Aces and Selma [Cleared]

[donkeylove]

Aces is a new player, selma isn't very good, now they play in every game together and act as if they don't know each other, they allow each other to get continents but don't break until the end seems a bit fishy

[donkeylove]

Subject line: <Aces and Selma>


These are suspected Multis/Secret Alliance

Suspect users: <Aces and Selma>

Game number: http://www.conquerclub.com/game.php?game=398715
AND
http://www.conquerclub.com/game.php?game=394241

Comments: see previous post - they have been in two of my games!!! They play at almost the same time weird weird weird

[relz0r]

I already opened a thread accusing these multis. Besides Aces and Selma there's a third account on this guy: CrimsonDeath.

[sully800]

http://www.conquerclub.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=18096

^^Blocked

[donkeylove]

It is kinda funny to see this guy talking to himself, maybe he has an account for each of his personalities:

2007-04-29 18:42:54 - Aces: seems we're all online at this point haha
2007-04-29 18:43:17 - Selma: yeah lol might have a bit of an RT
2007-04-29 18:43:52 - Aces: nah, I will only be on for another 5-10 minutes. Will be back later tho.
2007-04-29 18:58:54 - Selma: LOL your off to a crazy good start aces
2007-04-29 19:00:35 - Aces: haha, what can I say? I'm good
2007-04-29 19:05:46 - Aces: guys, I'm off for about 3 hours, I'll be back for my next move then.
2007-04-29 19:05:55 - Aces: Sorry for any inconvenience
2007-04-29 19:08:55 - Selma: no worries, cya then
2007-04-29 22:53:09 - donkeylove: green are you going to take your turn in our other game?
2007-04-29 22:55:14 - Aces: very sorry, yessir, slow connection
2007-04-29 22:58:11 - Aces: I joined that game prematurely, didnt realize there were no cards or I wouldnt have joined, I'm not taking it seriously lol. This one, I'm taking seriously tho ................
2007-04-29 23:00:28 - Selma: HELLO EVERYONE! lol welcome back to the game aces!
2007-04-29 23:03:45 - Aces: I make it policy to offer a rematch to my opponents. Would you 2 like another game?
2007-04-29 23:04:14 - Selma: I'll take one lol
2007-04-30 11:58:45 - Selma: damnit, terrible dice rolls!

[Jafnhár]

It is kinda funny to see this guy talking to himself, maybe he has an account for each of his personalities:

2007-04-29 18:42:54 - Aces: seems we're all online at this point haha
2007-04-29 18:43:17 - Selma: yeah lol might have a bit of an RT
2007-04-29 18:43:52 - Aces: nah, I will only be on for another 5-10 minutes. Will be back later tho.
2007-04-29 18:58:54 - Selma: LOL your off to a crazy good start aces
2007-04-29 19:00:35 - Aces: haha, what can I say? I'm good
2007-04-29 19:05:46 - Aces: guys, I'm off for about 3 hours, I'll be back for my next move then.
2007-04-29 19:05:55 - Aces: Sorry for any inconvenience
2007-04-29 19:08:55 - Selma: no worries, cya then
2007-04-29 22:53:09 - donkeylove: green are you going to take your turn in our other game?
2007-04-29 22:55:14 - Aces: very sorry, yessir, slow connection
2007-04-29 22:58:11 - Aces: I joined that game prematurely, didnt realize there were no cards or I wouldnt have joined, I'm not taking it seriously lol. This one, I'm taking seriously tho ................
2007-04-29 23:00:28 - Selma: HELLO EVERYONE! lol welcome back to the game aces!
2007-04-29 23:03:45 - Aces: I make it policy to offer a rematch to my opponents. Would you 2 like another game?
2007-04-29 23:04:14 - Selma: I'll take one lol
2007-04-30 11:58:45 - Selma: damnit, terrible dice rolls!

Wow ...

