Game of Thrones Night 3: The King's Hand, Justice and Guard

[chapcrap]

Safari, what do you think of the following protocol?

a) you will always send 2 reports to the HotK
b) the reports that probably indicate town power roles shall be sent to the HotK to preserve said town power roles - Queen Cersei shall get the least revealing ones (we can make a comprehensive list of revealing and non-revealing reports to guide your actions)
c) the report you send to Queen Cersei will be publicly shared at the beginning of the next day

Absolutely not. Then I'm of no use to mafia, and I'd get NKed immediately.

Like I said, I have to share information with both sides. Town and mafia's play should dictate what type of information I give to each side.

If you're not comfortable with that, I suggest you kill me now, because I must have severely misplayed my role then. I'm being clear here, I want a side to win, it's up to the play of the two sides to determine which side I help more to win.

This is why you won't make it to the end if this is a real claim. You just backed yourself into a corner.

[Rodion]

Safari, what do you think of the following protocol?

a) you will always send 2 reports to the HotK
b) the reports that probably indicate town power roles shall be sent to the HotK to preserve said town power roles - Queen Cersei shall get the least revealing ones (we can make a comprehensive list of revealing and non-revealing reports to guide your actions)
c) the report you send to Queen Cersei will be publicly shared at the beginning of the next day

Absolutely not. Then I'm of no use to mafia, and I'd get NKed immediately.

Like I said, I have to share information with both sides. Town and mafia's play should dictate what type of information I give to each side.

If you're not comfortable with that, I suggest you kill me now, because I must have severely misplayed my role then. I'm being clear here, I want a side to win, it's up to the play of the two sides to determine which side I help more to win.

The thing with your claim is that it can benefit both town and mafia and one side is going to get the lion's share of that. If we suspect that the mafia is getting the leverage, you'll probably be lynched. It was with that in mind that I considered that protocol.

Personally, I think you've placed yourself in a rough spot. In my opinion, we can only fully trust you if you follow the aforementioned guidelines (which basically remove your free will) and, if you do that, mafia will be forced to kill you quickly. In my view, by disclosing all information you did when you claimed, you've annihilated your chances of winning with the mafia. After all, if the mafia establishes a good lead in the game and you stop cooperating with the town, you'll have to be lynched (and I think that HotK has to come forward and out Safari if he is being less than honest to us - HotK keeping himself hidden while Safari is selling our docs/cops seems stupid, unless HotK has several good powers other than receiving said reports).

Maybe now you should play 100% town and hope that a doctor/watcher promise will keep you alive?

Fastposted by Chap: that's exactly what I think. Saf has backed himself into a corner.

[safariguy5]

You're assuming that HoTK and Queen Cersi survive until the end. If one side loses their leader, then I may or may not be in trouble. If the GF dies, then I assume the doc will protect me. If the Hand dies, then mafia probably have the upper hand anyways, and wasting a lynch on me only gives mafia an extra NK to extend the lead(in addition to any information I already gave them).

I offer knowledge. That can only get more valuable as the game goes on. Depending on which side is winning, I may or may not be willing to confirm or deny roleclaims. And you automatically assume I'm getting doc or cop investigations. I could just as easily receive a roleblocker, a vote stealer, and a busdriver action, none of which we consider a real "power role".

I submit that Third Party Survivor is difficult to play, especially since it's a possible scum claim. Full disclosure early is what I count on to stay alive (both from lynches and NKs). And after the first night, at least two people will know I am who I say I am, so that should be ok. Bottom line is that I'm not going to promise to show favoritism unless one side takes a commanding lead. Then I'm basically hoping that the losing side figures that wasting either a lynch or DK on me is less valuable than trying to get back into the game.

Town and mafia gain nothing from my death, and I offer information to both sides. You're wasting your time killing me as it gives the other side one extra chance to kill one of you.

