Parley on the religion debates

[Guiscard]

So, if this is going to truly work, it's all up to the art of debate...not necessarily what one believes, right?

What I would really like to see is luns101, jay a2j, or nunz try and argue something from an atheist side against someone like guiscard or backglass try and argue the case for the Christian side. Now THAT would be an interesting debate!

Probably won't happen but it would still be cool to watch.

I'd be up for trying that actually! I think when lack gets subforums up and running we should get a debating forum.

I recon I could convincingly debate a Christian perspective, at least on some issues...

[Backglass]

What I would really like to see is luns101, jay a2j, or nunz try and argue something from an atheist side against someone like guiscard or backglass try and argue the case for the Christian side. Now THAT would be an interesting debate!

Probably won't happen but it would still be cool to watch.

Now THAT would be funny and interesting.

The Bizzaro debate.

[CrazyAnglican]

I'm up for it backglass. How about should "the chocolate Jesus" be banned?

[vtmarik]

*shrugs* Just felt that it fit somehow.

[CrazyAnglican]

Certainly sums up the ten commandments nicely. We're not so far apart eh?

[Huckleberryhound]

I believe in the Great Muffy.

I believe that the world, the universe, and everything therein came forth from a giant Muff.....Prove me wrong.

[CrazyAnglican]

Okay, maybe the idea is different enough that some of you are not getting it. This is a Parley "A neutral discussion of terms of engagement" it is not a debate. If you have a point that you would like to make, that's a very good thing. Now read the rules at the top of this thread, and go and start your own 1-on-1 thread. Tell us here what the topic is and someone will take you up on it.

If you can show a rational reason for your opinion, I don't see why anyone would be afraid of a friendly 1-on-1 debate. Otherwise its just the same groundless assertions that are all too common around here. As such it really carries no weight because you haven't faced an opponent to prove its rationale.

[CrazyAnglican]

All right this time I'll take the middle whoever takes me up on it gets to begin and end. It has been stated that fear plays a role in people's acceptance of religion. That it is in some way a maniuplation to keep the flock in line.

But the main reason I believe religions are still practiced in society today is that idea of life after death is an attractive one to humans who share a fear of death.

I hate to sound like I'm just espousing rhetoric, but fear is a common tactic employed by religion to keep their followers in line. Of course, they have their own reasons to believe, but one of the main drives for someone to join a religion is the fear of what is going to happen to their soul, or whatever they believe. For example, "if you don't believe in Jesus Christ as our Savior and Lord and don't accept him into your heart, then you will go to hell".

:lol:. No, but nice try. I am not scared of superstitions and folklore. Obviously you are.

The new topic "Do we believe out of Fear?"

[heavycola]

Isn't the line, 'there are no atheists in foxholes' an (errant) oft-used rejoinder from christians?
And doesn't that then imply that atheists are supposedly too terrified to die without faith? SO yes, i believe fear - of death, of hell - is a large factor.

I am astonished how many people on this forum believe in hel (not to mention how many people are apparently headed there). Look at hell objectively, CA - it's the perfect control mechanism.

[2dimes]

That's a good way to bring in that Occim's thing.

Isn't it enough that if there's nothing after this life, to make people want to cling to it as long as possible?

What bearing does hell have on anything?

If this is all I get, I shouldn't waste a second of it.

So then if I live my life serving Christ,
(Obviously I'm using "if" there because I'm not doing it right now.)
it only causes my life to improve in quality. While I commit myself to improving everyone's life I encounter as well as everything I leave only positive influences.

(This means not letting religion including my own thoughts of "well maybe I should do this thing to make myself better than you." get in the way of allways doing what I can to help everyone I see.)

This forum would be just one example of something that indeed stands to improve from my decisions!

Then I die and my electrical impulses stop causing my concience to cease and my body returns to the minerals it was composed of.

I still enjoy improved quality of life for me and others before I leave, so there is gain there.

Hell no longer has any control over me because it's not an option.

I either go to heaven because Christ Jesus paid for me to go or I die a nice peacefull death of non-existance.

Hell is basically eliminated either way and left for the catholics (who I hear are thinking of writing up something to that effect.).

[vtmarik]

Isn't the line, 'there are no atheists in foxholes' an (errant) oft-used rejoinder from christians?
And doesn't that then imply that atheists are supposedly too terrified to die without faith? SO yes, i believe fear - of death, of hell - is a large factor.

I am astonished how many people on this forum believe in hel (not to mention how many people are apparently headed there). Look at hell objectively, CA - it's the perfect control mechanism.

Daniel C. Dennett, a famous atheist, had a heart attack and nearly died. Many people experience a change of faith during those types of moments, but Daniel didn't. Nope, he came out of it ever more convinced of his atheism than before.

There's a rule for every exception.

[Guilty_Biscuit]

'Do modern, western societies need organised religion to provide a moral framework?'

I would like to debate that they don't. And although my argument would probably be ripped to shreads it will be good for me to see where the biggest holes are

I will also enjoy debating against anyone who claims they can prove God does or does not exist.

[CrazyAnglican]

Isn't the line, 'there are no atheists in foxholes' an (errant) oft-used rejoinder from christians?
And doesn't that then imply that atheists are supposedly too terrified to die without faith? SO yes, i believe fear - of death, of hell - is a large factor.

I am astonished how many people on this forum believe in hel (not to mention how many people are apparently headed there). Look at hell objectively, CA - it's the perfect control mechanism.

So HC you were the first to reply, Do we have a debate? Hi 2dimes I think we'd actually be pretty close in opinions on this particular topic, at least I agree with a lot of your post.

[CrazyAnglican]

'Do modern, western societies need organised religion to provide a moral framework?'

I would like to debate that they don't. And although my argument would probably be ripped to shreads it will be good for me to see where the biggest holes are

I will also enjoy debating against anyone who claims they can prove God does or does not exist.

'Do modern, western societies need organised religion to provide a moral framework?' seems great! I think I have one going with HC right now, but I hope someone takes you up on it. There is certainly a lot to be said about morals and ethics there. I would like to see what you have to say.

[foolish_yeti]

I'm all up for debate (in case you haven't noticed in other threads). I see no reason to limit the discussion to four posts- or to two people. What happens if the first person to take up the gauntlet has crappy arguments?

I'm not a huge fan of debating against atheists because most of their arguments center around religion- not spirituality. But go nuts, people.

[vtmarik]

I'm all up for debate (in case you haven't noticed in other threads). I see no reason to limit the discussion to four posts- or to two people. What happens if the first person to take up the gauntlet has crappy arguments?

I'm not a huge fan of debating against atheists because most of their arguments center around religion- not spirituality. But go nuts, people.

Isn't arguing about spirituality akin to arguing whether the sky is blue?