[Iliad]

It is kinda funny to see this guy talking to himself, maybe he has an account for each of his personalities:

2007-04-29 18:42:54 - Aces: seems we're all online at this point haha
2007-04-29 18:43:17 - Selma: yeah lol might have a bit of an RT
2007-04-29 18:43:52 - Aces: nah, I will only be on for another 5-10 minutes. Will be back later tho.
2007-04-29 18:58:54 - Selma: LOL your off to a crazy good start aces
2007-04-29 19:00:35 - Aces: haha, what can I say? I'm good
2007-04-29 19:05:46 - Aces: guys, I'm off for about 3 hours, I'll be back for my next move then.
2007-04-29 19:05:55 - Aces: Sorry for any inconvenience
2007-04-29 19:08:55 - Selma: no worries, cya then
2007-04-29 22:53:09 - donkeylove: green are you going to take your turn in our other game?
2007-04-29 22:55:14 - Aces: very sorry, yessir, slow connection
2007-04-29 22:58:11 - Aces: I joined that game prematurely, didnt realize there were no cards or I wouldnt have joined, I'm not taking it seriously lol. This one, I'm taking seriously tho ................
2007-04-29 23:00:28 - Selma: HELLO EVERYONE! lol welcome back to the game aces!
2007-04-29 23:03:45 - Aces: I make it policy to offer a rematch to my opponents. Would you 2 like another game?
2007-04-29 23:04:14 - Selma: I'll take one lol
2007-04-30 11:58:45 - Selma: damnit, terrible dice rolls!

Wow ...

That is just sad.

[sully800]

CrimsonDeath has explained to me that the 4 of them are just classmates.

I have unblocked them from playing together under the condition that they stick to team games, or if they want a standard game it should only be the 4 of them. If they start joining standard games with other opponents and there are more complaints of secret alliance/multi they will be reblocked at least.

[donkeylove]

now all aces comments have disappeared from the game chat, what's going on?

[relz0r]

CrimsonDeath has explained to me that the 4 of them are just classmates.

I have unblocked them from playing together under the condition that they stick to team games, or if they want a standard game it should only be the 4 of them. If they start joining standard games with other opponents and there are more complaints of secret alliance/multi they will be reblocked at least.

Bad call m8... It's just to evident. When one leaves all leave, his accounts only speak at each time, and in the game I reported, he even answered me to a question with the wrong account. His excuses are hilarious and if you really just bother looking at all his games (which I did) he even mixes the personalities of each of his accounts. There are games where one of his accounts is the "good" one and the other the "bad" guy, changing in other games.

With all these evidences what more does one need to be banned?

[Jafnhár]

Well, I do kind of agree with the above poster.

Aces: I make it policy to offer a rematch to my opponents. Would you 2 like another game?

This quote seems not very typical for classmates, but more of a multi.

[donkeylove]

This is from another game:

2007-05-04 13:31:10 - wilderbeast: Here we go guys, final 2, may the best player win
2007-05-04 13:33:31 - wilderbeast: Crimson, Blue has become very powerful. How about a treaty between cyrodiil and Morrowind?
2007-05-04 13:44:27 - bayou: unfortunately, i have to finish a game with two blocked players?
2007-05-04 14:20:45 - bayou: Care to explain why you are still pretending wilderbeast?
2007-05-04 14:21:59 - CrimsonDeath: Hey. Wilderbeast messaged sully. I dont know why he's blocked either. we go to class together, thats all.
2007-05-04 14:23:04 - CrimsonDeath: I can understand my situation, I've been in a few games with selma/aces. Wilderbeast I'm not so sure tho, he's avoided us for the most part. he didnt even know I had applied until he got the email that it was started.
2007-05-04 14:23:43 - CrimsonDeath: and no lol selma/aces arent the same person. We all go to the same college. I should also message sully. Wilderbeast doesnt deserve to be kicked out for anything :s
2007-05-04 14:24:35 - CrimsonDeath: (and I didnt know who wilderbeast was until just recently when he said I should stay out of his games unless its doubles lol)
2007-05-04 14:27:53 - wilderbeast: Hello Bayou. He's right. I started the game and then later got the email that it had begun. I noticed that "CrimsonDeath" was familiar. Then I told him inclass who I was. He said he didnt know and I said I would play with him selma and aces in either....
2007-05-04 14:28:00 - wilderbeast: Doubles or Tripples
2007-05-04 14:28:22 - wilderbeast: But I didnt want to be accused of multiing or secret alliances simply because we played from the same computer.
2007-05-04 14:28:57 - wilderbeast: I know selma plays from at least 1 other IP. Aces I dont know, dont talk to him much inclass, just know him from this game. (We're not in the same program)
2007-05-04 14:29:39 - wilderbeast: I did message sully. I have to apologize to you however for having a game where I wasnt careful enough to make sure no one that plays from this IP was in the game as well...
2007-05-04 14:30:30 - wilderbeast: Its hard because I dont always know when someone signs up and if they do, they dont tell me hehe. I can promise you I dont multi and I dont make secret alliances. The only reason I was looking to make an agreement here is because you had Hammerfell and SI
2007-05-04 14:31:24 - bayou: all that sounds real nice, but you kept up the pretence this morning, did you not think I read the boards?
2007-05-04 14:31:46 - wilderbeast: Look at my games.....
2007-05-04 14:32:02 - wilderbeast: I have avoided selma aces and Crimson this whole time, I dont multi
2007-05-04 14:32:54 - wilderbeast: and no, I dont keep up pretense. I figured I could still play a normal game with Crimson. I'm not giving anyone special attention. I'm playing the game to win. I'm not a cheater.
2007-05-04 14:38:05 - bayou: so, just take your turn so we can get this over with
2007-05-04 14:41:22 - wilderbeast: I am. I just wanted you to know, I dont cheat.
2007-05-04 15:26:38 - bayou: you had a set crimson
2007-05-04 15:27:36 - wilderbeast: he's gone
2007-05-04 15:28:50 - wilderbeast: he was probably waiting to trade it in.
2007-05-04 15:38:10 - bayou: gone where?
2007-05-04 15:41:40 - wilderbeast: out of the room
2007-05-04 15:42:20 - wilderbeast: lol I have no luck with cards. This game should be over now
2007-05-04 15:42:51 - wilderbeast: at worst case scenario you should have it won next turn
2007-05-04 15:55:47 - bayou: don't insult my intelligence. he hit end
2007-05-04 17:20:02 - wilderbeast: Well yeah, he was probably waiting for someone else to cash in before he did. Dont know why, this late in the game its better to get the soldiers immediately.
2007-05-04 17:21:57 - wilderbeast: by "waiting to cash in" I mean that in an escalating game if someone else cashes in before you, you get more men for YOUR set. Thats what I was saying
2007-05-04 17:35:48 - wilderbeast: By the way, I messaged sully. Our situation is going to be cleared up I think. I am not a cheater. Also, I'm heading to work. I'll make my next move in 5 hours. (I only work a 4 hour shift today)


He admits they all play in same room, but when you start to play them they act as if they don't know each other.

Definitely secret alliance but more probable that they are the same person with a split personality disorder!!!

[wilderbeast]

Hello all.

Thought I'd clear something up.

Myself, Crimson selma and aces stay in the same dorm and attend the same college. Last semester we took the same classes (some of us passed, others, slackers (wink wink Crimson) have to repeat so wont be in many of the same classes this semester).

Seeing as I work close to 30 hours a week and still have to take a full course load (7 courses), I have very little time to take a board game of risk, set it up, play a good game, put it all away, etc....

For this reason, I play on this site, I play against alot of people and have a great time but I will also admit, I've had rivalries with Crimson Aces and Selma at times. (when you've practically been living with people for awhile and find out you have things in common, its nice to compete amongst yourselves.) We play Chess, checkers, and risk. I enjoy risk and chess quite a bit actually, (I cant stand checkers but will play once in the odd month).

Nobody pretends not to know anyone. I really dont know what you mean by that. I can assure you that first off, I hadnt been warned that friends couldnt play against each other and other people. I can understand why some might get paranoid enough however.