[pancakemix]

I was going to say something to that effect, but you've said it yourself. It's quite the conundrum. You're worth keeping around because the info you offer is valuable, but if the mafia can't benefit obviously they're going to kill you to keep us in the dark. At the same time if HotK dies, while there's no point in wasting a lynch a vig is certainly an option (if we have one).

Right now, I think we should move onto something else. There is no point at which safari is worth a lynch unless he's lying, and If Varys (sp) IS a fakeclaim, judging from the informed perspectives on flavor that just ain't fair.

[kwanton]

And you automatically assume I'm getting doc or cop investigations. I could just as easily receive a roleblocker, a vote stealer, and a busdriver action, none of which we consider a real "power role".

Sorry if I was unclear but those were two separate thoughts.

I was saying you'd probably get targeted by a cop or doc not receive their actions.

And as far as the results you get from night actions, yes they're random but any power role is useful. I do consider roleblocker, busdriver, etc to be "real" power roles. Actually I'd take a skilled roleblocker on my town team over a skilled doctor any day.

And I agree with letting the vig decide what to do here. No reason to waste a lynch.

[naxus]

Safari, what do you think of the following protocol?

a) you will always send 2 reports to the HotK
b) the reports that probably indicate town power roles shall be sent to the HotK to preserve said town power roles - Queen Cersei shall get the least revealing ones (we can make a comprehensive list of revealing and non-revealing reports to guide your actions)
c) the report you send to Queen Cersei will be publicly shared at the beginning of the next day

Absolutely not. Then I'm of no use to mafia, and I'd get NKed immediately.

Like I said, I have to share information with both sides. Town and mafia's play should dictate what type of information I give to each side.

If you're not comfortable with that, I suggest you kill me now, because I must have severely misplayed my role then. I'm being clear here, I want a side to win, it's up to the play of the two sides to determine which side I help more to win.

This is why you won't make it to the end if this is a real claim. You just backed yourself into a corner.

He hasn't backed himself into a corner, he's playing the role as best as he can to win. Day 1 arguing over this is useless as we still don't know what side he's chosen. Come day 2 with a scum lynch and a hopefully blocked mafia kill, he will join us. With a mislynch and a mafia NK then he'll join them. Either way we can't really waste a lynch on him. If we think he's untrustworthy and needs to be killed, free kill for the mafia. if we think he's working with the mafia and deceiving the king, then we waste a lynch on a survivor and give the mafia a free kill. Just forget him for now and lets move onto something else.

[safariguy5]

Safari, what do you think of the following protocol?

a) you will always send 2 reports to the HotK
b) the reports that probably indicate town power roles shall be sent to the HotK to preserve said town power roles - Queen Cersei shall get the least revealing ones (we can make a comprehensive list of revealing and non-revealing reports to guide your actions)
c) the report you send to Queen Cersei will be publicly shared at the beginning of the next day

Absolutely not. Then I'm of no use to mafia, and I'd get NKed immediately.

Like I said, I have to share information with both sides. Town and mafia's play should dictate what type of information I give to each side.

If you're not comfortable with that, I suggest you kill me now, because I must have severely misplayed my role then. I'm being clear here, I want a side to win, it's up to the play of the two sides to determine which side I help more to win.

This is why you won't make it to the end if this is a real claim. You just backed yourself into a corner.

He hasn't backed himself into a corner, he's playing the role as best as he can to win. Day 1 arguing over this is useless as we still don't know what side he's chosen. Come day 2 with a scum lynch and a hopefully blocked mafia kill, he will join us. With a mislynch and a mafia NK then he'll join them. Either way we can't really waste a lynch on him. If we think he's untrustworthy and needs to be killed, free kill for the mafia. if we think he's working with the mafia and deceiving the king, then we waste a lynch on a survivor and give the mafia a free kill. Just forget him for now and lets move onto something else.

Thank you. Now, on to the usual day 1 bandwagon stuff.

[Mr. Squirrel]

How do you know this? I don't know the show well, so I'm just wondering why you are so sure about completely ruling out a character. It seems to me like you shouldn't completely rule someone out unless the mod has told you so...

