Global earth warming up

[Hologram]

Yes, the only thing about that is scientists are now concerned that the current CO2 levels, the real present, not 1950, are reaching unprecedented heights, causing unprecedented temperature changes.

[unriggable]

They said its at 340 parts per million right now. Higher than appears on that graph.

[Hologram]

They said its at 340 parts per million right now. Higher than appears on that graph.

That's because the graph only goes to 1950.

[btownmeggy]

Science: "systematic knowledge of the physical or material world gained through observation and experimentation."

http://www.dictionary.com -- Use it.

[Spuzzell]

Lots of uncertainty about global warming/climate change etc.

I don't think it really matters though.

Thing is, we're pumping out far more CO2 than the plant life on Earth can deal with, which means our atmosphere is changing. Whether we'll freeze to death, boil to death or end up on the floor gasping our lungs out doesn't really concern me, we'll be just as dead.

Emissions have to be cut.. the ideal CO2 scenario is China and the US nuking each other. This would CLEARLY be a bad thing, but the two worst polluters in the world are the two least likely to listen to reason or scientific evidence.

[Anarkistsdream]

Anybody who deosn't believe in global warming is an idiot...

Read these two articles and then dispute that...

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/4228411.stm

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.c ... pe=science

[Stopper]

Emissions have to be cut.. the ideal CO2 scenario is China and the US nuking each other. This would CLEARLY be a bad thing, but the two worst polluters in the world are the two least likely to listen to reason or scientific evidence.

Bad thing? I don't know - thinking carefully about it, maybe the nuclear winter afterwards would cancel out the global warming.

[Nobunaga]

... The problem with this is, Global Warming is much too political now for anybody to know the truth. Once it goes political, 80% of what you hear from all sides is spin and BS. And I've seen folks jump on the "Warming is NOT caused by man!" wagon ONLY because they hated the people who were arguing otherwise. And the reverse is true, probably to an even greater degree.

... Funny as hell, though, a big "We Hate MegaCorporations, Let's Fight Global Warming" parade was nearly cancelled due to record snowfalls! That's hilarious. (was it Baltimore?)

[qeee1]

Nearly any respected scientist agrees that global warming is a problem. Sure you'll find one or two examples of dubious independance elsewhere, but in general those are anomolies. The reason nobody disputes gravity is because nobody has anything to gain from disputing it. Similarly the only people who dispute evolution are fudamentalist christians. I'm not saying science shouldn't be questioned, but right now all the evidence points one way.

Al Gore can gf himself, he's just looking for a political platform, but hell those concerned with global warming should use him like he's using them.

[Nobunaga]

... Now ya see, for all this "Those who disagree are morons" attitude:

http://www.frontpagemag.com/Articles/Pr ... p?ID=18526

... and yes, this is a very Right-Wing web site, but the cited scientific facts are no less credible than those arguing that Global Warming is caused by Man.

... It just depends on the politics of the scientist, I guess. Me? I really don't care, but I AM sick of hearing about it.

[Spuzzell]

Emissions have to be cut.. the ideal CO2 scenario is China and the US nuking each other. This would CLEARLY be a bad thing, but the two worst polluters in the world are the two least likely to listen to reason or scientific evidence.

Bad thing? I don't know - thinking carefully about it, maybe the nuclear winter afterwards would cancel out the global warming.

I was going more for the whole two billion dead thing.. I mean, not that nuclear winter is like, a plus point. I would be interested to see what Don King's hair would be like when it's irradiated though.

[unriggable]

... Now ya see, for all this "Those who disagree are morons" attitude:

http://www.frontpagemag.com/Articles/Pr ... p?ID=18526

... and yes, this is a very Right-Wing web site, but the cited scientific facts are no less credible than those arguing that Global Warming is caused by Man.

... It just depends on the politics of the scientist, I guess. Me? I really don't care, but I AM sick of hearing about it.

Yeah, screw facts! I read a lot of that and didn't see anything that said that it isn't happening other than 'the earth has been warming for ever!' Look at the graph I posted! Pretty concluding, if you as me. The CO2 is at around 340, and has not been this high in history of the glaciers. There have been several Ice Ages, and yes it does get hotter steadily after ice ages happen, but never this hot. I don't know, it's just stupid.

[unriggable]

That site said that the UN is trying to become a world government that gets rid of a person's sovereignty...somehow the US is protecting that sovereignty, right? Bullshit.

[Stopper]

I would be interested to see what Don King's hair would be like when it's irradiated though.

Isn't it already?

[heavycola]

Anybody who deosn't believe in global warming is an idiot...