When I was alerted by email that the game was started, I saw that Crimson was in. When I asked in real life if it was the same Crimson he said "yeah, now we can have a game and you dont have to waste hours, you can loggin at your own convenience". I said fine and we played the game. I never pretended not to know crimson, what I did do however and made a point of doing (and will continue to make a point of doing if I play with crimson/selma/aces in the futur) is establish that he is another player like anyone else around the world I could be playing against. To me he was just another opponent, so yes, for that reason I was not flaunting around that he was my "buddy" or anything like that, it would just be stupid. He's a player in the game just like me, or any of the 2 others I was playing against. It wasnt a team game.

(now you should all know, I am playing a team game with aces vs Keyborn and JCsolidrock.) nobody is cheating

Sully has asked me to refrain from joining games with them unless its doubles or tripples until these wild (and false) accusations come to a close.

Please pm me if you have any questions.

[relz0r]

Ok, here it is, I've bothered doing just a little compilation on my game versus this multi guy, so you can all make your opinions. If this isn't multi then I don't know what it is - game 402834.

Map was Tamriel. I remember quite well that his account ACES had skyrim except for 3 territories in the beggining disposal.

Round 1:

2007-05-01 16:38:58 - relz0r fortified Winterhold with 2 armies from Solstheim

I fortified Winterhold so he wouldn't get Syrim on the initial rounds. Now look at what his other account, CrimsonDeath did imediately after me:

2007-05-01 16:48:40 - CrimsonDeath deployed 3 armies on Hrothgar
2007-05-01 16:49:36 - CrimsonDeath attacked Winterhold from Hrothgar and conquered it from relz0r


Here's the chat on round 1:

2007-05-01 16:55:16 - relz0r: crimson what the hell was that play for?
2007-05-01 16:55:29 - relz0r: you gave skyrim to Aces...
2007-05-01 17:00:37 - Selma: I gave it to him?
2007-05-01 17:01:05 - Selma: I'm going for Morrowind
2007-05-01 17:01:28 - CrimsonDeath: Sorry rel, needed a card

Note that the multi first does a common error, which was answering to me with the wrong account (at bold), and then gives a great excuse: He needed a card (lol)

Still on round 1 (this is just to good to be true):

2007-05-01 17:05:19 - CrimsonDeath: Aces...
2007-05-01 17:05:26 - CrimsonDeath: I have a proposition for you
2007-05-01 17:07:27 - CrimsonDeath: You let me take Hammerfell. I will leave you to take Black Marsh. Then we should be able to bring down relzor in the most powerful area of cyrodiil


At round 4, multi Selma already had a continent, multi crimson only needed one more territory and multi Aces has one continent too. By this time it was just to evident that they were the same guy. The only territory that missed CrimsonDeath from having a continent was owned by Selma. Being the most powerful player atm she preferred to reinforce territories next to me instead of doing something on Crimson's only missing territory. Look at the chat now:

2007-05-01 17:29:39 - relz0r: Curious Selma.. why didn't you reinforce High Rock?
2007-05-01 17:31:28 - Selma: what do you mean reinforce High Rock? Why? :s
2007-05-01 17:31:48 - Selma: he had 1 guy there only :s I already had 2 :s

She(He) already had 2... Wow, now that's what I call an army. Let's continue in some more laughing stuff. Suddenly account Crimson gives another explanation for his dumb play. Now it isn't the card. It was a potential deal. ..

2007-05-01 17:37:18 - CrimsonDeath: and you know what.... I thought if I gave aces skyrim, he'd let me have black marsh
2007-05-01 17:37:32 - CrimsonDeath: or hammerfell
2007-05-01 17:37:42 - CrimsonDeath: its diplomacy, it backfired on me this turn

One of the most hilarious excuses I ever heard. Let's be serious. Account Aces only needed 2 territories to win a continent. I reinforced there. Crimson reinforced next to me (in this moment I knew that Crimson and Selma were the same person, I didn't know yet Aces was too). I thought "well done, he will have a big problem conquering that continent". Yeah sure, than Crimson burns his men on mine, leaving both territories with 1 and 2 armies. Great deal. Let's continue:


Round 8:

At this moment all 3 of them had a continent at least. Selma had 2. I was the only player with no continents, and with a very weaken army. Still, they kept attacking me, only attacking each other of them on territories that made no difference for them (him). Look at his excuse to attack me (remember this wasn't a terminator game, but a standard):


2007-05-01 18:03:26 - CrimsonDeath: lol I'm attacking the strongest continent here pal. Thats you!

