Account Sittingdragon dor fairman[djenre acct. suspended]es

[pascalleke]

u can see it also like this : a sitter takes up a job to help out an person wenn things come up , in this case we can only speculate what happend to Djenre , he is in the hospital for all i know ....(this is just an example ! )
Ok i have to agree to a certain responsiblity as a sitter but dont forget those are just people too. I dont read pms because they are none of my business , think most people follow that same thinking. If a person has to read all the forums , they would just be like me and u , no lifers . Think that program/setting of stating who is the sitter and that the turn is taken at that time by wich sitter would solve a big problem in this so other players could point it out later to that player/sitter , this in case of he missed something stated like Lindax had . For me i also forget sometimes to put my name under wenn i sit a turn , things happen , wenn i am busy or drunk
A month max sitting is fine but what if i go on holiday to thailand ? Then i would be gone for 2 or 3 months at least , or wenn i have a kid born , think i would need more then a month of free time on CC , or wenn i have a car accident and i am at least for 6 weeks in the hospital, .... Its good to have certain rules but sometimes things have to be bend a little just for 1 simpel reason....we are all just plain humans, well at least the most of us

[SirSebstar]

.....
A month max sitting is fine but what if i go on holiday to thailand ? T........... or wenn i have a car accident a.......

Good Points pascalleke. Sitters are there for emergency's or when you just can't play.
Note that I can hapely sit for 3 months for you when you make that Thailand trip. That part is not in discussion, when you cannot play, someone else can finish the games for you. However, when you do not return, when does someone stop making/accepting new games? Heavens forbid I should die, even though it might make me smile to know my account gets played on for the rest of ..eternity.., but thats not right.

Short, playing the ongoing games as a sitter is fine. Accepting new games for clan or tournament only, wears out after about a month. Just notify the TO(tournament organizer) for a replacement. (exceptions as always possible).

and yea pascalleke, that might mean you should not enter into a really really long tournament the day before you leave.

[Electricksabers]

A month max sitting is fine but what if i go on holiday to thailand ? Then i would be gone for 2 or 3 months at least , or wenn i have a kid born , think i would need more then a month of free time on CC , or wenn i have a car accident and i am at least for 6 weeks in the hospital, .... Its good to have certain rules but sometimes things have to be bend a little just for 1 simpel reason....we are all just plain humans, well at least the most of us

If you are going on vacation for longer than a month, you should end all of your games before you go.

If you are in a car wreck and in the hospital for 6 weeks, are you really going to worry about being dropped from a tournament because you are away?

[SirSebstar]

If you are in a car wreck and in the hospital for 6 weeks, are you really going to worry about being dropped from a tournament because you are away?

I would say Yes. I would worry. I;d be totally bummed out if because of this thing called life I miss a finals..... OMG
Also, I am going to deny I have ever said this... But you know what I mean.

[jackal31]

I dont understand how account sitting and joining tourney games is acceptable. Its the same thing as outright cheating on another players account (as already defined from a prior accusation).

When I lost my premie in early Jan, I was in 6-7 tournaments. I found replacements for all of them before my game limitations were presented because I did not want to renew at that time. Why cant players make arrangements with the TO to get a replacement. This is abusive to the absent players account...in addition, its unfair to the other people in the tournaments. I also had an experience last year when in a singles tournament, a higher ranked individual account sat for the lower ranked individual whom I was supposed to play. The higher ranked person joined the tourney games, and knocked me out of the tournament. Is that fair? I wasnt even playing against the correct opponent in that regard.

Its a bunch of crap. If CC needs to come down hard on this type of abuse with one person, then they need to be consistent with it and dish out penalties for everyone committing these offenses!

[Serbia]

I agree with Jackal. It's one thing if you're involved in a long tournament (like my Serbia's NHL Season 2, an 82 game sports league) that I'm running right now, and you know you're going to be gone for one month, then be back. In this instance, you'd pm me, explain that you have a sitter (hopefully it's a single sitter you can identify, or if you're using even 4 people, just tell me who) and that you'll be back at such-and-such a time - I'd be fine with that. If it's a shorter tourney (like my King of the Map series, a quick bracket-style) then I'd just replace you. Now if it's something where 2 weeks have gone by, and the account holder is simply gone, with no warning, no communication, then as both an organizer and a competitor, I'd rather the dormant account be replaced. For example, going back to the league, you're effectively not playing DJENRE (who was in my league); you'd be playing whoever the sitter is. And that's really not fair to the rest of the players in the tournament. (again, exceptions can be made if someone is taking a planned vacation, though I'd suggest not joining a long tournament if you know you have something about to come up in real life)

Bottom line - 2 months if FAR too long. The sitter(s) should have pm'd the organizers LONG ago to replace out.

