CYOC: TDT [6/22] Game Over! FREEDOM!!!

[Anarkistsdream]

OK... THANK YOU, PCM, for helping me out... You guys should know that I haven't had any time to do anything, so please forgive me... Changing jobs...

So, this is what I wrote out while reading the thread.

I have a horse


Strike suggested we watch another player, so I am fine with watching Aage…

On the potato note: it would seem to me that, regardless of if it is a mechanic or a role, it was made up by PCM and not a player… We were just supposed to send in characters and pics, not the role that they would be. That was for Pancake to make up. Second, what does everyone think about the choices made for the horse game each day? Does PCM choose randomly? Does he choose two town and three scum, or vice versa? This mechanic may be to towns advantage considering it should help us determine what groups are active – cults, mafia one, mafia two (if applicable), town, etc…

FOS lootifer for logic that I find lacking. I think it is safe to assume the "horse" is a player ability, not a mod one.

I disagree completely, due to what I said above… NOBODY chose their role… Just their character. And even then, it was a one out of three shot to get any character.

Well rodion beat me to it, but yes spiesr, it appears no one else mentioned your comment. Do you have any knowledge as to why you cannot vote?

I demand to get in a joke vote! Vote anark before he says that he is never scum

I am never scum... But for once I am not a VANILLA TOWNIE!!! YAYYYYYY!

I don’t like the way everyone is talking about this as a game of hot potato…. The problem with that is that you toss it to someone else and when the time is up, that person is out… This is about TAKING, not GIVING… And there are FOUR potatoes, not one… So the game mechanics are not very related, in my opinion.

And Rodion, That's my horse!

[Zivel]

Even if he did, Rodion is a good player. I'd rather he live and if he's on our side help us than die D1 with no chance.


Another note, I've played with pretty much ALL of you (besides 1-2 maybe XD). So be forewarned, I'm mixing up my approach this game.. hopefully. I hate being the center of talk mid-game with people tunneling always because of my theories. XD Like the theory I have already made about this whole horse game.

So being a good player excuses him from interegation?

And why do you need to mention that you will be changing your meta? I don't know your meta but to me it sounds like an excuse for you to appear differently to those who do. You say several times that you are active and pot stirrer and then you say you are going to play differently? So no pot stirring from you or what?

[Iron Butterfly]

Sorry but my internet was sown this weekend. Anyways after re reading the Horse Game I am confused.


"That's My Horse is a traditional game from The Old Country. In it, players take ownership of the "horse" from another player. The player left without a horse is the loser.

In other words, it's Hot Potato. Pass the potato along by posting "[player name], that's my horse!" The person with the potato at the end of the day will be killed."

Players TAKE the horse from another player. Not give.
The player left without a horse is the loser.

The person with the potato/horse at the end of the day will be killed."

like Anarch said in an earlier post Hot potato is about passing a potato and the loser is the one with the potato when the music stops. The rules seem to contradict themselves.

[Anarkistsdream]

Sorry but my internet was sown this weekend. Anyways after re reading the Horse Game I am confused.


"That's My Horse is a traditional game from The Old Country. In it, players take ownership of the "horse" from another player. The player left without a horse is the loser.

In other words, it's Hot Potato. Pass the potato along by posting "[player name], that's my horse!" The person with the potato at the end of the day will be killed."

Players TAKE the horse from another player. Not give.
The player left without a horse is the loser.

The person with the potato/horse at the end of the day will be killed."

like Anarch said in an earlier post Hot potato is about passing a potato and the loser is the one with the potato when the music stops. The rules seem to contradict themselves.

So glad I am not on my own on this one. The tactics that evdryone has talked about do not have much bearing with the odd rule system.

[spiesr]

I don’t like the way everyone is talking about this as a game of hot potato…. The problem with that is that you toss it to someone else and when the time is up, that person is out… This is about TAKING, not GIVING… And there are FOUR potatoes, not one… So the game mechanics are not very related, in my opinion.

And Rodion, That's my horse!

Taking someone's horse is functionally identical to giving them the hot potato. The "lack of horse" is the potato. Thus by taking Rodion's horse you have given him the metaphorical potato.