Sure, sure. We believe you. Continuing..

At the final rounds he started to conquer everything with his account Selma (which was always the dominant player, but I was the only one to try to do something about it). Do you know what he did with his other accounts? Started to put all his armies adjacent to my few territories left with accounts Aces and Crimson, so I could have no cards, and take armies from Selma's borders so he could easily be conquering territories. At round 11 here's another brilliant chat:


2007-05-01 18:10:57 - CrimsonDeath: I think my round proves I'm no multi..... remember what you said would be a multi move?

Sure it does. The first move on the game he did against one occuppied continent at round 11, when the account he chose to win this time was completely wining the game since about round 5 proves that he was no multi. Rofl.

More excuses lol:


2007-05-01 18:15:39 - relz0r: the stuff you invent to excuse your plays beats anything i imagined... youre mentaly sick man..
2007-05-01 18:16:14 - Aces: Man, thats the game of risk. nobody can attack the whole world at once, its just like chess
2007-05-01 18:32:50 - Selma: all our empires are guarded :s its the only reason people are waiting for attacks :s

And I copuld be here all ninght. Just check their games. If this isn't evident enough just think that the fact they are classmates doesn't mean they have to login exactly at the same time of the day on their apparently only computer (lol).

Trust me on this, I don't have a high rank but I do know how to play decently risk, and I do know when 3 people are playing against me, and only againt me.

PS: Curious to see that his new account says that Selma has a different IP... Weren't they all on the same PC? Lol.

[donkeylove]

Hello all.

Thought I'd clear something up.

Myself, Crimson selma and aces stay in the same dorm and attend the same college. Last semester we took the same classes (some of us passed, others, slackers (wink wink Crimson) have to repeat so wont be in many of the same classes this semester).

Seeing as I work close to 30 hours a week and still have to take a full course load (7 courses), I have very little time to take a board game of risk, set it up, play a good game, put it all away, etc....

For this reason, I play on this site, I play against alot of people and have a great time but I will also admit, I've had rivalries with Crimson Aces and Selma at times. (when you've practically been living with people for awhile and find out you have things in common, its nice to compete amongst yourselves.) We play Chess, checkers, and risk. I enjoy risk and chess quite a bit actually, (I cant stand checkers but will play once in the odd month).

Nobody pretends not to know anyone. I really dont know what you mean by that. I can assure you that first off, I hadnt been warned that friends couldnt play against each other and other people. I can understand why some might get paranoid enough however.

When I was alerted by email that the game was started, I saw that Crimson was in. When I asked in real life if it was the same Crimson he said "yeah, now we can have a game and you dont have to waste hours, you can loggin at your own convenience". I said fine and we played the game. I never pretended not to know crimson, what I did do however and made a point of doing (and will continue to make a point of doing if I play with crimson/selma/aces in the futur) is establish that he is another player like anyone else around the world I could be playing against. To me he was just another opponent, so yes, for that reason I was not flaunting around that he was my "buddy" or anything like that, it would just be stupid. He's a player in the game just like me, or any of the 2 others I was playing against. It wasnt a team game.

(now you should all know, I am playing a team game with aces vs Keyborn and JCsolidrock.) nobody is cheating

Sully has asked me to refrain from joining games with them unless its doubles or tripples until these wild (and false) accusations come to a close.

Please pm me if you have any questions.

If you don't pretend to know each other then why have conversations like, Hi Aces nice to see you back, if you are in the same room?

[donkeylove]

Your college doesn't have more than one computer?

[Selma]

Hey.

Well, dorm-mates will normally seek to work together on inclass assignements so they will likely share the computer for the work. In a library where its not rare to find 30-40 people on a bad day, 20 computers doesnt go too far. People understand this and sometimes groups of people will clutter around a computer.

As for the game strategy:

I will give an example from classic risk map because all players can relate to it.