[jefjef]

I dont understand how account sitting and joining tourney games is acceptable. Its the same thing as outright cheating on another players account (as already defined from a prior accusation).

If sitters joined tourney games that were indeed a continuance of actions taken by DJENRE himself then it is not cheating. It is legal, allowed and within the guidelines of sitting. Yes - 2 months, if that is how long DJEn has completely been gone, is a long time to sit and continue to join games but as per CC rules there is no rules violation.

If someone made a sugg that if an account holder is gone for longer than a month then no new games may be joined that would be a rule I'd support.

As for those discussing pm's sent to DJENRE, I as a sitter of several people I hardly ever enter the inbox for short time sitting. About the only time I do is if it's a week or longer and even then I only look at what might be important.

[jackal31]

my point is, nobody should be joining any new games....let alone tournament games, on behalf of the absent. If there was a circumstance that took control of ones personal life, then that person should be removed from the tourney. If the player in question has been gone for over a week, then the people sitting the account should take responsibility and find a replacement and contact the TO.

There shouldnt be any exceptions as it only add to grey area. It should be the sole responsibility of the account holder to make appropriate reservations even if the absence is planned.

[greenoaks]

i have rescued a tournament that he is in. it is 15 rounds with 5 games a piece.

i have noticed that sitters are announcing their presence - thankyou sitters

this is a really long league, it most likely won't finish this year.

i love how his sitters have been letting me know (and i have not taken ANY issue with it) but i do not know his situation and don't want the sitters to be in trouble for doing an outstanding job covering for a friend.

can guidelines be made/be made public, to help those who help others.

[jackal31]

i have rescued a tournament that he is in. it is 15 rounds with 5 games a piece.

i have noticed that sitters are announcing their presence - thankyou sitters

this is a really long league, it most likely won't finish this year.

Really? How is that fair to the other participants in the tourney?

In addition, how is this different from having a multi account?
Its not.

You have a high ranking player sitting for a lower ranking player on a consistent basis. That's fraud at its finest.

[jefjef]

my point is, nobody should be joining any new games....let alone tournament games, on behalf of the absent.

The only active games are tourney games. Sitters should be allowed to join ongoing tourney games for short term sitting. It is this way to help progress tourneys without punishing those that are away.

The sitting rule does need to be revamped to include time frame limits. But as it is there is no rule violation here unless a sitter signed DJ up for a tourney but the post history does not support that.

[jackal31]

jefjef....when I was running tourneys, I had plenty of people in reserve who would take a spot as well as all the tourney's I have joined. There was nearly always someone there to take the spot.

Also, after some searching, this tournament opened on 4/6 and DJENREsigned up on the 9th. The tourney then started on the 13th. So, if we go back 2 months (as the proposed date of absence), then this tourney shouldnt even have started with DJENRE in it. Not only that, DDor signed up right in front of him. I havent checked to see if DDor took any turns, but as a singles tourney, he shouldnt be allowed to sub for someone as a single in the same tourney.

It looks like (on a quick brush) he is involved in over 8 different tourneys too. I think if its not a finals match, then replacements should be found. Where do you draw the line?

[jefjef]

jefjef....when I was running tourneys, I had plenty of people in reserve who would take a spot as well as all the tourney's I have joined. There was nearly always someone there to take the spot.

Also, after some searching, this tournament opened on 4/6 and DJENREsigned up on the 9th. The tourney then started on the 13th. So, if we go back 2 months (as the proposed date of absence), then this tourney shouldnt even have started with DJENRE in it.

It looks like (on a quick brush) he is involved in over 8 different tourneys. I think if its not a finals match, then replacements should be found. Where do you draw the line?

It's called time limits for joining tourney games for accounts being sat. Tourney organizers could also install rules that those that sign up may only use sitters for x amount of time. If none of his tourney games has been played by him I would also think the tourney organizer could disqualify him because it isn't him playing. (assuming he has completely been absent)

Yes the sitting rule needs to be updated but as far as this complaint there just is no obvious rules violation. The sitters gain nothing from this. They are simply maintaining the account for a friend that they probably believe he may return to and doing it within the rules.

Now if DDor tooks turns in a game for DJ that they were opponents in then THAT would be a rules violation.