His death is mentioned in my pm so unless you are him and say otherwise, I'm gonna say he is not in this game. Plus, he didn't really play a role in the books. He died before the series ever started.

[chapcrap]

How do you know this? I don't know the show well, so I'm just wondering why you are so sure about completely ruling out a character. It seems to me like you shouldn't completely rule someone out unless the mod has told you so...

His death is mentioned in my pm so unless you are him and say otherwise, I'm gonna say he is not in this game. Plus, he didn't really play a role in the books. He died before the series ever started.

Ok. I don't know the series, so I'll take your word for it. I'm still trying to catch up on series info.

And naxus, if you read my post before that, you would know that I wasn't trying to target saf in any way, I was just responding to him. I already went with / to try and pressure Edoc.

[naxus]

How do you know this? I don't know the show well, so I'm just wondering why you are so sure about completely ruling out a character. It seems to me like you shouldn't completely rule someone out unless the mod has told you so...

His death is mentioned in my pm so unless you are him and say otherwise, I'm gonna say he is not in this game. Plus, he didn't really play a role in the books. He died before the series ever started.

Ok. I don't know the series, so I'll take your word for it. I'm still trying to catch up on series info.

And naxus, if you read my post before that, you would know that I wasn't trying to target saf in any way, I was just responding to him. I already went with / to try and pressure Edoc.

Not directed at you, just general frustration at wasting a few pages on BS that won't help us.

Vote Edoc to lay on some pressure

[Iliad]

Vote count
safariguy-2-pancakemix, daze
/-1-btg
pcm-1-lalaland
kwanton-3-talapus,saxlad, nagerous
edocsil-3- safariguy, /, naxus
chap-1-bleed
talapus-1-rodion
nag-2-edocsil, squirrel
bleed-1-haggis
skoffin-1 kwanton
rodion-1 strikewolf,
haggis-1-bleedgreen

With 18 alive takes 10 to lynch.

[dazerazer]

unvote safari as his role appears important no matter the side.... he can be lynched later if too many town afe offed early on.

[BGtheBrain]

****

[TheSaxlad]

Surely if Safari can help either Mafia or town he becomes a liability and we should lynch him now anyway so he can't tell the mafia any town power roles?

[nagerous]

Surely if Safari can help either Mafia or town he becomes a liability and we should lynch him now anyway so he can't tell the mafia any town power roles?

But he can give us information about the mafia too

[TheSaxlad]

But is the trade off really worth it?

[strike wolf]

I read back through from where Safari claimed and I have to agree that edocsil and bleed right now are the best targets. Edocsil for comments so shallow you couldn't drown an ant in it and bleed for slightly deeper but still shallow comments regarding safari. I'm willing to chalk down bleed's comments to still being new so I have to agree with the pressure against edoc and will wait for his response before I decide to vote or not.

[strike wolf]

I think the only thing we can do is keep an eye on Safari. Whichever side he chooses to help will gain a huge advantage. Im still new so day 1 is still kind of crazy to me. There is nothing to go on, except what he has told us.

Day 1 is confusing and it tends to end in a mislynch or just running out of time before the lynch can be made. Still it is probably the most valuable day as far as finding initial scum tells and patterns from players to investigate and form cases early on.

[Talapus]

I was going to say something to that effect, but you've said it yourself. It's quite the conundrum. You're worth keeping around because the info you offer is valuable, but if the mafia can't benefit obviously they're going to kill you to keep us in the dark. At the same time if HotK dies, while there's no point in wasting a lynch a vig is certainly an option (if we have one).

Right now, I think we should move onto something else. There is no point at which safari is worth a lynch unless he's lying, and If Varys (sp) IS a fakeclaim, judging from the informed perspectives on flavor that just ain't fair.