If someone is controlling all of asia except for a couple of countries, I control South america and a bit of North america (with scattered countries in africa or australia).... I will gladly sacrifice australia and africa to a potential competitor to counter the potential strength of the player that could easily take Asia.

Why would I do this?

1) I know that if the player takes power, they will also realize that someone can soon have control of asia and I will rely on their common sense to go after the player in asia.

2) I know that should the person in asia take control, they will likely have to deal with the player that now controls australia/africa.


These reasons (although yes, they contain some loopholes) have served me well. Alot of people are under the misconception that you should at all times, prevent anyone from taking control of a continent. That is simply not true, if someone clearly can take control, depending on the power ranking of the continent, sometimes it is smart to allow a player to grow to counter, this poses a risk, because now even tho you've established a balance, you now have to compete against 2 players.

This game is called risk however, if you prevent the #2 player from getting a continent to challenge the leading player, you allow the leading player to fortify and then pick off opponents 1 by 1 as he/she sees fit.



Now, in regards to my game at tamriel in which, I won so really, my strategy I dont figure was too bad.

I realized that relz0r controlled the majority of Cyrodiil which would give an additional 2 men per turn than any of the two 2nd place countries of skyrim or hammerfell. What did I do? I chose to boost another player in power. What aces and crimson may have considered to be lucky dice or whatnot, I considered to be me instigating a new competing force in the game. By me allowing/giving a continent to someone else, I would force relz0r to fight another of my opponents and I would likewise point out relz0rs strong points in hopes that the person (either crimson OR aces) would hope to stop relz0r before comming after me (who had yet to control a continent I believe by that point).


None of this is cheating. The players that took power invested soldiers to keep cyrodiil out of people's control. Then relz0r said: "well, I'm not taking it anyway, so you dont need to worry about me" (I'm paraphrasing, he was likely trying to get the other players to leave him alone). A few turns later he took the continent.

This got Aces in a tough spot (Aces had turned down a diplomatic offer from Crimson to invade all of cyrodiil and push relz0r down south, Aces said he agreed to keeping cyrodiil out of any 1 individual's hand, but would not join in an alliance to wipe out a player).

When relz0r decided to take cyrodiil anyway, aces decided to attack it, Crimson also attacked it. They didnt attack each other for a bit to ensure that cyrodiil wasnt going to produce extra men. I also stayed out of major conflict. Content to defend my continent and make small jabs at cyrodiil if it got captured, I just observed some events taking place. When Crimson fortified a border vs Aces, aces went back to war against him and I took advantage of some bad dice rolls.

Relz0r made it to the final 2 but he couldnt match the man-power I amassed.




I will say here, wilderbeast is right, none of us are cheating, this was my first victory vs aces ever lol. We fight against each other and have a good time, we are no secret alliance, we are definately no multi.

Alot of people consider strategy to be bad play or cheating. There can only be one winner, so if there are 4 players, 3 of their strategies will be losing ones. Mine was the winning one, I took offense to being accused like this.

Also pointed out by wilderbeast, I dont "flaunt" my relationship with these guys because then people will think that we ARE a secret alliance, please understand, Crimson, Aces, Myself and Wilderbeast are individuals who are enjoying this game, we enjoy playing with and against each other and with/against any of you that are in our games.

[robyblade]

a lot of time ago i reported the suspect of multi on this forum, i repeat the same charge:

These are suspected Multis

Suspect users: Selma & CrimsonDeath

Game number: http://www.conquerclub.com/game.php?game=385829

Comments:

• They played and talked always at the same time.
• They did several times the same error (refresh past writing in the chat repeating the phrase).
• In a situation of evidence of crimsondeat advantage Selma atttacked me instead of Crimsondeath.
• At the start selma attacked me in a territory where he didn't have advantage, leaving only 1 troop in 2 states in a continent were all the other territory were under crimsondeath's control. When i asked him why he did it he says:
  

  2007-04-23 23:18:02 - robyblade: why do you want to give mordor to green as a gift?
  2007-04-23 23:22:45 - Selma: Perhaps he will allow me to take Gondor without opposition
  2007-04-23 23:23:55 - CrimsonDeath: I will allow you to take Gondor temporarily. I will destroy you both tho. I'm that good
  

Robyblade

Now i ask: Why they never said that they were friends???
and look this:

2007-04-24 01:47:00 - CrimsonDeath: but uhhhh for futur reference, dont post msn conversations ingame

it is strange if they are in the same room...
Is it possible this? (look the time...)

