wasn't a lot of content in that post. Because I already gave my scum reads on you earlier. If you want to go look at it, page 18 IIRC

Doesn't count, that was a different AoG.

any backup? also using your relative inactivity to 'clean' yourself, lol.

I like how you pulled his reads from a quoted post and didn't remove someone else's comment. THIS IS WHY WE DON'T USE COLORS, STORR.

Right now I am town-reading PCM, would like to hear more from him on day 2.

Sowwy. Hope this helps, next few days will be a bit better.

I seem to have misplaced DD's nameclaim. Did we even get one?

[Zivel]

Romeo and Juliet PCM. I am still at work so can't catch up yet but have been reading it all. Will get a post up in the next day.

[strike wolf]

Sorry all. I meant to get online last night to post a fuller post but I was too busy celebrating (GO DAWGS!). Hopefully have time tonight.

[UltrasPlot]

I think I know who dd means Juliet is. With that I guess it may not be a good idea to shoot him... very townie move on his part to imply instead of state outright.

I believe I recognize why dd claimed now...

Storr, you have not yet responded with reads. I would like to see them and then we can discuss between Storr, Hotshot, and AoG2.0.

[UltrasPlot]

ebwop: although, don't get me wrong, I still think dd is scummy but he may not be worth shooting tonight.

[mtamburini]

ebwop

FOS Storr for not showing the information when it was a matter of ctrl+c and ctrl+v...
This push on hotshot is getting unnerving.

I advise you all not to vote hotshot until storr comes out and gives his explanation.

vote hotshot

[StorrZerg]

Interesting. This is a rather large shift from before, and you now have rather few scum reads, instead of Storr's alleged 'no town reads.' Now, HotShot could be scum saving face, but this is useful info we should discuss. In comparison, I would like to hear your reads, Storr.

These combined would give us a good feeling of who to lynch today.

So i have made town reads, i have made reads. Please stop pretending that i haven't. It is very clear you are not reading the game that closely, since you very well could just quote a read of mine, and give commentary of it. (this same comment goes to hotshot) who thinks i am avoiding giving "town reads" when he is the one that is avoiding giving commentary of them.

Why is it that when I disagree with an argument, it's "deflecting"?I'm not just going to follow the leader. You have to convince me. That's the game. You also need to start by addressing my vote on you, based on my argument yesterday.

Be specific. I will compare the 2 examples. As for your case today, what case? Its a new day, I'm sure you can take the time to readdress your issues. Not to mention i responded to strike wolfs case, the least you could do would be to comment on that as well. Not to mention i gave reasons yesterday for not continuing to pressure you, do you recall any of them... Am i full of shit? does it come from a town trying to do the right thing? What?

I know he didn't do anything earth-shattering, but let's be honest: 1) all you've done is harp on him since D1 and 2) PYP is the only instance I can think of of him doing something that earth-shattering early game (and that's a serious exception).

Furthest from the truth, i had almost no contact with hotshot day 1. How can you make such a statement like this as fact, when I never pushed him. Thanks for bringing up a recent game that hotshot was town in, and how he acted. Your right, that is deff on the more extreme position of hotshot, but my case still stands. hotshot isn't playing like a townie, and you have just admitted to it right now. Stop being stubborn with your case on me, and actually read into hotshot, and comment on the other points people are making about his inconsistencies.

What happened to what you did to me? Y'know, asking people what they thought and considering you target's arguments? This lynch feels like it's more about you than it is about HotShot.

Am i not doing that? am i not bitching and moaning about people not commenting about hotshot? (o wait i am) Did i not remark that there is little point to keep conversing with only hotshot, and how i would really love to talk to other people about hotshot. (as for those that have started to comment on hotshot, ill be getting to them at some point today)

I'd also like to point out these posts are useless and generate no new content, especially when your response to HotShot's counters is "NO".

yes, "no" to certain questions and demands of him, like him demanding my town reads, when he can't even recall one, when i've been very transparent on what i think of people. I'm not going to continue talking to hotshot when he isn't even willing to come forward with a read i've made, and either disagree or agree with it. Instead he is pushing this idea that i haven't given any reads, and since i'm refusing to give into him its "scummy" If hotshot is town, he knows i've given reads (well both alignments do) and i imagine town hotshot is willing to pull up a read i've made, and either agree or disagree with it (not virus case). That shows he is at least paying attention to my scum pushes, (note anark push). Not once does he make any comment about a town read i make.

Storr, you have not yet responded with reads. I would like to see them and then we can discuss between Storr, Hotshot, and AoG2.0.

Again, stop acting like i haven't given reads this day.

