Anarchy

[mandalorian2298]

which way to the rogue state?

Go to South Korea and then go a little to the North.

Or, you can PM Xen and ask him if he'll take you.

i was just about to say something like that...

There is no shame in being fast posted by a man who is three times younger then you.

[s.xkitten]

which way to the rogue state?

Go to South Korea and then go a little to the North.

Or, you can PM Xen and ask him if he'll take you.

i was just about to say something like that...

There is no shame in being fast posted by a man who is three times younger then you.

lol...young and...ignorant

[mandalorian2298]

Lol Good one.

Wow, I have been called "ignorant" and "an idiot" by two separate Rogues in a same day. I think you guys are geting to know me too well.

[s.xkitten]

where was the second one?

[Anarchist]

Anarchy

Every anarchist is different,for everyones utopia is different.
Human nature is an invented thing, I have no desire to hurt you, why is it that you have the desire to hurt me?
Before Tibet was invaded by the chinese, The Bhuddists were proud to walk alongside wild animals even snow leopards, because the animals had no reason to fear mankind.
There was a time before we simply accepted a special few to be noble, and allowed them to force their views on us, "what ever did the noble do to become noble?" and why should we allow it?
Religion, which were supposed to guide us to salvation now lead you to your own damnations. The reason some religions are well spread is through blood and not a matter of faith, false moralities lead to atrocities
through out history done in poor fools names
Countries used to be territories for us to live on and explore, now they are private property and require extortion and passports. How do you purchase land that noone owns to begin with?
Idealist maybe, but what would you suggest? Instead of dropping money on the ground, i should consume it in my pocket? Should I discuss the activities of others instead of looking after myself? Must i become supportive of the troops because they would rather be home? Your right my ideas are too extreme, I think we should stay the course.

It is NOW the Age of Aquarius, The Age of Christ is over. The followers era has ended. It is time to discover for yourself the meanings of life.
Perhaps im not as optimistic as you, im sure men like Tony Blair,George Bush, and Vladimir Putin have your childrens best interest at heart.They have done so well havent they?
They rule the world while you sell yourselves.
Im sorry to dissagree it is possible for every man to be free, we just need to wait for everyone else to come to the same conclusions as we have, or for them to kill themselves...
Whats funny is that for Anarchy to work(The Socialist Revolution) no violence is required. All you have to do is quit and start living for yourself, all of us. Then watch your powerfull economy fall knowing that noone will ever force you from your home, or force you to starve again.
That teachers will teach out of knowledge and the desire, education would be free and our race will prosper. Instead of wearing shoes on streets, we could walk barefoot on soft soil, eating fruit from our garden earth. The songs we could sing...
Those of you who no longer believe that mankind can wake up from its own seduction, have lost the most important thing about being an anarchist.
I guess your all right and im wrong, thats ok my life is better in my delusions. I hope capitalism makes you happy, i choose to dissagree. Ive already told you how i think life should be...

Too bad you force your ways on me

[vtmarik]

The age of Aquarius?

Stop watching Hair, for god's sake. We've passed through the Age of Aquarius and we're now in the Age of Libra. Only this age of Libra fails to balance the scales. The various opinions on Anarchy tend to split between those that think "anarchy=chaos" and those that think that anarchists want to build some kind of hippie utopia where we all sway and sing Kumbaya under the stars.


Let me define my view of Anarchy, in the philosophical sense:

First off, you come to a divide in the perception of human nature. Some believe that humans are inherently good (Thoreau, Emerson, Kerouac), while others think humans are inherently evil (Melville, Hawthorne, Golding).

I see human nature as inherently neutral. Our nature drives our perceptions, not the other way around. Once we come to the conclusion that by changing how we view things that we are, in effect, changing what we are at the core then the next step can begin.

I look at Anarchy in much the same way that Nietzsche defined the concept of the overman:
The first stage in the development of the overman is as a camel, simply existing and going with the flow. The second stage is the lion, the man with the fury to say "No" and tear down the current systems. The third stage, the final development into the overman is that of the child, who has the strength and purity to say "Yes" and rebuild the world into something wonderful.

Anarchy is seen by many merely as the second stage of the development into the overman. As the systematic tearing down of all organizations and structures in order to bring down the arcane and ineffective social order.

What most people don't understand is that anarchy, in its political/philosophical sense, is the transition from the lion into the child. Anarchy, as a theoretical model, is the reconstruction of base parts into a mutually beneficial and open society free of the barriers that keep us at each other's throats. True Anarchy, or as I see it Pure Anarchy, is the transition from total disorder into a state of balance. Most akin to the concept of Yin and Yang as presented to us through Taoism.