On the potato note: it would seem to me that, regardless of if it is a mechanic or a role, it was made up by PCM and not a player… We were just supposed to send in characters and pics, not the role that they would be. That was for Pancake to make up. Second, what does everyone think about the choices made for the horse game each day? Does PCM choose randomly? Does he choose two town and three scum, or vice versa? This mechanic may be to towns advantage considering it should help us determine what groups are active – cults, mafia one, mafia two (if applicable), town, etc…

FOS lootifer for logic that I find lacking. I think it is safe to assume the "horse" is a player ability, not a mod one.

I disagree completely, due to what I said above… NOBODY chose their role… Just their character.

Well, yeah pancakemix made every role, but the question is: Is the game a direct effect of someone's role or just a random event.

And even then, it was a one out of three shot to get any character.

What?

[jak111]

Well a few things to reply to anyway.

@virus, sorry, was typing up the post, then ended up moving a bunch of stuff for two days, buzzed one night after a few drinks. When I came back, I said screw replying to everything since, might as well post what I had and see if my reads change as I caught up. Not much happened so they didn't.

@DoomYoshi, read the @virus tag.

@Zivel, people use meta-gaming a lot. This is my 2nd played game back, Deciding to switch it up a little to try something new. But no, stuff will be stirred regardless, just more of a casual approach to it instead of putting my theories all out the second I think them up, giving the baddies things to hide behind. Right now my theory that I am willing to give out is the theory about this horse game. It's TOO random to just be a mod game to me. Someone somehow is making it happen.

Also Zivel, no one is really interrogating Rodion, nor have I said it's a bad thing. I said I'd rather he live D1 instead of die stupidly when he's more useful to town than most people realise.

Well, that was quick to reply to.

Anyway. Whoever brought up the original idea of only having one kill by lynching the guy without the horse... you know we can just vote no lynch and hammer no lynch when the guy without the horse does not have a horse right?

7. You may vote ‘no lynch’ to end the day without a death.

Herp Derp.

FP'd by spiesr.

[pancakemix]

Vote Count

Virus90 - 1 (sheep)
TFO - 1 (Rodion)
edoc - 2 (KGB, Zivel)
Betiko - 1 (Jmac)
Rodion - 2 (aage,
Lootifer - 1 (jonty)
Jonty - 1 (Doom)

With 22 alive it takes 12 to lynch! Deadline is May 15th at 11:59PM ET.

Rodion is currently without a horse.

[Zivel]

This horse game is more of a distraction than anything else and has become more of a hinderance to town than a help as it is taking away from any real discussion.

Jak111 I know people use meta gaming a lot and thats why I find your post saying you are going to change your meta up odd. Why put it out there? It feels like you are anticipating pressure and giving yourself a way to distance yourself from your meta (a reason to act odd), or an excuse to not scum hunt as much as you normally do.

I don't like it.

FOS jak111

[Whatsausage]

I don’t like the way everyone is talking about this as a game of hot potato…. The problem with that is that you toss it to someone else and when the time is up, that person is out… This is about TAKING, not GIVING… And there are FOUR potatoes, not one… So the game mechanics are not very related, in my opinion.

I know spiesr covered this, but just to double clarify: the mechanics are exactly the same with wording being the only difference. While it is true the you could equate the horses to potatoes making four potatoes, but then the person without a potato is the one who would lose the game when time runs out (or get killed in this instance). So the wording is opposite, but the function of someone being "it" (ie: having the hot potato or not having a horse) and then they choose another player to pass the condition of being "it" on to. So while you are technically "taking" a horse, you are still "giving" the condition to one of your choice. And this goes around and around until time runs out.
While pcm put it in the game as a random function, just like in hot potato [and any game for that matter (excluding war)], there can be strategy. So I believe we should use it to our advantage, hence my "horse vote" that no one has talked about

FP'd twice

pcm, wanna check your VC on rodion? you say he has two votes, but only list one

[Anarkistsdream]

I don’t like the way everyone is talking about this as a game of hot potato…. The problem with that is that you toss it to someone else and when the time is up, that person is out… This is about TAKING, not GIVING… And there are FOUR potatoes, not one… So the game mechanics are not very related, in my opinion.

And Rodion, That's my horse!

Taking someone's horse is functionally identical to giving them the hot potato. The "lack of horse" is the potato. Thus by taking Rodion's horse you have given him the metaphorical potato.