[StorrZerg]

Storr and HotShot both are giving me scum vibes, but at the way they're at each other's throats, they definitely can't both be scum. I'm interested to see where this goes.

Great, glad you commented on the case itself, and pointed out the inconsistency in hotshots responses. I don't really have much else to say, other than i can agree with what you bring up.
(fyi, town read him earlier, he lost some favor yet still retain his town presence in my books) (Why? because he responded about the hotshot situation, rather than generically sum up the situation, it seems he has taken effort into analyzing the situation, and is looking and explaining what is scummy)

[rishaed]

Vote Count:

Hotshot53 (3) - mtamburini, Storrzerg, ArmyofGod
Storrzerg (3) - Hotshot53, Pancakemix, dd515087
ArmyofGod (1) - Crasp

With 16 alive it takes 9 to lynch. Deadline is Nov. 21st.... Also it might just be me but some ppl are nearing prods. Please try and post more often. (It might just be the flooding of posts by certain ppl as well....

[mtamburini]

Vote Count:

Hotshot53 (3) - mtamburini, Storrzerg, ArmyofGod
Storrzerg (3) - Hotshot53, Pancakemix, dd515087
ArmyofGod (1) - Crasp

With 16 alive it takes 9 to lynch. Deadline is Nov. 21st.... Also it might just be me but some ppl are nearing prods. Please try and post more often. (It might just be the flooding of posts by certain ppl as well....

Probably the latter then the former

[StorrZerg]

Ok, since there are a lot of players, and I don't want to let anyone fall through the cracks, and have also been requested for town reads, I guess it's time for an infamous list.

1.Hotshot53 Town, obviously
2.Pancakemix - Had a fight with Storr day 1, in re-reading it, storr seemed to be grasping at straws as much as he was in my "case". I liked the way PCM was responding to things. Right now I am town-reading PCM, would like to hear more from him on day 2.
3.mtamburini - has been very disinterested in the game, a lot of skimming and mis-reading. Preemptively claimed being able to revive a dead town, which I can believer from his non-interested play, I would imagine a scum mtam would try harder. Would still be nice to hear more reads from him while he is alive though
4.Streaker - led the push on ultra, and to a lesser extent on virus. Turns out he was wrong, but re-reading his reasons and posts, they sound like they come more from a towny. I didn't like how storr tried to pit me against streaker based on a post I made 2 weeks ago before streaker had posted much, makes me have a better town feeling on streaker lol. (Also noticed streaker had been suspicious of storr...) I'd lean town.
5.Virus90 Yuuki Asuna Lover/Shield - Dead
6.aage - reading back, I agree with most of his posts, I would lean town for him
7.Storrzerg - Didn't like how he wanted to lynch virus over ultra day 1, or his recommending to shoot mtam today. After reading his pressure on PCM day 1, didn't like it any more than I liked his pressure on me today. Didn't like how he tried to pit streaker and me against each other. In my reading back, it's surprising how many people have FOS'd him for various reasons. I'd lean scum as of now, it's possible it's from OMGUS feeling, but there are enough other things he's done that I think I would be leaning scum outside of his case on me.
8.Ultrasplot - With virus' death, he is about as confirmed a town as we have now
9.Zivel - counterclaimed ultra's lover, and has made town sounding posts otherwise also. Obvious town read with DD's counter-counter claim indicating multiple lover pairs
10.Whatsausage - hasn't been very active, but the posts he has made seem to be more towny. Neutral to lean town
11.Army of God Katsuragi Mayuko Town Redirector - Dead
12.Anamainiacks - hasn't made too many posts, but the ones he has made are pretty long and seem substantive. I'd lean town
13.Crasp - has a lot of one-liner posts and posts with no info in them... tried to raise suspicion on ultra day 2 saying he might have been recruited. I'd go with neutral to leaning scum due to his lack of content
14.dd515087 - counter-counter claimed lover. Could have done it because he is a lover and thought it weird there were 3 sets, as he claims, or could have done it as a scum trying to get potential town cred for him and for a future claimed lover. Claimed role either doesn't fit the normal manga, or his backstory doesn't match the manga's backstory. Claimed he is a commuter, but only every-other night, and he is in town tonight, so he doesn't want to be shot by ultra. I'm a coin flip on him right now, I can see why he'd be town, and why he'd be scum. If ultra still plans to shoot him tonight, his lover might want to think about coming forward before day end to try to save him, or else both of them would die (assuming he is telling the truth that he's a town lover)
15.Anarkistsdream replaced by AoG 2.0 - Nark didn't post too much before disappearing early on day 1. Had a little spat with storr early on day 1, maybe scum trying to distance themselves from each other? Had a post saying "people know stuff, should come forward with it", seemed to be a little role fishing. AoG 2.0 tried to throw a little doubt on if ultra really is town, and then sheeped storr's vote on me. Is in a fight with crasp over which of them is posting less, the answer is neither is posting much. Not too much to go on, neutral to leaning scum.
16.Strikewolf - Has had pretty in-depth posts that seem town to me. Leaning town on him.
17.Crazymilkshake5 replaced by TFO - Has been pretty inactive, only one or two posts longer than a line, most of his posts are apologizing for not being more active/giving reasons why he wasn't around. "@Ultra regarding my post count: I'm sorry, but this is the absolute max I can do with my work schedule. I am not on all day (Like most of you) and I'm not home most night till midnight. My posts are always going to be Content over a bunch of small posts." Reading back I saw mostly small posts without comment, and not a ton of them either. Could be really busy, could be a scummarizer. From what I remember of his activity in other games, he is usually not very active. So I am neutral on him.