You could say, I suppose, that I equate Pure Anarchy with the Tao. And you'd be mostly right.

Now, I don't see an anarchist society as some kind of hippie commune where we all sit around with our beads and sing songs and sway while we smoke pot. I see it as total self-rule, the model of One Million People, One Million Governments.

Think about it this way, while economic or social equality may not happen overnight (if at all), if there allowed for a situation where all people shared equal political power things could actually get done. No more PACs or soft money donations are necessary when the lobbyists have the same clout as the senators.

An equal footing between those "in power" and the rest of society. That is Real Anarchy.

I apologize if I'm being redundant or going in circles, as I've been drinking caffeine drinks for a few hours now and my brain isn't working properly.

[Anarchist]

No, it was very well written and i dont dissagree with any of it.

However i have read that we were in the Age of Pisces, entering Aquarius.
Libra is next?

EDIT: im assuming the hippie commune was directed at me? let me state that i dont believe that, wouldnt mind it though... personally i dont care what form of anarchy you choose to live, just leave me alone or give me a hand. Ofcourse i guess thats the foundation of what we want?

The Age of Aquarius (c.2000 ) starts at the dawn of Satya Yuga. The beginning of this age was estimated by various calculations around the year 2000. Some astrologers believe that mankind will step out of the mystical age of Pisces right into the luminous age of Aquarius between 2000 and 2050, which means the end of superstitions and of dogmatic religions (apud Bruno Wurtz.) It is not without interest to go back to the Ahmadiya Movement of Islam speaking about Mahdi's appearance on the Earth.

[XenHu]

What is up with all of you guys and anarchy? I mnea, htere is the rogue state, and there are so many users that have anarchy in their name(anarchst, anarchy ninja, anarchistsdream, just to name a few) Are you just a bunch of potheads who want anarchy so that drugs can be legalized or what?

I'm taking offense from that comment.


-X

[vtmarik]

No, it was very well written and i dont dissagree with any of it.

However i have read that we were in the Age of Pisces, entering Aquarius.
Libra is next?

Well, I was meaning it in a figurative sense, not any actual astrological sense.

EDIT: im assuming the hippie commune was directed at me? let me state that i dont believe that, wouldnt mind it though... personally i dont care what form of anarchy you choose to live, just leave me alone or give me a hand. Ofcourse i guess thats the foundation of what we want?

No, actually, it's more aimed at Gustavus and his ilk who thinks that anarchy=Woodstock '69. Sorry you got caught in the line of fire bud.

[Huckleberryhound]

I don't know about other viewpoints, but I see anarchists as people that believe no government is the best way for people to live.

if there was no government, there would be havoc. No one could enforce laws, there would be a whole shitload of illegal stuff. hell, for all i know, we might start slavery again! No government wouldnt be great......

I've tried to tell the pro-anarchists that, but they spout a bunch of mumbo jumbo rhetoric about "the end justifying the means" or "i'm not saying it's perfect", and in my opinion have no idea about the concept of the real life effects of what they strive for.


In the end anarchy is ok if you want to refuse to clean your room, or start a commune in your front garden, but apart from that..........you're trying to tell lemmings that jumping off cliffs isn't fun mate.

[vtmarik]

In the end anarchy is ok if you want to refuse to clean your room, or start a commune in your front garden, but apart from that..........you're trying to tell lemmings that jumping off cliffs isn't fun mate.

That analogy would be apt if it wasn't for the fact that the only reason the lemmings leapt from the cliff in the first place was that workers were tossing them off.

http://www.wc.adfg.state.ak.us/index.cf ... issue_id=6
http://www.abc.net.au/science/k2/moments/s1081903.htm


Anarchy is a shift from the current system. It would be more positive in terms of a true balance of political power, except no one can really gauge the potential negative effects on economic or social systems. Your assumption that it would be irrevocably wrong is based on the same lack of information as those who say that it would be a utopia.

[bob3603]

Personally I would call myself an individualist rather then an anarchist. However, the good thing about the anrchists is: thay realize that Goverment and Laws aren't divine entities that should be obbeyed or the World will end. One think I know for sure is that I must take the complete responsability for my actions. Because one of these 3 things must be true true:
1) There is a higher Force that created me and has authority over me. If this is so, thaen this Force has gave me the ability to choose my actions and I am therefore, the only one responsible for those actions.
2) There is no higher Force and my life is truely my own. Again, it is my responsibility (towards myself) to choose what I'll make of it by choosing my actions.
3. Everything is predetermined and I have no choice in my actions and thus no responsibility for the results. But, if this is true, then a) It doesn't harm me at all to belive 1) or 2) and b) If I belive 1) or 2) then that means that I HAVE TO belive it.