Wake up and smell the coffee Mrs Bueller, any patriot knows global warming is just another joyless, muesli-eating pinko-commie conspiracy to get Al Gore elected. God WANTS us to drive SUVs and drill the shit out of alaska. Plus he HATES polar bears - can you point to one mention of those seal munching freaks anywhere in His book?

Speaking of which, where did jay and happysadfun go? Is it the rapture already?

[unriggable]

I'm kind of confused what the skeptics think the scientists get out of tricking the general public...

[strike wolf]

Emissions have to be cut.. the ideal CO2 scenario is China and the US nuking each other. This would CLEARLY be a bad thing, but the two worst polluters in the world are the two least likely to listen to reason or scientific evidence.

Bad thing? I don't know - thinking carefully about it, maybe the nuclear winter afterwards would cancel out the global warming.

^stolen from Futurama.

[Hologram]

Lots of uncertainty about global warming/climate change etc.

I don't think it really matters though.

Thing is, we're pumping out far more CO2 than the plant life on Earth can deal with, which means our atmosphere is changing. Whether we'll freeze to death, boil to death or end up on the floor gasping our lungs out doesn't really concern me, we'll be just as dead.

Emissions have to be cut.. the ideal CO2 scenario is China and the US nuking each other. This would CLEARLY be a bad thing, but the two worst polluters in the world are the two least likely to listen to reason or scientific evidence.

Heh, however much your idea is humorous, it would still be detrimental to us all, even those not involved. An exchange of just 20 nuclear warheads would severely change the Earth's climate. No, U.S. needs to step up if for nothing else to make the enviroment healthier, then China can see what they need to do and follow that formula and make any adaptations they need to for whatever reasons, ex-Industrial Revolution nation's economy is much different from industrialized nation, any cultural differences, etc.

[Hologram]

Emissions have to be cut.. the ideal CO2 scenario is China and the US nuking each other. This would CLEARLY be a bad thing, but the two worst polluters in the world are the two least likely to listen to reason or scientific evidence.

Bad thing? I don't know - thinking carefully about it, maybe the nuclear winter afterwards would cancel out the global warming.

HAHAHA, no.

[Hologram]

... The problem with this is, Global Warming is much too political now for anybody to know the truth. Once it goes political, 80% of what you hear from all sides is spin and BS. And I've seen folks jump on the "Warming is NOT caused by man!" wagon ONLY because they hated the people who were arguing otherwise. And the reverse is true, probably to an even greater degree.

... Funny as hell, though, a big "We Hate MegaCorporations, Let's Fight Global Warming" parade was nearly cancelled due to record snowfalls! That's hilarious. (was it Baltimore?)

As I believe I said before, it's more of a global climate change than global warming. Sure the average temperature is going up, but that doesn't mean that every place is suddenly going to have record temperatures. I personally buy into the idea of an altering of the ocean's currents due to the de-salinazation of the Antarctic Sea due to it's melting, a theory that the movie The Day After Tomorrow used for its plot.

[Aimless]

The problem with the Global Warming hype is that it is counter-productive.

First of all, the climate is exceedingly complicated, and there are a large number of confounding factors whose influence is unknown. For instance - water vapor is a much stronger greenhouse gas than CO2, but the presence of clouds in the atmosphere increases the planet's albedo. So, what's the true effect on global climate in increased humidity? We don't know.

Likewise, those who claim that global warming is entirely caused by human activity are ignoring the strong correlation between climate and solar output, and the fact that Mars and Jupiter are both showing signs of warming that match ours.

Secondly, I have yet to see a conclusive demonstration that a warming Earth is a bad thing. Sure, sea level will rise by a few inches, glaciers will melt, and tropical species will move farther north. On the other hand, there is a lot of land in Canada and Siberia that will become arable if the climate there improves.

So, before we get hell bent on stopping Global Warming, we had best consider the consequences of Global Cooling. For all we know, CO2 emission may be the only thing preventing the next Ice Age. (Actually, there is considerable evidence that this may be true : in geological terms, global CO2 levels are at an historic low, and this is the first epoch in about 60-million years with CO2 levels below 400ppm. Coincidentally, this is also an epoch marked by Ice Ages.)

As a caveat of the above, it is probably true that uncontrolled warming is bad; after all, we wouldn't want the Earth to turn into Venus (however unlikely that might be), but a few degrees centigrade over a couple of centuries is not the catastrophe the chicken little types are saying it is.

Third, the great majority of proposed "solutions" to global warming don't work, and serve only as a vehicle to promote other political agendas. The greens don't like SUVs, so they must cause Global Warming!