Well... that took a lot longer than I expected, reading back people's posts over 36 pages takes a lot of time lol. Came out with a lot more town reads than I expected, including some I expected to get a scum read on from just memory. So I didn't come up with too many scum reads... the main ones now are Storr, crasp & Nark/AoG 2.0, with neutral on DD and TFO. I was hoping to be able to find a good case on someone other than storr... but he is my main scum read at this point.

I will vote storr for the reasons I gave above.

Isn't it interesting that hotshot was not able to put a town read on me day 1, when he agreed with so many of my reads?

Or when he didn't agree with my reads day 1, he didn't bother to voice his opinion?

Also, 90% of this post, is 1 liner for a read. There is no reason for liking certain posts, we don't know exactly what he liked, he has town reads on 10 towns people, that are largely unsupported with why. (a blanket statement about someones post content, with out discussing in particular what he liked or didn't like isn't useful to knowing how he really feels about someone) This all looks SUPER easy to fake. Every person that is pushing me today, he has a town read on. He is only pushing 3 people as scum, 2 of which are more inactive people that he hasn't really had contact with, (Crasp in particular i town read day 1, gave reasons, and he is scum reading crasp today yet didn't bother to comment day 1 about crasp).

His push against me is largely omgus. If i hadn't pushed him, he wouldn't have pushed me almost certainly. Day 1 habit, would have dictated he would follow the path of least resistance. (so actually maybe he would have pushed me following in the lines of others) yet his habit is still viable, hence his push on Aog, probably the person with the largest doubt upon, because of who he replaced, and crasp a read which i disagree with, and isn't actually talking about why crasp would be scum. Instead its "hey low post count, low content" yet there is content, there are posts with more than 1 liners, and he doesn't actually address what crasp is talking about, what crasp is pushing. Specially since crasp is pushing aog right now, did make a fairly large post regarding why he felt aog is scum.

He doesn't like how i tried to pit streaker vs him, when both seemed to "forget" they had reasons to be pushing each other. Streaker, for apparently "forgetting" that hotshot was on virus, for sheeping me and NOT finding that suspicious, and then hotshot, bringing up streaker as someone to look into if ultra was town, and not actually looking into the situation. Both have now "backed off each other and are "town reading" each other." hotshot also finds every reason streaker pushed, he believes came from a townie person. Which seems absolutely crazy, considering at the time he felt drastically different about the situation. So much so that if he would learn ultra was town, he would have to seriously reconsider streakers push... Yet, this serious reconsideration, is simplified with a 1 liner.

[dd515087]

You're absolutely right there wasn't a lot of content in that post. Because I already gave my scum reads on you earlier. If you want to go look at it, page 18 IIRC

Doesn't count, that was a different AoG.

Okay this is the 2nd time I've seen this. I thought I responded to it. You can't just quote what I'm saying without the context. We were talking about the original AoG. Here is his post, my quote above was my response to it:

Cmon crasp, if you're gonna vote me for not writing much content, at least post more content other than "you're not writing much".


Also, I love it. D1 people vote for me with one line reasons and no one bats an eye, I write a well thought out post which happens to agree with Storr and all of a sudden I'm the scummiest person in the game again. Seriously, my previous incarnation was a confirmed townie yet I'm the only one who's suspicious of the people who jumped on my wagon?

Also, and I can't stress this enough, how come everyone is just pushing aside mtam's stupidity from the last few pages? He proved he has just skimmed and has literally added nothing to the conversation. He has just been barking over his obsession about lynching me but its gonna be funny when I die and flip town.