To conclude: Goverment, Laws and Society are just the stage for expressing your SELF. You can love them, you can hate them, but you would have to be a damn fool to worship them more then you worship yourself.

Kind of off topic, but doesn't quantum mechanics null the idea of everything being predetermined (number 3)

[Anarchist]

I don't know about other viewpoints, but I see anarchists as people that believe no government is the best way for people to live.

if there was no government, there would be havoc. No one could enforce laws, there would be a whole shitload of illegal stuff. hell, for all i know, we might start slavery again! No government wouldnt be great......

I've tried to tell the pro-anarchists that, but they spout a bunch of mumbo jumbo rhetoric about "the end justifying the means" or "i'm not saying it's perfect", and in my opinion have no idea about the concept of the real life effects of what they strive for.


In the end anarchy is ok if you want to refuse to clean your room, or start a commune in your front garden, but apart from that..........you're trying to tell lemmings that jumping off cliffs isn't fun mate.

Weve never told you you had to agree with us, I just wish that you people would resist forcing us to live the way you want us to.

Slavery? You mean the world isnt enslaved now?

99% of laws are directed towards the protection of property and profits, in a world where that doesnt exist we wont require laws to protect them.
Im not saying that murder and rape wont happen, however it wont be up to the elitists to protect us from ourselves, depending on how a Anarchist/Socialist society works. It will be up to the victims and neighbors to deliver punishment. As for other crimes, i cant think of any other examples that wouldn't be irrelevent. Hes smoking pot? Mind your own business!

regarding noone enforcing laws, there would be no laws, if someone is causing problems and disturbances i guess the community would have to find its own solution instead of calling the cops.(or as i like to call them the Gestapo)

"the ends justifying the means" ???
You do realise that a Anarchist/Socialist revoltution could be won as simply as a world wide strike? "Youve got the guns,weve got the numbers"
granted that prolly wont ever happen but im hopefull that you will stop doing what your told, and start following your own ambitions.

[Iliad]

I don't know about other viewpoints, but I see anarchists as people that believe no government is the best way for people to live.

if there was no government, there would be havoc. No one could enforce laws, there would be a whole shitload of illegal stuff. hell, for all i know, we might start slavery again! No government wouldnt be great......

I've tried to tell the pro-anarchists that, but they spout a bunch of mumbo jumbo rhetoric about "the end justifying the means" or "i'm not saying it's perfect", and in my opinion have no idea about the concept of the real life effects of what they strive for.


In the end anarchy is ok if you want to refuse to clean your room, or start a commune in your front garden, but apart from that..........you're trying to tell lemmings that jumping off cliffs isn't fun mate.

Weve never told you you had to agree with us, I just wish that you people would resist forcing us to live the way you want us to.

Slavery? You mean the world isnt enslaved now?

99% of laws are directed towards the protection of property and profits, in a world where that doesnt exist we wont require laws to protect them.
Im not saying that murder and rape wont happen, however it wont be up to the elitists to protect us from ourselves, depending on how a Anarchist/Socialist society works. It will be up to the victims and neighbors to deliver punishment. As for other crimes, i cant think of any other examples that wouldn't be irrelevent. Hes smoking pot? Mind your own business!

regarding noone enforcing laws, there would be no laws, if someone is causing problems and disturbances i guess the community would have to find its own solution instead of calling the cops.(or as i like to call them the Gestapo)

"the ends justifying the means" ???
You do realise that a Anarchist/Socialist revoltution could be won as simply as a world wide strike? "Youve got the guns,weve got the numbers"
granted that prolly wont ever happen but im hopefull that you will stop doing what your told, and start following your own ambitions.

please actually find somethign about revolutions. What you said above will never work. Why should everyone do it? Why should the government give up? How would you get the people to fight for you? How would you get people to risk their lives for you? Seriously just go to wikipedia and read about the Russian revolution. Besides anarchism would never work.

[Anarchist]

the violence of the socialist revolution?
(perhaps some from the imperials and those in power) a worldwide strike,the day mankind shrugs its shoulders as if it were Atlas holding up the world.