[jackal31]

Yes the sitting rule needs to be updated but as far as this complaint there just is no obvious rules violation. The sitters gain nothing from this. They are simply maintaining the account for a friend that they probably believe he may return to and doing it within the rules.

jefjef

I understand you are supporting the current process, but seriously. Many people made accusations about another player saying he knew full well what he was doing when another player told him they were leaving. Now, if these players know DJ hasnt been around lately, then why wouldnt they be responsible for getting replacements in those tourneys. They other player was held responsible after the accusations. These players know what they are doing. Its unfair to the other participants in the tourneys that someone other than the opponent they think they are playing is taking all the turns.

On that note too, I just found they guy that beat me in 6 games in a singles tourney. His account has since been disabled. I never reported it and now wonder if it was a multi of some type. Same can be said here.

If Duality. gets his account locked after 2-5 weeks absence, then why cant DJ's? CC even posted a statement telling the TO's to find a replacement.....forcibly.

[jefjef]

Yes the sitting rule needs to be updated but as far as this complaint there just is no obvious rules violation. The sitters gain nothing from this. They are simply maintaining the account for a friend that they probably believe he may return to and doing it within the rules.

jefjef

I understand you are supporting the current process, but seriously. Many people made accusations about another player saying he knew full well what he was doing when another player told him they were leaving. Now, if these players know DJ hasnt been around lately, then why wouldnt they be responsible for getting replacements in those tourneys. They other player was held responsible after the accusations. These players know what they are doing. Its unfair to the other participants in the tourneys that someone other than the opponent they think they are playing is taking all the turns.

On that note too, I just found they guy that beat me in 6 games in a singles tourney. His account has since been disabled. I never reported it and now wonder if it was a multi of some type. Same can be said here.

If Duality. gets his account locked after 2-5 weeks absence, then why cant DJ's? CC even posted a statement telling the TO's to find a replacement.....forcibly.

The other player/case you are referring to was an abuse. They were joining OPEN games in addition to tourney and NOT taking turns except in games they were partners in and it was decided that they were dumping points. This is a completely different and unrelated case. As for Duality he is a 100+ multi.

As for THIS case the TO's have the right to disqualify DJ.

[eddie2]

my point is, nobody should be joining any new games....let alone tournament games, on behalf of the absent. If there was a circumstance that took control of ones personal life, then that person should be removed from the tourney. If the player in question has been gone for over a week, then the people sitting the account should take responsibility and find a replacement and contact the TO.

There shouldnt be any exceptions as it only add to grey area. It should be the sole responsibility of the account holder to make appropriate reservations even if the absence is planned.

i hate to quote this with what i am going to say. but sitters are only allowed to cover for short periods of time. 2 months sounds like a bit 2 long for this to be happening and all those that are defending for the 2 months, do you not remember the blitz case.

[40kguy]

my point is, nobody should be joining any new games....let alone tournament games, on behalf of the absent. If there was a circumstance that took control of ones personal life, then that person should be removed from the tourney. If the player in question has been gone for over a week, then the people sitting the account should take responsibility and find a replacement and contact the TO.

There shouldnt be any exceptions as it only add to grey area. It should be the sole responsibility of the account holder to make appropriate reservations even if the absence is planned.

i hate to quote this with what i am going to say. but sitters are only allowed to cover for short periods of time. 2 months sounds like a bit 2 long for this to be happening and all those that are defending for the 2 months, do you not remember the blitz case.

Blitz was joing games tho non tournament games to.

[Dukasaur]

I guess I should speak up.

1. DJENRE has been a friend and often a team-mate of mine. About 7 weeks ago he went AWOL and I took over running the Jules Verne tournament in which I had previously been his Assistant TO. As time went on I had to field many questions about "where is DJENRE" which I honestly cannot answer.

2. As has been quoted several times already, I considered removing him, but I did not do so because I kept hoping he would return. On June 1st I wrote to Lindax asking for guidance. Should I remove DJENRE, should I not, how long is it proper to wait, etc, etc, etc. I asked, because I wasn't sure. I had read the site rules and the rules of conduct and the tournament handbook and none of them gave a specific rule about how long someone can be kept alive in a tournament by turn sitters.

Lindax replied that no-one should turn sit for longer than a month, and his post in the tournament forum has also been quoted here several times already. I totally agree with Lindax's post, but until the day I asked him I had no clear rule to go by.

3. I believe DJENRE's turn-sitters were acting in good faith. I don't think any of them were deliberately trying to break any rules. They continued playing for him, just as I continued inviting him to tournament games, because they were hoping he would return. Like me, they had not heard of the one-month rule until it was posted in the tournament thread.