This is what scum say every time. I do it when I'm scum to. The thing is it wouldn't be funny if you flip town, it would be bad for us. Also, I'm not going to let myself get lynched because I didn't cast a vote
Vote AoG

Well, since it looks like the vote is between AoG and DD, with ultra in a relatively distant third, as I said before I would rather an AoG lynch than a DD lynch, so I will unvote, vote AoG

These were the last two votes on me...yeah, a ton of content in these. Also crap, you were nowhere to be found during the last vote, so let's not get on the "you're not posting content" train

[StorrZerg]

Going to quote some of my town reads, not going to quote everything about a certain person, just enough to a point. Ill also comment if anything has changed on a person.

My first 2 town reads of the game.

With that ill give 2 soft town reads.

Zivil is giving off reads right now, and imo is trying to figure out the game from his posts. The things he has pointed out as scummy, i can agree with and make sense.

Strike wolf also seems to be along those lines of figuring out the game, really liked his analysis of hot_shot.

Town read of Crasp, got shaken due to me misreading something, i still stand that he is likely town.

Only need to post once every 4 days so somebody give me a shout when this gash is over.

so we start with crasp post that got peoples feathers ruffled. So yeah, i can agree this post is a bit crappy, it is really crappy if he follows though with what he has said.
(could be looked at as a joke too considering what happens next)

The reason i made that wake me up post was because i am used to playing with Mt and Storr and what you were seeing was a load of gash. They have an unwritten dont vote early on for each other agreement and what you were seeing was their standard game. A bit of keyboard tennis until somebody then steps into that breach, in this case Ultra, they then step out and leave us mere mortals to carve each other up.
Not a big fan of day 1 reads or of playing my hand so early but a rishead has brought attention to me here are my reads so far.
I dont think Ultra is scum as no self respecting scum would make such a daft play. Just a really bad move on his part. Could get a deserved lynch though.
Streaker has got a FOS from me with that No5 vote . safest place of all for a scum vote and totally pointless post that didnt even need saying.

Lol, advocating 'no lynch' before third day of the game? It might very well come to that, but you are basicly saying Hey Guys let's just not play this game and just do night actions and see what we come up with.
What will happen when there is no cop result, or a positive town check? No Lynch on D2?

Vote Ultra

I am also very suspicious of that half baked vote from crazymikshake on me. Non -commital but capable of starting a bandwagon. if a bandwagon starts he just changes it to red and appears mid vote and nobody thinks much about it. If it doesent the he just accepts my explanation and moves off.

Like i say very little but all i have so far. Not sure why but Zivel is jangling my web as well. Keep looking at his posts but cant see why. Could just be because he is trying to crawl up Storrs butt or the safe vote on Ultra. Or could be because he just metioned me in his skim. Time will tell.
FP Storr, strikewolf.

He comes back with a lengthy post for the early game. I think its a pretty good post because it does a few things. Generates new discussion (me + mt no vote topic)
Gives his own read on Ultra, (something more to talkk about)
And imo shows he is looking for scum, indicating that streaker has the scummy vote on top of ultra.

The other thing to note about this post, is that it contradicts his entrance. he isn't looking to afk in this game, he is looking to play in this game. This is a good stance for him to be talking since it shows his desire to contribute to the game. (which he has continuously done so, having one of the more frequent posters in this game )

what do you think of pcm?

I much prefer making my own to that boxed nonsense.
Get a grip. he has made one post since the game strted and that was tell you that you were full of it. Even a self confessed guru like you cant have a read on that.
Why are you steering me away from Zivel.

Shows that he is paying attention to the game, also he redirects at the end to continue previous conversation about zivel. This post isn't about deflection either, he clearly responds to my PCM question, at to the point its blunt.



As far as his "post count post"

It isn't alignment indicative in the slightest imo. But it is 100% a pro town thing to do. Its mechanical of the game. Its good information to have, gives everyone a clear idea of who is active in this game, who isn't.

Crasp is probably up there as one of my stronger town reads atm. (along with Anamainiacks who i wish would post some more)

Insight to my town read of anamainiacks, still feeling town on him.

@Whatsausage who are you going to push?
still on crazy? (i don't see you continuing poke him O_o)

So his reads agreed with your own, you liked how he got there, and....? Or is that all it takes?

My town read on anamainiacks, is actually because he had a different read on anark than I did. (among other things in the post) So that's not all it takes

Defending ultra.

LOL holy crap, how did i forget ultra was in the pyp game.... So this isn't his first game, but its his first day 1 on this forum.

he replaced in, after day 1. so nothing to compare to that. BUT one of the big things he did was, hint, then claim his role as town.....