On the potato note: it would seem to me that, regardless of if it is a mechanic or a role, it was made up by PCM and not a player… We were just supposed to send in characters and pics, not the role that they would be. That was for Pancake to make up. Second, what does everyone think about the choices made for the horse game each day? Does PCM choose randomly? Does he choose two town and three scum, or vice versa? This mechanic may be to towns advantage considering it should help us determine what groups are active – cults, mafia one, mafia two (if applicable), town, etc…

FOS lootifer for logic that I find lacking. I think it is safe to assume the "horse" is a player ability, not a mod one.

I disagree completely, due to what I said above… NOBODY chose their role… Just their character.

Well, yeah pancakemix made every role, but the question is: Is the game a direct effect of someone's role or just a random event.

And even then, it was a one out of three shot to get any character.

What?

Reread what he asked for dude... it isn't that hard... when he posted about this game, he said send three characters, of which he would choose one and make a role for... if PCM did not do this, then I call shenanigans and am a bit pissed off.

[Zivel]

So I believe we should use it to our advantage, hence my "horse vote" that no one has talked about

My last post about these bloody donkeys!

So your plan is to ask the most suspicous person (voted by us) to sacrifice themselves for the good of the town? Sounds like there is no loopholes in that plan......

Fastposted by Anark:

One to three characters I think Anark.

[Anarkistsdream]

Well... That is a bit ambiguous... I apologize for the misunderstanding, but Spiesrs complete ignorance of this is pretty damn dumb.

[spiesr]

Okay, I see now. Having been the 2 previous CYOC games, and thus familiar with the role creation aspect, I didn't look deeply enough at the rules to notice that this line:

- The name of a character (by "character", I mean any person, being, or object (or group thereof), living or dead, real or fictitious, sentient or not. Anything. Up to you)

Had been replaced with this:

- The name(s) of up to three character(s) (by "character", I mean any person, being, or object (or group thereof), living or dead, real or fictitious, sentient or not. Anything. Up to you)

I apologise.

[Anarkistsdream]

Okay, I see now. Having been the 2 previous CYOC games, and thus familiar with the role creation aspect, I didn't look deeply enough at the rules to notice that this line:

- The name of a character (by "character", I mean any person, being, or object (or group thereof), living or dead, real or fictitious, sentient or not. Anything. Up to you)

Had been replaced with this:

- The name(s) of up to three character(s) (by "character", I mean any person, being, or object (or group thereof), living or dead, real or fictitious, sentient or not. Anything. Up to you)

I apologise.

Skimmers always bother me... especially about the most important post... rules...

[TA1LGUNN3R]

I don’t like the way everyone is talking about this as a game of hot potato…. The problem with that is that you toss it to someone else and when the time is up, that person is out… This is about TAKING, not GIVING… And there are FOUR potatoes, not one… So the game mechanics are not very related, in my opinion.

And Rodion, That's my horse!

Taking someone's horse is functionally identical to giving them the hot potato. The "lack of horse" is the potato. Thus by taking Rodion's horse you have given him the metaphorical potato.

On the potato note: it would seem to me that, regardless of if it is a mechanic or a role, it was made up by PCM and not a player… We were just supposed to send in characters and pics, not the role that they would be. That was for Pancake to make up. Second, what does everyone think about the choices made for the horse game each day? Does PCM choose randomly? Does he choose two town and three scum, or vice versa? This mechanic may be to towns advantage considering it should help us determine what groups are active – cults, mafia one, mafia two (if applicable), town, etc…

FOS lootifer for logic that I find lacking. I think it is safe to assume the "horse" is a player ability, not a mod one.

I disagree completely, due to what I said above… NOBODY chose their role… Just their character.

Well, yeah pancakemix made every role, but the question is: Is the game a direct effect of someone's role or just a random event.

And even then, it was a one out of three shot to get any character.

What?

Reread what he asked for dude... it isn't that hard... when he posted about this game, he said send three characters, of which he would choose one and make a role for... if PCM did not do this, then I call shenanigans and am a bit pissed off.

Up to three characters. I only sent in one.

Anyway, I agree with Zivel. Y'all are using the horse game as an excuse to avoid other discussions.

-Tails

[Lootifer]

Okay, I see now. Having been the 2 previous CYOC games, and thus familiar with the role creation aspect, I didn't look deeply enough at the rules to notice that this line:

- The name of a character (by "character", I mean any person, being, or object (or group thereof), living or dead, real or fictitious, sentient or not. Anything. Up to you)

Had been replaced with this:

- The name(s) of up to three character(s) (by "character", I mean any person, being, or object (or group thereof), living or dead, real or fictitious, sentient or not. Anything. Up to you)

I apologise.