Honestly it' more then a conundrum, it's a damn smart play by saf. Kwan couldn't figure out why he'd claim so soon and others had a hard time buying it as well. But basically by doing it he ensures both factions try to avoid him at least a night or so while he gets to use his roll. Will he make it to the end of the game, probably not. But I really hope that now all the power roles aren't focused on saving him for the night. For the sake of the rest of us I hope most if not all are smart enough not to focus them on saf. As for the vig taking him out I see no issues with that. I agree we or mafia probably won't do it yet because he could be useful, but he might also be dangerous. So odds are good it will be hard for you to make it much farther then day three in this game with the number of resuts you get.

In general, your role makes you sound like the Heidi Fleiss of this mafia game. You may or may not have important information and you may or may not share certain info with certain people. Just depends on who you think is more beneficial for you. Rod had a good number breakdown for you but I doubt you will abide by it. You claimed so early so people would come forward and ideally save you while you then get to assist them and win the game. So as long as the majority of the power roles don't waste there abilities covering you butt and focus elsewhere then I'm sure mafia will as well until your usefulness is proven with information come tomorrow or the next day.

[safariguy5]

My rationale for why I'd survive until endgame is that once a side is behind (AKA losing HoTK or Queen Cersi), I'd assume that they'd not want to waste a kill (lynch or otherwise) on a third party survivor like me. Of course, passions of the crowd as they are, things may not work out that way and I still might be killed, but then they just give the side in the lead an opportunity for a free kill and extend the lead further.

[edocsil]

I read back through from where Safari claimed and I have to agree that edocsil and bleed right now are the best targets. Edocsil for comments so shallow you couldn't drown an ant in it and bleed for slightly deeper but still shallow comments regarding safari. I'm willing to chalk down bleed's comments to still being new so I have to agree with the pressure against edoc and will wait for his response before I decide to vote or not.

Sorry man, don't know the flavor of the game and there isn't much else to go by at this point.

[Iliad]

5 Day deadline implemented from now, as activity has begun to flag.

[strike wolf]

I guess I can't really argue with the lost in flavor argument...I've been there too but it does the reason does seem a bit small to turn a blind eye to it...alright the reasons were a bit weak to begin with. I will not vote you at this point but I will be keeping my eye on you. That being said I don't really have a case on anyone else. I do think a some people may have over thought safari's claim and elements of the game around it but I don't really consider that a scum tell (it would be different if I thought their logic was intentionally misleading).

[Mr. Squirrel]

I read back through from where Safari claimed and I have to agree that edocsil and bleed right now are the best targets. Edocsil for comments so shallow you couldn't drown an ant in it and bleed for slightly deeper but still shallow comments regarding safari. I'm willing to chalk down bleed's comments to still being new so I have to agree with the pressure against edoc and will wait for his response before I decide to vote or not.

Care to build this up a bit more?

[/]

I read back through from where Safari claimed and I have to agree that edocsil and bleed right now are the best targets. Edocsil for comments so shallow you couldn't drown an ant in it and bleed for slightly deeper but still shallow comments regarding safari. I'm willing to chalk down bleed's comments to still being new so I have to agree with the pressure against edoc and will wait for his response before I decide to vote or not.

Care to build this up a bit more?

the case on edoc I posted on p9

Awesome, so let's get scum hunting.

I'm going to vote Edoc, his last two posts seem a bit phoned in.

Under no circumstances will we hang you today. To valuable.

No comment on plausibility, planning, thoughts, points, or anything, just "You seem important, let me point this out to look like I'm town's buddy." Also the wrong "To".
And his latest post is mostly meta-speculation worry. "Oh no, if there are a lot of scum, then I am worried there are a lot of scum."

Sorry, not trying to sound like a picky jerk, but it is day one.

I don't know about the bleed case, I assume it has something to do with this post (since it's the only one related to the game without being a joke)

Saf, I think everyone can see how beneficial you possibly could be to the town however there is a lot that can happen that you could be the main cause for the town demise, with the ability to pick and choose who gets what information. Do you also have the ability to be recruited?