Yeah, absolutely i want him to comment on things that are not relative to himself. Thing is, streaker made it appear that his entire reads are simplified to omgus, which i disagree with. And as someone who did get lots of quick votes, its understandable that most of his reads are about those that pressure him.

Strike, any comments on virus or pcm? you still pushing anark? whats changed anything?

me pushing for virus OVER ultra, IF ultra keeps wanting to be the lynch. I'm pushing for them to give alternatives. Why? Because i don't want to be lynching them.
So to quell the accusations of me wanting a virus lynch, this is what i'm talking about. I don't want to lynch virus, I only want to lynch him if ultra keeps demanding to be the lynch, instead of pushing someone else.

@ultra/virus need to start talking about who should be the lynch.

Since the only reason that makes sense to me, as to why ultra would want virus to die to "prove himself" is if he gains power when virus dies. Since he has claimed no additional powers.
(and if all the other lovers have powers...) Now this theory makes more sense, if the other lovers can confirm their powers interact at all with each other/ benefit each other. And if this is the case, its more hiding of your claim...

cause atm ultra for you to be "confirmed" town with virus death saving you, i can't see it doing that much good. I know i'd still value the opinions, and views of several people over yours, as i imagine others would to.

So if you keep insisting, that you should be the lynch, i will keep pushing that virus dies over you.

@VIRUS FIND SCUM i know you can scum hunt, and you are not doing it 1 bit this game... one of the reasons you are scum in my books. maybe the deal with ultra being his lover muddled things up. yet i don't see why that would change how you play that much...

My town read of zivel, not much has changed.

Why is zivel most likely town, and even if 3rd party, his win conditions are likely the same as towns.

His style of play compared to the 2 other lover claims. He is active, he is scum hunting. He is giving reads, and proactive.

His counter claim was very townie. A mafia cc wouldn't make much sense, if ultra was lynched and flipped town, he is gunned next. Not a good trade of 2 for 2.

His counter claim also includes information that he had an additional power and his partner has one as well.

Claiming his qt is active. More than likely it's discussion on the game, trying to figure things out which lines up with how he is playing. This is something hard to do as 2 mafia, being active on both fronts, not to mention again, being ok to cc ultra.

His discussion isn't limited, he is open to new paths. He isn't tunneling on ultra, his follow up on pcm is good to.

He read pcm as mafia, revaluation of pcm. Wasn't quite sure, asked pcm a question after. Imo this is a townie trait of zivel. He is still trying to figure out pcm, hence the question which was more of a prompt to get pcm to add discussion on the subject.

My stance on aage, town.

Double post

By the way, don't take my posts too personal, upon rereading I see I'm being a bit cold. I'm here to have fun with the game, and I don't want to ruin yours.

You are doing fine, no one calling you an asshole yet, so you know you haven't over stepped. i've been liking your recent posting. Interested to see who you push. While i can agree with a lot of what you are saying, i'm just not sure where you think mafia are.

My opinion on dd5 near end of day 1. While im unsure of his alignment, i'll be damned if he is lynched for stupid accusations.

Its very doubtful dd5 made up his role pm. why? cause if he did so he would have been more careful about what was in the pm, and the information he told us, why he couldn't talk in the night, who was dead etc.

Now with the continual pressure of dd5. we can expect a claim from his lover yes? Then what?


And the theory that dd5 claimed to relieve pressure off virus/ultra is super tinfoil hat. Since he would have to claim his lover at some point, meaning thats 4 scum on day 1 with claimed roles. and they expect to "win the game" like this? this is the realm of make believe.

I'm going to continue to defend dd5 on all points made on him that are silly and not alignment indicative. (yes silly, i consider 99% of this flavor talk meaningless as to what alignment dd5 is)

Responding to zivel about WS, still null on him. Haven't placed that much time to be looking at him.

really don't have that much on him. the one thing i do have, which i don't like is the manner of which he asks questions. The follow up seems to be lacking, and there is no continuation of discussion. Its mostly just him quoting someone, but not following up with it.

So what do you want me to do lol?

I have a town read on him

You could explain that town read

So like this, i did, yet he doesn't have any comment?

First off, my goodness some of you are grasping hardcore at nothing when you are actually accusing anark for his very early "let's all jump on pcm" joke. You've got to be kidding me if you took that as a serious idea.

God you bleed town anamainiacks

Have to agree, that was a solid first post and explained coherently why we vote day one.

I am still pushing for an Ultra lynch, he has not come back to defend himself and so is either afk or lurking. Till I hear more from him, I am happy for him to die today.