Skimmers always bother me... especially about the most important post... rules...

Really dude? You just afk'd the first 4-5 days of the game...

[Lootifer]

ebwop: I know you're busy with RL, but those in glass houses and all that...

Also Zivel, no one is really interrogating Rodion, nor have I said it's a bad thing. I said I'd rather he live D1 instead of die stupidly when he's more useful to town than most people realise.

Can you explain this statement a bit more? Just humor me if you will.

[aage]

Anark's latest two points have moved me to unvote, vote Anark. Being away, getting your ass saved slightly by me no less, and then picking up the game by moaning about semi-ambiguous rules that make perfect sense if you only tried to understand them, which is basically discussing semantics, is not the way to go. If you do not understand the rules, PM the mod or post about it right away. But no, it took IB to get you to admit that you didn't "understand" the horse game, even though you are in it. Barring that, you decided to moan about spiesr not understanding the reference in "And even then, it was a one out of three shot to get any character." Clearly you have not been reading the rules yourself, since they clearly state that you do not HAVE to send in three characters. But then, you do already have a record for misunderstanding the rules. If someone (say, TFO) really wanted to be a character from Ed, Edd and Eddy, they would be. Manipulating your own role isn't that hard. Send in Dr. Evil as your character, and you'll likely be scum.

In all, (a) scumarining w/o leave, (b) being granted a pardon for the horse game and then moaning about it anyway, and (c) distracting town with useless discussion on allegedly ambiguous rules. Enough for day 1, seems to me.

[spiesr]

An update on the activity watch: TFO has only made one (content free) post thus far, back on Thursday. I am of the opinion that requesting a prod is more appropriate than a vote in this situation, as I don't think it is deliberate scummarning.

[jak111]

Zivel, only you have a problem with me mentioning it. I mention it so that there's no way a mafia can say "Oh, you changed your meta, you should be lynched". No, they will have to try another tactic this time now that everyone knows I wont be playing my exact self this time around. In a big game like this I should be allowed to switch it up some without it being scummy, like you're calling it now.

For the whole Anark thing, let me explain it to him a bit clearly.

You have the option of sending 1-3 characters to pcm when you sign up. He will try to give you your most preferred character but if he cannot for whatever reason he will go down the list and take the second or third for you. You are not multiple characters at once. He just wants names and bios of your choices so he can take one and make a role out of it.

The deadline is three days away, I am of the favour of Vote No-Lynch It's not enough time to build pressure on someone and then let off if we wish to today and it's D1 with no real night actions for info. Someone is already going to die, usually town does D1 so let's not make our faction shrink by two before we even enter the night please.

The horse game will have to pick who dies. 5 choices but if it makes you feel better it might have 1-2 baddies in it. So we might have a 1-2/5 shot of hitting them.

Once tomorrow comes, we'll have information to play around with.

[jak111]

ebwop: I know you're busy with RL, but those in glass houses and all that...

Also Zivel, no one is really interrogating Rodion, nor have I said it's a bad thing. I said I'd rather he live D1 instead of die stupidly when he's more useful to town than most people realise.

Can you explain this statement a bit more? Just humor me if you will.

(Meant to copy/paste this in my last post)

What I meant is that Rodion is one of the best players here at CC. He's very useful when he is on our side. Sure there's a chance he's scum/3rd party. But it's D1, we can get him another day if he is against us. Losing him D1 is losing one of our top players in this game. Something I'm not comfortable with.

[spiesr]

Zivel, only you have a problem with me mentioning it. I mention it so that there's no way a mafia can say "Oh, you changed your meta, you should be lynched". No, they will have to try another tactic this time now that everyone knows I wont be playing my exact self this time around. In a big game like this I should be allowed to switch it up some without it being scummy, like you're calling it now.

You know what Jak? I have a much bigger problem with you saying what amounts to "I am deliberating changing my meta so you can't use it against me" than I do with you playing somewhat differently than in another active game. (Where since you still alive your alignment can't even be known.) Vote Jak You don't get to decide how other people can use your meta to interpret your play in this game.