If all of the world refused to pay taxes what would our slavemasters do?
if all of the world refused to pay rent what would they do?
if we all decided that the money we make isnt worth the time of day, because we all own this planet since the day we were born?
If instead of allowing your friends to be arrested we simply refused?
what if our troops said the hell with this were going home?
all we need to do is think for ourselves, kill your gods and kill your demons,the only violence in that is if we are divided.

Isnt that how we are now? Divided
The wealthy wouldnt do it, they would order us to kill eachother.
Bribe us with money we would no longer accept.Threaten to kick you out of your homes and put everyone in jail.(impossible)

Why should we do it? thats kinda obvious. Unless you enjoy being a slave and selling yourself, all for the right to live. tisk,tisk

Violence only promotes violence, revolutions of the past have not saved us from the present. It can become reality through violence, by cutting of the heads of those in power. Only to create another ruler isntead. The way Cuba is now was not the original dream, ofcourse Castro does have to protect himself from the outside governments, but is the true path to anarchy to become what we hate? To force it upon others as if we were a democrasy?

[Iliad]

the violence of the socialist revolution?
(perhaps some from the imperials and those in power) a worldwide strike,the day mankind shrugs its shoulders as if it were Atlas holding up the world.

If all of the world refused to pay taxes what would our slavemasters do?
if all of the world refused to pay rent what would they do?
if we all decided that the money we make isnt worth the time of day, because we all own this planet since the day we were born?
If instead of allowing your friends to be arrested we simply refused?
what if our troops said the hell with this were going home?
all we need to do is think for ourselves, kill your gods and kill your demons,the only violence in that is if we are divided.

Isnt that how we are now? Divided
The wealthy wouldnt do it, they would order us to kill eachother.
Bribe us with money we would no longer accept.Threaten to kick you out of your homes and put everyone in jail.(impossible)

Why should we do it? thats kinda obvious. Unless you enjoy being a slave and selling yourself, all for the right to live. tisk,tisk

Violence only promotes violence, revolutions of the past have not saved us from the present. It can become reality through violence, by cutting of the heads of those in power. Only to create another ruler isntead. The way Cuba is now was not the original dream, ofcourse Castro does have to protect himself from the outside governments, but is the true path to anarchy to become what we hate? To force it upon others as if we were a democrasy?

First of all that is not possible. Seriously. How would you get everyone to do this? How? There is no way a revolution can happen. You are talking about a worldwide strike. How will it be organized when? Seriously you have too many holes in that dream of yours. EVEN if it does happen, how the hell is going to work. Before proposing anarchy understand how much the government has to do. How would decision making be done? Anarchism is not the way.

[Anarchist]

First of all that is not possible. Seriously. How would you get everyone to do this? How? There is no way a revolution can happen. You are talking about a worldwide strike. How will it be organized when? Seriously you have too many holes in that dream of yours. EVEN if it does happen, how the hell is going to work. Before proposing anarchy understand how much the government has to do. How would decision making be done? Anarchism is not the way.

First nothing is impossible,
When those who arent the ten percent, get so sick and tired of working for them, get so sick and tired of capitalism..Have heard so much about Socialism, and begin to ask how high will gas prices go? What will we do when they kick us out of our homes? perhaps when they begin to see their neighbors starving to death because there isnt enough food in the world. Or perhaps when they see that our leaders do not have our best interest at heart, and see young men being dragged away and loaded into trucks, The only ones who dont want it to happen are those that use others, or are too scared of change. Who have never wondered what it would be like to be free. We dont have to do anything, we just have to wait. Your denial already prooves that we have won

What government has to do? well considering it is us that get sent to fight in wars,it is us that makes the economy work,it is us that protect eachother,and heal eachother. I would imagine that the government doesnt do anything at all, except charge us for living, and tell us what we may or may not do,
give us rules to obey. really what does government do? Besides control us?

Who would make the decisions? You would,I would, and the person whose reading this now.

Anarchism is not the way! - sounds like you want to stay the course?
Do your own research before telling me it wont work

[ZawBanjito]

Before Tibet was invaded by the chinese, The Bhuddists were proud to walk alongside wild animals even snow leopards, because the animals had no reason to fear mankind.

Bwhahahahaha. Usually I stay out of these discussions, but this is too much.