Will come back later after shopping with a more comprehensive list.

So because he had a post agreeing with you he bleeds town? Most of his post was meta-based (the benefits of lynching D1) and that is normally the type of thing you like to jump on. What gives? That wasn't questioning/ pressuring/ giving reads.

And then zivel hops right on to agree as well.
Followed by promising a list we have yet to see (I'd give him more time on it, but it has been a decently long shopping trip)

Right now I am getting scum vibes from zivel

Fp'd by storr
somewhat talks about my question

Seems that it wasn't worth the effort to revise his post since i posted before him. again, he sees what i posted before hand, and it answers some questions, but no follow up.
what didnt i respond to? why isn't he interested in that?

1.Hotshot53 (scum read, obviously, lots of points made)
2.Pancakemix (null, not liking his play day 2)
3.mtamburini (town, I'd be pushing him other wise. I've also made several off hand comments regarding him)
4.Streaker (scum, posted a case today)
6.aage (town above)
7.Storrzerg (biggest scum hunter in the game, #fact)
8.Ultrasplot (town)
9.Zivel (town )
10.Whatsausage null
12.Anamainiacks (same as above)
13.Crasp (same as above)
14.dd515187 (likely town)
15.Anarkistsdreamreplaced by AoG 2.0 (scum reading)
16.Strikewolf (town, though getting a little concerned about his day 2 play, differently not as strong of a read as day 1)
17.TFO (null)

For mesure, this was my earlier stance in the game on Nov 2nd.

virus (1 post explained why i disliked it)
streaker (yeah what? didn't have time to get to him)
Crazymilkshake5 (i think 1 post thats it?)
Anarkistsdream (meh might come back to him well see)
Army of God
dd515187 (fallen off like the dickens)


Null
mtamburini
Hotshot53
Whatsausage
Hotshot53

town
ultra (slight town read)
aage (slight town read, like his posting, but he has not pushed anyone)
zivel
Strikewolf

stronger town
Anamainiacks
crasp

Also it would be fantastic if people would start placing votes... We have 4 days left. So it be nice to know if i'm going to be forced to claim or not. Same goes for hotshot, I don't want this getting down to less than 48 hours, and we still don't know what direction we are taking, then "random afks happen"

[aage]

Just finished reading the last five or so pages, my brain is a bit fried thanks to all the back and forth split-quote responses. I agree with pcm, please stop using the colours sequentially. In addition to the quote="name" technique, I suggest you just cut down the quote to the relevant bit.

I will reread the whole thing again (probably all of day 2 again) but so far I am inclined to follow Storr. Hotshot's "reads" list is a boatload of glorified hunches. It makes me wonder if he is trying to recruit allies in his push on Storr by naming people town. I'll do some fact-checking of HotShot's and Storr's posts before I vote though.

@Storr, you believe Strike's play of today is weak/bad, but I am apparently still town while my only posts today were quite short. Now I don't mind still being read town, but it's odd that you don't call me out on it.

@dd, if your lover is so obvious then why do you say it's obvious rather than say the name? Mafia has more eyes and brains than each single towny, so it's more likely they will discover your lover while townies are left in the dark until you confirm (or your lover does). Initially I thought Storr was your lover but since he suggested that Ultra should shoot you (and if he's your lover, you would have informed him on the mechanics of your role), that is off the table.

[crasp]

Storr seems pretty convinced on hotshot.
I thought ultra had already mentioned this but i cant find the post. Why dont we lynch hotshot and if he is town MT brings him back and ultra takes out storr and whoever.
if he comes up scum then we leave him and in my book storr would be almost confirmed town. (could be 3rd party but doubt it.) MT then brings back AOG 1 and gives rishaed a bad day.
As far as I am concerned if this goes to plan we then have 4 almost confirmed town. at the same time we have our investgators, watchers whatever we have into the mix and at some point some of these guys must hit pay dirt then we have more town and a real platform to follow.
Strorr hasnt convinced me on Hotshot but the way thing are there is a real danger scum slip in there with last minute votes and we lose another townie.
My money is still on AOG aand streaker.

FP'd aage

[StorrZerg]

@Storr, you believe Strike's play of today is weak/bad, but I am apparently still town while my only posts today were quite short. Now I don't mind still being read town, but it's odd that you don't call me out on it.

Because your play isn't like him.

In particular the last page.
[quote"strike wolf"]Storr-I had moderately strong scum vibes from him yesterday. They are a little less today but not as much. I did not like how he seemed to try to gauge town's readiness to lynch AoG again before he had even posted. On the other hand, his initial case on Hotshot seemed more like the Storr I was accustomed to but it has kind of perplexed me how he seems to have abandoned some of his stronger points on the case and pressed the weaker ones.