What I meant is that Rodion is one of the best players here at CC. He's very useful when he is on our side. Sure there's a chance he's scum/3rd party. But it's D1, we can get him another day if he is against us. Losing him D1 is losing one of our top players in this game. Something I'm not comfortable with.

I would say an argument for the reverse could be made. As a skilled player bringing a case against him later in the game would likely be difficult barring some actions implicating him. Trying on Day 1 when standards are lower might be the best way to catch a scum Rodion.

[jak111]

What I meant is that Rodion is one of the best players here at CC. He's very useful when he is on our side. Sure there's a chance he's scum/3rd party. But it's D1, we can get him another day if he is against us. Losing him D1 is losing one of our top players in this game. Something I'm not comfortable with.

I would say an argument for the reverse could be made. As a skilled player bringing a case against him later in the game would likely be difficult barring some actions implicating him. Trying on Day 1 when standards are lower might be the best way to catch a scum Rodion.

First to the part that I didn't quote, leave active games alone. You know better than to discuss them.

Now to the part I did. Rodion is too skilled to kill D1. I am not saying let's let him live until the end, but to kill him D1 with NO proof or anything is just anti-town play. To even suggest doing it, that's not like you if we want to begin bringing metas up already.

I have been gone from CC long enough to be allowed to say that I am going to be changing something up a bit. Everyone does it. Do you want scum to be able to use my meta against me if I did not mention I am switching it around a tad?

Unvote, Vote spiesr

This vote is not because of you against me, it's actually for your comment when I said let Rodion live past D1 at least. That part I do not find to be pro-town. Right now we need the vets working together. If you do not mind a vet dying. Well, I'm all hands for eliminating you if you wish to keep down the mindset of letting Rodion die so easily.

[jonty125]

Lootifer's vote any worse than aage's?

To be honest I thought aage's vote was a joke (the one on Rodion) it has since been shifted.

unvote Lootifer with more of his reasoning I can partially see the camp he was coming from.

FOS virus for flip-flopping. Jak's post wasn't that ground-breaking, (And I'm very skeptcial when people say I made this poor/scummy move to lure others)

I really think Nark is making a mountain out of a mole hill over speisr not reading the rules, particularly when he seems to be struggling to understand the horse game & potato notation. I can understand aage's case on Nark, but I believe you have to start with the opinion Nark is scum to arrive at Nark is scum (if that's not clear what I'm trying to say the light aage is painting Nark in is much darker than mine, so to aage Nark looks scummy but to me it seems to be a misunderstanding).

I also support spieser's argument that just because Rodion is a good player, that shouldn't make him a D1 target.

With 3 days to go, deadline is clearly looming. Now as I understand the rules (well rule 7) that a lynch will occur if there is a majority of those who vote. So if 10 players vote it takes 6 to lynch. MOD can you comment?

Anyhow, I think there is a more pressing issue. The Horse Game. We are going to see one of the players die and as of now we have no information about any of the players roles. Are people happy to accept that a random one of the five are killed, or should we say players A,B,C will keep there horse, because they seem to be town. D & E, claim and then we'll ask one of you to die, where failure to comply will result in pain the following day, Personally, I'm a fan of the second way of operating things but, as you can imagine, this is only going to work if we work together. So I'm not going to place my vote yet, because it still depends on a) the specifics of lynching b) what we're going to do with the horse game and c) I would love some more defenses on the table before I place my vote.

FASTPOSTED by jak

[Whatsausage]

So I believe we should use it to our advantage, hence my "horse vote" that no one has talked about

My last post about these bloody donkeys!

So your plan is to ask the most suspicous person (voted by us) to sacrifice themselves for the good of the town? Sounds like there is no loopholes in that plan......

Well I didn't find any post about "donkeys", I am assuming you mean where you said the horse game was more of a distraction than anything else? You then question the plan... While recognize there is no guarantee, and I fully expect or selectee to not "sacrifice" themselves willingly, they would have all four others passing it right back to them and would have a much worse chance. So we would be able to learn from how that ends up going down, who is willing to pass to who even.

I think this is much better than jak's plan to not lynch anyone and just let a random die and for some reason expect us to have more information tomorrow. We MIGHT have a better idea of what we are up against, but pushing is a much better way to learn than just letting the day go by. And while I am on the topic of jak, you are definitely allowed to, but why are you changing your meta?