Sorry, dude, I agree with a lot of what you say, but get real. Before Tibet was invaded by the Chinese, the Buddhists were tyrannical feudal overlords that kept their populace ignorant and poverty ridden through superstition and a hefty dose of thug violence. The Dalai Lama fled to India where he sits on a heap of golden treasures getting his feet licked by gormless westerns with pop-stars in their eyes, taking money from the CIA to fund a guerilla war, and when that dries up he decides Gandhi was fashionable once too and starts charging lecture fees. Meanwhile the refugees he purports to lead starve to death under his window, waiting for some undefined miracle that will take them back to a homeland an increasing number of them have never seen before, where this goofy little man with no plan to get them there hopes to rule over them like he did before. Meanwhile the Communists are trucking in Han Chinese by the hundreds of thousands in a grand ethnic displacement plan, forcing more and more refugees across the border, where they die of exposure or get shot. The best thing the Tibetans could do right now is throw that old "No Violence" coot in a small room with a couple of those snow leopards and see if they don't smell a goat.

[Iliad]

First of all that is not possible. Seriously. How would you get everyone to do this? How? There is no way a revolution can happen. You are talking about a worldwide strike. How will it be organized when? Seriously you have too many holes in that dream of yours. EVEN if it does happen, how the hell is going to work. Before proposing anarchy understand how much the government has to do. How would decision making be done? Anarchism is not the way.

First nothing is impossible,
When those who arent the ten percent, get so sick and tired of working for them, get so sick and tired of capitalism..Have heard so much about Socialism, and begin to ask how high will gas prices go? What will we do when they kick us out of our homes? perhaps when they begin to see their neighbors starving to death because there isnt enough food in the world. Or perhaps when they see that our leaders do not have our best interest at heart, and see young men being dragged away and loaded into trucks, The only ones who dont want it to happen are those that use others, or are too scared of change. Who have never wondered what it would be like to be free. We dont have to do anything, we just have to wait. Your denial already prooves that we have won

What government has to do? well considering it is us that get sent to fight in wars,it is us that makes the economy work,it is us that protect eachother,and heal eachother. I would imagine that the government doesnt do anything at all, except charge us for living, and tell us what we may or may not do,
give us rules to obey. really what does government do? Besides control us?

Who would make the decisions? You would,I would, and the person whose reading this now.

Anarchism is not the way! - sounds like you want to stay the course?
Do your own research before telling me it wont work

that has juust proven how much you don't know. What if we don't agree? And trust me on no(barring very, very extreme decisions by which I mean human race threatening) no-one is going to agree. So how do you chooses? Do we have to vote for every tiny decision? Seriously understand how much the government has to do. I repeat what I said. Anarchy is not the way

[Iliad]

bump, Anarchist what how do you reply?

[Anarchist]

Even though the only place the arguement is going is that we dissagree

I would encourage you to read the passages written by those more articulate then me

It would seem to me that you dont know how to operate without having someone to look up to. The vote you speak of is different then democrasy.
Its only includes whoever is there. If I tell you that my family is in need of a home. Would you help me?
If you dont please remember that i may not help you.
do what you want, not what they want, but remember we need eachother in order to survive.

There really is no vote involved, only asking for help.If noone helps ill have to do it myself. your thinking of things in massive population, who really cares about the masses? worry about your self and your own. dont worry about what everyone else is doing. I really dont care whats happening in Washington DC, I am here. It may sound selfish, but minding my own business is far more community then trying to control what they do.

I stand by the fact that governments dont accomplish anything but grief and control. Any arguement that defends a government only exists because they are trying to compensate for problems they cause in the first place. Public image. Its a circular arguement.

Everything sees to itself

[Iliad]

Even though the only place the arguement is going is that we dissagree

I would encourage you to read the passages written by those more articulate then me

It would seem to me that you dont know how to operate without having someone to look up to. The vote you speak of is different then democrasy.
Its only includes whoever is there. If I tell you that my family is in need of a home. Would you help me?
If you dont please remember that i may not help you.
do what you want, not what they want, but remember we need eachother in order to survive.

There really is no vote involved, only asking for help.If noone helps ill have to do it myself. your thinking of things in massive population, who really cares about the masses? worry about your self and your own. dont worry about what everyone else is doing. I really dont care whats happening in Washington DC, I am here. It may sound selfish, but minding my own business is far more community then trying to control what they do.

I stand by the fact that governments dont accomplish anything but grief and control. Any arguement that defends a government only exists because they are trying to compensate for problems they cause in the first place. Public image. Its a circular arguement.

Everything sees to itself

If there is no government what happens when a decision has to be made?

[Anarchist]

You make it

[Iliad]

You make it

What if you don't agree with me. Who makes the decision then?

[Anarchist]

why are you making a decision that involves me?

i can understand if we need eachothers help that you would ask for it, but i dont understand why you would try to make decisions for other people.