2. Hotshot-found him mildly scummy day 1 and that hasnt changed much today. I have liked most of his answers to Storr's case but there is some contrast to how active he was once pressure began than beforehand.[/quote]


[quote"StorrZerg"]
I can't defend anything strike has just said, since everything he said is "vague and non specific"
Strike seems to have forgotten that i was pushing anark before he went inactive... [/quote]

He isn't going into detail about hotshot (yes i know he is busy), and hist post about how i'm not focusing on the "better points" makes little or no sense. Largely up to this point, i had just been talking to hotshot about hotshot. I hadn't been able to discuss hotshot with anyone else. Yet i i don't understand why it makes me scum, or why the action in itself is scum to be focused on "a weaker point" rather than focusing on the "stronger points" When he doesn't explain what points these are, not to mention its me bashing my head against the wall (the wall being my scum suspect).

So while yes you have been more quiet this day, you are not making these kind of statements that baffle me and confuse me with out following up (yes i know strike wolf plans to follow up)
And my focus has been on hotshot... then streaker...

fp crasp.

What hasn't sold you on hotshot, what has he done that makes you think he is town. Can you look at whats best for town now, cause what your doing isn't going to help anything right now since the situation of me vs hotshot has to be resolved now, before we can look at aog/streaker. SO i urge you to please pressure hotshot, since it will benifit your view of streaker (since i'm linking them together, what do you think of their link? their avoidance of each other when they logically should be looking at each other)

[aage]

I've decided to pull apart HotShot's list of reads before rereading a ton of posts because "glorified hunches" is pretty vague, and I assume HotShot will want to reply.

All town reads:

3.mtamburini - has been very disinterested in the game, a lot of skimming and mis-reading. Preemptively claimed being able to revive a dead town, which I can believer from his non-interested play, I would imagine a scum mtam would try harder. Would still be nice to hear more reads from him while he is alive though

= town because he is uninterested - that is not the reason Mtamb is a town read... the reason you should read him as town is because his role can be proven tonight. Disregarding that, you should read him as scum because he is skimming, scumarining and lead a mislynch out of nowhere on AoG1.0, by your rationale on Crasp and the new AoG.

2.Pancakemix - Had a fight with Storr day 1, in re-reading it, storr seemed to be grasping at straws as much as he was in my "case". I liked the way PCM was responding to things. Right now I am town-reading PCM, would like to hear more from him on day 2.
4.Streaker - led the push on ultra, and to a lesser extent on virus. Turns out he was wrong, but re-reading his reasons and posts, they sound like they come more from a towny. I didn't like how storr tried to pit me against streaker based on a post I made 2 weeks ago before streaker had posted much, makes me have a better town feeling on streaker lol. (Also noticed streaker had been suspicious of storr...) I'd lean town.

= town because they are suspicious of Storr - I would agree, but Storr is attacking HotShot so this is just another form of OMGUS at this point. Streaker's mis-wagons are excused because "he sounds towny" (why? when? which? does it hurt to be specific?) and you read him as town directly because of Storr - in other words, you're basing your entire read on your read on Storr.

6.aage - reading back, I agree with most of his posts, I would lean town for him
9.Zivel - counterclaimed ultra's lover, and has made town sounding posts otherwise also. Obvious town read with DD's counter-counter claim indicating multiple lover pairs
10.Whatsausage - hasn't been very active, but the posts he has made seem to be more towny. Neutral to lean town
12.Anamainiacks - hasn't made too many posts, but the ones he has made are pretty long and seem substantive. I'd lean town
16.Strikewolf - Has had pretty in-depth posts that seem town to me. Leaning town on him.

= town because multiple and/or extensive "town sounding" posts (why? when? which? does it hurt to be specific?), Zivel being a slight exception because of the lover-affair. Note how he uses pretty much the same phrase for each of us.
The phrase "I agree with most of his posts" has been used more often concerning me, and it makes me wonder which posts are "most". Apparently my awesome pro-town posts have cancelled out my anti-town posts but you decide not to tell me which they are. How am I (or anyone) supposed to believe you then?

All neutral reads:

14.dd515087 - counter-counter claimed lover. Could have done it because he is a lover and thought it weird there were 3 sets, as he claims, or could have done it as a scum trying to get potential town cred for him and for a future claimed lover. Claimed role either doesn't fit the normal manga, or his backstory doesn't match the manga's backstory. Claimed he is a commuter, but only every-other night, and he is in town tonight, so he doesn't want to be shot by ultra. I'm a coin flip on him right now, I can see why he'd be town, and why he'd be scum. If ultra still plans to shoot him tonight, his lover might want to think about coming forward before day end to try to save him, or else both of them would die (assuming he is telling the truth that he's a town lover)

=neutral because... idk? Is he neutral? Or is this no read at all...?