007-04-24 02:48:10 - Selma: alright, talk to you tomorrow
2007-04-24 10:29:47 - Selma: lol crimson, he attacked you and broke into ruhn
2007-04-24 10:30:49 - CrimsonDeath: ohhhhhhhh welcome back to the game everyone! Just about to head out for an exam guess I'll make my moves tho

it's not finished... look also this:

2007-04-24 20:54:03 - CrimsonDeath: Careful Selma. Its up to you but do you think he should have the most powerful continent in the game? I know I wont allow it. If you do I will have to go through you to destroy him. It would be a shame.
2007-04-24 20:55:29 - Selma: hehe I'm in a tough situation, caught in a war between you 2
2007-04-24 20:55:39 - robyblade: i have 30 armies, you have 80!!!!
2007-04-24 20:55:56 - CrimsonDeath: hehe dont worry, he cant compete with me. I'm too good

at this time that was the situation on board:

2007-04-24 20:49:19 - Selma receives 4 armies for holding Rohan
2007-04-24 20:49:19 - Selma receives 3 armies for 6 territories

2007-04-24 20:54:57 - CrimsonDeath receives 5 armies for holding Gondor
2007-04-24 20:54:57 - CrimsonDeath receives 3 armies for holding Mordor
2007-04-24 20:54:57 - CrimsonDeath receives 7 armies for 23 territories

2007-04-25 17:22:16 - robyblade receives 2 armies for holding Lindon
2007-04-25 17:22:16 - robyblade receives 5 armies for 15 territories

try to guess who was attaccked by selma.... right, it was me...
Next turn that was the situation:

2007-04-26 02:10:33 - CrimsonDeath receives 5 armies for holding Gondor
2007-04-26 02:10:33 - CrimsonDeath receives 3 armies for holding Mordor
2007-04-26 02:10:33 - CrimsonDeath receives 5 armies for holding Rhovanion
2007-04-26 02:10:33 - CrimsonDeath receives 8 armies for 24 territories
2007-04-26 02:10:40 - CrimsonDeath cashed in a set of Ithilien, Iron Hills, and Forochel worth 4 armies
2007-04-26 02:10:40 - CrimsonDeath gets bonus of 2 armies added to Ithilien
2007-04-26 02:10:40 - CrimsonDeath gets bonus of 2 armies added to Iron Hills

do you need i adduce other evidence???

[Aces]

I can comment on that. By typing to each other ingame, no one can accuse them of a secret alliance. I dont see that there should be a problem with that. If they want to make an alliance, it should be announced in chat anyway so it makes sense that any diplomacy (ie the mordor for Gondor diplomacy) would be brought up in chat.


Sure, we can talk to each other in the room, and yeah lol if we're in the same game, sometimes we do, but we will also talk in chat so that all players know if there is a deal going on. That way we can be sure that there are no secret alliances.



As for your getting annoyed that you were attacked instead of someone else, lol get over it, its a game. Its strategy, there is no rule book saying who has to attack who when. Selma said it best when she said there will be 1 winner. To be the winner, each player can attack who they want when they want to try to achieve a certain goal, thats the game. I'm real sorry.

[relz0r]

This is just to evident, everyone who played with them, without knowing about other games before, complained on the way they acted.

If they're not the same person then at least there's a clearly secret alliance here. And we all lost points due to that....

[Selma]

relz0r. There is no secret alliance.

In this game there is alot of diplomacy, you cant go around accusing everyone of having a secret alliance simply because someone notices that keeping peace with another player for a certain period of time will allow them to advance in the game.