Sure, doing what we can to cut CO2 emission is a good thing. I'm all for nuclear power, hybrid vehicles, and other methods to reduce our emissions. But reducing our emissions won't stop global warming, because (assuming that the principles of anthropogenic global warming are correct) the climate is not changing in response to our CO2 emissions, but to the excess CO2 already in the atmosphere. Emitting more CO2 might make things worse, but we could cease all CO2 emission tomorrow and still not have done a thing to solve the problem.

Sadly, none of the above concerns are ever mentioned by the media in their hype that the world is going to end. Which is why I have no respect for the Al Gore types prophesying doom and gloom without actually considering all the issues involved.

So, before we start instituting extreme measures that will wreck our economy in some misguided, doomed attempt to stop this crisis, we need to step back, let the scientists do their job and actually figure out how the climate works, and not jump to conclusions.

[Hologram]

I'm kind of confused what the skeptics think the scientists get out of tricking the general public...

Well, like the whole cigarrettes and nicotine thing, some are probably paid by various people and organizations to say certain things. On both sides, mind you.

[Stopper]

Bad thing? I don't know - thinking carefully about it, maybe the nuclear winter afterwards would cancel out the global warming.

^stolen from Futurama.

Go away. I've never seen Futurama. If that's the best they can come up with, they should employ me - I can think of a million shit jokes like that.

[Guiscard]

OK here's how I look at the whole thing:

If those who think climate changed from a significant human contribution is real get their way and we do something now then down the line:

a) Wow, isn't it hot? But it would have been a hell of a lot hotter... We've saved a lot of people's lives...

or b) It doesn't exist... Wow. Our emissions have been cut, which has got to have a good effect of the environment. We've moved to more sustainable forms of energy... All these good things, shame about the reason being wrong. Big business is annoyed, but hey aren't they always!


If the global warming sceptics get their way and we do nothing to try and tackle climate change now, then down the line when it matters either

a) They were right, big business has got its profits from not having to implement environmental measures and a whole load of scientists have egg on their faces.

or b) Climate change from significant human contribution DOES exist and we're all fucked

Now I know which one I'd choose...

[vtmarik]

The problem with the Global Warming hype is that it is counter-productive.

First of all, the climate is exceedingly complicated, and there are a large number of confounding factors whose influence is unknown. For instance - water vapor is a much stronger greenhouse gas than CO2, but the presence of clouds in the atmosphere increases the planet's albedo. So, what's the true effect on global climate in increased humidity? We don't know.

Likewise, those who claim that global warming is entirely caused by human activity are ignoring the strong correlation between climate and solar output, and the fact that Mars and Jupiter are both showing signs of warming that match ours.

Secondly, I have yet to see a conclusive demonstration that a warming Earth is a bad thing. Sure, sea level will rise by a few inches, glaciers will melt, and tropical species will move farther north. On the other hand, there is a lot of land in Canada and Siberia that will become arable if the climate there improves.

So, before we get hell bent on stopping Global Warming, we had best consider the consequences of Global Cooling. For all we know, CO2 emission may be the only thing preventing the next Ice Age. (Actually, there is considerable evidence that this may be true : in geological terms, global CO2 levels are at an historic low, and this is the first epoch in about 60-million years with CO2 levels below 400ppm. Coincidentally, this is also an epoch marked by Ice Ages.)

As a caveat of the above, it is probably true that uncontrolled warming is bad; after all, we wouldn't want the Earth to turn into Venus (however unlikely that might be), but a few degrees centigrade over a couple of centuries is not the catastrophe the chicken little types are saying it is.

Third, the great majority of proposed "solutions" to global warming don't work, and serve only as a vehicle to promote other political agendas. The greens don't like SUVs, so they must cause Global Warming!

Sure, doing what we can to cut CO2 emission is a good thing. I'm all for nuclear power, hybrid vehicles, and other methods to reduce our emissions. But reducing our emissions won't stop global warming, because (assuming that the principles of anthropogenic global warming are correct) the climate is not changing in response to our CO2 emissions, but to the excess CO2 already in the atmosphere. Emitting more CO2 might make things worse, but we could cease all CO2 emission tomorrow and still not have done a thing to solve the problem.

Sadly, none of the above concerns are ever mentioned by the media in their hype that the world is going to end. Which is why I have no respect for the Al Gore types prophesying doom and gloom without actually considering all the issues involved.

So, before we start instituting extreme measures that will wreck our economy in some misguided, doomed attempt to stop this crisis, we need to step back, let the scientists do their job and actually figure out how the climate works, and not jump to conclusions.

Finally, someone with a sense of scale about the whole issue.