17.Crazymilkshake5 replaced by TFO - Has been pretty inactive, only one or two posts longer than a line, most of his posts are apologizing for not being more active/giving reasons why he wasn't around. "@Ultra regarding my post count: I'm sorry, but this is the absolute max I can do with my work schedule. I am not on all day (Like most of you) and I'm not home most night till midnight. My posts are always going to be Content over a bunch of small posts." Reading back I saw mostly small posts without comment, and not a ton of them either. Could be really busy, could be a scummarizer. From what I remember of his activity in other games, he is usually not very active. So I am neutral on him.

= neutral because "few posts"? Special treatment because he just replaced? I don't see AoG getting that treatment... In fact, your case on AoG is worse since he had few posts as AoG1.0 too, and AoG1.0 was town.

All scum reads:

13.Crasp - has a lot of one-liner posts and posts with no info in them... tried to raise suspicion on ultra day 2 saying he might have been recruited. I'd go with neutral to leaning scum due to his lack of content
15.Anarkistsdream replaced by AoG 2.0 - Nark didn't post too much before disappearing early on day 1. Had a little spat with storr early on day 1, maybe scum trying to distance themselves from each other? Had a post saying "people know stuff, should come forward with it", seemed to be a little role fishing. AoG 2.0 tried to throw a little doubt on if ultra really is town, and then sheeped storr's vote on me. Is in a fight with crasp over which of them is posting less, the answer is neither is posting much. Not too much to go on, neutral to leaning scum.

= scum because "few posts" (see TFO read - is AoG behaving differently from AoG1.0? Imo no, so why does that make him scum this time? Or do you just wanna lynch all inactives first?)

7.Storrzerg - Didn't like how he wanted to lynch virus over ultra day 1, or his recommending to shoot mtam today. After reading his pressure on PCM day 1, didn't like it any more than I liked his pressure on me today. Didn't like how he tried to pit streaker and me against each other. In my reading back, it's surprising how many people have FOS'd him for various reasons. I'd lean scum as of now, it's possible it's from OMGUS feeling, but there are enough other things he's done that I think I would be leaning scum outside of his case on me.

= scum because a) he pressures people, b) he comes up with a way to make both of Ultra's shots hit thin air and c) many people FoS'd him for "various reasons". I'll be reading back to find those.
I wanted to lynch Virus over Ultra too, if you recall. His pressure on pcm yesterday was fine, and provided us with useful info on who is the antagoniser. Pcm seems quite convinced that Storr is the root of all evil. Storr keeps his options open. How does that translate to "I didnt like his pressure"? What is wrong with pressuring anyone? Why do you think pressuring you is bad? (other than "it's you")
Interesting is that you say "there are enough other things he's done", but those things haven't lead to you leaning scum before iirc.
Please explain why Storr's posts are not 'towny' and my/Strike's/Ani's/WS's/Zivel's posts are. What is the criterion that makes you distinguish?

All in all the only active player HotShot seems to be capable of attacking is Storr.

[crasp]

I admit right now that storr has basically bullied me into this but i am absolutely pissed off trying to skim read his posts. Information overload bud.
Vote hotshot.
There better be a good point to this.
fp'd again by aage.

[dd515087]

@dd, if your lover is so obvious then why do you say it's obvious rather than say the name? Mafia has more eyes and brains than each single towny, so it's more likely they will discover your lover while townies are left in the dark until you confirm (or your lover does). Initially I thought Storr was your lover but since he suggested that Ultra should shoot you (and if he's your lover, you would have informed him on the mechanics of your role), that is off the table.

I think it's obvious. That doesn't mean it's obvious to everyone else. If I reveal my lover than the mafia has another target tonight that could kill two people. If my lover wants to come out he will, that's not a decision I'm going to make for him at this point in the game. unvote Storr Your last couple posts have swayed me off you. Not entirely convinced by your HotShot case, but I will go back and read more thoroughly when I have time

[UltrasPlot]

UltrasPlot wrote:
ebwop

FOS Storr for not showing the information when it was a matter of ctrl+c and ctrl+v...
This push on hotshot is getting unnerving.

I advise you all not to vote hotshot until storr comes out and gives his explanation.

vote hotshot

Inconsistent much?

[StorrZerg]

Pretty consistent from mtamburini