If someone forms an alliance, you will complain, even if it is in chat. If there is nothing announced in chat, you assume there is an alliance anyway and accuse people of a SECRET alliance. So yes, I will announce if I form an alliance with someone and I will make my terms clear. It is not cheating although you would be just as bitter.

If an alliance is made obvious, there is no cheating, what you should do is try to counter-act the diplomacy, offer reasons why instead of a pact with so and so, the player should have a pact with you. Or whatever you want to do.


Diplomacy with other players is not a cheat. It happens all the time and it continues to happen, I find alot of players that are on the low end of a formed diplomatic pact often complain, thats understandable, in risk (standard) you are fighting to survive, so go ahead and cut a few deals that you think will help you stay alive longer (be sure that you are ready for the person you are dealing with to also recieve benifits of your deal). If you dont, then you must assume that you are fighting the world at once (and other players will assume the same). This is just common sense. its ok to be bitter that a deal formed between 2 players may have lead to your loss, but dont accuse those players of cheating lol. Its all part of the game and you just look like a sore loser afterwards.

[robyblade]

if you don't have a secret alliance, can you explain me why you play always together against an other player?
If you start a 3players standard game, why 2 of them are always 2 of you and never all 3 players? And why do you never play alone???

We are not playing in poker where there is a chicken to eat....

I want my point that you steal me....

[donkeylove]

The whole point of our complaints is that you guys have played games together whilst you know each other, probably playing on the same computer. You gang up on the other player in the game until it's just you left. This is a secret alliance. In my games you never announced an alliance but you clearly let each amass bonuses whilst attacking me. If you want to play like that fine, but do it in a team game or just announce an alliance.

[donkeylove]

2007-04-25 10:27:11 - Aces: Selma, I'm going after Australia, I'm leaving Africa alone, you can have it.2007-04-26 18:33:46 - Aces: Oh my haha, added 5 guys to my 7 on siam for a grand total of 12 with hopes of taking australia, auto-attack, find myself now with 3 guys left after that war. What the hell is with these dice! lol
2007-04-26 18:34:08 - Aces: *oh, should note* I was only fighting 3 soldiers!
2007-04-26 18:45:37 - Selma: ouch, that IS bad luck, looks like castle will have no problem taking australia back then.
2007-04-27 08:17:05 - castletown: enjoy ur game u2.....hope u enjoyed ganging up on me and leaving each other alone..... well, one of u2 has to win......glu2
2007-04-27 14:05:18 - Aces: hehe thanks for just throwing me the win castle. I didnt work together with anyone. I dont know about selma but I didnt attack her in africa because................ a) she had well defended borders and b) she had them on most countries, so it was.....
2007-04-27 14:06:29 - Aces: ... pointless to take a country she'd come right back and take. She played well and made Africa a country not worth going to war with until later. I wasnt ganging up on anyone, I'm just picking my spots. Had you done the same on australia (put like, 5-6..
2007-04-27 14:07:42 - Aces: 5-6 guys on each country, I would have not invaded you so soon because you would easily retake the first country and I wouldnt have been able to overthrow it. on the other hand I had both south america AND europe, so I was ok for military forces. Still...
2007-04-27 14:08:00 - Aces: I wasnt working together with selma.
2007-04-27 16:11:24 - Selma: Hey guys. Aces is right castle, no-one is ganging up on you. I was hoping to keep africa and take North America (from there I would push into south america.)
2007-04-27 16:18:05 - Selma: There is no ganging up here. Although lol we could have considered it (You obviously have more games under your belt than we do lol) but no, we merely had our own intentions. I wanted africa to start and then north america after (funded by africas +3/turn
2007-04-27 16:18:42 - Selma: appearantly aces wanted South america and europe. He got his before I could get mine lol so yeah, he should win this game hands down, he's obviously the best player here.
2007-04-28 01:15:06 - Aces: Good game castle, you did the best you could.
2007-04-28 01:15:39 - Aces: You too selma, although unless your very lucky with cards I think I will end it next turn seeing as I also trade in a set of blues next.
2007-04-28 01:37:52 - Selma: thank you aces

[robyblade]

In this game selma was alone, and he missed 3 turns... Without friends he don't want to play?