Fairman and Dragon Dor have both PM'd me more than once about DJENRE's status. They have been totally upfront about what they are doing and about their concern for DJENRE. Besides them, there is also DJoach and djelebert. I have written to all of them and asked them to stop taking any more turns for DJENRE.

4. Fairman has written to me more than once, and I am confident that he is acting properly and not taking turns in the same game in which he is DJENRE's opponent. He hasn't tried to hide anything.

I do not know, unfortunately, who IS taking DJ's turns in that game. He has at least four turn sitters that I've mentioned and possibly others, so we really don't know. I myself suggested to the players concerned that if they are really worried about it they should open a C&A ticket and get DJENRE's account frozen until we know who is taking the turns.

5. DJENRE is currently still listed as a player in 3 of my tournaments. I intend to disqualify him from the other two as soon as his current games end. I did not do this previously because of the same lack of a specific rule as above.

6. I think this is an important issue and should be addressed, but I do not think anyone has deliberately broken any rules here. I think if there was any wrongdoing it is because the rules are NOT clear.

[perchorin]

6. I think this is an important issue and should be addressed, but I do not think anyone has deliberately broken any rules here. I think if there was any wrongdoing it is because the rules are NOT clear.

I couldn't agree more on all counts. Let's have a clearly stated easily found rule on this and start enforcing it universally.

[patrickaa317]

I believe that the current situation should be closed with nobody receiving punishment as all things were done within the boundaries of the current rules. HOWEVER, I do believe that going forward the rules should be modified to ensure that ongoing tournament games can only be joined for a limited amount of time, unless the time frame of the absence is known. If it is unknown, then after a couple weeks, no new games should be allowed to be joined and perhaps the sitter should contact the TO.

If someone knows they will be gone two months and have been in a tourney that lasts for a year, I have no issues with the sitters ensuring that tournament is sufficed, though I would recommend shifting the games to the sitters account during that time frame.

I realize my thoughts aren't real clear cut, just throwing out ideas.

[squishyg]

In most countries women get at least 6 weeks of maternity leave... Guess my coverage plans for baby #2 will be in violation of the rules...

Perhaps my sitter could email me after the one month mark is up whenever I get a new game invite. Either that or I'll have to teach the kids to change their own damn diapers.

[pascalleke]

In most countries women get at least 6 weeks of maternity leave... Guess my coverage plans for baby #2 will be in violation of the rules...

Perhaps my sitter could email me after the one month mark is up whenever I get a new game invite. Either that or I'll have to teach the kids to change their own damn diapers.

Cant u ask Lack for a pay raise to hire a Nanny ? Or an allowance in the cost of taking a nanny ?

[SirSebstar]

In most countries women get at least 6 weeks of maternity leave... Guess my coverage plans for baby #2 will be in violation of the rules...

Perhaps my sitter could email me after the one month mark is up whenever I get a new game invite. Either that or I'll have to teach the kids to change their own damn diapers.

you could check in once and the ask for another month.. also, if there is communication then much more is possible.
Also, why join that tournament anyways just before you deliver the baby? It's not like you got no notice or something..lol

If you are real far in the tournament there is nothing to worry about, if its a slow moving massive tournament, and you have a due back date, not much of a problem either, at least thats my view.

[eddie2]

In most countries women get at least 6 weeks of maternity leave... Guess my coverage plans for baby #2 will be in violation of the rules...

Perhaps my sitter could email me after the one month mark is up whenever I get a new game invite. Either that or I'll have to teach the kids to change their own damn diapers.

you could check in once and the ask for another month.. also, if there is communication then much more is possible.
Also, why join that tournament anyways just before you deliver the baby? It's not like you got no notice or something..lol

If you are real far in the tournament there is nothing to worry about, if its a slow moving massive tournament, and you have a due back date, not much of a problem either, at least thats my view.

i think the problem here is not the same squishy. your absense will be known by your sitters. the problem with this case was the player just disappeared. so the players sitting for him were not actually asked to cover a set period of time. (this part is in the sitting guidelines.) also it needs to be looked into if this player has joined any more games since lindax stated he was not to be invited to anymore.if there was more join ups then there is a defo sitting abuse.

[squishyg]

Hehe, I do see the difference. I agree that endlessly account sitting for someone who has simply vanished is problematic. I just wanted to weigh in that there are valid reasons to PLAN to be away from CC.

Re: tournaments
In my case I'm referring to long running tourneys. But I also find that I'll sign up for a tourney and I don't get the first game invite until months (sometimes months and months) later.